soaringhigh718

Hi all,

I am in the process of putting together an Escapade 61. Ihave heard that some planes need to have the area where the landing gear is secured reinforced or strengthned? This might be simple or real elementary, but how would I go about reinforcing the wood where the landing gear is bolted on. Icannot acces that area from inside the fuselage? Can anyone offer any guidance or suggestions?

Gray Beard

My Feedback: (-1)

Not sure about that plane but if you can touch the LG block and there is any wood around it you just use angle stock and epoxy it to the block and sides of wood of the fuse. It doesn't take a lot of reinforcing to help keep the block in there on a hard landing. Each ARF is different and I haven't assembled that one for anyone yet so I'm not sure what is required. If no one else can answer your question then a photo of the inside of the fuse would help.

soaringhigh718

Here are a few pics of what I am trying to describe. I cannot access the opposite side of the fuselage to brace any walls from inside. I don't have a clue a how to reinforce any other way. Any suggestions greatly appreicated

Charlie P.

When in doubt, don't.  Adding weight increases wing loading and that makes landings harder on the airframe.  To have the gear pull away easily is a good thing.  The alternative is to tear out fuselage sides and frames.  

If you are tearing out and flattening gear - work on your landing technique, not your model's robustness.  

soaringhigh718

Thanks Charlie. I am somewhat confused because I have been told by several individuals that I should reinforce the landing gear just in case I have a "tough" landing. To date and knock on wood, I haven't had a landing where I have damaged the landing gear, but Ihave only flown foam planes so far. This will be my first glow powered plane.

In any case, I will try your advice which simplifies the process for me. Thanks again.

CGRetired

My Feedback: (1)

Is it possible to take a picture of the inside of the fuselage where the landing gear mounts are? That would give us a much better idea of how it's constructed and maybe a better offering if it is needed or not.

CGr.

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

The bottom line with that airplane is there is no access to reinforce the gear block without surgery. You cannot reinforce unless you cut a hatch from the top.

You will find folks who insist you have to reinforce this and that sometimes to where you are reinfoceing the reinforcement. You yourself said you are having no problem. Its real simple don,t fix a problem that you don,t have. If you at some time pop out that gear block on a less than pretty landing, so what. Go home and now is the time to reinforce it when you are putting it back in, simple to do tri stock up the sides or whatever. Ya'll have that thing flying agine the next day.

Sometimes folks especially newer ones will far overdo the enforcement thing to the point that the airplanes performance can be surprisingly adversely affected.

John

See Ya'll at the field

da Rock

Two things to consider.

One...

Yes, you can reinforce, and it can be done where your pictures show what you chose to show, the outside bottom of the fuselage. Strip off the covering and epoxy/glass the surface of the gear plate out to about an inch to 1.5 inches onto the fuselage. Use one layer of glass cloth and slow epoxy. Use 1 or 2 ounce glass. After a day or so, sand it, tack cloth it, and iron on new covering.

Would it be worth it?

Not really unless your inspection of the structure inside and out showed poor joints, gluing and supporting wood. And if that was the case, you'd probably be better off to glass the entire nose from the wing saddle forward.

It really isn't worth the effort on most ARFs when things are wrong and your experience is limited to assembling ARFs. It's entirely possible to reinforce with epoxy/glass and not gain weight excessively, but that takes experience. So yes, it's possible to reinforce, but NO it's not a good idea for most new modelers. If your experience isn't sufficient to tell you whether or not that model really needs reinforcing, then honest, you really shouldn't worry about it. Fly the sucker and learn from what happens. Honest, that's the best thing you could do if you enjoy the hobby and think you might stick with it. And plan to autopsy any chance you have to learn what to look for next time. If you do happen to tear that gear out, you will then have an excellent opportunity to work with something that you know needs fixing, and where it needs the reinforcement. And you won't be worried about cutting into it either.

Suggestion two.............

da Rock

Suggestion TWO:

Replace the gear mounting bolts with nylon bolts.

Use the same size bolts, only use nylon ones. The idea is to have the gear break away without causing damage. It's not a guaranteed result, but if your model really is weak and beyond your experience to reinforce, then it's worth considering.

da Rock

BTW, reinforcing from the outside with epoxy/glass cloth works great when done properly. The weight of the cloth and how far out it extends are the important details. The inspection of the inside structure suggests how far the skin should be covered. You want to spread the force that single plate encounters. Spreading it to reach the next set of bulkheads greatly improves the ability of the skin to pass the force to something strong enough to help the skin survive.

Also consider the possibility of epoxy/glass from that unreachable inside. If you can see in there, it might be possible to do quite an adequate job of reinforcement with the proper tools. Solder brushes make the job possible. They can be bent to reach around things. Cut pieces of glass cloth that'd fit inside where needed. Paint the epoxy inside, covering everywhere you want reinforcement. As soon as that's covered, dip the brush again...... then touch it to a piece of glass cloth and use the brush to carry it through your access. Simply place the piece where you want it and the cloth will usually pull itself down onto the wet surface. It's actually quite easy to get the glass down.

I've done that to a number of planes. I guess about half my first ARFs got the inside of the firewall and the supporting fuselage and interior bulkheads painted with epoxy when my flashlight inspection showed glue joints only an idiot would have made when building a model airplane for themselves. Some were so bad they got pieces of glass cloth at the same time they got epoxied.

How much weight do I expect from doing things like that? Since my 60 size H9 Thunderbolt with it's OS91 is the lightest one I know of and is under the mfg's recommended weight, I'd say the weight gained was insignificant. It's all how you do things.

acdii

Best suggestion made is to replace the steel bolts with nylon. Far less damage will happen.  I have a Deweyville that started out with steel bolts, and a bad landing tore the crap out of the fuse. I switched to 1/4-20 nylon bolts, and had an incident last week that busted he wing, and tore the LG off, but the fuse is 100% intact. 

Gray Beard

My Feedback: (-1)

With from what I see of your plane this is some very good advice. Wait until you have the problem then do the upgrade when you have to. Reinforcing the LG bock and fire wall on a plane isn't going to add enough weight to ever notice the difference in wing loading. If it did no one would be doing it. Were talking grams, not ounces.

biam

I agree with John, Gene and Da rock, if it aint broke dont fix it! If you know how to land at all, you wont have a problem. my .61 escapade is holding up just fine, even with a few not so perfect landings. If you do anything, epoxy in the tail feathers instead of relying on the two bolts and locknuts. Allinall a tough good flying plane, you should enjoy it!

opjose

So true.

As one person told me, "fix the pilot not the plane.".

KitBuilder

My Advice.. fly it as is and work on smooth landings... if you hve a hard one that causes issues.. you'll then have access to build it stronger

bikerbc

It is a hard area to get at but you could drill through the former where the wing saddle is and put a few 3/32" or 1/8" dowls in..They wont help much because they should be on the front side where the biggest stress load is ...Dont put so many in that you weaken the former but you could probably put them in 1/2" apart....

Edwin

My Feedback: (2)

Others beat me to it but I would do nothing other than replacing the bolts with nylon bolts. I do that on several planes.
Edwin

flyboy9994

I have built and flown the Escapade .61 and it is one of the very few ARF's that don't really need the landing gear block beefed up. Nylon mount screws are a good idea if you think you will have trouble with your landings but this plane lands better than a trainer if it is set up right. I used the factory recommended CG and she landed like a dream! You will love this plane. Just build it and fly the heck out of it! Good luck.