DESERT RATT

My Feedback: (7)

I've used nothing but Nicads since they came out. Now, I'm contemplating Nihm.
I have read just about everything on the web. Definitely here and the other board trying to get the charging down on them.
I just about think I've got it until the next post I read about them and it's different.

I'll fill you in on what I have for charging. I own three different types of chargers Hobbico's accu cycle, Cirrus cycle pro, and a Imax 6a. I bought 4 Hi-Energy 6.0 volt 2200 Mah nihm's.


I have tried charging these things a few times on all the charges and the most I'm getting is 1200 Mah. using the NiCad chargers. I must be setting the Imax up wrong and only getting about 700 mah out of. (Yes. I have looked at all the youtube videos)
would someone walk my dumb *** through charging on any of these chargers?
On the Imax, I use the auto settings and still no luck.
I'm not against buying another charger but I'd like to see if it's me or my chargers first. Pretty sure it's me.... LOL

Thanks in advance guys, I'm really feeling stupid on this one. And apparently am.

Truckracer

My Feedback: (19)

What are you using these batteries for? Receiver / servo power for an airplane or other application? Also, where did you source your batteries from and what is their cell size, cell brand, impedance, etc.

DESERT RATT

My Feedback: (7)

I can't run a Charger and you ask me these things? LOL
which of these chargers are you familiar with?

Batteries from Hobby people and many other resources on the Web.
HE5N2200AASZ

Truckracer

My Feedback: (19)

Well I thought it was important to know what kind of batteries you are trying to charge and what they are being used for. I know what they are now but still don't know what they are being used for. Many people post questions here about airplane, car and other applications. Any additional info you can supply would be helpful. I assume this is for an airplane?

I have experience with the Imax and Hobbico charger but would probably base any help on the Imax as it is more versatile and set up in the fairly common (4) button format common among many different brands. I'll check back here tomorrow and if someone else hasn't helped you by then, we'll see if I can had you in a direction.

You might want to visit the Hangtimes Hobbies / NOBS batteries site for additional info on NiMh batteries and the different types available. Even if you don't buy from them, they are a valuable information source.

http://hangtimes.com/

Look on the left side of the page for info on NiMh batteries and especially the "sport" category as this is the type of cells you dealing with.

DESERT RATT

My Feedback: (7)

Sorry Truckracer I forgot to tell you what they're for.

Receiver and servos.

da Rock

You "can't get more than 1200" ???? And you're charging with "the NiCad" setting?

All the chargers I've got report how many mAh they put into the battery that's being charged. And I haven't ever seen a meter that reports how many mAh are in the battery being tested.

How are you reading how full your batteries are?

The meter I use to read capacity reports 0% to 100%. The chargers I have that can juice up NiMH cells all report mAh they put into the battery. There should never be a time you need to put the full capacity into any battery. You're charging up those batteries, and they should have some charge left so the mAh being added should really be something like 1200 mAh.

We ruin batteries when we discharge them completely. From what you've said, it sounds like you expect to use 100% from your rechargables. Their voltage drops below usable levels way before we can do that.

Every charger I've got has a NiMH setting. Using NiCad isn't a good idea for NiMH batteries, at least with them.

flyinwalenda

My Feedback: (5)

I'm not a fan of NiMh packs as they have too many failures (cells dying,false-peaking, etc) and I have switched to LiFe packs as my old Nixx packs fail.
Anyway, I assume you mean you have an Imax B6, charger ?
If so it will charge,cycle Nixx packs and it will charge and maintain Lixx packs if you decide to try them.
* Connect the NiMh pack to the charger.
*Press the left button until " NiMh Batt" appears.
* Press the right button to select.
*Press the middle buttons until NiMh charge MAN" appears.
*Press the right button to select and highlight the amperage (lower right on the screen).
*Press the middle buttons to adjust the amperage rate for the battery. In your case you would select 2.2amps for the 2200mah packs.
*Press and hold the right button to start the charge.
You will see the amount of ma put into the pack on the display as the charge is in progress and the total when the charge has completed.

Edit: If the charger completes and the pack is not warm to the touch then the pack has false-peaked and you need to start the process over again until the pack takes a full charge. Note: this can take several tries until the pack responds ad it can happen again and again. One of the reasons I don't care for NiMh packs.

Truckracer

My Feedback: (19)

Good charger tutorial from 'walenda. I'll add the following.

First, did you ever do a "forming charge" when you received the batteries? This is a low rate charge over a long period of time which can best be done with the wall wart type charger provided with most radios. You'll find quite a bit of info about what a forming charge does and why it is important here .....

http://hangtimes.com/rcbattery_faq.html

If you don't perform this first important charge, your batteries may never fully deliver their rated capacity.

From there, how are you testing your batteries for capacity? The only true way to do this is by performing a known discharge over a recorded period of time. Your charger will perform this function. The batteries you purchased are "high capacity, high impedance" batteries which are rated to deliver a fairly low current over a long period of time. In this case, you probably need to perform your discharge test using a current setting of something like .5A maximum or your readings will be well below your expectations. Most of the 4 button chargers have a timer set to 2 hours and your discharge test will take much longer than that so when the discharge cycle times out, simply restart the discharge cycle again and note the discharge readings on a piece of paper. When the discharge finally completes, add the readings obtained during the timed cycles for your total capacity. For the type of batteries you have, I'd expect to see something like 1800 MAh. as a typical reading when discharged to 1.0V / cell or 5 V. for a 5 cell pack.

Going forward using your Imax charger, these batteries being high impedance types, they will not take kindly to a high current charge as they will overheat long before the charge is complete. Once again, I would recommend a low .5A charge setting and if the charger times out before the charge cycle completes, just hit the start button again to complete the charge. This type of battery is prone to "false peak detection" which usually can occur if the charge rate is too high or too low. Usually a too high charge will yield a false peak detect and with a too low charge rate, the charger may never detect when the batteries are fully charged and the charger will continue charge until it times out. If you ever notice your batteries getting more than just warm to the touch, something went wrong with the charge cycle .... usually caused by wrong settings for the battery type.

Many people have success with this type of battery if their current demands in the airplane are low, which means 4 or 5 standard servos. The last several years I used NiMh batteries, I only used the low impedance types that were capable of high current outputs as they were just more reliable for all applications. They are considerably more expensive than the higher impedance types and with NiMh being more and more out of favor these days, the cell size selections are now limited.

You have the chargers so I would have to recommend one of the LiFe batteries available these days. You can find low cost ones on through expensive ones and even the cheap ones will offer consistent, easy charging with current capacities that far exceed most NiMh types. If you want bullet proof batteries, the genuine hard, cylinder celled A123 LiFe batteries are hard to beat but the poly pack types offered by many outlets also work very well.

oliveDrab

I've been using Hydrimax 2000 maH 6 volt NiMH's since 2006 in .60-sized and 1.20-sized planes and have never had a failure. The radio's I bought in the past (Futaba and Hitec) both came with a wall charger (trickle charger) for charging the transmitter and receiver batteries. If you know you're going to fly the next day, simply charge your transmitter and receiver batteries ... overnight ... with the wall charger that came with your radio.

I have a kick-***** Hyperion charger that will charge Lipos, LiFe's, NiMH ... but I don't use it to charge NiMH. Just use the wall charger to trickle charge your NiMH overnight.

After looking at the planes in your gallery I'm thinking a 5-cell 6 volt 2000 maH NiMH will work just fine. There are planes that would benefit from dual LiFe's, such as my jet and my Rascal 110, but for .60-sized planes a 4 or 5 cell NiMH is just fine.

Don't let a NiMH sit in your garage for several months unused. If you try to use it after letting it sit for several months, you may find that it has self-discharged and has killed itself.

Truckracer

My Feedback: (19)

Good info from olive Drab! Sometimes simple is better but oh, there are so many good choices of products these days. We have a choice of products to fit so many applications .... it wasn't that way in the past.

c/f

My Feedback: (1)

42 years modeling SR nicad packs were the bomb, never cared much for NmH but forced to use for awhile till lipo, which are a solid technology and dont care for LifE sorta the NMH comp to Lipo in my mind.

My buddy literally sells 1000 's of NmH packs for TX. both JR and Futaba and 4 and 5 cell cause some old timers wont switch he puts his own label on it and derates them by 25% as compared to the individual cell stamping, tells people to use walwart for days on first charge and gives a year warranty. People look him up and tell him how good his packs exceed his label rating, if they ever removed the shrink they would not sleep at night cause they never make the OEM rating just sayin, My Hyperion charges always did better than Shulze chargers on NmH.

For me the best alternative to Nicad lovers that will give you the same peace of mind is A 123 packs. get them from Andy at electro dynamics. thats been my expieriances.

geeter

My Feedback: (110)

I have used nimh battries for years on three different radios in the tx and rx battries without fail. Just charge them before you go flying and there very reliable. I wouldn't use anything else. I don't cycle them or worry about them much. Just check voltage of the packs to make sure they don't drop a cell. Have used them in nitro helis planes, nitro and gas powered. No reason to change.

DESERT RATT

My Feedback: (7)

Thanks for every ones input, I Seriously mean that.

I'm doing my break in with a factory wall charger, I do that two times, Then I set the Imax to 1.5 and do that 2 times, after that I charge the batteries @ 2.2.

Last night I finally set the charger to Manual, and also took the time cut off to 300 minutes. (Random number)

Truckracer, I let the batteries completely cool down before I start the next phase. checked the batteries today and found a 1669 and 1741. so I think this means they are coming around.

flyinwalenda ,You put on paper just what I needed! Thank you much. And with the problems that are inherent in these batteries I just may go back to the old NICADS even though I like the good things NIHMS have to offer..

In 40 years of flying I have only lost one aircraft due to the battery ,( My fault!) I forgot to preflight) the aircraft, battery was too low to keep her in the air. That was around 1990.

I read a post where some guy never discharges his NHIM batteries, Just throw them on the battery and charges them. Doesn't sound very good to me. If you don't know where the battery is, rather a good spot of mah's or low mah's any response to this? Oh, I have the cirrus lit battery checker in all but a couple of planes I fly.

Once again, Thank everyone so very much for your input. I believe I have charging these things finally down due to your help.

DESERT RATT

My Feedback: (7)

Hi Olive drab, My garage is almost obsolete, I'm building up to 120/140 size aircraft. Which Hyperion model do you have?

jetmaven

If you go to hangtime hobbies.com , you'll find the grand dissertation on NIMH's . Basically the message is this , let them get ever so slightly warm while charging , never never hot . I've used nothing but NIMH's and their modern cousin , ENELOOPS for years in my T/D sailplanes with zero issues .
Hangtime hobbies is a good source .
Desertratt is right on the money , I also use the wall wart charger with no problems at all .

Truckracer

My Feedback: (19)

Dessert Ratt, good to know they are coming around. I would highly recommend you reduce your charge rate though. That style of battery just won't take the higher charge rates over the long haul without damage. A quality battery would have had a data sheet that specified what the cells were capable of and the recommended charge rates. As I and others recommended, visit the Hangtimes website for info. Also, Radical RC has some good info. Good luck as you go forward.

DESERT RATT

My Feedback: (7)

Thanks Truckracer!

One more thing is happening that I feel is weird Why would after using my Imax have it tell me the batteries discharged then I put the battery on my Cirrus charger (no further charge) have it still show another 1700 mah left.?

Truckracer

My Feedback: (19)

Sorry, I have no answer for that question without having the chargers and batteries at my location for tests.

DESERT RATT

My Feedback: (7)

sorry, double post!

flyinwalenda

My Feedback: (5)

Is it a "real" Imax charger or is it a cheap chicom copy or clone? Post a picture of the charger.
If it's a copy/clone then the problem is cheap components and sub-par workmanship resulting in erratic charging and balancing. I had two of these clones years ago and they were junk from the start;never charged or balanced accurately.

turnnburn

My Feedback: (49)

I have had VERY mixed results with nimhs . I have had the best results with JR nimh packs. I use Litco alpha 4 charger for most of my charging BUT I only use C10 charge, no fast charging not even with the function is for fast charging Nimhs.

I have had mixed results with the Hydramix brand. I personally prefer to avoid these but I am using a couple hydramix packs that were purchased recently with good results so far.

I can't speak to any other brands as this is all I have used.

Make sure you never NEVER ever use peak detection fast charge. I learned this lesson the hard way.

corvettez06

My Feedback: (8)

I use Hydrimax 2000 and 1600 mah NIMH batteries. I recharge them with the Hobbico Accu cycle charger. I use the factory default settings it has for NIMH and just change the mah rating. I do not have any issues at all. All my batteries charge just over their mah rating. I dont think it matters with nimh, but i do cycle them once in a while.

stegl

Like Turnnburn ; I too used the Alpha 4 charger and when charging Nimh cells their instructions recommended only using the C/1 charge and discharge rates. Another big point is each and every brand of Nimh cells being sold have their own specs and way of coming to those conclusions. It's the old horse power race ; mine has power than yours , syndrome !

Years ago when NiCad's were the battery to use , most were damaged by over charging and at too high a rate, in most cases .

Today, I feel the Eneloop by Sanyo/Panasonic are probably the best Nimh out there BUT depending on the type of useage , I would reserve judgement on what they are used for. For transmitters fine. For airborne use, they are dependent on drain of servos and receiver. Limit would be 4 standard servos in the 40-50 oz inch torque and the receiver. up to 40 size airplanes. High drain applications; either use Life or lipo if the receiver and servos can handle the voltage if not then use a quality Bec in between.batteries and system.

Truckracer

My Feedback: (19)

So there are cheap Chinese copies of a cheap Chinese charger? What's the world coming to? I'm so surprised!

hairy46

My Feedback: (1)

I tried the NiMH battery's after loosing two planes to them I run not walked back to Nicads not going to change again!