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  1. #5976

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    wjc - thanks for the stall pointers. As you say your approach sounds very similar to S&S's. What are some of the other advanced aerobatics you do with the Revolver?


    btw - the big toe is turning a nice shade of purple now!

  2. #5977

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    OWWW!!!!

  3. #5978

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    ahicks - thanks, but this purple \ swelling \ throbbing part is NOTHING, compared to that initial WHAM!!! THAT hurt. Attached are some pics. I expect the black and blue will continue. In the first pic you can see the indentation across my big toe where the prop blade struck.
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  4. #5979

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    Micro, sorry to hear of your accident. Hopefully no broken or fractured bones. About 3 years ago, I kicked an oak chair at 2am on my way to the dark bathroom and fractured my big toe. Had one of those big flat hospital shoes on for 8 weeks. Didn't know it was fractured until I tried on my shoes and the throbbing got more and more intense with every step.

    My flat spin method is utilzed with a 50 cc extra, and may not work with the Revolver. Good luck with your next attemp and your big toe. Please don't take this the wrong way, but having a gas engine running in your house is very dangerous, even with the pipe to the outside. That pipe should extend well beyond, 10 feet or more, from the outside wall. We have had people in S Florida die from generators running outside, but near a window; or cars left running in a garage, even with the interior door closed. I wish you the best.

  5. #5980

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    Duplicate xmit

  6. #5981

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    I haven't tried a flat spin with the Revolver yet but I have done them with several other planes. The location of your CG seems to play alot into how you execute the flat spin. I've been moving CG back a bit on mg planes to help with harriers and hovering. Moving the CG made it harder to find the sweet spot for flat spins and inverted flat spins. It also had a huve impact on KE spins....I can barely do them now.

  7. #5982

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    My understanding is that the CG will effect knife edge menuvers. For instance, during conventional knife edge, my Extra pulls to the canopy when it is flown nose heavy. And the flat spins are flatter with a neutral CG, while the nose tips downward when nose heavy, although I can compensate with aeleron input. But I fly with two other guys, who also fly 50cc planes, one is an EF Edge, the other is an EF Yak, while I am now flying the EF Extra. Each of us has a different way of performing knife edge spins. I think the aerodynamics of each of these planes also effects execution. My EF Yak will pull to the gear in knife edge, even with a neutral CG. WJC's instructions may be more appropriate to the Revolver.

  8. #5983

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    S&S - your concern is noted, but I do not run the engine for long- at all - just enough to see that it's running and maybe to make a quick adjustment. And I also leave other windows open, on the other side of the place, for extra ventilation. Believe me - I don't have a death wish!

  9. #5984
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    RE: Larger Revolver


    ORIGINAL: microdon2

    ahicks - thanks, but this purple \ swelling \ throbbing part is NOTHING, compared to that initial WHAM!!! THAT hurt. Attached are some pics. I expect the black and blue will continue. In the first pic you can see the indentation across my big toe where the prop blade struck.

    if I were you I d go to have X rays taken. That doesn't look good

    Keep your wings level
    Club Saito Member #693

  10. #5985

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    Micro, Glad you have a sense of humor, it always helps. I wish you a speedy recovery.

  11. #5986

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    Save your time hunting for my directions. I think S&S might be referring to WJC's directions? Would like to take credit for them but I'm just getting to the point I can run the length of the runway 5' off the ground on knife edge without scaring myself too bad.
    KE and flat spins still beyond me - unless done by accident!

    Do you guys know what you're running regarding CG? I'm at 1/2" back, and the plane seems just a hair nose down from neutral there. Harriers and high alpha stuff seem to be working OK here?

  12. #5987

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    KE spins are pretty tough and get your heart going as you watch your plane drill quickly towards the deck. The flat spin on the other hand is surprisingly easy. One of the guys watched my stick moments when I did one and was able to do it on his first attempt. I'm not sure how flat of a spin you can do in a Revolver with the factory throws on the elevator. My Extra 300, Edge 540, and MXS all need about 45 degrees of elevator (or more) to do a nice flat spin.

  13. #5988

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    Love to start high on the down wind side of the field, pull the power, roll the plane to KE and let 'er drop, then add power to check the planes descent and eventually climbing out - still on KE! Adding a KE spin to that is now something that has me thinking...

    -Al

  14. #5989

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    My R70 spins pretty flat - perhaps 10* nose down. Agree with S&S that CG plays a big role, as does bit elevator throws. Most planes will rotate on their yaw axis in a spin, but getting that yaw axis near vertical - a true flat spin - is dependent both on stick inputs and on plane setup. I'll get some video as soon as i can convince my wife to come to the field to film.

    I have made the R70 KE spin, but that is a hard maneuver for me to hit right; each of my (3) Extras needs different kinds of inputs and tweaking to get there. Last time out she KE spun pretty well. I don't know if it has to do with the fast prop (12 picth), or that I am learning to fly the plane into KE spin better. Once it starts, it can be pretty exciting because one loses altitude in a hurry. One of my extras likes to spin a extra turn or so after i clear the inputs, so be ready for that as you exit.

    microdon - roger that recommendation on xray, or you might just treat it as a fracture with a buddy tape and boot! Give you something to talk about at work.

  15. #5990

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    RE: Larger Revolver


    wjc - of course I just started running again! Maybe I should get the toe looked at.

    btw - Along with the piston rings I recently received from Frank Bowman he also sends out a sheet with recommendations on how to deal with the reed valves of Chinese-made gassers. From owning the DLE 20 and 30 and having issues with low-idle on both, I'm thinking his recommendations make LOTS of sense. I"m going to be doing this to the DLE 20 soon (along with replacing the ring). Will let you know the results. Instruction sheet from Frank Bowman is attached.

    Attached Files Attached Files

  16. #5991
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    RE: Larger Revolver

    Hey Guys,
    I don't know you has seen this yet, but here is the big brother. See link below!!!
    http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...7&I=LXCLCJ&P=K
    A must have for my fleet!!!

    Sonny
    aka
    jet22b
    Spitfire Brotherhood #12
    P-40 Brotherhood #52

  17. #5992

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    jet22b - I'm right there with you, brother! Actually, we've been talking about the new Rev 90 on this thread for a few weeks, including discussing best power plant and servos. But welcome to the club!

    btw - wjc, sbach, and anyone else who does advanced aerobatics with the Rev 70 - two questions: after doing your aerobatic maneuvers (flat spin, KE spin, etc) do you switch all three control surfaces out of high throws? If so, isn't that a lot of switching to coordinate while not looking at the controller? That's my biggest concern, is being able to switch out of high-rates safely, as, from what I've seen, this plane is VERY reactive on high throws. Actually, I leave my rudder on high all the time, so would just have to switch back ailerons and elevators.

    Do you have the setup on your radio where you can control all high throws using just one toggle switch?

    btw - I think KE spins is one of the most dramatic maneuvers out there. Am surprised that anyone could do this with a Revolver - congrats, wjc!

    Second question - does anyone do these advanced maneuvers with the Rev 59?

  18. #5993

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    All three surfaces are on the same switch. It seemed like too much of a pain to have three separate switches.

  19. #5994

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    Full rudder full time with about 25% expo. Rudder and aileron on the same switch. Running enough expo on those so that normal stick movements fly similar to low rate. I hate super sensitive sticks....

    Geeked about learning/trying this knife edge spin. Will likely try it first using the profile. I trust it doing stupid stuff like this a little more. Sounds funny, but even when it's dropping like a rock it's still in slow motion? Should be much easier to get my head wrapped around this with it, then make the jump to the R70.

    Only problem I have is it's going to be 3 weeks or so until I can try it. We're out galavanting around the country in the RV the rest of the month. We were at the Wright Brothers National Monument at Kitty Hawk N.C. today though. Neat place. Pretty humbling thought regarding what those 2 did compared to where we are today.... sheesh - can you imagine running a KE spin past those 2 guys given the knowledge available at the time?
    -Al

  20. #5995

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    Mike:
    I think the flying gurus use a separate rate switch for each axis (elev, aileron, rudder), but i put all three on one switch; when i pull that switch to low rates, i have a docile bird, no matter what i am flying. I adjust my low rates so that it is not possible to snap with full low rate elevator. I use increasing expo with increasing rate, as ahicks says, to keep the feel around center about the same independent of the rate switch.

    When i get to be a better pilot, I might split off the axes onto differnent switches, but for now, i prefer the security of a single switch. It is a big three position switch right by my right index finger => easy to pull. I do not have to look down at my radio to change rates. Trouble=>low rates = less trouble. I have a Futaba 8FG, which is really flexible in its programming setup.

    For the KE spin, one really needs a lot of down elevator, so i think max rates are essential for that. On the F*G* forum, there is a thread about positive G KE spins, with max up elevator - belly out. rather than max down - belly in. That direction i have not been able to make work. If anyone else can do it, let us know the tricks.


  21. #5996

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    RE: Larger Revolver


    ORIGINAL: jet22b

    Hey Guys,
    I don't know you has seen this yet, but here is the big brother. See link below!!!
    http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...7&I=LXCLCJ&P=K
    A must have for my fleet!!!

    Sonny
    aka
    jet22b
    Their is already a " 50cc Revolver Forum " here on RC Universe.
    Check it out ........... [:-]

  22. #5997

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    Ahicks, Sorry for the cofusion, I edited my post to refer to WJC's directions for the flat spins. Must have had a senior moment when I originally wrote the post, having started with WJC and then changing it to you.

    Regarding switching rates; I use a Futaba 12FG, which is very flexible allowing me to choose from 3 rates, Low, High and 3D; all on one switch. I use low for landing high for flight and 3D for extreme menuvers. I think John Glazelis may have recommended using one switch in one of his columns. It is very important to get out of 3D rates at the end of your menuver, to avoid an unexpected snap. I am trying to learn the knife edge spin and have found it much easier with the Extra than the Yak. I agree, it is the most exciting stunt to watch, particularly at 1/2 to 2/3 throttle. The plane looks like it is going to come apart at the seams and before you know it you are running out of altitide. On the other hand, we have a young fellow who can transition into knife edge spins with seamingly little effort and exit within a few spins. It is kind of like a conventional knife edge in that after you become comfortable, you can slow down the throttle and really enjoy mixing it up.

  23. #5998

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    S&S, yup, I get it! Did the same exact thing to acdii and microdon2 a week ago!! Got focused on the topic and completely spaced who wrote what.

    Re: KE, yes, been flying it a lot lately, and comfort factor IS settling in (been working on KE loop with a roll every 90 degrees - still pretty high with that though!) Now at the point there's time to think regarding the decision between using more/less rudder or more/less throttle to control altitude on passes down the strip. Slow KE is more fun to watch I think, but the R70 responds really well/predictably with either?

    -Al

  24. #5999

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    RE: Larger Revolver

    Crashed my Rev 59 \ OS 91 4s on Saturday. Bad. It was flying great - plane and engine - a beautiful day (winds 4mph, sunny) - I was doing my usual stunts. At this field - RCRCC in Central Nyack, NY (just west of the Tappan Zee Bridge) (I love this field) - unfortunately, the morning sun is somewhat in your eyes, so you have to be careful. Well, at one point I'm coming around - was flying inverted - the plane was pretty far away and I either took my eye off of it for a second and \ or lost orientation as it passed in front of the sun. Either way I was suddenly guessing about it's orientation, pulled up, and guessed wrong - the plane was still inverted, and, pulling up it now dove towards the ground, at 2/3 throttle. I tried to pull more to pull out of it but the 59 just spun and then plowed right in, just over the edge of the field. When a buddy and I got over there it was not good - the plane had landed smack in the middle of a 10ft wide drainage ditch lined with big rocks. Plane was totaled, including the engine. The crankcase of the OS 91 broke in half, and even the head was broken. I've never seen engine damage like that before. Even the receiver was broken. Considering the size of this field the odds must be 100-1 to land right in that ditch. So I was pretty bummed - it was one of my favorite and best-flying planes and engines, and the crash was completely my fault.

    The only part not damaged at all was the tail feathers. When I got home I found an older, also damaged set of Rev 59 wings, and realized I might be able to transplant a section or two from one set to the other to make a complete set. So I ordered a new chassis, cowl, and spinner. And I do have an older OS 91 4s and Futaba receiver I can use. So now I feel a little better.

  25. #6000
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    RE: Larger Revolver

    I am finishing a Revolver 70 with an OS120.
    The back plate of the spinner provided go through the theaded part of the shaft, but won't go any further.
    Anyone knows what can I do so I don't mess the plate drilling of using a dremmel.

    Thanks
    What\'\'s rudder?


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