FlyBoy95

Hi Guys,

I have a fairly general question. I have been flying a Cloud Dancer 40 (borrowed from a member at my club) and have decided to build a larger Cloud dancer (RCM 96" to be exact).
I have been flying .40 sized trainers for a while and the CD 40 which floats and performs very nicely. Unfortunately the member of the club who owns the CD is moving away so i need to find a new intermediate plane while i build the CD 120. I have heard of people using the scanner (Made by Phoenix models i believe), but i have little room in my car (looking at upsizing to a van for the larger models i have in mind) the Challenger made by seagull models appears to be a nice looking low wing intermediate sport plane (It looks similar to the Great planes Escapade .40).
My questions is have any of you had any experience with one?
My second questions is would a Super Tigre GS 45 work well in the model? (Give it enough 'power' to pull of general aerobatics eg. stall turns / loops / cuban 8 etc.. while having enough to pull it at speed when im feeling a bit heavy fingered)
if not would a JEN .57 (Just engines UK) be a better alternative?
I have been flying for over a bit and am looking at pulling out of Glow (due to the cost of fuel and the 'mess').

Any information / recommendations will be greatly appreciated.

I will be using some of the gear from my trainer (Futaba 14SG with 7008SB rx, Hitec servos (look at moving to 645MGs for the ailerons) and a Eneloop 4.8v 2500mah pack)
Seagull Challenger - http://seagullmodels.com/product/challenger-40-46/

Cheers,

FlyBoy

richardgerardi

I have a Seagull model and they are built very nice. You will like it. I have the extra 300s

FlyBoy95

I like the look of the Seagull model. I have had 2 trainers from their collection, I was wondering if anyone had heard anything about this or is it a new model?

Thanks for the response

FlyBoy

FlyBoy95

Alright for those who haven't seen the model i have just got it and ill post pictures of the ARF build.

FlyBoy95

Now this ARF is a very nice looking Oracovered affordable(Cost me $160 AUD from a LHS) Low wing (.46) sized plane.

Some of the features out of the box:
Assembled main undercarriage (wheels and pants installed)
Pre-hinged surfaces with control horns installed
Pre-assembled fuel tank
Partially assembled tail-wheel
White painted cowling
Wing tube
Push rods
Spinner
Electric Conversion Kit
Parts pack (Clevises / Machine screws / spinner / undercarriage mounting screws / Engine mounting screws / wing bolts / Fuel tank balsa block )

This was my set up for the model:

Evolution .60nx (.46nx case enlarged to .60)
Medium fuel line
Filter

Futaba 7008SB Rx
Hitec HS-311 servos x 3 (Elevator / rudder / throttle)
Futaba FP-S148 x 2 (Ailerons [Dubro HD arms used])
Sanyo Eneloop 4.8v 2500mAh pack
Hitec 100mm Extension leads x 2 (Ailerons)
Futaba HD switch

Engine mounting screws (I decided to use bolts washers and nuts to fasten the engine)
Dubro 3mm hex machine screws x 4
Dubro 3mm washers x 4
Dubro 3mm Locknuts x 4

I decided to use the Evolution as I had it new from a previous model project that i never got into.
The manual is fairly well written although some steps can be confusing.
The hardware pack while being extensive doesn't have any foam for the fuel tank, there isnt any form of tank restraint (Manual says use cable ties [I used 350mm ties]).

If running glow you will need to fuel proof the inside of the fuselage as well as the open wood of the fuselage and wings.
I found that installing the engine and working out the location of the throttle pushrod, removing the engine and then drilling the firewall is the easiest method to install this.

I found that one of the pushrods (Rudder / elevator) was longer than the other so i had to remove 5mm and then re-bend the Z.
There is some trimming that will need to be done to the servo holes in the wings to allow most servos to fit (I used a sharp xacto with a #11 blade to trim the opening)
After installing the rudder and elevator on the model i installed the servos and attached the pushrods. I centered all the surfaced with tape and a level and then connected and adjusted the clevis on the push rod until i got a near accurate centering. I used large silicoln fuel tube to secure the clevis.
A note about the rudder - Align the hinge with the fuselage and cut the slot with an xacto knife also Make sure you use CA to secure the hinge into the fuselage

After all the electrical gear was installed and the engine and muffler were in I installed the undercarriage. The tail wheel is one of the easiest pieces to install although i needed to redrill one of the mounting screw holes.

I moved the switch from the right side to the left side due to the exhaust position.
Rx was mounted on the side of the fuselage with all cables taped and wrapped together. For easy wing removal I used small extension leads and taped off the excess wire.
The CG is really easy to find and the model balances easily.
I ensured everything was in balance (Prop / spinner)
I will hopefully maiden it next week with a flight video to soon follow.

Any questions Feel free to contact me!

Here are some pictures!!!!

the_madgenius

hello flyboy95, a question for you , what club do you fly with in Brisbane?

FlyBoy95

I dont live in Brisbane Madgenius im currently working out western QLD. Im usually on the sunshine Coast. Yourself?

the_madgenius

Good morning FlyBoy95, I am right where the cyclone came in, in Yeppoon. I was a Brisbane resident many years ago and flew at Tingalpa. Now i still have my Cloud Dancer 40, she is 15 years old now and needs a new motor, wore out the other one.

FlyBoy95

Good Afternoon Madgenius,
Hope you managed to get through with little damage.
Thats cool nice to hear that its lasted that long, I have just started building a massive CD as I said. I have just got through building the basic fuselage, I am hoping to be finished by midyear.

the_madgenius

mmm ,, tis now evening FlyBoy05, well we did record winds of 294k, just a wee bit to much to go flying, but i spoke to the weather gods , and thankfully i had no damage to worry about, just 2 plants in front garden missing, but i must admit it was a wee bit hairy for a while , as the eye passed right over us.Massive damage all around us, but we are safe. Had no power or phone connection for 5 days, had to throw out all food in fridge and freezer, but all is good now. Well the weather will be good by the time you finish building, as i put in an order for good weather at that time.
bill from down under

FlyBoy95

Wow, you certainly did escape lightly. I have a friend in Rocky still cut off and wont have power for 2 more weeks.
All they got on the sunshine coast was some slightly heavier showers and a bit of wind.
Haha that's great would be nice to maiden something when its completed!!
Im still awaiting a good day to maiden the Challenger, I'm really hoping it happens this Wednesday, the field I fly at had around 400mm of water across it thanks to the storm.

Flyboy

FlyBoy95

So After a few months of flying this model with the Evolution 60nx, I have determined that,
1 It is a really great flying model, it performs nearly all of the aerobatic maneuvers an Intermediate flyer would be required to do plus some more.

I have had a few issues though, by far the largest is
This model has obviously been designed with an electric set up in mind, now I say this but the model does come with a nitro engine mount installed.
Due to the intended design installing a glow engine will land you with the fuel tank sitting about 10mm lower than the center line of the carb. Because of this fuel flow wasn't constant with air bubbles and back flow happening making the engine unpredictable. I am still to fully resolve this issue (i used a check valve designed form smoke systems which worked alright but degraded to fast) any ideas would be welcomed. You cant move the tank up due to the removable cockpit supports, and you cant move the engine down without modification to the firewall due to the blind nut mounting locations.
Using an engine larger than a 40 is a bit of overkill, the model with the 60 flies at an 1/8th throttle and no need to go more than 1/2 for all aerobatics (in reality I don't think the model structurally could handle it).
The final problem which wasn't really a problem more and annoyance is the location of the wing mounting bolts, there is a small gap between the wing tube and throttle servo, which can be annoying getting an allen key with bolt into position. The other annoyance is getting the wing bolts into their respective holes and threading them down you can experience the occasional cross threading or the occasional misalignment which results in the screw no even going into the blind nut.

In all this is a great intermediate low wing plane, with aerobatic capabilities as well as great flying qualities ie floats like a trainer. It does have its downsides with respect to nitro operation but i believe that as an electric it would be a great cheaper alternative.

Any more questions or solutions feel free to send me a message.

collective itch

I've just finished the build on one of these using a asp 46. I can't get the plane to balance with the battery in th manual recommendation, so tried getting it under the fuel tank through the gaps in the formers. it goes through first former, but wont go through second, and can't stay there as the throttle servo needs to go back in. any ideas apart form adding lead? its a normal 4 cell ni mh flat pack. thanks

FlyBoy95

G'day collective,

I never had this issue as the Evo had a little bit more weight. I mounted the battery slightly forward of the wing spar, just behind the servo. I use a eneloop sq. pack and have just enough room for the wing bolts. I do use a dubro aluminium prop nut / spinner, one of the machined ones. I am plum in range, sometimes slightly forward.

collective itch

hi fly boy,

i tried the battery in that location, and it was still tail heavy. did you use the recommended cog points? and i balanced the plane upside down if that makes sense?
i have metal spinner base also, and had a full fuel tank when i tried it.
i suppose i need to file the former if i can get access, or put some lead in the nose?
how is the plane holding up?

the_madgenius

collectiveitch< when checking the cog of a model< you do it with fuel tank empty>

collective itch

oh ok, makes sense ha, otherwise tail heavy on empty tank?
thanks of the heads up!

collective itch

update on this, had a more experienced member maiden the model, then did 5 tanks of fuel through it myself, few small things to iron out, like may change the prop, currently on a 10 x 6, and advised to go larger, so may go to 11 x 6?

overall, really enjoyed it, and was a different experience being my first nitro plane, and first wooden plane in along time.

FlyBoy95

Did it fly alright apart from the small things? I use an 11 x 6 for sport flying with the ST45.
5 tanks not a bad effort for a new model straight out of maiden. Enjoy, it is a nice model!

collective itch

yes, flew nice, bit tricky on take off and landings for me at the moment as its also my first tail dragger.
apart form being covered in glow snot, which i knew it would be, was great.
will try a 11 x 6 and see how that performs.

FlyBoy95

Yeah tail draggers can be interesting but after a few flights you'll have no issues.
yeah glow mess is a pain... i run castor and methanol only (4:1)....
the 11x6 may help just checked mine and i have a 12x8 on the .60.

I have also just finished a build on the Ripmax Jive .30 and I have an evo .40nx in that...
Also started another forum about a Cloud Dancer 1.20 that I started building.... but got side tracked with a SU26mx rebuild.
add work and university to the mix and I need more flying hours!

Flyboy

n0mats

Good morning guys!

Just newbiew almost 1 year flying rc plane would like to ask, if this plane can use the motor and ESC of fms trojan 1400mm?,

Motor model: 4250-KV580
FMS ESC: 70a
Props: 13x9 3 blades

Im not in a speed flying.... like to fly this plane as normal speed for my 2nd lowing
Hoping for you imputs🙂

More power RCU!

FlyBoy95

G'day n0mats,

The manual for the model recommends
.45 - .52 sized electric motor
35mm 830 rev / volt
12x6 to 13 x 6 prop
esc of 50A
and a 4S 3200mA pack

basically if the motor specifications meet that of a .46 size glow (os i believe have a comparison) it should work quiet well.

This model will not break any speed records however it is very forgiving and rather tame. Landings can be really smooth at it floats onto the strip. even in windy conditions it is very predictable.
Putting the model into a spin it is predictable, generally taking 1 - 1.5 rotations to come out after forcing it.
I swapped the evolution for an os .46 and lowered the engine mounts and improved its ability 10 fold.
Would i recommend it as an intermediate low wing with its characteristics yes. however it is all dependent on your skill leveI.

cheers

n0mats

Thank you sir!,

Just little problem to know if this motor is same in .46 i dont know how ill compute for this one mei be i can find help to our guys here it the motor that i use is suitable for this plane.

FlyBoy95

n0mats

I am not overly sure if the set up would be suitable, i guess one method would be to test it.
Looking at some information the 580Kv would turn 580rpm. however I can't be certain.
I don't play with prop electrics, mainly ducted fan. I would ask someone who has a more
in depth knowledge.