rajul

My Feedback: (58)

I would like to get some advise as to whether it will be better for a beginner to use low or high throw rates ? Thanks...........

bobi

begin with low rates and when you are familiair with the plane( and it's tendency ) then you go to higher rates .( which is at the flick of a switch in todays radios )

Crashem

Low! Low!! Low!!!

And also setup throws to instructions if provided.

Don't forget balance point either in same cases it can be more critical then rate selection.

A nose heavy plane may by sluggish and have a poor glide rate
but a tail heavy plane may fly only once.

Cactus.

My Feedback: (1)

just to stir up some thoughts.... .

1.low rates... for the first flight you might NEED those high rates if you have a trim problem... yes i almost did crash a plane by having high rates, a bank turned into 2 rolls!!! but i test fly all planes on high rate. however i dont move the stick much, years of RC car racing.

2. i have a friend that learnt on low rates, now he cant fly on high, his Cougar is wasted on him

3. some learners ( like my GF on a glider ) loose concentration when the plane is too slow to respond/ feels remote to them then get into trouble easy, i moved the horns in a notch ( not mad, but below what i would have ) and suddenly shes much better. the twitcher glider needs more thought and demands they pay attention. its also damn nice for me to fly low over the grass tufts now

tazc3

definitely start flying the plane on low rates until you get use to it after some time switch on the high rates and go have fun with the plane.the high rates may be to touchy for first flights good luck and have fun

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

Don't worry about rates.
Set the plane up so that you are at the manufacturers minimums then adjust from there. You may find that you need less throw than recommended. That is what I have on my Giles. I never fly with the recommend rates. My plane snaps 100% of the time with the recommended low rates. I will admit, if I fly 3D, I will need the recommended high rates and even more, but for now, extremely low rates work.

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

The number one cause of new aircraft loss and the number one mistake by the newbie arriving at the field the first time is 'CG to far aft'.

The number two reason is 'throws to high'.

And yes Phillybaby throws to low can also have first flight problems but since this is in context of the beginners forum and that beginner needs to have an experianced pilot do that first test flight anyway Its probably not prudent to susgest that a newbie use higher throws. Seen a lot of newbies and airplanes showup with throws far to high but have never seen one arrive with throws to low!



Just my opinion

John

Crashem

Yeah CG Problems stink!!!

Best 30 bucks I spent GP Balancer. (It also works With ARFs and RTFs)

Adjust the "rulers" on top in inchs or milimeters to what ever the plans/instructions say place plane on balancer make sure leading edge of wing is touching vertical posts on ruler and see if plane balances. PS make sure balance is on level serface.

BingoFlyer

LOW RATE for the first flight, I set the high rates to the recommended throws and set the low rate to approx. 1/2 the high.

I have to agree that CG is more important than the throw as long as you are somewhere near the recommended. Nose heavy planes don't fly well but tail heavy planes won't fly long!

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)

Whenever I am instructing a new student on the buddy box I keep my radio on high rates (need that to recover in an emergency), but I definately keep the buddy radio (the trainee) on low rates. The low rates help them from overcontrolling at first. As they start getting a better feel for the sticks with more time on them, I slowly turn up the low rates. This way they get more control as they learn not to over control.

Definately low rates for a beginner.

Cactus.

My Feedback: (1)

ok first off, i really do agree with low rates for learners, just not stupid low, whichhhhhhhh is what this litle story tells us.
our club chair woman is flying a members Limbo dancer, learning on it, she flys a little close to the pits and we all start shouting over in jest "no flying over the pits" and other things along the same line, inculding my " no flying " then it dives and dosnt pull out... weird, it had oodles off room, and my line was only a joke
Turns out they wernt using a buddy box, and the rates had been set way low. so, she lost concentration when she turned round to us lot and the plane started its dive, when the guy took his plane back he didnt have enough rate to pull the plane out of a 20 ish degree dive in 3-5 seconds. thats LOW!!!!!!! espicialy for a Limbo.
for me i wouldnt consider rates as low as that as the pliot flying the plane. + it also sets up bad habbits of over control in later planes on higher rates.

nun45

My Feedback: (1)

shouting while a newbie is learning is a nice way to break concentration also! things do happen while a person is training and over the pits is a common problem, but shouting can only make it worse, buddybox or not.---henry

Cactus.

My Feedback: (1)

not a newbie, just a notflyveryoftenbie she does helis ok, and its pay back for the ear ache she gives us lot ; )
having a plane that cant pull up from a simple dive wasnt expected from us lot ribbing her in the pits.

anyways... point was, having rates too low is also bad

Crash_N_Burn

I'm a second-time newbie, so I always read threads like this one with interest.

I am just setting up a new plane and the manufacturer only gives the "recommended rates for the first flight" (sigh)

So, instead of guessing at the 'low' rates, how about using the 'recommended rates' plus 60% expo?

Is this acceptable?

Cactus.

My Feedback: (1)

i'm guessing rates for first flight are low rates...
for me.... ( remember i have years of car racing and a well trained thumb ) i dont like expo too much. you end up with a soggy middle and a over reactive end ( sound familar? lol )
your trying to control, the plane then it comes out of expo and dumps twice the control you just had in a fraction of the stick. better to soffen the middle with -20% and learn small smooth movements.
when your at low rates, you also have very little need for expo, the surface hardly moves, why do you need to make it less twitchy around neutral?

i just have this belief that flyers should be aimed towards having built in expo and good control of the thumb, rather than let a computer radio iron out the Playstation reaction.

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)

Crash_N_Burn,
My advice would be to stay away from the expo on a trainer. That is something entirely different from high and low rates. You need to set you low rate at about 50-60%. Leave the expo for your second plane.

Just my 2 penny's worth

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

Crash_N_Burn
I have seen a guy fly 3d and aerobatics with only one rate and 80% expo. I guess with practice, you could do that

Crash_N_Burn

Boy, did this hit home "i don't like expo too much. you end up with a soggy middle and a over reactive end ( sound familiar? lol )"

and...

My advice would be to stay away from the expo on a trainer. That is something entirely different from high and low rates.

Thanks, Philbaby and RCKEN!

I've had a number of planes, but just invested in a computer radio. My mentor always says "dial in 60% expo", and I do, but it just doesn't feel right (soggy middle, reactive end).

Because of this great advice I'm going to dial-out any expo and just work with the rates. I'll start with the recommended rates and see how she does and just adjust the throws, up or down from there.

I guess expo has it's place for a more experienced flier, and I'll put it on my learning curve short-list, but for now traditional control makes more sense.

Thanks to you both for helping me grasp this point!

Cactus.

My Feedback: (1)

expo is good for umm 3 things, or there about...
old flyers with shaky hands, sorry but its true
low flying where you need to control the pitch very carefully
to control a over controlable plane.

for the last one i have a Outlaw, its rolls are the quickest i've ever seen, most of the time i stay within the -60% expo ( use just the middle of the sticks range). then when i want to spin or flip i'll wack it over right out of that range.
however, this leads to a bad suituation if you suddenly have to react because you'll auttomaticly come out of the expo and get in more trouble... done it a few times with this plane.

-60% is far to much for any non 3D/mental plane.
for trainers upto -20 on the elevator can help with smoother landings, but it all depends on the pilot and plane, do what feels right to you.

KCFlyBoy

My Feedback: (12)

It is all about what feels right. If someone sets it up and it does not feel right then you will have trouble. I set mine up with small throws on low and as much as I can on high with out causing the plane to snap to soon. I have a Smith Mini Plane that would snap with just elevator on high rates. This could be bad if you don't understand the plane and its flight characteristics.

Unstable

for a trainer suggested manufacturers rates. dont worry about low/high expo etc etc etc

first off if the student over controls the plane its something he needs to break himself of before he can really learn to fly so low rates only delays this proccess.

expo really no need for it on most trainers cause they arent that touchy.

when do you need high/low rates and expo

i dial in about -20 to -40 on most of my planes for personal feel. its not needed but i like it with the exception of 2 planes. my pizza box and my somethin extra there im using about -50 to -70 expo for the simple reason that i have the throws set to maximum (not max recomended, max phisically possible with the surfaces) and those planes if i put the sticks in the corners im doing something stupid so it doesnt matter if the controls "jump"

as for dual rates i dont use them (dont have any planes that really need them)

but fot fast planes were you need high throws for take off and landing but need small thows during flight or 3d planes that need smaller throws for "normal flying" so as not to snap or such.

but that is just my opinion its really up to the person flying... if you want a rate for takeoffs and landing and a rate for flying then use it.. if you arent comforatble with your setup then "tweak" it till you are. you have more fun that way

but again... thats just my opinion

rajul

My Feedback: (58)

This is exactly what my instructor advised. Thanks............