VetteV12

First I want to start with saying that I've been flying my Alpha 40 for about 4 months now every weekend and use my flight sim about once a week flying different planes. I've modified my Alpha 40 with increasing the throws and beefing up the tail and wings so they will hold together with the bigger flight control movements. My "instructor" (a guy I've been flying with that's been doing it since he was 9 and from seeing him fly is a damn good pilot that know's what he's doing) said that I should skip the basic low wing sport plane and jump to an Extra 300 or Edge 540 because I've been advancing so fast in my skill level. I was originally looking at getting a Phoenix Dolphin and beefing it up handle more than it was probly ment to, or getting a P-51 from Hangar 9. Either of which I'm wanting to install a 4 stroke, Enya 80 or Magnum 70. So what do you guys think I should do or do you have a different plane to suggest? I'm not looking to break the bank on this but if I can get just the airframe for $160 - $200ish that is .40 size to fit one of those 2 engines I'll be happy. Also, what servo's are good yet cheap? I've been looking at the Hitec 5485 and 5625. Lastly, is $150 a good price for an Enya 80 new in box for the 1980's?

kenh3497

IF.... you can talk somebody into it..... Maybe they will let you fly their Extra or Edge for a few minutes. Possibly on a buddy box for safety???

Also try some of the sport planes out there. Many are VERY capable fliers. Will do any of the aerobatic maneuvers, maybe not quite as precisely as a an Edge or Extra, but still capable.

What does your instructor fly? Try out his stuff. If he won't let you, maybe he is not as confident in your abilities as he says he is?????

IMO Jumping from a trainer to an Edge or similar, is like going from drivers training to an Indy car. Not saying you cant driver the thing, but most likely it is above your skill level and an accident is much more likely to happen.


I sure there are many more opinions out there in both directions. Good luck on your quest!!

Ken

corch

My Feedback: (1)

FWIW, the second plane is often THE most crashed plane.  I completely trashed mine  Probably added a pound of epoxy and posicle sticks since I first assembled it.  It was a Phoenix Seebee btw with an os55ax.

jester_s1

If you're interested in aerobatics and truly want to skip the "second plane" stage, I'll suggest a Tower Hobbies Kaos. It's very neutral handling and can do any maneuver you can think of aside from 3D flying, but it also avoids the tip stall tendencies that many of the IMAC planes will have (like Extras, Edges, etc). That said, a Sig 4 Star or any Ugly Stick will let you advance your skills a lot and fly the vast majority of aerobatic maneuvers and will be more forgiving of piloting errors, especially stalls. Later on, it will be your windy day plane or will come out when you're just in the mood to bore holes in the sky instead of think hard about flying a scale warbird or serious aerobatics plane.

ATVAlliance

Cant go wrong with a Stick type plane.

And the "ugliness" (pun intended...lol) wears off after you see how much fun they are!

Id go with a 60 size one and somewhere around a 90-100 2 stroke to get the most adrenaline rush.

I have the ultra in 60 with an ASP 61 2 stroke. The 61 flies it well...but just doesnt have the "pucker factor" that Ive seen with some of them with a larger engine.

Ive even seen a few folks put DLE 20's on them with great success. Cant really say how a 20 gasser compares to say an EVO 100 or something similar.

A guy in our club has one with EVO 100 on it and its crazy fast and nimble!

blueapplepaste

My Feedback: (5)

A Big Stick would be a good 2nd plane. I think you could do an Extra or Edge, just turn the rates down way low and maybe do the first few flights on a buddy box. Many of the 3D type planes are EXTREMELY docile and very forgiving on the low rates.

But as others said, you're probably going to crash your second plane a lot. So whatever you get, get something you don't mind becoming an ugly patchwork of random repair jobs.

frenchie79

Well said-can't beat stiks or four Stars for just about anything. As said though, the 3d planes are very simple to fly, just set it up with a forward CG and turn down the throws and you can work into it.

Stick 40

mine was the Great Planes Super sportster 60 and I have liked that plane every sense. When it got a little boring with the Enya .60 on it , I switched it to the Enya .80 with a tuned pipe. Man does that plane go.

Still have one in the barn waiting for better weather.

I with with the 60 over the 40 as the wing loading was better.

sticks

hugger-4641

My Feedback: (6)

I'd reccomend the P-51.

Why?...........

Because from what I read, you really want to improve your skills, not just look like you are. The P-51 is going to be less forgiving of some mistakes than the Edge or the Extra. The Extra and Edge are awesome planes that will let you power out of a lot of bad situations. You will probably crash the P-51 more than you would either of the other two, but you will learn how to "fly" it, as opposed to learning how to power out of mistakes. Just my opinion.

VetteV12

Out of these airplanes what would you guys recommend? All running Hitech 5485 servo's and a Magnum 70 4 stroke swinging a 13x6 at about 10K RPM.
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXAVPJ&P=ML Stinger II
http://www.horizonhobby.com/products...sion-2-HAN2660 Twist 40
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXLGM8&P=ML Dolphin

Like I said I'm not looking to break the bank so these are my watch list. Only one I know I've got to do a little work on is the Dolphin because the hinges and control horns suck. I'm not into the look of the stick's, I want a low or mid wing sport plane or the P-51 (only warbird I like).

jester_s1

I don't think you could go wrong with any of those. Of the three, the Stinger is going to be the most like a true aerobatics plane and also is made to be flown fast. To that end, I think your prop choice isn't going to be the best because a 13x6 with a 4 stroke is going to be pretty slow. If you're looking for stump pulling torque and unlimited vertical that's the way to go, but if not I'd go down to an 11x9 or 11x8 to give you a little more top end speed.

bigdanusa

Don't over look the great planes u-can-do .46 size. Looks nice, very easy to fly, will do any aerobatics you're capable of doing, will not tip stall on you, floats like a butterfly and lands very easily. Your 4-strokes would work perfect on it. Just don't fly it full bore....the horizontal stabilizer will rip off unless you beef it up to begin with!

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXDUL8&P=0

good luck on your decision

VetteV12

Well I bought a new in box Enya 90-4c off my co-worker for $150. So whatever I get Ill be sticking that into it. He suggested a U-Can-Do .60 and I might go that route. But I hear alot of people say you can't fly fast with it. Is that true or are they meaning stupid fast like a race plane?

Does anyone have a manual for the Enya 90-4c? I'm looking for recommended prop size and engine break-in procedure.

jester_s1

The U-Can-Do is known for having flutter issues at speed. I know lots of guys fly them as sport models because the light wing loading makes them fun, but they really are a special purpose plane made to do 3D aerobatics. If you want to fly around slow and do lots of vertical maneuvers and start practicing 3D now, it's a good choice. But if you're looking for an all around sport plane that will let you work on your overall piloting skills, go back to you list and pick one of those.

dignlivn

If you want something faster than the U can do, think about a Stik.
My 60 size with a 120 4 stroke is quick and fun,


Bob

jaka

Hi!
None of those planes are particularly "good" aerobatic fliers, especially the second is no good! It's fun-fly typ airplane!
If you want to do maneuvers, then the third is best! ...But there are better planes out there.
The You-Can-Do is no good if you want to pratice maneuvers! It's a hovering plane...nothing else!

A much better plane if you want to be good at R/C flying is the China-Clipper (Sonic 500) Q-500 plane. With that typ of plane, powered by a good .40 engine (Two stroke) you can fly every maneuver in the book and it will fly rather fast, around 180km/h, with a Kyosho. 40 GX or Webra .40 GT with a 10x6 RAM prop. Learning to handle fast flying planes is something you must learn if you want to become a better flier!

Look for airplanes like the: Great Planes Escapade or Super Sportster if you want good flying sport airplanes!
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXVXN8&P=0
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXAVR1&P=0

jester_s1

Suggesting a racer as a second plane is worse than suggesting a Yak. Any of the planes from the list above will work as a second plane. Me personally, I would suggest a stick as others have or a Sig 4 star or Goldberg Tiger 2, but the OP isn't interested in those. What makes for a good second plane is good slow speed stability combined with moderately neutral handling and agile maneuverability. Any of the planes on the above list will work, as will any of the traditional tried and true second planes that get suggested over and over on the forum. A racer does not meet the requirements, as they land hot and can get into high speed stalls that a beginning pilot won't know how to recover from.

jaka

Hi!
The above pictured China -Clipper is no more difficult to fly than the Great Planes Sportster. Landing speed is about as fast as you can walk and it has no bad habbits.

A good second plane I forgot to mentioned is the Kyosho "Calmato Sports"! This plane is much more versatile than a You-Can-Do or Twister!
http://www.rckungen.se/index.php?pag...mart&Itemid=64

A nother even better plane is the Kyosho OXALYS 50. http://www.kyoshoamerica.com/OXALYS-50_p_335.html

opjose

Oh so true!

This is one reason I second the Big Stik suggestions.

A stick is a very robust plane with a simple fuselage.

That makes it easy to repair, even though it can take a LOT of abuse.

It also handles well in high winds, letting you fly when others are grounded.

It's the perfect plane for fun flys, and you never tire of it.

A Stick is also a great engine break in platform, for other planes since the mounting is exposed.

Choose a good mount and you can swap engines on and off quickly.

VetteV12

With the Enya 90 I'm looking at the Escapade .60 but I'm unsure if the engine will be able to pull it like I want. I've always been on the "overpower it" side when it comes to these planes, however this thing weighs in at 27.4oz according to my scale. I mainly like to overpower it so I can fly at 1/2 throttle and if things get hairy I can just snap it to WOT and pull my self out. Most people suggest a 14x6 K series or 12x8 APC for this engine. What are your guy's thoughts on overpowering a plane, and what would be good for this heavy engine? Or are the .40 size ones you've been listing is what it should go in?

jaka

Hi!
Being a pylonracer fan for more years I can remember I like speed! But being a racer I also know that light weight is very important! This is something newbies tend to forget!
So powering a plane with enought power without sacrefying light weight (low wing loading) is what's counts!! What's enough power you learn from experience! Having lot's of power and a heavy plane is no good! Could get you into more trouble... The saying: "I like to overpowering (bigger engine) my planes as this could help me out if I get inte trouble" is just a tale...Nothing could be further from the truth as more power usually gets you into trouble more easily! And newbies cannot throttle down or up...fast enough to save a plane, that's my experience.

If you go the .90 size path remember that APC props are always outperforming MA white tipped props and that 13x8 or 14x6 props are good choices for a .90 four or two stroke.

VetteV12

I agree that too much power is well, too much power. I'm meaning I like to have enuf power to go vertical, doesn't have to rocket into the sky just climb up there. I've learned alot about throttle management mainly because one day we got bord out on the flied and decided to pull an OS 55ax with 12x7 APC out of one of his planes and install it into my trainer. Man that was incredible power to weight. Little too much at that, almost ripped the wings off lol.

But I'm seriously considering the Escapade .60 to install this engine into. It looks nice, fairly cheap, and has a huge wing area, wing loading is about 23-27 though so it's not as good as a stick but WAY more attractive.

Do you guys trust nylon geared servo's or metal all the way? I'm looking for core-less and found the Futaba S9001 and I would run a LiFe battery 3200mah for it on a Spektrum A6210 receiver so I can re-use the DX5 that I have.

JollyPopper

My Feedback: (6)

I realize that you pretty much have your mind made up and are only going to listen to the guys who support you, but you would be wise in heeding the advice of so many who have been in the hobby much longer than you. A 60 size stick with a .90 four stroke in it would keep you amused/excited/eager for as long as you fly it. Better looking planes like the Four Stars would do the same. And even better looking planes like the Kaos would thrill you for years. All planes that are capable of doing anything you want to do, yet very forgiving of mistakes. Bit I get the sense that you had your mind made up before you made the original post as to what direction you want to go and all the advice from all the guys who have been there and done that is not going to change your mind, so go for it. I wish you all the luck in the world and hope you don't even put so much as a scratch on your next plane, but history is against you. It will give the economy a boost though.

overbored77

My Feedback: (11)

I fly 78" 1.60 size airframes with a glow engine on plastic gear servos, I don't use metal gears in anything but .90 and over 3d planes, and
any plane with a gasser. coreless, and digital servos will make no difference on this airframe, nor will you see much (if any) difference
at your skill level, Trust me, I also progressed with great speed, and was aking the same questions a few weeks after solo.

JollyPopper

My Feedback: (6)

I have a friend who has a barn full or really pretty, expensive airplanes but he was not having a lot of success flyiing them. Then one day he bought an ugly old .60 size stick with a .91YS in it. All of a sudden he was greasing his landings and performing maneuivers in the sky he had never been able to do before. It was astounding how quickly that ugly old Stick got real pretty in his eyes.