Larger Revolver
07-15-2013, 05:56 PM
#6826
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RE: Larger Revolver
I recently bought the Revolver 50cc Airplane. I like the way it flies in the air. I like the takeoff short and stable roll. What I do not like is the crazy style landings I seem to have to do with it to get it to land and stay on the ground as well as stop before the tall grass. Of course I just had to play Brush Hog with the club's Simplicity Mower. Since I bought the gas, the new mower deck belt, and sharpened the mostly worn out blades, I think I deserve the right to mow down the hay all the way back to the property line. This gives me a good approach path now, but did not solve the landing issue. The plane just floats and floats and does not want to land, nor does it want to slow down. My friend that flies really well said I need to learn how to slip it in. Ya, right, I want a model in one piece. My solution over his method of killing lift by upward of the ailerons when you bring the power back below 2 clicks with a switch turned on on the top of the transmitter which results in a 45 degree diving down motion and getting too low too quick, yet not bleeding off any speed is to add flaps with my computer controlled JR9503 Radio. There is a 3-position toggle switch that would be good to add a couple positions of flaps. I may have to check the CG on a CG Machine too, as he used his fingers. Not my method of precision I am used to. As far as the toughness of the gear with the Revolver 50cc Plane, I can say it has not ripped off yet, but should have with some harder landings that were enough to spring the gear for not enough ground clearance of the prop. I took them off put them in a vise and bent them back. Two small screws per landing gear half is what I got. It even stands up to sliding it sideways to slow it down, and not even rocking up on a wingtip either. First sliding it to the left and then to the right. Wow, if this gear holds up to that, it will hold up to about anything. Of course I have not tried to take it through any ditches like one post stated, which no gear will stand up to that treatment, LOL.
ORIGINAL: ChuckW
a giant scale version would be cool wouldn't it? Maybe something that'd work well with a nice 50cc gasser?
a giant scale version would be cool wouldn't it? Maybe something that'd work well with a nice 50cc gasser?
07-15-2013, 06:19 PM
#6827
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RE: Larger Revolver
The UPS man left a Revolver 70 on my door step about a year and a half ago. It is neatly stacked in the closet waiting for assembly. In the meantime, I got a Revolver 50cc with a DLE55 engine in it which only had 1 flight on it. I took out the Futaba Analog Servos and replaced them with JR5625 Digital Programable Servos. I took out the small capacity battery packs for the ignition and the receiver and replaced them with something more in line with safe flying, a pair of 2700mah JR 6 volt packs. Only one minor hitch after that. The engine would not start. No ignition. The included Opto Isolator Ignition Kill was bad. Luckily I had a new one for another model, and presto, it came to life. I am looking forward to putting the Revolver 70 in the air next year. This will be one of my first winter projects. I am going to put a Super Tigre 90 in it though. That will have authority, believe me. It pulls my Bridi Super Kaos 60 unlimited vertical as soon as the wheels break ground. It should have no problem pulling the Revolver 70 unlimited vertical as well.
07-15-2013, 08:34 PM
#6829
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RE: Larger Revolver
flyboy - are you sure your idle is low enough for landing? My friend (who owns a Rev 90 \ DLE 55) was landing too hot till we suggested he lower his landing idle, and that did the trick. The plane floats in like a docile bird.
07-16-2013, 02:20 AM
#6830
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RE: Larger Revolver
On a 50cc plane, if the idle seems OK, and it's still using the whole field to land, suggest you look at the CG, and move it back 1/2" or so from wherever it's at. Then try it again. Pretty sure you'll see the difference, without changing the plane's handling noticeably.
Play with this 2-3 mistakes high at first, so you can see just how slow it really will go prior to stalling? Then, if you really want to get tricky, go to low rates and set your full up elevator throw so full up travel in a power off glide won't move the elevator far enough to allow the plane to stall... Pretty sure you'll find you have plenty of authority left on low rates, and a fool proof (SAFE!) way to get your bird on the ground under a wide variety of conditions.
Those moves may bring some new confidence to your landings, and be much kinder to your gear while you're at it. The GP Giant Sportster, with CG set at factory, will do this same thing, using an incredible amount of runway, causing guys to rip out the wing mounted LG regularly. That CG can be moved back about 1.5" without screwing the handling up, and will then slow down enough to do tail wheel first landings?
Not sure about others, but my experience has been GP uses WAY conservative starting CG positions in their directions. Suggest you not think twice about moving it back once past those first few test flights. -Al
Play with this 2-3 mistakes high at first, so you can see just how slow it really will go prior to stalling? Then, if you really want to get tricky, go to low rates and set your full up elevator throw so full up travel in a power off glide won't move the elevator far enough to allow the plane to stall... Pretty sure you'll find you have plenty of authority left on low rates, and a fool proof (SAFE!) way to get your bird on the ground under a wide variety of conditions.
Those moves may bring some new confidence to your landings, and be much kinder to your gear while you're at it. The GP Giant Sportster, with CG set at factory, will do this same thing, using an incredible amount of runway, causing guys to rip out the wing mounted LG regularly. That CG can be moved back about 1.5" without screwing the handling up, and will then slow down enough to do tail wheel first landings?
Not sure about others, but my experience has been GP uses WAY conservative starting CG positions in their directions. Suggest you not think twice about moving it back once past those first few test flights. -Al
07-16-2013, 05:37 AM
#6831
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RE: Larger Revolver
ORIGINAL: frankeldan
Well .. I just returned from the "man Cave". I completed the Revolver. Well almost.
I too have my spinner backplate 7/16" away from the cowl.. You ask why... well I must have messed up the measurement when I installed the engine. I swear a was dead nuts on , but nope ..Soooooo.. Not changing it , but I went to balance and I'm totally nose heavy with the Batt installed up front. I'll change it tomorrow and place the battery by the receiver.
The only trouble I had with this model was the forward wing pin was off in relation to the fuse. I had to take that ply circle doubleroff the fuse and remount it to the correct position. Other than that, this model was a breeze to put together. 2 thumbs up to Great planes. They keep on getting better. All they need to do it fix the landing gear and don't be so skimpy with the glue.
More pics..
Well .. I just returned from the "man Cave". I completed the Revolver. Well almost.
I too have my spinner backplate 7/16" away from the cowl.. You ask why... well I must have messed up the measurement when I installed the engine. I swear a was dead nuts on , but nope ..Soooooo.. Not changing it , but I went to balance and I'm totally nose heavy with the Batt installed up front. I'll change it tomorrow and place the battery by the receiver.
The only trouble I had with this model was the forward wing pin was off in relation to the fuse. I had to take that ply circle doubleroff the fuse and remount it to the correct position. Other than that, this model was a breeze to put together. 2 thumbs up to Great planes. They keep on getting better. All they need to do it fix the landing gear and don't be so skimpy with the glue.
More pics..
Many models today are put together using "Hot Glue" instead of the traditional 30 Minute Epoxy, Wood Glue, and let us not forget how much strength some "Fiberglass Cloth and Fiberglass Resin" can add to the area as well as soaking the wood with thin CA and waiting a minute or so for it to soak in before lightly misting the area with CA Accelerator, making a very strong joint. Just a light, one-time easy spray from a distance will allow the CA to cure slower and bond stronger instead of misting it heavily with multiple squirts. A friend uses this method with his CA and I can attest to the fact that he really abuses his models with High-G maneuvers and they do not break apart either.
He is a stickler for using a nice CA Applicator device that is made of flexible plastic with a bulb molded on one end to suck the CA from his bottle and it has a long neck to control the glue and it does not clog. Even if it does, one can cut the end off as there is plenty to spare and they are cheap. Once he sucks the CA into this applicator, he leaves it in there and uses it day after day, unless the CA becomes cloudy, then he discards it. You do not see him with clogged CA Bottle Tips and getting aggreviated, because he uses these applicators that are about 5" long. They look like an eye-dropper and allow precision gluing into hard to reach places.
One thing I do not agree with is those wheel collars holding two elevator pushrods. That is an accident waiting to happen. Why not use two digital servos, one for each elevator half, that allows for precise tuning and programming? If you criss-cross the pushrods, you have a straight shot and no chance of that loosening and ruining your day and plane.
For the rudder, use a pull-pull system and make sure you use one of those aluminum servo trays to avoid extra strain on your servo. Remember, buzzing is excessive current draw which can be tuned mostly out using the servo tray. Miracle has them reasonable, compared to other makes. For the cost of the servo tray, I get added comfort knowing I am not putting all that strain on my servo shaft. The strain goes on the twin bearings in the Aluminum Servo Tray not the servo. Your rudder servo will last longer. Many ARF's I see come with just a servo hole cut into plywood, not the way to mount the rudder servo.
As for the landing gear modification to the fuselage, I would look for a piece of aluminum thin angle iron that would cover the same area in one piece. You may have to search for speciality metal shops that can cut you pieces to the easily shippable length, but worth the effort and it would be far easier to assemble. Thankfully, I have one of those fabrication shops close by and can just go there with my needs. They generally can accomodate me in my needs for metal for special projects like this.
Happy building and flying everyone. Thank you's for all your posts, I have learned a few tricks and mods to engines and planes I already own and have not assembled yet.
07-16-2013, 07:10 AM
#6832
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RE: Larger Revolver
As for the landing gear modification to the fuselage, I would look for a piece of aluminum thin angle iron that would cover the same area in one piece. You may have to search for speciality metal shops that can cut you pieces to the easily shippable length, but worth the effort and it would be far easier to assemble. Thankfully, I have one of those fabrication shops close by and can just go there with my needs. They generally can accomodate me in my needs for metal for special projects like this.
Joe M.
07-16-2013, 04:35 PM
#6833
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RE: Larger Revolver
ORIGINAL: wjcalhoun
Email is pretty quick [email protected] He can give you prices and other details.
Bill
Email is pretty quick [email protected] He can give you prices and other details.
Bill
He is a great person tospeak with.
07-16-2013, 06:24 PM
#6834
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RE: Larger Revolver
daRock:
Sometimes it just does not pay to let others touch your plane. I know they no doubt mean well, but that is how errors and problems begin, with others touching things. Not thinking about the effects of G-force on the battery and the inerta of its weight which no doubt is 7 times that here on earth at rest, to say the least, will move a lot with nothing to stop it, it will break a battery wire. As for why the black wire broke and the red wire did not, that is simple to answer. Those wires do not connect to the same spot inside the battery pack. One connects to a positive terminal and the other connects to a negative terminal. Often one wire connects on one end of the pack and the other wire at the opposite end of the pack. The reason, the batteries are in series making the connections at opposite ends. With one wire longer than the other, one wire will have the strain on it and will break before the other. How do I know this? Simple, I tear them apart and measure voltage of all the cells, I cut the connections apart and save the good cells for making such things as cordless phone battery packs. Often taping them together and mounting them on the outside of the back of the phone. Hey, good enough to make the phone work again without investing $28.00 each to replace them on both phones. The kids drop them and abuse the charging by leaving them off the base station. I have seen many constructions of RC Battery Packs and I will say, one wire has to break before the other if pulled on.
Now for the solution so it does not happen again. Wrap the battery packs in vibration dampening foam such as that from Dubro. Fasten them down good using 2 heavy duty tie wraps in both directions. Problem solved. Now to protect yourself from a pack going sour while your flying, which I have had happen, I suggest investing a little more money on a receiver that has redundant battery connectors. Yes, two connectors for two separate battery packs of the same make/model/capacity. That way if one battery fails, the receiver is designed to shut one off and just use the other. Providing you have enough capacity in each pack, you can fly safely for the day on one battery. That is why I check my battery voltages before every flight. I will know beforehand should one begin to go sour and have the opportunity to correct the problem. JR and Spektrum have some nice receivers with dual redundant battery connections. There is only one drawback to this. You must unplug the connectors to the battery after the day of flying because they do draw a little current all the time. These receivers use a special "Soft Switch" instead of a normal battery switch. Should the soft switch fail, the default condition is "ON", so you do not crash from a bad switch. The benefits outweigh the need to unplug both battery connectors at the end of the day. A small price to pay for safety and longitivity of your prize models. Happy Flying, sorry for the loss.
It is OK to take some suggestions from fellow fliers, but be your own perfectionist when it comes to models and do the actual work yourself, that way you have nobody to blame but yourself should you not do something. Bad enough to crash because of your own mistakes but crashing because of other people's non-perfectionist thinking is another. I will give you a perfect example in my own experiences. My friend knows a lot about this hobby, but he does not devote the time using the proper tools to prefect his adjustments, nor does he set the plane up for my flying style. He sets the throws way over specs, does not use a balance machine to fine tune his CG nor mine on my plane. The result is my plane snap rolls out of a loop if I pull all the way back on the elevator. My plane does not want to settle down in time before the runway ends. The plane is way too touchy on the controls, but it is OK if he is on the sticks and not me. So he says I need to learn this and need to learn that. Well that is fine, but I am a sport flyer that does have the need for speed and yet the need for nice slow aerobatics as well as faster motion aerobatics. I will never need the control movement that will make a model roll at the rate of 10 rolls per second. I put in some expodential to soften the stick movement for landing, and he sees it and takes it out. Wow...... make your own choices, do your own work and adjustments, do not allow others to touch anything, LOL.
Sometimes it just does not pay to let others touch your plane. I know they no doubt mean well, but that is how errors and problems begin, with others touching things. Not thinking about the effects of G-force on the battery and the inerta of its weight which no doubt is 7 times that here on earth at rest, to say the least, will move a lot with nothing to stop it, it will break a battery wire. As for why the black wire broke and the red wire did not, that is simple to answer. Those wires do not connect to the same spot inside the battery pack. One connects to a positive terminal and the other connects to a negative terminal. Often one wire connects on one end of the pack and the other wire at the opposite end of the pack. The reason, the batteries are in series making the connections at opposite ends. With one wire longer than the other, one wire will have the strain on it and will break before the other. How do I know this? Simple, I tear them apart and measure voltage of all the cells, I cut the connections apart and save the good cells for making such things as cordless phone battery packs. Often taping them together and mounting them on the outside of the back of the phone. Hey, good enough to make the phone work again without investing $28.00 each to replace them on both phones. The kids drop them and abuse the charging by leaving them off the base station. I have seen many constructions of RC Battery Packs and I will say, one wire has to break before the other if pulled on.
Now for the solution so it does not happen again. Wrap the battery packs in vibration dampening foam such as that from Dubro. Fasten them down good using 2 heavy duty tie wraps in both directions. Problem solved. Now to protect yourself from a pack going sour while your flying, which I have had happen, I suggest investing a little more money on a receiver that has redundant battery connectors. Yes, two connectors for two separate battery packs of the same make/model/capacity. That way if one battery fails, the receiver is designed to shut one off and just use the other. Providing you have enough capacity in each pack, you can fly safely for the day on one battery. That is why I check my battery voltages before every flight. I will know beforehand should one begin to go sour and have the opportunity to correct the problem. JR and Spektrum have some nice receivers with dual redundant battery connections. There is only one drawback to this. You must unplug the connectors to the battery after the day of flying because they do draw a little current all the time. These receivers use a special "Soft Switch" instead of a normal battery switch. Should the soft switch fail, the default condition is "ON", so you do not crash from a bad switch. The benefits outweigh the need to unplug both battery connectors at the end of the day. A small price to pay for safety and longitivity of your prize models. Happy Flying, sorry for the loss.
It is OK to take some suggestions from fellow fliers, but be your own perfectionist when it comes to models and do the actual work yourself, that way you have nobody to blame but yourself should you not do something. Bad enough to crash because of your own mistakes but crashing because of other people's non-perfectionist thinking is another. I will give you a perfect example in my own experiences. My friend knows a lot about this hobby, but he does not devote the time using the proper tools to prefect his adjustments, nor does he set the plane up for my flying style. He sets the throws way over specs, does not use a balance machine to fine tune his CG nor mine on my plane. The result is my plane snap rolls out of a loop if I pull all the way back on the elevator. My plane does not want to settle down in time before the runway ends. The plane is way too touchy on the controls, but it is OK if he is on the sticks and not me. So he says I need to learn this and need to learn that. Well that is fine, but I am a sport flyer that does have the need for speed and yet the need for nice slow aerobatics as well as faster motion aerobatics. I will never need the control movement that will make a model roll at the rate of 10 rolls per second. I put in some expodential to soften the stick movement for landing, and he sees it and takes it out. Wow...... make your own choices, do your own work and adjustments, do not allow others to touch anything, LOL.
07-17-2013, 11:50 PM
#6835
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RE: Larger Revolver
Want a twin powerplant for it? Good thought. If wing loading is an issue, then add one rib to each wingtip and then you will probably solve the wing loading with a little longer wing. Sometimes one modification deserves another.
ORIGINAL: ChuckW
Anyone else besides me look at the Revolver cowl and thing it sure would be sweet with a twin in it? Maybe an OS FT-120 or the FT-160 that replaced it? The main problem is that those engines weight a good 10-12 ounces more than a single cylinder 4-stroke so there would be balancing and increased wing loading issues. I just think it would look and sound nice though.
Anyone else besides me look at the Revolver cowl and thing it sure would be sweet with a twin in it? Maybe an OS FT-120 or the FT-160 that replaced it? The main problem is that those engines weight a good 10-12 ounces more than a single cylinder 4-stroke so there would be balancing and increased wing loading issues. I just think it would look and sound nice though.
07-18-2013, 12:31 AM
#6836
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RE: Larger Revolver
ST90, great engine, lots of power and this equates into speed. Super Tiger's just do not like a lot of nitro. For me, all my Super Tigers seem to run just fine on 10% nitro. I have ST34's, ST61abc, ST75's, ST90's and they all run great. Love them. I read so many that post how difficult the Super Tigre Engines are to tune and they are having so much unstability in their tuning. Let this be known, Iown a tach but I never use it. I can hear the RPM increase and decrease. My ear is the best tuning device I have ever owned. How you plumb the tank is key first off. Many models do not allow you to get the center of the tank high enough in relation to the center of the crankshaft. If not, then a Perry Pump will solve this lean burn once the tank gets below half a tank. Needle Valve adjustment is key. First tune the High Speed for max RPM, and then richen it slightly. Pick the model up and point it skyward, yes vertical. If the engine keeps the same RPM and does not die down, your good to go. Now for the low speed adjustment, and this is critical to keeping the engine reliable idle wise as well as a smooth (not faultering) transition from low to high. Too rich and it will faulter and could quit from being rich. Too lean and the engine will simply quit when you transition from idle to full throttle. At idle, I tune the Low Speed needle for max RPM, then counterclockwise a little until the engine just starts to lose RPM, then back clockwise to lean it slightly. Then I readjust the High Speed needle again, as the low speed affects the high speed setting. After that, I never have to touch it again, yeah, that is right, never have to touch it again. The glow plug is key also. Not all glow plugs are created equal. Some glow plugs give an increase in RPM's. I will take the 2 ST-90's any day. Want more performance, invest in a Jett Muffler!
ORIGINAL: DenverJayhawk
i just bought a 95ax from tower for my Big Stik 60. They're running a $60 off promo for orders over $300. So it made it a little easier to swallow the price. Plus I was tired of trying to tune the other 90 sized Chinese engine I had on it. I just decided it was worth the investment as I'll keep the 95ax for a long, long, time and I plan to stay in 60 sized models. Agree it's expensive though. Could have bought 2 ST90s for the less than I paid for the 95AX.
Will the Phoenix Extra fly similar to a Twist 60? I'm guessing it will be a little quicker due to the thin wing but should have the same 3D capability?
i just bought a 95ax from tower for my Big Stik 60. They're running a $60 off promo for orders over $300. So it made it a little easier to swallow the price. Plus I was tired of trying to tune the other 90 sized Chinese engine I had on it. I just decided it was worth the investment as I'll keep the 95ax for a long, long, time and I plan to stay in 60 sized models. Agree it's expensive though. Could have bought 2 ST90s for the less than I paid for the 95AX.
Will the Phoenix Extra fly similar to a Twist 60? I'm guessing it will be a little quicker due to the thin wing but should have the same 3D capability?
07-18-2013, 08:47 AM
#6837
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RE: Larger Revolver
Well, just joined the ripped my landing gear out of my body club. I fly and land at our club field which has a nice long asphalt runway. I usually land so smooth with the occasional hop. I thought I would be the exception and not have to beef up my landing gear area. Wrong. Took a small bounce after a crosswind that didnt seem bad at all and boom, sliding down the runway on my belly. Skirts punctured small holes under both wings, new prop gone, wheel skirts cracked and road rash. Over all not that bad. Monocote will be easy to repair wings, already ordered new wheel skirts since I'm anal like that. Now I need to go searching some threads on how to re-mount and strengthen the gear.
07-18-2013, 12:06 PM
#6838
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RE: Larger Revolver
ORIGINAL: Bennijiggs
Well, just joined the ripped my landing gear out of my body club. I
Well, just joined the ripped my landing gear out of my body club. I
07-18-2013, 02:13 PM
#6839
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RE: Larger Revolver
Thanks KC, could you attach that photo again in a larger formt? It's real small and blurry for my iPad. I think I can see a piece of metal on there. I bought some roofing flashing today but want to see how you did it.
07-18-2013, 05:01 PM
#6841
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RE: Larger Revolver
Geez, don't ya H A T E that! You read something like this and think that'll never happen to me, then it does! DARN IT!!! 
Go back a couple pages to find post # 6785 for the pictures I posted that Bill's refering to. The pic's are file pics I found here - don't want to take credit for posting them originally! These show the reinforcing process using sheet alum that's been cut to size then bent 90 degrees.
There's another set of pics real early in this string that show angle alum being used the same way. They may help you if you're going that route.
To find those, go to the top of this page and click on "GALLERY". It takes a minute, so don't try it on a slow connection, but it will proceed to load every picture ever uploaded to this particular (Larger Revolver) string 10 or 15 at a time. It's fast enough where you can cover a lot of country pretty quickly, but there are a LOT of pictures on file for this string. The angle alum. pics are early enough where they should be prety easy to locate in just a few minutes.
BTW, tattered wheel pants are a sign of expereince! Like battle wounds! Nothing to be ashamed of as long as they make it back to the pits after your flight! Don't be a litter bug!
I have to admit I did just replace mine too, but I was patching my patches. I was afraid of turniing into a litter bug. Somebody gave me the hair brained idea of using CA hinges for the purpose of patchinng wheel pants. If you haven't tried that yet, don't. All that did was remind me why I wasn't using them on my control surfaces! A little stress and the fabric part of the hinge peels right off the plastic part that give the hinge it's strength. Fine idea as a patch IF you could keep them from delaminating! So now, if I can't use them on control surfaces OR even use them for wheel pants patches, I'm not even going to save them any more. They're going straight to the round file! -Al
Go back a couple pages to find post # 6785 for the pictures I posted that Bill's refering to. The pic's are file pics I found here - don't want to take credit for posting them originally! These show the reinforcing process using sheet alum that's been cut to size then bent 90 degrees.
There's another set of pics real early in this string that show angle alum being used the same way. They may help you if you're going that route.
To find those, go to the top of this page and click on "GALLERY". It takes a minute, so don't try it on a slow connection, but it will proceed to load every picture ever uploaded to this particular (Larger Revolver) string 10 or 15 at a time. It's fast enough where you can cover a lot of country pretty quickly, but there are a LOT of pictures on file for this string. The angle alum. pics are early enough where they should be prety easy to locate in just a few minutes.
BTW, tattered wheel pants are a sign of expereince! Like battle wounds! Nothing to be ashamed of as long as they make it back to the pits after your flight! Don't be a litter bug!
I have to admit I did just replace mine too, but I was patching my patches. I was afraid of turniing into a litter bug. Somebody gave me the hair brained idea of using CA hinges for the purpose of patchinng wheel pants. If you haven't tried that yet, don't. All that did was remind me why I wasn't using them on my control surfaces! A little stress and the fabric part of the hinge peels right off the plastic part that give the hinge it's strength. Fine idea as a patch IF you could keep them from delaminating! So now, if I can't use them on control surfaces OR even use them for wheel pants patches, I'm not even going to save them any more. They're going straight to the round file! -Al
07-18-2013, 05:37 PM
#6842
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RE: Larger Revolver
Awesome! Thanks. I didn't know about that gallery function. All sorts of pics of how to do it. I will be beefing it up tommorow. Already started cutting my sheet metal to fit. Need to drill some holes now.
ORIGINAL: ahicks
Geez, don't ya H A T E that! You read something like this and think that'll never happen to me, then it does! DARN IT!!!
Go back a couple pages to find post # 6785 for the pictures I posted that Bill's refering to. The pic's are file pics I found here - don't want to take credit for posting them originally! These show the reinforcing process using sheet alum that's been cut to size then bent 90 degrees.
There's another set of pics real early in this string that show angle alum being used the same way. They may help you if you're going that route.
To find those, go to the top of this page and click on "GALLERY". It takes a minute, so don't try it on a slow connection, but it will proceed to load every picture ever uploaded to this particular (Larger Revolver) string 10 or 15 at a time. It's fast enough where you can cover a lot of country pretty quickly, but there are a LOT of pictures on file for this string. The angle alum. pics are early enough where they should be prety easy to locate in just a few minutes.
BTW, tattered wheel pants are a sign of expereince! Like battle wounds! Nothing to be ashamed of as long as they make it back to the pits after your flight! Don't be a litter bug!
I have to admit I did just replace mine too, but I was patching my patches. I was afraid of turniing into a litter bug. Somebody gave me the hair brained idea of using CA hinges for the purpose of patchinng wheel pants. If you haven't tried that yet, don't. All that did was remind me why I wasn't using them on my control surfaces! A little stress and the fabric part of the hinge peels right off the plastic part that give the hinge it's strength. Fine idea as a patch IF you could keep them from delaminating! So now, if I can't use them on control surfaces OR even use them for wheel pants patches, I'm not even going to save them any more. They're going straight to the round file! -Al
Geez, don't ya H A T E that! You read something like this and think that'll never happen to me, then it does! DARN IT!!!
Go back a couple pages to find post # 6785 for the pictures I posted that Bill's refering to. The pic's are file pics I found here - don't want to take credit for posting them originally! These show the reinforcing process using sheet alum that's been cut to size then bent 90 degrees.
There's another set of pics real early in this string that show angle alum being used the same way. They may help you if you're going that route.
To find those, go to the top of this page and click on "GALLERY". It takes a minute, so don't try it on a slow connection, but it will proceed to load every picture ever uploaded to this particular (Larger Revolver) string 10 or 15 at a time. It's fast enough where you can cover a lot of country pretty quickly, but there are a LOT of pictures on file for this string. The angle alum. pics are early enough where they should be prety easy to locate in just a few minutes.
BTW, tattered wheel pants are a sign of expereince! Like battle wounds! Nothing to be ashamed of as long as they make it back to the pits after your flight! Don't be a litter bug!
I have to admit I did just replace mine too, but I was patching my patches. I was afraid of turniing into a litter bug. Somebody gave me the hair brained idea of using CA hinges for the purpose of patchinng wheel pants. If you haven't tried that yet, don't. All that did was remind me why I wasn't using them on my control surfaces! A little stress and the fabric part of the hinge peels right off the plastic part that give the hinge it's strength. Fine idea as a patch IF you could keep them from delaminating! So now, if I can't use them on control surfaces OR even use them for wheel pants patches, I'm not even going to save them any more. They're going straight to the round file! -Al
07-19-2013, 06:08 AM
#6843
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Antwerp, NY
Posts: 62
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RE: Larger Revolver
Roof Flashing, what are you going to strengthen with that? That will only give you a false sense of security, but will do nothing to strengthen up a landing gear. There is a big difference between Soft Metal roof flashing and Hard Metalangle iron or flat stock. Noah's Ark was made of wood and far stronger than you can imagine to handle those huge waves and severe storms. Never under estimate the power of wood, providing one uses the right wood type and places pieces in the best possible positions as well as uses the best glue for particular gluing task. Glue joints that are clamped will be many times stronger than those that are just set in place without clamps. This was proven to me in Wood Shop Class in school by the professor. The bonding strength of a clamped joint far exceeds those pieces that are not clamped until the wood is completely dry. Sometimes one has to cut some wood out of the way and glue it back into place after a repair is finished in order to gain access to it. This will lower the stress level too, LOL. I will give an example. I wanted to strengthen up my tail section and the sides of the fuselage as well as change out my 2-56 hardware and put in new pushrods with 4-40 harware on my Super Kaos 60 Bridi Kit that I just had to replace the engine with a Super Tigre 90 for unlimited vertical performance; Yeah that is the ticket to full blown happiness. I thought this out for weeks before I finally decided to cut the bottom sheeting from the wing back to the tail. You probably know how it would make you feel doing that after covering it to what looked like perfection over 40 years ago. It took some careful cutting of the Monokote so it was neatly cut away and left me with an easily fixable covering that will not be able to be seen. The bottom sheeting was the thinest and the least evasive to cut away, and on the bottom, nobody sees that. I did such a neat job cutting the bottom sheeting off. It allowed me the great and roomy access for my strengthing modification project. It is coming along nicely. You would not believe what a foot of birch plywood did to strengthen the sides of the balsa fuselage back to the rear of the tail section. The triangle stock is next. From the stress of adding the 90 engine for more speed, plus a possible drop, from leaning against the walls over the years, onto the tail, it developed a stress crack about 1/4" down from the horizontal stabalizer and you could wiggle the horizontal stab up an down. Never ignore a small crack in your Monokote Covering. That is the warning sign before the parts start flying apart in the air, which I was lucky I found it before that happened. I pulled the landing gear out of another model two times before I finally got it strengthened up with 1/4" Birch Plywood and some triangle stock on my nice flying and nicel looking ShowTime 50. Oh, did I mention that the 2nd time was due to a slightly off the runway landing from an engine out scenario on takeoff that did not quite allow me to get fully back on the field. Never underestimate the power of tiny brush stalks in the hay. It ripped the firewall out as well as the landing gear. Now the firewall was far thinner than I know it should be, so I made a new 1/4" thick firewall out of Birch Plywood. Not only did this strengthen up drastically the firewall but a few stratigically placed 1/4" harder balsa stringers in a criss cross triangular shape besides that for added strength, not to mention replacing the stringers from the top of the firewall and back to the bulkhead at the front of the wing with larger 3/16" balsa plus an added couple more as an added engineering marvel, lol, gave me what I was looking for in a strong fuselage. There was also the forethought of knowing I would someday be removing that OS61 and replacing it with a Super Tigre 90 engine. That was a tough complicated little project, but well worth every hour spent on it. My gear stays on, I am ready for the 90 engine replacement over the winter, and Ilove how this airplane flies. Too bad GP quit making it. I would have loved the 90 size after flying the 50 size. So let that be a lesson on engine picking. A 90 will give you all you need and want in a 50-60 sized kit. Just take the time out to strengthen it before you put it all together, even if it is an ARF, strength is key to having your models still flying 40 plus years down the road. Hope this helps some of you based on your posts. Happy Flying everyone. My engineer friend has really taken valueable time to show me what a few extra pieces of wood can do and what additional strength and fuel proofing will do when painting on a layer of alcohol diluted epoxy that most of us just throw out because we do not like it over other brands. He grabs his fuselage and wings and tries to twist them when he builds them. If they crack loose at the glue joints or if they twist, he adds a few more sticks of the right wood and presto, an almost indestructible in flight model. I guess it pays off in the end because I just say him a week ago whack his flying wing Outlaw into the hay and bushes at wide open and very fast speed. Guess what, it only cracked his small firewall, easily repairable. Many thanks to Jamie, a very valuable asset to our club and to my learning curve. :-)
ORIGINAL: Bennijiggs
Thanks KC, could you attach that photo again in a larger formt? It's real small and blurry for my iPad. I think I can see a piece of metal on there. I bought some roofing flashing today but want to see how you did it.
Thanks KC, could you attach that photo again in a larger formt? It's real small and blurry for my iPad. I think I can see a piece of metal on there. I bought some roofing flashing today but want to see how you did it.
07-19-2013, 06:19 AM
#6844
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Antwerp, NY
Posts: 62
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RE: Larger Revolver
Iprefer to use fiberglass cloth and resin to fix my wheel pants and cowlings. It does a fine job. Easy to work with and those cheap acid brushes from the hardware store don't break the bank throwing them away when finished with the fiberglassing. There are many different weight flberglass cloths available. The larger selections come from an online boat supply place. A search on e-Bay helped me find this person that was selling smaller amounts of various weights, that he gave great descriptions on, plus he was knowlegable when it came to what weights were best for what jobs on model airplanes.
ORIGINAL: ahicks
Geez, don't ya H A T E that! You read something like this and think that'll never happen to me, then it does! DARN IT!!!
Go back a couple pages to find post # 6785 for the pictures I posted that Bill's refering to. The pic's are file pics I found here - don't want to take credit for posting them originally! These show the reinforcing process using sheet alum that's been cut to size then bent 90 degrees.
There's another set of pics real early in this string that show angle alum being used the same way. They may help you if you're going that route.
To find those, go to the top of this page and click on "GALLERY". It takes a minute, so don't try it on a slow connection, but it will proceed to load every picture ever uploaded to this particular (Larger Revolver) string 10 or 15 at a time. It's fast enough where you can cover a lot of country pretty quickly, but there are a LOT of pictures on file for this string. The angle alum. pics are early enough where they should be prety easy to locate in just a few minutes.
BTW, tattered wheel pants are a sign of expereince! Like battle wounds! Nothing to be ashamed of as long as they make it back to the pits after your flight! Don't be a litter bug!
I have to admit I did just replace mine too, but I was patching my patches. I was afraid of turniing into a litter bug. Somebody gave me the hair brained idea of using CA hinges for the purpose of patchinng wheel pants. If you haven't tried that yet, don't. All that did was remind me why I wasn't using them on my control surfaces! A little stress and the fabric part of the hinge peels right off the plastic part that give the hinge it's strength. Fine idea as a patch IF you could keep them from delaminating! So now, if I can't use them on control surfaces OR even use them for wheel pants patches, I'm not even going to save them any more. They're going straight to the round file! -Al
Geez, don't ya H A T E that! You read something like this and think that'll never happen to me, then it does! DARN IT!!!
Go back a couple pages to find post # 6785 for the pictures I posted that Bill's refering to. The pic's are file pics I found here - don't want to take credit for posting them originally! These show the reinforcing process using sheet alum that's been cut to size then bent 90 degrees.
There's another set of pics real early in this string that show angle alum being used the same way. They may help you if you're going that route.
To find those, go to the top of this page and click on "GALLERY". It takes a minute, so don't try it on a slow connection, but it will proceed to load every picture ever uploaded to this particular (Larger Revolver) string 10 or 15 at a time. It's fast enough where you can cover a lot of country pretty quickly, but there are a LOT of pictures on file for this string. The angle alum. pics are early enough where they should be prety easy to locate in just a few minutes.
BTW, tattered wheel pants are a sign of expereince! Like battle wounds! Nothing to be ashamed of as long as they make it back to the pits after your flight! Don't be a litter bug!
I have to admit I did just replace mine too, but I was patching my patches. I was afraid of turniing into a litter bug. Somebody gave me the hair brained idea of using CA hinges for the purpose of patchinng wheel pants. If you haven't tried that yet, don't. All that did was remind me why I wasn't using them on my control surfaces! A little stress and the fabric part of the hinge peels right off the plastic part that give the hinge it's strength. Fine idea as a patch IF you could keep them from delaminating! So now, if I can't use them on control surfaces OR even use them for wheel pants patches, I'm not even going to save them any more. They're going straight to the round file! -Al
07-19-2013, 06:33 AM
#6845
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Antwerp, NY
Posts: 62
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RE: Larger Revolver
Servos to use in most models Ihave from 90 size to G-38 and most recently 50cc airplanes with DLE-55's in them are the HiTec HS-5625' and the HS-5645's. Both are MG programable digital servos. Some of the 50cc planes require rudder servos exceeding 200 oz. in. of torque, and that is the only time I have to use anything different in the above models. The Revolver 50cc plane does not need a special HiTec Rudder Servo. I am using the 5625's for the elevator, rudder, and ailerons. Better to use 6v battery packs of 2700mah or higher with these servos. I am using (2) 2700mah packs, one for the ignition, one for the receiver, and they give about 1 1/2 to 2 hours of flight time. Enough for one day, LOL.
ORIGINAL: mschulz531
I'd be happy to give a flight report but I have to get the plane first!
I got the engine with Christmas money.
And yes, it is still on sale at HobbyPeople.net for $139!
The Magnum 180 is also on sale for $289 for any one who needs more power!
I'm hoping to get the plane in January with a end of year bonus from work...one step at a time.
Servos are the other purchase that I need to make...what torque rating does the Large Revolver require for the servos?
I'd be happy to give a flight report but I have to get the plane first!
I got the engine with Christmas money.
And yes, it is still on sale at HobbyPeople.net for $139!
The Magnum 180 is also on sale for $289 for any one who needs more power!
I'm hoping to get the plane in January with a end of year bonus from work...one step at a time.
Servos are the other purchase that I need to make...what torque rating does the Large Revolver require for the servos?
ORIGINAL: ptuxbury
Quite a few people considering the Magnum .91 RFS. I'm guessing because it is on sale for $140. I'm also considering this power plant so I'm curious to hear a flight report from one of you guys.
Quite a few people considering the Magnum .91 RFS. I'm guessing because it is on sale for $140. I'm also considering this power plant so I'm curious to hear a flight report from one of you guys.
07-19-2013, 08:25 AM
#6846
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Antwerp, NY
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RE: Larger Revolver
How to slow the revolver down:
With the new computer radios, you can program into any of your extra channel switches and also program in how far the throttle must be reduced for the spoilers to come on. By spoilers, sometimes referred to as speed brakes, I mean both ailerons will go up to add drag and to kill the lift. When setup properly, and fine tuned, the Revolver will steepen its descent and not pick up speed, the goal. With mine, I flick the switch programmed for the spoilers on the transmitter when I decide to land. The spoilers do not come on unless I reduce the throttle back to witin 1 click of full idle direction. I do not turn chop the throttle all the way back until I am over the threshold. Then the plane descends at a steeper angle, yet fully controlable. The ailerons work great when the spoilers are on, no effect on them. Yesterday me and my engineer friend went to our club field and he tweaked these spoilers for me. Reason, I did not like descending at an angle greater than 45 degrees. He saw that, and modified the settings in the transmitter. The result, now I am able to land it within the field distance easily, but still I am using more runway than I would like to use for landing. He can land my 50cc Revolver at his feet every time, but me, I need more practice. I am not done with the tweaking yet. I think I can improve upon the plane's attitude when the spoilers come on. He has programmed in a mix for the ailerons (spoilers) under the flap system with the elevator, which I believe may be in a different location in the menu. I believe he went the wrong way in programing the mix of elevator. That is why it dives down so much. I think he should have programmed in some up elevator so it descends steeper without dropping the nose so far. I do not want a high alpha attitude because this is dangerous with relative wind theory and it will get the airplane in a unstable condition very quickly, especially with varying wind direction and wind speed. I am not using up the entire runway length now, but I know I can get the distance I am using cut about in half with further tweaking. I did not want to continue tweaking yesterday because there was a cross wind that kept changing velocity and direction quickly throughout the approach. Give me a few days and I will tell you's how it is going with the tweaking.
With the new computer radios, you can program into any of your extra channel switches and also program in how far the throttle must be reduced for the spoilers to come on. By spoilers, sometimes referred to as speed brakes, I mean both ailerons will go up to add drag and to kill the lift. When setup properly, and fine tuned, the Revolver will steepen its descent and not pick up speed, the goal. With mine, I flick the switch programmed for the spoilers on the transmitter when I decide to land. The spoilers do not come on unless I reduce the throttle back to witin 1 click of full idle direction. I do not turn chop the throttle all the way back until I am over the threshold. Then the plane descends at a steeper angle, yet fully controlable. The ailerons work great when the spoilers are on, no effect on them. Yesterday me and my engineer friend went to our club field and he tweaked these spoilers for me. Reason, I did not like descending at an angle greater than 45 degrees. He saw that, and modified the settings in the transmitter. The result, now I am able to land it within the field distance easily, but still I am using more runway than I would like to use for landing. He can land my 50cc Revolver at his feet every time, but me, I need more practice. I am not done with the tweaking yet. I think I can improve upon the plane's attitude when the spoilers come on. He has programmed in a mix for the ailerons (spoilers) under the flap system with the elevator, which I believe may be in a different location in the menu. I believe he went the wrong way in programing the mix of elevator. That is why it dives down so much. I think he should have programmed in some up elevator so it descends steeper without dropping the nose so far. I do not want a high alpha attitude because this is dangerous with relative wind theory and it will get the airplane in a unstable condition very quickly, especially with varying wind direction and wind speed. I am not using up the entire runway length now, but I know I can get the distance I am using cut about in half with further tweaking. I did not want to continue tweaking yesterday because there was a cross wind that kept changing velocity and direction quickly throughout the approach. Give me a few days and I will tell you's how it is going with the tweaking.
ORIGINAL: jet22b
Hi Widget;
I have both Revolver and to me the small one is faster than the big one. I have them both pack in my suv for the trip to the club field for some winter fun!! The sun is out with blue skies and no rain in sight. We don't get to many days like this here in the Great North West. I know the field will be full today!! Go to Great Plane website and you will see the large revolver on their video. The one in the vid is using the same engine that I have in mines. A OS Max 91II FS, ( 4 stroke ). One thing good about the large revolver, it do slow down for landing and thats a big plus!!! The small one can be a pain to slow down.
Got to run now, the sky is calling me!!!
Have a great day everyone!!!
Sonny
aka
jet22b
Hi Widget;
I have both Revolver and to me the small one is faster than the big one. I have them both pack in my suv for the trip to the club field for some winter fun!! The sun is out with blue skies and no rain in sight. We don't get to many days like this here in the Great North West. I know the field will be full today!! Go to Great Plane website and you will see the large revolver on their video. The one in the vid is using the same engine that I have in mines. A OS Max 91II FS, ( 4 stroke ). One thing good about the large revolver, it do slow down for landing and thats a big plus!!! The small one can be a pain to slow down.
Got to run now, the sky is calling me!!!
Have a great day everyone!!!
Sonny
aka
jet22b
07-19-2013, 08:34 AM
#6847
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Antwerp, NY
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RE: Larger Revolver
If ground clearance is an issue, there is no issue. A smaller prop with a greater pitch solves that. Even using a 3-blade prop works nicely as long as you do not over do it with the length and pitch of the blades. A lot of people do not like 3-blade props, but I can tell you that Graupner 3-blade sure turned the speed and the vertical up a tad or two on my Super Kaos 60. I like the Graupner prop because there is less flexing and it is a very sturdy material. You have to shop though for the desirable sizes it seems, but there are hobby shops still carrying them in their stock. One can always to to Graupner directly.
ORIGINAL: Tony Gag Jr.
Is there enough ground clearance with the bigger props for the big engines? An O.S. 75AX will swing a 14" prop. Is there enough ground clearance? Thanks for the input on the Super Tigre but I am a huge fan of O.S. engines so my choices are either the 61FX or the 75AX.
Thanks,
Tony
Is there enough ground clearance with the bigger props for the big engines? An O.S. 75AX will swing a 14" prop. Is there enough ground clearance? Thanks for the input on the Super Tigre but I am a huge fan of O.S. engines so my choices are either the 61FX or the 75AX.
Thanks,
Tony
07-19-2013, 10:38 AM
#6848
My Feedback: (2)
RE: Larger Revolver
flyboydale54 -
I can assure you the roof flashing reinforcement method works as intended. It's actually been tested to failure pretty recently? A couple months ago I hit a "hole" in the air while flying a little lower than I should have been, resulting in me hitting the ground at very high speed unintentionally. The plane hit the ground dead flat, so flat the incident left little damage to the cowl (1 small crack in the gel coat!) and I'm still flying on the same prop? Unfortunately the landing gear was wiped clean right off the bottom of the plane - with the bottom half of the fire wall still attached..... and yes, as you can imagine the wheel skirts received even more "experience".
If you get a chance to check it out, the stuff I'm talking about might not be as soft as you think it might be? Believe/do as you like, but try it before telling everyone it will give only a "false sense of security".
Point being above (as well as your flaperon solution to slowing the plane), there are often multiple good answers to a problem. Not sure about you, but that's what attracts me to groups like this. So I can see, discuss and better understand different solutions to problems we run in to? -Al
I can assure you the roof flashing reinforcement method works as intended. It's actually been tested to failure pretty recently? A couple months ago I hit a "hole" in the air while flying a little lower than I should have been, resulting in me hitting the ground at very high speed unintentionally. The plane hit the ground dead flat, so flat the incident left little damage to the cowl (1 small crack in the gel coat!) and I'm still flying on the same prop? Unfortunately the landing gear was wiped clean right off the bottom of the plane - with the bottom half of the fire wall still attached..... and yes, as you can imagine the wheel skirts received even more "experience".
If you get a chance to check it out, the stuff I'm talking about might not be as soft as you think it might be? Believe/do as you like, but try it before telling everyone it will give only a "false sense of security".
Point being above (as well as your flaperon solution to slowing the plane), there are often multiple good answers to a problem. Not sure about you, but that's what attracts me to groups like this. So I can see, discuss and better understand different solutions to problems we run in to? -Al
07-19-2013, 10:55 AM
#6849
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: League City, TX
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RE: Larger Revolver
Al
Well said.
The very best way of slowing a plane down, full scale or model, is RPM control. Get the idle down, and the plane will land, without all the potential adverse effects of flaperons (worse) or spoilerons (aerodynamically a bit better). I land my R70 that is propped with a 14x12 prop by having a low idle. With a lesser pitch prop (7-8) that most people run, I cannot imagine real difficulty in getting her down.
On the servo matter, many folks have found that the HS-56xx series of servos don't center that well. I have a set of them on another plane, and they are OK, but there are certainly other options that may be better. Clearly, this is NOT an airframe in which one should generally install plastic gear servos, unless the flying style is racetrack only. The question of digital vs analog is a personal choice, with pros and cons on each side.
Well said.
The very best way of slowing a plane down, full scale or model, is RPM control. Get the idle down, and the plane will land, without all the potential adverse effects of flaperons (worse) or spoilerons (aerodynamically a bit better). I land my R70 that is propped with a 14x12 prop by having a low idle. With a lesser pitch prop (7-8) that most people run, I cannot imagine real difficulty in getting her down.
On the servo matter, many folks have found that the HS-56xx series of servos don't center that well. I have a set of them on another plane, and they are OK, but there are certainly other options that may be better. Clearly, this is NOT an airframe in which one should generally install plastic gear servos, unless the flying style is racetrack only. The question of digital vs analog is a personal choice, with pros and cons on each side.
07-19-2013, 01:10 PM
#6850
My Feedback: (2)
RE: Larger Revolver
ORIGINAL: wjcalhoun
Al
Well said.
The very best way of slowing a plane down, full scale or model, is RPM control. Get the idle down, and the plane will land, without all the potential adverse effects of flaperons (worse) or spoilerons (aerodynamically a bit better). I land my R70 that is propped with a 14x12 prop by having a low idle. With a lesser pitch prop (7-8) that most people run, I cannot imagine real difficulty in getting her down.
On the servo matter, many folks have found that the HS-56xx series of servos don't center that well. I have a set of them on another plane, and they are OK, but there are certainly other options that may be better. Clearly, this is NOT an airframe in which one should generally install plastic gear servos, unless the flying style is racetrack only. The question of digital vs analog is a personal choice, with pros and cons on each side.
Al
Well said.
The very best way of slowing a plane down, full scale or model, is RPM control. Get the idle down, and the plane will land, without all the potential adverse effects of flaperons (worse) or spoilerons (aerodynamically a bit better). I land my R70 that is propped with a 14x12 prop by having a low idle. With a lesser pitch prop (7-8) that most people run, I cannot imagine real difficulty in getting her down.
On the servo matter, many folks have found that the HS-56xx series of servos don't center that well. I have a set of them on another plane, and they are OK, but there are certainly other options that may be better. Clearly, this is NOT an airframe in which one should generally install plastic gear servos, unless the flying style is racetrack only. The question of digital vs analog is a personal choice, with pros and cons on each side.
Regarding the "very best way"? IMHO, that needs to involve stall speed in addition to rpm. Anything you can do to lower either will be part of the better plan?
The easiest way to lower stall speed is by adjusting your CG. From previous conversations, I know Bill has moved his back, and I darn sure have, and contrary to what some flight line "experts" might say about the practice, our planes still fly pretty darn good? So the point is if you're serious about slowing the plane down for landing, you owe it to yourself to look into how the cg affects landing speed.
I think you'll find the practice of adjusting your CG right near the top of the list when trimming a first class aerobatic plane to fly it's best. The lower landing speed you normally get out of doing that is merely a bonus.... the real intent is so the plane flies BETTER! -Al
