Lokihaus

My Feedback: (8)

I've been flying for over 20 years now and was going to teach my friend to fly. I told him the usual routine to start with a trainer, but this is what he wants.

He would like an electric.
He would like to build a balsa plane from a kit.
He would like to keep it smaller than a .40 size kit, more like a .1-.2.
He would like a plane that doesn't look like a lame trainer.

I showed him around Tower and other sites and he was focused on buying this one:

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXGAL0&P=0
or this
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXM389&P=0

P-51 is not in stock at the moment... and of course these are not trainers. Why does he want this? Cause it looks COOL! Who doesn't want to fly a fighter plane. I guess my question to the general audience is, do you know of any fighter looking planes that can be handled by a newbie? Any help would be appreciated, thanks!

Admiral052

I hear the eFlite T34 Mentor is a pretty docile plane that claims it is a 'Trainer' I have one for fun since I like the plane but I haven't flown it yet. 55" wingspan, balsa frame, easy to see

RCVFR

My Feedback: (7)

One approach you and your friend could consider is for him to buy wharever he wants, arrange for another instructor to fly him. Then, when he gets over that experience, you and he can get together and go with your recommendations. Your friend's choices are the stuff to try relationship. When he stuffs the cool looking plane(s), who will he be looking to point the finger at? So do you want him to despise you for doing what he wants or for not doing what he wants. Some choice. Just kidding!

I think you know what's best

Good luck.

skeeter_ca

If he just has to have something cool looking, how about this Hanger 9 p-51 mustang trainer. Not a kit but could be converted to electric pretty easily.

RTF version
http://www.hobbyzone.com/rc_planes_h...eAdWordsSearch

ARF version
http://www.hobbyzone.com/rc-planes-h...ng-pts-arf.htm

skeeter

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

Are you and experianced instructor and even if you were those will both be a disaster with the student not really learning anything. you need to do a rethink at what you are going to be responsible for.

If he will not listen to reason then you would be foolish to play up to his ego like that. Not only will he be wasting his time and money but more importantly your time and frustration.

That little T-34 while I do not own one I have maidened and flown many as well as set up local pylon races for them and they are not exceptable trainers for a first timer.

John

Admiral052

I have heard the same about the T-34 but this is my third plane. John has does that plane fly? Anything I should know about setting it up?

Steve Steinbring

I agree with John!

As an instructor I highly encourage newbies to select a good trainer as their initial airplane. It is normal for new people entering the hobby to have preconceived ideas as to what airplane they think they want.

Personally I am not really fond of the Hanger 9 P-51 as a first choice, but have instructed using several of them with good success.

I prefer glow over electric because training flights can be longer and you don't have to deal with the charging and changing of batteries. Electric has its own set of issues including safety. Also unless the student invests in a good supply batteries training sessions are often limited compared to glow due.

IMO too many students want to progress to the perceived "COOL" stuff too quickly without being very proficient flying R/C. I really encourage my students to stay with their trainer for a good while after they have soloed. Most trainers can perform quite well, and I fly a sequence of aerobatics to demonstrate that there much more they can learn with their trainer. Then progress to an intermediate airplane something like an Ugly Stik which is a good performer.

You've gotten some good advice here, try to advise your friend accordingly.

Best of luck in obtaining your new flying buddy!

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

Admiral I think that the little T-34 is a superb little second type of an airplane and it tracks relitively well being a slightly faster airplane than what I would call a park flyer. That is if you have already soloed a conventional full house (aileron-rudder-elevator-throttle) trainer but as a first airplane the fellows just end up takeing longer (read money) to reach their goals.

The trouble with that ship is new folks all wanna go off to some park and normally they have no concept at all to how much clear space is needed and you can picture the result. Sure a sharp experianced pilot can put it in a tiny spot but the problem is most asking these questions are not.

Its a no brainer get a trainer if you just starting even using a sim.

I have had experiance with the Horizon PTS Mustang glow 'trainer' like Steve and having taught one fellow from scratch with that ship just exteneded the training period making it longer by the time he acheved the goal. Some of the gimmicks on that airplane are down right dangerous in the training environment. Also you are all most guarenteed at least several landing gear block ripouts with that ship due to the silly main struts bent so far forward which torque rolls the block right out of the wing if ever landing is not very good.

I fly and teach mostly glow primary and then some advanced disciplines. But did just finished up a fellow who just had to convert a Senior Kaydet to electric. Well it came out great and flys well but not counting the transmitter hes into it for almost a thousand bucks[X(]


One little true electric trainer that I am impressed with though is the Great Planes Sensei. Just solo'd a fellow with one of those and it worked very well for the task.


John

ec121

My Feedback: (2)

I just had almost the same conversation today. A buddy at work has been flying a three channel toy type Cub and wants to buy a Parkzone T28. I told him to look for a trainer of some sort. His answer was that the T28 is a better deal than spending more for the trainer. He flies with a school yard group in town. I hope they help him out. I told him his first flight with the peppy T28 without help wouldn't be more than 20ft. and wished him luck. I could be wrong. Standby for updates.

Admiral052

Thanks John I actually have done what your advising, I started last summer with my first plane, a SIG LT-40 with a OS 46 on it and logged some major flying on it. Followed the instructor and he even showed what my trainer could do. I only recently built the T-34 and a .40 GP stik this winter as projects but I don't expect to fly the stik till at least mid summer. I was in the same boat as this guys friend wanting to jump up but then I listened to some people at the clubs, watched some crash videos on youtube, and thought about if I felt like throwing away $500 or taking my time gaining skills. I took the latter. I am glad I did because once I learned to fly I could how complex it is and how your skills are needed to control the aircraft with heavier wingloads. So even though I am a few years away from my Skyraider or Zero, I am having a blast watching others and working on my flying.

This is the best piece of advise I can give

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

Sounds as though you have made some wise choices and you will do just fine. Enjoy

Lokihaus

My Feedback: (8)

Well thanks for all the words of advice. No, I've never trained anyone at rc flying, but I have faith in this guy. He picks up things really quick.

He came in this morning and shot me this link: http://www.hobby-lobby.com/micro_tel...37167_prd1.htm

No, it's not as spiffy as a fighter plane, but it's small and electric and cheap. Anyone have any experience with this kit? This does seem like a nice plane to start out with.

jester_s1

Telemasters are well proven as trainers. Just understand that one that small is going to be a cork in any kind of wind, so it's calm day flying only with that one.

CGRetired

My Feedback: (1)

In my experience, you (the OP) will need a trainer that is built as a trainer. They have to be somewhat tough but have trainer-like tendencies (self righting, tend to float, and can take abuse).

Most balsa electrics that were designed as balsa electrics are pretty delecate... they have to be because the power plant is electric and they can be very fussy about how they are powered because they have to be light weight.

Glow powered trainers usually are well over-powered to the point where they can fly with the added weight needed to toughen up the trainers to take the abuse. I speak from experience based on what I put my trainer through when I was learning. Landing hard with an electric trainer can be tough on the airframe. It can be tough on anything, but it seems that glow powered trainers can take it a tad more than electrics.

Converting a glow trainer to electric ends up being more costly than just going with a glow powered trainer.

But, if you want to go with electric power, well, do, by all means, stick with a trainer type aircraft as everyone has stated.

CGr.

Gray Beard

My Feedback: (-1)

A better choice. I don't give a student the option of a plane. I don't let a student even buy anything until after they have soloed then gotten some stick time. We use my trainer, my buddy box and my field gear. The only thing any of my students is requested to buy is there own fuel. After they solo my trainer I let them fly it on there own and by being out at the field they can talk to the other pilots and get enough information so we can sit down and talk about there next move. It usually begins with what radio to buy then moves on to what plane and type of power supply. If they decide to go wet I will usually have an engine to loan them for there first plane. After that they can decide on there own.
Everyone wants a cool plane and wants to get away from the trainer. That works out well for me, I haven't ever had to buy a trainer. They arre given to me by someone that has moved on to bigger and better planes. I still enjoy trainers and always take mine out on windy days to have fun with.
I learned to fly with a telemaster, a Sr. with a .60 glow engine. I really like them but I haven't ever flown the little electric and know nothing about them. I have a Wright Flyer trainer at the moment, not a clue how many people have learned to fly with it but it has been a few. Looks like hell but it's a perfect plane in the air and doesn't bounce on landing.

Lokihaus

My Feedback: (8)

Moving on to another question here. I would definitely like to buddy box with him and I have an Hitech Aurora 9. I wouldn't want him to buy an FM transmitter (although I could buddy with him if I had the optional FM pack for the Aurora, which I don't). Can I buddy the Aurora with any 2.4Ghz Hitech transmitter? How about another manufacture's 2.4 transmitter system?

I was looking at the Optic 5 or Optic 6 2.4GHz systems, as their prices seems to be pretty nice.

thanks for the help!

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

jaka

Hi!
Bin an instructor for 36 years!
Here is what a god trainer looks like!
Glow powered!
160cm-200cm in span.
Weight: 1,8-2,4kg
Powered by a 4,8-6,5cc engine.
Model: Kyosho "Calmato"
The one in the picture slighly modified (lightened) weighing 1,8kg powered by a MVVS 4,8cc engine spinning an 11x4 APC prop

Lokihaus

My Feedback: (8)

Aurora 9 FAQ's
Q. What cord do I need?

A. Hitec provides two training lead accessory packs:
#58320 TRAINER CABLE (between 6 cell transmitter battery systems)
[Do Not Attempt to substitute/use a standard stereo cable as the Hitec cable plugs are cross wired]
#58321 TRAINER CABLE FULL PACKAGE (#58320 + Slave DIN + Master DIN) - For use between a 6 cell transmitter battery system and 8 cell transmitter battery system. (NB: All 8 cell type TX used as a Slave, must have own power supply, i.e. a battery pack installed, refer instructions.)

Seems to be two solutions to the trainer setup.

Admiral052

Not to create any probelms but shouldn't a trainer be a tri-gear instead of a dragger?

rgburrill

Two suggestions:
1.  Tell him to save his money and buy the Real Flight simulator.  Building is wonderful but a new pilot trying to fly that small an airplane is nuts.  And to top it off he wants the P-51?  The Hangar 9 P-51 looks good but is fuel and much larger than what he wants.
2.  Show him the Flyzone Switch.  http://www.flyzoneplanes.com/airplan...530/index.html   It's the right size.  It's electric.  It comes with everything.  It can be a high wing trainer that looks cool, not boxy.  It can be a low wing sport plane, not a fighter but still cool.  And I think I saw one at the Fairfield Hobbytown USA.

rgburrill

I hope he isn't looking at "small" because they are cheap. There have been plenty of discussions on kits versus RTF cost and they almost always show that the kit price is a very small part of the cost of the plane. It is interesting that the original P-51 took two rolls of Monokote - so does a PT-40.

Your info shows you live in Stamford. Like me, then, you will be fighting winds for most of the flying season. Even the Switch I recommended is a little small for the kinds of winds we deal with. And most electric trainers are light and tossed easily by the wind. You really need to get him to look at 40 size trianers to start - or, as I suggested before, buy Real Flight.

Mk23socom

My Feedback: (7)

I learned on a dragger, it taught me to use the rudder right out of the gate which is important when getting into warbirds. I flew a trike trainer once and I didn't really like it that much. This question could be answered either way really! I say whatever gets a guy up in the air is the way to go!!

dgholmes59

Warbirds are hard to fly as a beginner. They are meant to shoot the enemy and go fast so as not to get shot. My second airplane was a H9 PTS P-51 and was my second and third crashed airplanes (same plane). Can you say TIP STALL. OMG Was good for learning to rebuild at the time. The first crash, I broke it in half and hit my wife with pieces of it. I still fly it and it is now one of my favorite airplanes to fly (once I threw the evolution engine in the trash). I would NOT recommend it as a good trainer. Mine did not come with the wing droops. That might would have helped.

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

What cord you need is dependant upon what tx you are going to attempt to use as a slave. The last time I checked was just before the AMA expo and the 58321 low to high voltage was unavalible. Which means you could only buddy with two aurora's or with a low voltage Optic 6 using the low to low voltage 58320.

I have no idea or not if the 58321 has finally reached the selves yet or not.

There are no two solutions with low to high transmitters the appropriate cord must be used and with low to low transmitters the appropriate cord must be used.