Black Horse AT6 Texan
07-06-2010, 03:45 PM
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Black Horse AT6 Texan
Hello. This is my first post on this forum so be gentle with me.
I havea question to start on this forum. Is there anybody here that has built and flown the Black Horse AT6 Texan?
I would like to know if anyone has had an issue with the centre of gravity. As far as I can see on the instructions the c of g is quoted as being in 2 different places.
The 1st is shown as 77mm from the leading edge at the fuslage sides and the other is set at 510mm from the wing tip and then 77mm back from this point.
Does anyone know for sure where it is meant to be.
Ray
I havea question to start on this forum. Is there anybody here that has built and flown the Black Horse AT6 Texan?
I would like to know if anyone has had an issue with the centre of gravity. As far as I can see on the instructions the c of g is quoted as being in 2 different places.
The 1st is shown as 77mm from the leading edge at the fuslage sides and the other is set at 510mm from the wing tip and then 77mm back from this point.
Does anyone know for sure where it is meant to be.
Ray
07-07-2010, 12:46 AM
#2
RE: Black Horse AT6 Texan
Hello from Greece Ray ...
Ammm,
what BH AT-6 ARF are you referring to ?
This NEW version ?
Or this older version and bigger one ?
Will you post some pics ?
Ammm,
what BH AT-6 ARF are you referring to ?
This NEW version ?
Or this older version and bigger one ?
Will you post some pics ?
07-08-2010, 02:02 AM
#5
RE: Black Horse AT6 Texan
ORIGINAL: Pennbrit
I am refering to the new one. Silver and red cowling.
Ray.
I am refering to the new one. Silver and red cowling.
Ray.
i don't have an idea of CG,
but you may check other AT-6's of the same size and see where they put it at!
Nevertheless,
post some pictures of this gorgeous AT-6
because
little to no info is available!
Kostas
07-08-2010, 01:59 PM
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RE: Black Horse AT6 Texan
To be honest the reason I am trying to find out this info is that last Saturday I test flew the Texan and it crashed before it had done a circuit. It spun into the ground out of control. I am convinced the C of G is in the wrong place on the instuctions. 
I have ordered a new one. Will try again.
Ray
I have ordered a new one. Will try again.
Ray
07-09-2010, 08:36 PM
#7
RE: Black Horse AT6 Texan
I would try to locate the main spar, I have the Seagull model, and it and the BH are very nearly the same dimensions. The BH model was designed with a gas engine in mind, what engine were you using?
07-10-2010, 02:25 AM
#9
RE: Black Horse AT6 Texan
ORIGINAL: tailskid
Take a photo of the interior of BH Texan's fuse and post the picture - same mfg will build two different fuselages, just different color scheme.
Take a photo of the interior of BH Texan's fuse and post the picture - same mfg will build two different fuselages, just different color scheme.
Tailskid you think that the Seagulls Texan that also a bit of green trim ,
comes from the same manufacturer as the BH one ?
The BH's AT-6 wing has flaps,
the Seagull one , no ...[
]But i second the fuselage pics , too !
07-10-2010, 05:13 AM
#10
RE: Black Horse AT6 Texan
I forgot to mention, if you used the retracts, you need to balance with the gear in the Up position.
If you look at both of the manuals, you will see very similar construction, I have had my hands on both planes, from Seagull and Black Horse are nearly the same.
They are so similar, I bought the Black Horse retracts to use on my Seagull model. With all the mods I have had to do to put a gas engine in the Seagull, I should have bought the Black Horse version.
If you look at both of the manuals, you will see very similar construction, I have had my hands on both planes, from Seagull and Black Horse are nearly the same.
They are so similar, I bought the Black Horse retracts to use on my Seagull model. With all the mods I have had to do to put a gas engine in the Seagull, I should have bought the Black Horse version.
07-10-2010, 05:25 AM
#11
RE: Black Horse AT6 Texan
ORIGINAL: Pennbrit
To be honest the reason I am trying to find out this info is that last Saturday I test flew the Texan and it crashed before it had done a circuit. It spun into the ground out of control. I am convinced the C of G is in the wrong place on the instuctions. [img][/img]
I have ordered a new one. Will try again.
Ray
To be honest the reason I am trying to find out this info is that last Saturday I test flew the Texan and it crashed before it had done a circuit. It spun into the ground out of control. I am convinced the C of G is in the wrong place on the instuctions. [img][/img]
I have ordered a new one. Will try again.
Ray
sorry to hear about your crash !
Maybe it's not that bad,
do you want to post some pics here to inspect the damage
and offer any possible suggestion for re-construction ?
07-10-2010, 03:55 PM
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RE: Black Horse AT6 Texan
ORIGINAL: Kostas1
Ray ,
sorry to hear about your crash !
Maybe it's not that bad,
do you want to post some pics here to inspect the damage
and offer any possible suggestion for re-construction ?
ORIGINAL: Pennbrit
To be honest the reason I am trying to find out this info is that last Saturday I test flew the Texan and it crashed before it had done a circuit. It spun into the ground out of control. I am convinced the C of G is in the wrong place on the instuctions. [img][/img]
I have ordered a new one. Will try again.
Ray
To be honest the reason I am trying to find out this info is that last Saturday I test flew the Texan and it crashed before it had done a circuit. It spun into the ground out of control. I am convinced the C of G is in the wrong place on the instuctions. [img][/img]
I have ordered a new one. Will try again.
Ray
sorry to hear about your crash !
Maybe it's not that bad,
do you want to post some pics here to inspect the damage
and offer any possible suggestion for re-construction ?
I am not even going to try and fix it. I went and bought a new one today and I am going to badger the importers of this model untill I get the truth out of them that they are importing a model that I have pointed out the CoG in shown wrong in the instructions.
Even if it means building it and then taking it to the warehouse and flying it in front of them to proove a point.
I have done some research and every one I have spoken to agrees the CoG is wrong.
So if anyone knows the exact measurement for the CoG from the wing leading edge ( on the parallel centre section) could you let me know please.
Thanks
Ray.
07-10-2010, 10:36 PM
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RE: Black Horse AT6 Texan
If you had been able to perform even part of a circuit as you indicated, the C.G. could not have been that far off as you had it.
If the plane was fairly neutral in it's C.G. setting, it would then be easy to stall if too much elevator was commanded, causing a wing over and spiral into the ground. Especially if the wing loading was high.
3D pilots tend to purposely seek neutral C.G.'s...
Most Warbirds tend to have the C.G. further forward, which helps to prevent reduce this tendancy but it will not eliminate it all together.
The best way to eliminate the tendancy is to lower the wing loading.
If the plane was fairly neutral in it's C.G. setting, it would then be easy to stall if too much elevator was commanded, causing a wing over and spiral into the ground. Especially if the wing loading was high.
3D pilots tend to purposely seek neutral C.G.'s...
Most Warbirds tend to have the C.G. further forward, which helps to prevent reduce this tendancy but it will not eliminate it all together.
The best way to eliminate the tendancy is to lower the wing loading.
07-11-2010, 07:30 AM
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RE: Black Horse AT6 Texan
Thanks for all the info. I had a chad with some of the guys at the field yesterday and it has become quite clear that the instructions are showing the MAC point but it says CG. It seems that the CG is infact 77mm from the leading edge. I have ballanced it at the MAC point hence the very unstable flying.
Ray.
Ray.
07-11-2010, 07:49 AM
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RE: Black Horse AT6 Texan
ORIGINAL: opjose
If you had been able to perform even part of a circuit as you indicated, the C.G. could not have been that far off as you had it.
If the plane was fairly neutral in it's C.G. setting, it would then be easy to stall if too much elevator was commanded, causing a wing over and spiral into the ground. Especially if the wing loading was high.
3D pilots tend to purposely seek neutral C.G.'s...
Most Warbirds tend to have the C.G. further forward, which helps to prevent reduce this tendancy but it will not eliminate it all together.
The best way to eliminate the tendancy is to lower the wing loading.
If you had been able to perform even part of a circuit as you indicated, the C.G. could not have been that far off as you had it.
If the plane was fairly neutral in it's C.G. setting, it would then be easy to stall if too much elevator was commanded, causing a wing over and spiral into the ground. Especially if the wing loading was high.
3D pilots tend to purposely seek neutral C.G.'s...
Most Warbirds tend to have the C.G. further forward, which helps to prevent reduce this tendancy but it will not eliminate it all together.
The best way to eliminate the tendancy is to lower the wing loading.
I fly aerobatic models mostly and have the CofG right back but this was totaly out of control.
But thanks
Ray.
07-11-2010, 03:21 PM
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RE: Black Horse AT6 Texan
Pennbrit, i think you may have misinterpreted the manual, you don't measure from the leading edges , you measure @ the wing tip, ie use a right angle & measure back from there, & mark, then you string a line to the other edge of the wing & make your marks close to the fuse/in line with the string.
Remember these wings taper off & this is how it is done.
Then you invert your plane with the landing gear down....i know this as i hankered after At6's when i was learning to fly low wing tail draggers.
Remember these wings taper off & this is how it is done.
Then you invert your plane with the landing gear down....i know this as i hankered after At6's when i was learning to fly low wing tail draggers.
ORIGINAL: Pennbrit
I am not even going to try and fix it. I went and bought a new one today and I am going to badger the importers of this model untill I get the truth out of them that they are importing a model that I have pointed out the CoG in shown wrong in the instructions.
Even if it means building it and then taking it to the warehouse and flying it in front of them to proove a point.
I have done some research and every one I have spoken to agrees the CoG is wrong.
So if anyone knows the exact measurement for the CoG from the wing leading edge ( on the parallel centre section) could you let me know please.
Thanks
Ray.
ORIGINAL: Kostas1
Ray ,
sorry to hear about your crash !
Maybe it's not that bad,
do you want to post some pics here to inspect the damage
and offer any possible suggestion for re-construction ?
ORIGINAL: Pennbrit
To be honest the reason I am trying to find out this info is that last Saturday I test flew the Texan and it crashed before it had done a circuit. It spun into the ground out of control. I am convinced the C of G is in the wrong place on the instuctions. [img][/img]
I have ordered a new one. Will try again.
Ray
To be honest the reason I am trying to find out this info is that last Saturday I test flew the Texan and it crashed before it had done a circuit. It spun into the ground out of control. I am convinced the C of G is in the wrong place on the instuctions. [img][/img]
I have ordered a new one. Will try again.
Ray
sorry to hear about your crash !
Maybe it's not that bad,
do you want to post some pics here to inspect the damage
and offer any possible suggestion for re-construction ?
I am not even going to try and fix it. I went and bought a new one today and I am going to badger the importers of this model untill I get the truth out of them that they are importing a model that I have pointed out the CoG in shown wrong in the instructions.
Even if it means building it and then taking it to the warehouse and flying it in front of them to proove a point.
I have done some research and every one I have spoken to agrees the CoG is wrong.
So if anyone knows the exact measurement for the CoG from the wing leading edge ( on the parallel centre section) could you let me know please.
Thanks
Ray.
07-12-2010, 10:36 AM
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RE: Black Horse AT6 Texan
ORIGINAL: Pennbrit
When I say I managed part of a circuit it was a pure fluke. The whole time I was trying to keep it airbourne.
I fly aerobatic models mostly and have the CofG right back but this was totaly out of control.
But thanks
Ray.
When I say I managed part of a circuit it was a pure fluke. The whole time I was trying to keep it airbourne.
I fly aerobatic models mostly and have the CofG right back but this was totaly out of control.
But thanks
Ray.
Yup if it felt out of control, there's little doubt the C.G. was indeed too far back.
07-13-2010, 09:59 PM
#25
Senior Member
RE: Black Horse AT6 Texan
The other trick is to put a little wash out on this sort of aerollin (half wing out to the tip - say 4mm up on both) which will help prevent a wing tip dropping at least on landing approach.