Vertical Stabilizer - which glue?
11-08-2013, 11:54 AM
#27
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I'll never glue a fin again with CA.
Last time I did I lost the fin while flying. Fortunately, I was able to land it without damages (and fortunately it was on a trainer).
I never had any problems with epoxy, so I'll stick to it.
Of course this is just my experience. As I can see on the posts above, some of you never had any issues with CA.
Last time I did I lost the fin while flying. Fortunately, I was able to land it without damages (and fortunately it was on a trainer).
I never had any problems with epoxy, so I'll stick to it.
Of course this is just my experience. As I can see on the posts above, some of you never had any issues with CA.
Last edited by P-Y; 11-08-2013 at 11:58 AM.
11-08-2013, 03:52 PM
#29
I'll never glue a fin again with CA.
Last time I did I lost the fin while flying. Fortunately, I was able to land it without damages (and fortunately it was on a trainer).
I never had any problems with epoxy, so I'll stick to it.
Of course this is just my experience. As I can see on the posts above, some of you never had any issues with CA.
Last time I did I lost the fin while flying. Fortunately, I was able to land it without damages (and fortunately it was on a trainer).
I never had any problems with epoxy, so I'll stick to it.
Of course this is just my experience. As I can see on the posts above, some of you never had any issues with CA.
Bob
11-09-2013, 12:48 AM
#30
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P-Y, in your avatar the Spit is just about to cart-wheel or is it a low pass ? just curious
.
You must be pretty good on the sticks
I think I was lucky. I tried to keep it as flat and straight as possible and landed it far away from our field.
11-11-2013, 09:37 AM
#32
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On balsa and plywood airframes I only use thin and medium CA because it is fast, easy and safe to use if you use proper ventilation, it's lightweight and is much stronger then balsa wood or the first full ply of plywood in the first place, and the thin CA soaks into plywood and balsa wood further then 30 minute or 1 hour epoxy anyway so there really isn't a valid reason for me to use epoxy unless I am using laminating resin for wing skins to foam or part manufacturing from a mold.
Bob
Bob
I'm a CA user though, I do once in a while get the reaction but after I had a bad reaction and figured out what it was I can tell when it's time to quit building and leave the shop.
11-11-2013, 11:07 AM
#33
Bob, I have never had any luck gluing hardwood with CA?? Balsa to hardwood no problems. I must be doing something very wrong if it works for you. I use 30 minute epoxy on hardwoods. I also use it in places like the tail feathers even when it's all balsa. I have come out in the morning to find the parts have shifted and epoxy is easy to soften with a heat gun and the parts can be re-glued. Last summer I started using Sigment again when I built a stick frame up, it was all hardwood sticks and CA wasn't working for me.
I'm a CA user though, I do once in a while get the reaction but after I had a bad reaction and figured out what it was I can tell when it's time to quit building and leave the shop.
I'm a CA user though, I do once in a while get the reaction but after I had a bad reaction and figured out what it was I can tell when it's time to quit building and leave the shop.
Bob
11-11-2013, 11:35 AM
#34
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I don't understand Gene because CA is all I use throughout my builds
Last year, I had a profile with an OS 70 4-stroke that the area ahead of the leading edge started to delaminate from engine vibration, a common profile complaint. I pried it apart a bit, dropped some microballoons and medium CA in and clamped it quick. It still came apart.
I'm probably going to add 1/8 bolsters on the sides and pin with several dowels. I hate to add the weight, but the other option is to 'bin it', as the Brits would say.
11-11-2013, 02:13 PM
#35
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I haven't had luck with CA and ply either.
Last year, I had a profile with an OS 70 4-stroke that the area ahead of the leading edge started to delaminate from engine vibration, a common profile complaint. I pried it apart a bit, dropped some microballoons and medium CA in and clamped it quick. It still came apart.
I'm probably going to add 1/8 bolsters on the sides and pin with several dowels. I hate to add the weight, but the other option is to 'bin it', as the Brits would say.
Last year, I had a profile with an OS 70 4-stroke that the area ahead of the leading edge started to delaminate from engine vibration, a common profile complaint. I pried it apart a bit, dropped some microballoons and medium CA in and clamped it quick. It still came apart.
I'm probably going to add 1/8 bolsters on the sides and pin with several dowels. I hate to add the weight, but the other option is to 'bin it', as the Brits would say.
11-11-2013, 02:26 PM
#36
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*I* think you guys need to do some better prep work.
As for perforating the wood for glue penetration, I'd only do that in an attempt to make Gorilla Glue or other foaming type to work. The voids being created only decrease the surface area to be bonded. I'd much rather scuff with sandpaper.
11-11-2013, 03:04 PM
#37
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With all due respect, my dad was a cabinetmaker, brother was a part-time luthier, and I've been making models since 1966 and working with CA since 1986. Not exactly a noob. I've never had reliable structural joints using CA on ply. Might be the ply, usually high quality. I don't know. But I rely more on aliphatics for important areas.
As for perforating the wood for glue penetration, I'd only do that in an attempt to make Gorilla Glue or other foaming type to work. The voids being created only decrease the surface area to be bonded. I'd much rather scuff with sandpaper.
As for perforating the wood for glue penetration, I'd only do that in an attempt to make Gorilla Glue or other foaming type to work. The voids being created only decrease the surface area to be bonded. I'd much rather scuff with sandpaper.
As for the "voids" reducing the surface area I think we might have a slight disagreement because I think they INCREASE it since you are adding surface the glue can latch on to. Use what works for you, and I have found that in almost all cases where I was building a joint and wanted shear strength, the extra 'fingers' helped. Of course I am nuts and will do it MY way! LOL.
Oh, what the heck is a "luthier"?
11-11-2013, 04:57 PM
#39
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Of course I am nuts and will do it MY way! LOL.
Oh, what the heck is a "luthier"?
Oh, what the heck is a "luthier"?
My my recall is a luthier is a stringed-instrument maker. I could be wrong, it happened once. I think. Lol
11-11-2013, 07:42 PM
#40
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No offense taken, ! I have no explanation why CA doesn't seem to hold ply, lawd knows I've tried especially with new ARFs to augment their hot melt/oddball glues. Same with my buds, but epoxy and aliphatics work great. I've seen great differences in the strength of our hobby epoxies vs. the commercial grades.
My my recall is a luthier is a stringed-instrument maker. I could be wrong, it happened once. I think. Lol
My my recall is a luthier is a stringed-instrument maker. I could be wrong, it happened once. I think. Lol
I never use CA for those but I do put Titebond in a Monojet 421 syringe and use that to put the glue where *I* think it should be rather than just a dab here and there with ARF's.
11-12-2013, 05:01 AM
#41
I guess I am one of the lucky ones that has good luck with CA as my assembly glue of choice on fuselages, engine boxes, and landing gear assemblies, Been doing it this way over 20 years now and never had a glue joint itself fail yet. I have had structural wood failures at times, especially during testing but proper CA bond lines have never given up the ship. Just one guys experience...
Bob
Bob
11-12-2013, 05:35 AM
#42
I'm with you sensei for the most part. I do, however, always use epoxy on the firewall joints since glow fuel attacks CA. Otherwise, it's mostly CA and I have never had a problem with it on hardwoods, neither plywood nor basswood spars. However, as I said before I will use epoxy on tail surfaces where shear stress is an issue.
11-12-2013, 05:44 AM
#43
Good morning Bob, Yup this keeps up we are gonna have to start going to twelve step meetings (my names John Buckner and I am a CA user).
Good grief the gentleman is just sticking a solid fin in an ARF's slot, Heck even this stuff we all remember from the second grade would probably work! Oh OK belay that but CA for the OP's (remember him) application is perfectly fine as well as all the other types of adhesives mentioned in this thread.
Good grief the gentleman is just sticking a solid fin in an ARF's slot, Heck even this stuff we all remember from the second grade would probably work! Oh OK belay that but CA for the OP's (remember him) application is perfectly fine as well as all the other types of adhesives mentioned in this thread.
Last edited by JohnBuckner; 11-12-2013 at 05:46 AM.
11-12-2013, 06:43 AM
#45
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I build giant scale and I am a big fan of Hysol and Gorilla glue and I do some ca med for tacking only, stopped using ca's as the main adhesive years ago,I never use ca to fix a major componant in place.but to each his own and good luck on all your builds,keep your powder dry and pray the creeks dont rise.
Last edited by dadragon; 11-12-2013 at 07:07 AM.
11-12-2013, 09:15 AM
#49
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Once the question is answered and all opinions are in, all RCU threads turn into a BS session. I finally got in the habit of stating that in my threads so everyone feels free to jump in and just talk.
Stab, I would use epoxy just in case it needs to be loosened up with heat and straightened out. It's happened. CA, I buy it in 8 ounce bottles. My bench also has epoxy, white wood glue,Tite Bond, Sigment, Gorilla Glue and that grade school paste that was mentioned. Today it is in a glue stick form though. I often use it for a quick glue down of templates.Doesn't really stick too well.
I recommend people to go into Bobs photo gallery to see what he is really up to. I rag on him about being a weight watcher but if you go look you will understand why he does things his way.
Stab, I would use epoxy just in case it needs to be loosened up with heat and straightened out. It's happened. CA, I buy it in 8 ounce bottles. My bench also has epoxy, white wood glue,Tite Bond, Sigment, Gorilla Glue and that grade school paste that was mentioned. Today it is in a glue stick form though. I often use it for a quick glue down of templates.Doesn't really stick too well.
I recommend people to go into Bobs photo gallery to see what he is really up to. I rag on him about being a weight watcher but if you go look you will understand why he does things his way.
11-12-2013, 09:31 AM
#50
Good morning to you as well John...
We have all been having a nice conversation until until now by you jumping in here and stating (my names John Buckner and I am being an A## H%%#). Good grief isn't this site about show and tell, or is it only about that when your doing it?
Bob
We have all been having a nice conversation until until now by you jumping in here and stating (my names John Buckner and I am being an A## H%%#). Good grief isn't this site about show and tell, or is it only about that when your doing it?
Bob
Bob reread my post you quoted above it was intended in Full support of you in post #41 sorry. Yes and Yes I am an unabashed CA user and not ashamed of it.
Last edited by JohnBuckner; 11-12-2013 at 09:46 AM.