Go Back  RCU Forums > RC Airplanes > Beginners
Reload this Page >

72 MHz or 2.4

Community
Search
Notices
Beginners Beginners in RC start here for help.

72 MHz or 2.4

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 04-22-2014, 03:41 PM
  #51  
bjr_93tz
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: ToowoombaQLD, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 1,026
Likes: 0
Received 17 Likes on 15 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by ka8jvx
He can scrap the two receivers he has if he wants to. I sent 2 new ones with the transmitter I sent him. At least let him use the 72 mhz equipment before telling him he needs 2.4 ghz.
Well if he has a 72MHz TX on the way and a couple of spare 72Mhz RX's then problem solved :-)

I'm still using 36Mhz (Australia) and don't have an issue with it.
Old 04-22-2014, 04:23 PM
  #52  
ka8jvx
Junior Member
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: ripley, WV
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

I have never seen a 36 mhz transmitter. What kind of antenna does it have? Does it have a coil for loading in it?
Old 04-22-2014, 05:03 PM
  #53  
[email protected]
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: hemet , CA
Posts: 1,164
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

ive been to texas>> utah>> arz>> cal>>ill> no trouble with my 72 futaba>> i say to each his own
Old 04-22-2014, 07:23 PM
  #54  
L8cruiser
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Jackson , Georgia
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

I bought some fuel and a glow plug igniter for my yard sale plane today. The plane is a Hanger 9 Arrow with an evolution glow engine. I bench tested the evolution. I used a chicken stick to start it. It fired right up and ran great. My 72 MHz radio should arrive tomorrow thanks to ka8jvx who is giving it to me. I am getting started in this hobby for less than a 100 bucks. This has given me a chance to enter the hobby without breaking the bank. If I lose the Arrow , I hardly have any money in it or hours building. I am sure my next radio will be a 2.4 I won't add additional 72 MHz equipment. I was only going to use it because my plane already had a 72 receiver.
Old 04-22-2014, 07:53 PM
  #55  
bjr_93tz
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: ToowoombaQLD, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 1,026
Likes: 0
Received 17 Likes on 15 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by ka8jvx
I have never seen a 36 mhz transmitter. What kind of antenna does it have? Does it have a coil for loading in it?
Probably looks identical to a 72Mhz one. Big, long, silver fishing pole of an antenna on the TX and 4-5 foot piece of wire hanging out the RX. I'd expect RF wise there're few more changes than just a loading coil but with 36Mhz being half of 72Mhz they might have some simple (cheap) tricks to make them work in their respective markets. RF guys tend to have sneaky ways to pull all sorts of information out of thin air...
Old 04-22-2014, 08:10 PM
  #56  
dirtybird
My Feedback: (5)
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: San Tan Valley, AZ
Posts: 5,768
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

I had an F&M reed system, a C&S AM digital proportional system, a Futaba FM proportional system, and a Futaba PCM proportional system.They all worked just fine, but I got rid of them because they were obsolete
Old 04-23-2014, 04:16 AM
  #57  
toolmaker7341
 
toolmaker7341's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Lockport, NY
Posts: 387
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Hey John could you please ask your young whippersnappers how to reverse a non-programable digital servo. On anolog servos you reverse the 2 outer wires on the pot and the +- on the motor. The digital ones I have now have white and black on the outside of the pot and red in the center.
Old 04-23-2014, 05:42 AM
  #58  
jester_s1
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 7,266
Received 35 Likes on 30 Posts
Default

I'm glad you have good equipment to use, L8cruiser. I hope you are getting some instruction. The Arrow is a nice flying plane, but it is fast enough to get away from you if you don't have some basic piloting skills. Most guys who try to teach themselves to fly wind up crashing a lot and spending a lot of money and time on repairs. Many quit out of frustration before ever completing a single damage free flight. Most guys who get an instructor wind up learning quickly and often pass on their trainers to new beginners later on. Take some of the money you've saved by finding a great deal at a yard sale to join a club and get with an instructor that knows what he's doing.
Old 04-23-2014, 05:45 AM
  #59  
jester_s1
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 7,266
Received 35 Likes on 30 Posts
Default

I see that you're from the home of the unabomber, so here is a list of clubs within driving distance you might consider.

[TABLE="width: 700"]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]BRAUERS AVIATORS
Flying Site Details
0.00 miles[/TD]
[TD]1612[/TD]
[TD]47[/TD]
[TD]DAVID RACZKA
Email Contact[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716-684-2122
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]LAKE ONTARIO R/C FLYERS
Flying Site Details
7.27 miles[/TD]
[TD]3898[/TD]
[TD]31[/TD]
[TD]ROSS NIVER
Email Contact[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716-778-7194
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]BROOKFIELD R/C FLYING CLUB
Flying Site Details
8.51 miles[/TD]
[TD]4661[/TD]
[TD]20[/TD]
[TD]WILLIAM MARFURT
Email Contact[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716.741.1154
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]NIAGARA COUNTY RC MAC
Flying Site Details
9.22 miles[/TD]
[TD]747[/TD]
[TD]35[/TD]
[TD]RICHARD BATTAGLIA[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716-741-4875
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]WING AND ROTOR OF WESTERN NEW YORK
Flying Site Details
14.04 miles[/TD]
[TD]2477[/TD]
[TD]60[/TD]
[TD]MARK RAWLS
Email Contact[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716-838-4291
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]NIAGARA SUNDAY FLIERS, INC.
Flying Site Details
15.08 miles[/TD]
[TD]779[/TD]
[TD]26[/TD]
[TD]DIANE LETOURNEAU[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716.297.0229
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]WNY SAILPLANE&ELECTRIC FLYERS
16.49 miles[/TD]
[TD]1883[/TD]
[TD]31[/TD]
[TD]ANDREW LUCHOWSKI
Email Contact[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716-662-0505
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]RC PULSERS OF WESTERN NY
Flying Site Details
17.91 miles[/TD]
[TD]476[/TD]
[TD]57[/TD]
[TD]RICHARD PRATT
Email Contact[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716-683-6632
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]Yes[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]RC AIRCRAFTERS OF W.N.Y.
Flying Site Details
22.95 miles[/TD]
[TD]925[/TD]
[TD]62[/TD]
[TD]ANDREW BROSE
Email Contact[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716-400-2265
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
Old 04-23-2014, 06:55 AM
  #60  
toolmaker7341
 
toolmaker7341's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Lockport, NY
Posts: 387
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by jester_s1
I see that you're from the home of the unabomber, so here is a list of clubs within driving distance you might consider.

[TABLE="width: 700"]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]BRAUERS AVIATORS
Flying Site Details
0.00 miles
[/TD]
[TD]1612
[/TD]
[TD]47
[/TD]
[TD]DAVID RACZKA
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716-684-2122
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2
[/TD]
[TD]Yes
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]LAKE ONTARIO R/C FLYERS
Flying Site Details
7.27 miles
[/TD]
[TD]3898
[/TD]
[TD]31
[/TD]
[TD]ROSS NIVER
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716-778-7194
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2
[/TD]
[TD]Yes
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]BROOKFIELD R/C FLYING CLUB
Flying Site Details
8.51 miles
[/TD]
[TD]4661
[/TD]
[TD]20
[/TD]
[TD]WILLIAM MARFURT
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716.741.1154
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]NIAGARA COUNTY RC MAC
Flying Site Details
9.22 miles
[/TD]
[TD]747
[/TD]
[TD]35
[/TD]
[TD]RICHARD BATTAGLIA
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716-741-4875
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]WING AND ROTOR OF WESTERN NEW YORK
Flying Site Details
14.04 miles
[/TD]
[TD]2477
[/TD]
[TD]60
[/TD]
[TD]MARK RAWLS
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716-838-4291
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]NIAGARA SUNDAY FLIERS, INC.
Flying Site Details
15.08 miles
[/TD]
[TD]779
[/TD]
[TD]26
[/TD]
[TD]DIANE LETOURNEAU
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716.297.0229
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]WNY SAILPLANE&ELECTRIC FLYERS
16.49 miles
[/TD]
[TD]1883
[/TD]
[TD]31
[/TD]
[TD]ANDREW LUCHOWSKI
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716-662-0505
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2
[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]RC PULSERS OF WESTERN NY
Flying Site Details
17.91 miles
[/TD]
[TD]476
[/TD]
[TD]57
[/TD]
[TD]RICHARD PRATT
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716-683-6632
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2
[/TD]
[TD]Yes
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #F7F6F3"]
[TD]RC AIRCRAFTERS OF W.N.Y.
Flying Site Details
22.95 miles
[/TD]
[TD]925
[/TD]
[TD]62
[/TD]
[TD]ANDREW BROSE
Email Contact
[/TD]
[TD]Phone: 716-400-2265
Visit Website
[/TD]
[TD]2
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
Hey Jester were you refering this to toolmaker? I fly mostly turbines and would like to reverse a digital servo for flaps without using a seperate channel.on a knock about turbine (test jet)
Old 04-23-2014, 07:14 AM
  #61  
jester_s1
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 7,266
Received 35 Likes on 30 Posts
Default

Ah, I need to pay better attention to user names. I meant to help the OP by referring him to clubs in his area, but I see now that he hasn't set his location. For your servo issue, it would be better to start a new thread so this one stays on topic.
Old 04-23-2014, 07:31 AM
  #62  
rgburrill
 
rgburrill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Dallas, Tx CT
Posts: 2,865
Received 76 Likes on 67 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by jester_s1
Why is it that every time someone asks about radios we have to have this 72mhz vs. 2.4ghz conversation again? 72mhz equipment isn't even being made anymore. That's how much the community has embraced 2.4ghz technology and how good the newer equipment is. Yes, there are a few older guys who were happy with 72mhz before and are still happy with it now, much the same as there are a few older guys who drive carbureted vehicles even though fuel injection makes an engine so much more efficient and trouble free. The OP got a 72mhz radio for free so he should use it (assuming it passes a thorough range check). When he's ready to invest in more capable radios, he should buy 2.4ghz (actually will have to buy one unless he goes the very used route). That's really all that needs to be said on the matter IMO.
Going to 2.4 GHz doesn't have anything to do with how good it is. It is simply a matter of cost. There is no reason that 72MHz could not have frequency hopping, spread spectrum technology. Nor is there any reason that 2.4GHz couldn't have stayed with the PPM/PCM technology. Both FREQUENCIES have their inherent issues - neither is BETTER. It's the use of better RF modulation techniques that makes it BETTER. The 72MHz wavelength doesn't lend it self to highly integrated circuit transmitter/receiver/processor technology. That means it will be bigger, use more power and most importantily, cost more in large production runs. It's not the fact that it's 2.4GHz that gives the protection and versatility of the new radios, it's that it can be integrated into a cheap chip.
Old 04-23-2014, 08:48 AM
  #63  
AMA 74894
Moderator
My Feedback: (1)
 
AMA 74894's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Spicer, MN
Posts: 1,216
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 4 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by toolmaker7341
Hey John could you please ask your young whippersnappers how to reverse a non-programable digital servo. On anolog servos you reverse the 2 outer wires on the pot and the +- on the motor. The digital ones I have now have white and black on the outside of the pot and red in the center.
hey Mike.. What servo specifically? I know some digital servos have magnetic or optical feedback circuits, or have the motor soldered directly to the board, (in all of these cases you're out of luck reversing with a soldering iron)
although you could get a pair of 'budget minded' programmable digital servos.
Old 04-23-2014, 09:40 AM
  #64  
toolmaker7341
 
toolmaker7341's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Lockport, NY
Posts: 387
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by AMA 74894
hey Mike.. What servo specifically? I know some digital servos have magnetic or optical feedback circuits, or have the motor soldered directly to the board, (in all of these cases you're out of luck reversing with a soldering iron)
although you could get a pair of 'budget minded' programmable digital servos.
They are EXI from Hobby Partz. They appear to have a normal pot. The motor is not wired to the board red+ black- white to motor case
Old 04-23-2014, 09:59 AM
  #65  
opjose
 
opjose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Poolesville, MD
Posts: 12,624
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by toolmaker7341
They are EXI from Hobby Partz. They appear to have a normal pot. The motor is not wired to the board red+ black- white to motor case
Here is a MUCH easier solution.

I have used dozens of these, and I have used them with the EXI servos ( aka Hextronics, TowerPro, etc... ) with no problems nor drift.

Click on the link below. Gotta love the price too.

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...arehouse_.html
Old 04-23-2014, 10:13 AM
  #66  
AMA 74894
Moderator
My Feedback: (1)
 
AMA 74894's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Spicer, MN
Posts: 1,216
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 4 Posts
Default

hmm, in that case, you should still be able to swap the 2 wires to the motor and the 2 outboard wires on the pot. (leaving the center wire on the pot as it is)
Jester IS right tho..
Check this thread:
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/tips...d-servo-2.html
Old 04-23-2014, 10:18 AM
  #67  
[email protected]
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: hemet , CA
Posts: 1,164
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

ill match my 72 aginst your 2.4 anyday i like ford pick ups what do you like
Old 04-23-2014, 10:49 AM
  #68  
dirtybird
My Feedback: (5)
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: San Tan Valley, AZ
Posts: 5,768
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by rgburrill
Going to 2.4 GHz doesn't have anything to do with how good it is. It is simply a matter of cost. There is no reason that 72MHz could not have frequency hopping, spread spectrum technology. Nor is there any reason that 2.4GHz couldn't have stayed with the PPM/PCM technology. Both FREQUENCIES have their inherent issues - neither is BETTER. It's the use of better RF modulation techniques that makes it BETTER. The 72MHz wavelength doesn't lend it self to highly integrated circuit transmitter/receiver/processor technology. That means it will be bigger, use more power and most importantily, cost more in large production runs. It's not the fact that it's 2.4GHz that gives the protection and versatility of the new radios, it's that it can be integrated into a cheap chip.
There is a good reason you can't have spread spectrum on 72. You don\.t have the necessary bandwidth. On 72 you are limited to 10kc. On 2.4 you have a bandwidth of 400mh. Thats more room than 72 is from 0.
In a previous post I listed disadvantages of 72. Please tell me of the ones you dont agree with and why.
Old 04-23-2014, 11:25 AM
  #69  
jester_s1
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 7,266
Received 35 Likes on 30 Posts
Default

I think this conversation about radio bands should really move to the clubhouse. There are some old guys who will never accept the new stuff, and there are some new guys who think their planes will spontaneously auger in if they use a radio more than 5 years old. Both are wrong. We have solved the OP's problem and answered his questions. Can the bickering about radio bands please end now?
Old 04-23-2014, 12:11 PM
  #70  
[email protected]
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: hemet , CA
Posts: 1,164
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

to each his own i dont think that all people got the money to spend on this hobby>> do what they can to enjoy it >> ive been on 72 for 20 yrs now no wrecks from it only one time i had a wreck and that was from a dead receiver battery>> today in this world people do the best they can with what they got do you have to buy the best to try and be someone if you cant be happy for someone dont say anything>>
Old 04-23-2014, 12:20 PM
  #71  
dirtybird
My Feedback: (5)
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: San Tan Valley, AZ
Posts: 5,768
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

.OK
Just one last point
SS transmission is a huge break trough in RF transmission. I have seen some specification sheets that claim 40db in processor gain.
This allows communication on 2.4 in spite of the greater propergation loss over 72mhz.
If you have the means you are foolish not to take advantage of it.
Old 04-23-2014, 12:29 PM
  #72  
Sport_Pilot
 
Sport_Pilot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Acworth, GA
Posts: 16,916
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

Originally Posted by dirtybird
There is a good reason you can't have spread spectrum on 72. You don\.t have the necessary bandwidth. On 72 you are limited to 10kc. On 2.4 you have a bandwidth of 400mh. Thats more room than 72 is from 0.
In a previous post I listed disadvantages of 72. Please tell me of the ones you dont agree with and why.
You cannot have spread spectrum but you can have frequency hop. Also a lot of the old shared bands for phone pagers are no longer or little used, they could be brought (or is it bought?) in to be used for spread spctrum. About using more prower, I think that we basically abandoned 72 about the time designers were designing the next generation of digitally controlled radio gear for all products. Thus there were no erricient new designs for 72.
Old 04-23-2014, 01:32 PM
  #73  
toolmaker7341
 
toolmaker7341's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Lockport, NY
Posts: 387
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by AMA 74894
hmm, in that case, you should still be able to swap the 2 wires to the motor and the 2 outboard wires on the pot. (leaving the center wire on the pot as it is)
Jester IS right tho..
Check this thread:
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/tips...d-servo-2.html
Worked like a charm on EXI digital servos
Old 04-23-2014, 01:39 PM
  #74  
dirtybird
My Feedback: (5)
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: San Tan Valley, AZ
Posts: 5,768
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Sport_Pilot
You cannot have spread spectrum but you can have frequency hop. Also a lot of the old shared bands for phone pagers are no longer or little used, they could be brought (or is it bought?) in to be used for spread spctrum. About using more prower, I think that we basically abandoned 72 about the time designers were designing the next generation of digitally controlled radio gear for all products. Thus there were no erricient new designs for 72.
Yes you could make a system that hops around all of the channels on 72. But that would make all of the 72 frequencies unusable. I dont think the .FCC or the AMA would like that.
The old phone pager bands would not support SS either.
Old 04-23-2014, 05:14 PM
  #75  
JPMacG
My Feedback: (2)
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Ivyland, PA
Posts: 2,299
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

I'll add that 72 MHz is actually a much better frequency to use than 2.4 GHz for communications between omni-directional antennas. This is because the path loss at 72 MHz is much lower than at 2.4 GHz. Path loss is an unavoidable result of physics that is related to the physical versus electrical size of the antennas we use.

Unfortunately, 2.4 GHz was the band that was available to the developers. I don't think the FCC would allow CDMA (spread spectrum) on 72 MHz. Other services use that band and the process of quickly hopping actually generates a continuum of bandwidth, not just discrete channels.

So we are stuck with 2.4 GHz and the designers have done a good job of overcoming the inherent disadvantage of 2.4 to give us very workable systems.


Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.