goneflyn

Hardlandings,

Whether you have "mastered" your trainer or not, the four star is a good second plane, and was my choice (strongly advised by my instructor as well). It is a pretty tough plane as well. I broke a lot of props with it (probably because I like the wooden ones and loved the four stroke) but the airframe held up very well. The only crashs I had that was "my fault" was when I ran into trees. It is not as easy to knife edge as a straight wing, but does most other manuvers very well, and will self level pretty well (which makes for the difficult knife edge). That airplane helped me learn a lot about flying.

If you do decide on that plane, I have two suggestions. First, screw the servo blocks to the wing servo hatches, and don't just trust the epoxy (I had one servo come loose while doing cuban 8, and since I was not as experienced as I should have been, it spiraled into the ground at near full throttle--an new wing kit is $50 . Second, I would recommend planking the turtle deck with sheets of balsa. Those little stringers are easy to break, and it makes the plane look better.

The four star is a very straight forward build, easy to see and orient in the air, and lends itself to some great covering schemes. It is also tough, but also easy to repair. The stringers in the leading edge may not look the best, but are very easy to fix in the event they encounter immovable objects :-). If/when you get yours, I hope you enjoy it as much as I did.

Vidra

I just finished building my four star 60 arf with a os .91 fx engine. This plane is very beautiful to look at and is able to hover at half throttle with a 14 by 6 prop. Don't buy the magic, believe me, u will like the four star much much better

HarryJ

My Feedback: (98)

Why has everyone overlooked the Sig Kadet Senior? It is a much better second plane than the Magic or 4*. With a Saito 65 it will do anything you can put it through and is very forgiving. The 4* would make a good first low wing plane. Just my $.02 worth.

wings

Does the Sig Senior even have ailerons?

cappio777

My Feedback: (2)

YES AND NO...........
The kit version still comes as a 3 channel although is easily modfied for ailerons. Now, the ARF version comes with ailerons and smaller dihedral.
One incredibly smooth handling and forgiving airplane. But for second airplane? I dont think so....its like moving from a corvette into a GEO metro.

Mike Buckley

Hard Landing, you certainly shouldn't feel you have to wait until you've master a plane to move on... This is a hobby, if you want to move on to a different plane then go for it. Which plane do you want? I've only been flying 2 years and I already own 9 planes. I've got:
4*40 - a great plane!
Hangar 9 Ultrastick - awesome,, one I would seriously say you should consider as your next plane Kyosho Sukhoi - wow, but I know it will bite me if I don't respect it
Goldberg Cub - nice and relaxing, good for practicing rudder use!
Hobbico Viper - capable of speeds up to 120mph+
GWS Zero - great fun for the park outback when I don't feel like driving to the club field
GP Ultimate Bipe - hey it's biplane what can I say...
Modeltech P-47 - don't know it yet haven't had a chance to fly it.
Pice Duelist - just finishing the build, but it's twin so it should be interesting

I guess I've rambled a bit, but my point is every plane is different and will give you a different experience. In the end get what you want and enjoy it!

Mike

fun_fly_3D

My Feedback: (1)

Guy's i was reading, with great intrest, your posts about a magic and such being to much. here's my story. There was a very stubborn guy at my flying field who decided he was ready for a little tony PYLON RACER!!!! as I said, he was stubborn and could not be talked out of it, and he flew it ok until he realized it will not slow down for a landing! (reasonable as it is a PYLON RACER)!!!! One day, a lot of people were there, and he tried to land like a trainer, and EVERY SINGLE PERSON WAS YELLING (at the tip-top of their lungs), MORE POWER!! MORE POWER!!! Once he tip-stalled, he added full throttle and pulled straight back on the elevator, and headed straight for the now scattering crowd!! he finally recovered it, but he sold it right away and sole EVERYTHING he owned, right down to the glow driver. Then he comes out one day, and I ask him if he was getting out of the hobby, he said no, that he just got in so much over his head, and that he was just going to buy a trainer and stick with it! (yes he sold his first trainer the week he got off the box, even having it explained to him that all getting off the box ment was that he had the minimal skills). One thing I reccommend before getting off the box, is having your instructor htake the plane and have you close you eyes and put it into an unusual attitude, and then give you the plane back and have you correct it. this is what I did ( I passed every single time. if you can do this, you are ready to solo (not quite move on though). I origially talked my instructor into keeping me on the box for a couple more weeks. (he thought I was more that ready). If this guy at my club had done this, he would not have almost crashed his plane. (this test was extensive right down to inverted, stalled simulated dead sticks(throttled back). and then the engine really quit and i actually had to land it out of sight. ( dead stick below the hill). I let the plane drop according to what i thought the slope of the hill was, then just stalled it in, and when we walked down, we sall that it was upright, just as if it had been in my sights. I owe a lifetime debt of gratitude to my very thorogh instructor!!! He only takes one student at a time, so he can work with them extremely extensively. The other guy? he had about ten other students.

please consider my two cents worth of advice!

Brian

RichD

I have a model tech Magic... it is NOT a second plane, period.

blw

My Feedback: (3)

Trainers can do more than we give them credit for. A guy at our club took up another guys LT-40 and was doing rolling circles, among other neat things, with it. I bet every single one of us wouldn't have believed half of that stuff was possible if we had not seen it.

Razor-RCU

My Feedback: (50)

Why go from trainer to trainer?

Why try to fly pattern with a trainer?

Why confuse magic-3D with Magic extra?

Why make the answer to this question so difficult?

He said Magic or 4*60, one or the other-

Geesh--- The Magic-3D is fine for your 2nd plane just keep the rates and CG conservative and you'll be fine---

leftnut

My Feedback: (1)

4* 60 kit version.
excellent kit , laser cut and the parts fits nicely.
You can frame it up in a weekend
It's more forgiving and easy to repair. I crashed one of mine five times
and never damage the wing.
Building one will help u understand construction techs and what not.
Crashing one can help uderstand weak pionts.
You can modify a 4* or bash it easily to make it more nimble.
I wacked the wings to help increase the roll rates.
But it'll still float.
I will never master my fourstars. It is a great tool for parctice
or trying new maneuvers.
Or just something I can us to fly around without much hazzle.
With dual rates she can be as gentel as a kitten or pretty wild.
The wing gets toss around a lot when it's on wild. I notice the wing
stops flying quit a bit. But I want it to do that sometimes.
It torque rolls or hover fine with only a magnum .61

The magic or magic extra is the same plane or have the same air foil.
I like this air plane. I deem mine needed reinforcing in certain areas.
My extra magic look fine it's red base with neon flames, now.
I won't have choosen it as a second air plane for me.
It will float, not like a trainer or a 4*, however.
it is recommend that you have some thrust going
or gravity pulling. Landing a dead stick in a head wind is not recommended
or to be avioded if possiable.
Flying the CONTENDER as a second air ship helped me understand this.

RichD

The [link=http://www.globalhobby.com/public/modeltech/gallery/123740.asp]Magic [/link] and the [link=http://www.globalhobby.com/public/modeltech/gallery/123739.asp]Magic Extra[/link] are not the same aircraft.

Unless I totally misunderstood your point, if so, sorry

leftnut

My Feedback: (1)

They have the same air foil

I did manage to get one of my fuelage to fly without a wing.
It only lasted for 10 sec. or less.
It was cool controling missle thou.

DTB

My Feedback: (15)

The Four Star is a much better 2nd plane. The magic would be a better 3rd or 4th plane. These are two totally different planes. Example: A Porsche 911GT and Kia Rio. Both are cars, but totally different.

chadvone

My Feedback: (2)

Which is the Porshe and which is the Kia?
I have both and am not sure myself.

NJAIRSTRIKE

My Feedback: (2)

Hey MinnFlyer,

I always look for your comments on people's questions because you seem very knowledgable and I respect your answers as well as a few other guys on this forum. ( not that I dont respect other's)
you said "I say go with something that has a high or shoulder wing, semi-symmetrical airfoil, and rubber bands. Stiks, are good choices, and if you want an ARF, the Midwest Aerobat which I recently reviewed for RCU Magazine is an outstanding choice. "


Since the 4* Doesent have the durablility that is often needed as a second plane,

To move up from a trainer to a better trainer is stupid in my opinion, if you want to move up you might as well take a bigger step up

so my question is, you recommend the stiks and the midwest aerobat, What other "Bigger steps" up would you recommend?

Thanks

dredhea

My Feedback: (13)

WOW!!!! you guys have convinced me!! I have a looong way to go to get there, but was considering what I would like to get for a second plane. After reading this thread I've decided that my next step will be............ A wing kit for my PT40, built without dihedral or washout. Just kidding, but I was surprised at how heated this discussion got.
Hmmmm. wing kit doesn't sound like such a bad idea