madtr

Well my local lhs is fine if your a airplane guy and treated me well but since i started cars hes been a jerk,He used to get me stuff for my planes when i called hed order, but now with the cars he doesnt seem to be interested

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)

That's the truth. When I was in collage I worked in a motorcycle shop. Whenever a man walked into the shop to by a motorcycle or ATV it was usually a pretty easy sell, but when a couple walked in it was a totally different sales pitch. When a couple is in you always convince the WIFE to buy it, because once she's sold then the sale is a done deal. But if she's not going for it you can pretty much forget the sale, cause it ain't happenin!!!!

Ken

DadsToysBG

My Feedback: (35)

I will follow this because I do want to be the best I can. This is a one horse store and i do it all. Planes and cars. Trying to keep up with all the new stuff can be hard to do because people change their minds so fast. But like my handle I do fly what i sell and will not carry products I feel are not the best. I wil order them but I will tell you what I think about it. Example is the PTS 51.
Also most of my customers are also my friends at the field, and i will really hear about selling a new guy something weird. Dennis

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)

Dennis,
Man, I really wished I lived closer to you than I do. Because I would definitely shop with you. Your attitude (at least what I see here) is a breath of fresh air after dealing with some of the LHS's near me. Heck, if I bought stuff from you would you consider shipping to me?? <Bruce, close your eyes and don't read the next sentence > Shipping with USPS (postal service) is great because they have flat rate boxes that you ship up to 70 pounds for the same rate ($4.05). I'd definitely be more than willing to send business your direction than to Illinois any day of the week, and twice on the weekend!! One question, do you sell Airtronics stuff?? I need some other things hardware wise (might also need to get a OS 120 Surpass before too long) too. We shouldn't get doing business in the forums, but I wanted to ask you out in the open because others might benefit to know if you will ship to them. Anyway, let me know.

Ken

TopThumbs

"I'll have to talk to my wife"

This has and always will be a hard one to figure out.

What helps is to try and remember the last time YOU said that and what you where thinking.
most of the time it's a bail out stratagy due to not enouph of the right information for the customer to make a comfortable decision to spend $$.

One of the hardest phrases a salesman can say is "What can I do to help you decide?" another one to NOT be affraid to ask is "What can I do sell you this kit today"

This will sometimes prompt a joke like "pay for it for me" or "call the wife and have her cut the check" etc etc... but... what you just got was an opportunity to relate to your customer - this promotes trust.
Offer to reduce the price of the radio by $10.00 if he buys the package today.
Offer something that, through your conversation, you have learned that he will appreciate.
Do everything you can to keep your customer talking - you'll learn more about what it will take to make the sale - more importantly you will learn what will make him satisfied.

I said once - does your wife build models? "No" Does she fly? he said no and I promtly responed half jokeingly, then why make HER pay for it?? I have sold more package deals and kits with that line.
It appeals to the male ego and the dominant gene all guys have - try it.

Another that has worked is - "it's easier to ask forgiveness then it is to seek permission"

Bill


ps. always focus on your customer, always look them in the eye and always ask questions to invoke a better response than yes or no.
never ask a question you know the answer will be "negative" no to. Never ask a question that will invoke any negative type answer and the word no is a negative.
Try to ask questions that invoke a either a fun, positive, or chatty type answer in a positive tone.

Bill 101 has now concluded - any questions?

DadsToysBG

My Feedback: (35)

Thank you for the kind words. I'm not a mail order store but i do send to people. I only charge what the shipping is. To answer your other question I don't handle Airtronics. Had a bad time with them once, lost a few planes due to the program "going japiness" But i can get them. Send PM I'm always ready to talk planes. Also check the club web site at SKYMACRC.com. We have a couple of big shows coming up in June and July.
I always match MO pricing if it doesn't have to set on the shelf.
Thanks, Dennis

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)

Dennis,
I'll PM you later on when I figure out what I need right now. I just went to the LHS last weekend and picked up what I need to finish my current project, so it may be a little bit.

Ken

DadsToysBG

My Feedback: (35)

Start somthing new I've got a lot of planes to move. Might even cut the price to find more shelf space. Dennis

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)

Bill,
I'll tell you flat out that if you ever said that me while I was standing in your store, I'd turn around, walk out the door, and never grace your establishment again. My wife and I are a team and we run the household (as well as a successful business) together and before I lay out a large amount of money I will consult with her if I don't know how the budget looks. I don't need her permission, but I have enough respect for her to talk to her before I lay down a few hundred dollars that she doesn't know about. In return she also shows me the same courtesy. If I tell her that I want to spend a large amount of money and the family budget can't handle it then I won't buy it then, but on the other hand if the budget is good then she'll say go ahead. Why do I call her in the first place? Because she's the one that keeps the books on the computer so she knows what we have and what's coming up, I don't usually carry that info with me to the LHS. Her knowing that I do take into consideration the family budget also has it's advantages. Like last summer, out of the blue she said to me "You haven't bought anything for you planes in awhile, so you're probably having withdrawl symptoms. Take $200-$300 out of the checkbook and go buy yourself something!!!"

This is true, once. From my observations of others that I fly with trying something like this usually doesn't work but once or twice. To be honest with you, the quickest way to alienate somebody's spouse is to sneak around behind her back to do things like this. It's no wonder that so many wives hate their husbands hobbies when they pull stunts like this. I'm willing to bet that if they consulted their wives first they might find out that she's a lot more willing to go along with it. I've had several students that I was teaching that would do this, they would buy planes with family budget money or sneak around behind their wives backs to buy planes. This is one thing I teach all of my students, take care of your family first. I had one student that I refused to teach because he took grocery money to buy his plane with, and he had 2 young kids to feed.

For you to post something like this shows me that you have an attitude of "anything to make the sale";
I expect to hear things like this from a used car salesman, not the owner of the hobby shop I buy from. It's called customer service when you call me and say "man, you need to see what I just got in. It's really cool", and this is called customer service. But it's another thing to do anything you can to get me to buy something before I head out the door no matter what, that's what is out of line. If you want to run a good store then you need to realize that there are times that I am going to come in, lean on your counter, shoot the breeze, ask you some questions, and then walk out your door empty handed. And then on my next trip I may come in and drop $4,000 on a new plane, radio, and engine. But for you to expect me to buy something every time I walk in your door, you can forget that. I'll head on down the road to the next guy that isn't a high pressure salesman, or I'll just get on Tower's or Horizon's website and make my order.

That's my 2 cents worth.

Ken

TopThumbs

RCKen.
Keeping things in perspective here is often hard for a customer (such as you) to hear sales techniques from the profession.
All things being held to the standards of the LHS owner I wouldnt expect the car salesman hard sell either. I also wouldnt expect to sell you something every time you came into my shop.
if your referring to my comments about getting something form everyone I also included a smile in that statement

There is a very fine line between what the customer percieves as service and what the LHS owner/staff understands as service.

my notes are meant to help direct and add food for thought and apply said notes to a particular situation. Maybe I should make that more clear huh?

The hundreds of hours of training and classes and the 25 years plus of applied service I have endured have taught me one thing.
I can pick apart almost everything and say that doesnt work for me, if you ever said that to me... etc etc... but - the truth is given the right circumstances all are correct.

Said out of context like you present it, it sure sound bad however applied artfully all are legitimate comments to help push along the sale.

there is nothing wrong with asking a customer what I can do for you to help make this sale. It opens direct and honest dialog. Done "artfully" and without the "used care salesman" pushyness it can sometimes make a difference between making the sale or not.

"anuthing to make the sale" ??

Hardly - simply information to draw off of and possibly apply to a given circumstance. I doubt any laid back LHS owner would ever take anything I say as gospel and push every sale like a used car salesman. Frankly I am almost offended, however - such is life. [8D]
I am one of the most layed back sales persons you would ever meet, however I almost cry watching some LHS owners ignore and take thier customers for granted and not ask for the sale.

I'm not exactly sure where this came from. maybe read above for your answer...

Try and remember also that what might not work for you might work for 10 others and it's up the LHS owner to distinguish the difference and or make his choices based on the personality of the customer.

I'll add, and I guess I should add this before I am fileted further for passing along what I have learned is this.
always remember two things.
what works for me might not work for you - it's up to you to disseminate the information and apply, if you wish, what might work for you and your personality.
also, regular customers are already sold - DOH! treat em with respect and follow thier lead and you should be fine.

Bill

ps.
I almost forgot one of the MOST important things you could EVER LEARN!!! sheesh I feel so stoopid...

Know when to shut up.

Dont keep talking after the close.

bruce88123

I tend to agree with Ken on this. The LAST thing I will put up with is "The Hard Sell". If I ask for a product or information, feel free to offer it. But if I say "No thank you", you need to accept it or get out of my way before I trample on you walking out of your store. I've had people try "The Hard Sale" with me on the phone before, refusing to accept several polite refusals. They get the correct idea when I request a supervisor be put on the line so I can file a complaint against them. If I really want something I'll ask if there is any way the salesman can make a deal happen. If he says no, I accept that and move on.

I've had car dealers tell me they were giving me the best possible deal before. Then I show them my Edmunds & KBB research and save thousands more sometimes, either on the purcahse or the trade-in.

Do I trust salesmen? Never. But they are just doing their jobs and it's up to me to defend myself from them.

flyinrog

My Feedback: (1)

Maybe it doesnt sound as "artfull" on paper as it does flowing professionally out of your mouth, but you DO sound like its "anything for the sale"..as if you try and corner someone into buying something..I might buy something that way but I doubt I'd come back...Your friendly conversation sounds as if you are looking for ammo to corner the sale....btw,, "I need to check with my wife" translates to "I dont want it now but I'm trying to remain social now get out of my way and maybe I'll come back for it".....people are different and I wish you only success, but "pushy"-drives me away...Rog

bruce88123

BTW TopThumbs - Ken happens to be a successful entrepenuer who runs a successful computer business. So for YOU to tell him that he doesn't understand the other side of the picture is simply ludicrous. He needs to sell his products and services to his customers daily.

MikeL

My Feedback: (3)

Personally, I don't respond well to someone trying to sell me something. With how easy it is to compare prices and shop around today, I think it's much more valuable to the small business man to cultivate relationships rather than to focus on making a sale. A hobby shop isn't the sort of business with an endless source of customers. There's a pool of people who generally know each other or of each other, with the occasional new person coming to the area or discovering the hobby.

If I ran a hobby shop, when it came to the people side of the business I'd want to focus on two things: Building and maintaining a solid reputation within the local modeling community and creating customer loyalty through great service. If a shop can do those two things, odds are they're doing all of the ancillary things well, too.

In the context we're talking about, I think the LHS is better served to be family-friendly rather than the place where husbands go to squander the disposable income. Encouraging someone to make a large purpose without the consent of their spouse is just asking for that spouse to feel resentful of the hobby. How long is that customer going to be in the hobby if it causes family problems?

Repeat business seems to be the key, not pressured sales. Warm, friendly service seems to be an important component of hobby shop success. Ambivalence or pressure? That works great for grocery stores and used-car sales, respectively. The teenager that makes minimum wage and doesn't care about the hobby isn't going to be an ideal employee, and neither is the fellow who's looking for a one-time $300 sale.

TopThumbs

ok - perspective lost... time to re-group I guess...

Agreed Bruce.
however like I said,
I am sure he is successfull. I can tell by the intelligence of his postings, I meant no disrespect.
One of the best known and longest standing businesses I have ever had the pleasure of working alongside was a bike shop. he was open forever and always managed to keep afloat. But, he was the most staunch hard headed individuals I ever knew (loved him to death). But he will always be simply just- just getting by because he was not open to knew ideas.

You guys seem to be stuck on the hard sell concept. I cant remember offer any advice to hard sell. Please re-read before you hang me out to dry.
again - it's food for thought - that's all.
What I am relaying here is what every singe professional sales person (hard sell or NOT) will hear through very expensive training and or years and years seminars from top fortune 500 companies. Like it or not, I know it's a hard things for customers to hear.
consider it free unsolicited advice - remember you get what you pay for

My shop was VERY successfull as well as my restaraunt as well as my limo company and several online companies I operate at present. I have never once applied a hard sell tactic EVER.
I dispise hard sell as much as you guys do, however... information is power.
An open mind is a sponge
a closed mind is a rock

Just trying to help by offering my advice and experience to anyone that cares to listen. I would hope others would also offer up thier own stories and musings without hanging any one person out to dry based on thier own experiences.
I have seen to many really good threads here die a painfull death due to personal attacks and outright foot stomping 'cause someone disagrees.
I say it's ALL valid, even if I disagree with you what you have to say may help others in some small way. Why be so hard and judge so harshly those that try to offer up something, arguably, usefull?

good thing I'm thick skinned

Bill

TopThumbs

I LOVE this..
Thank you MikeL

TopThumbs

Ammo ?
Nah, more like paying attention to the customers wants and needs without being pushy or HARD SELL

but thanks for your take on this. Seems I need to tip toe and soften things up a bit and not be so direct.

Bill

hezik

Sell pink Airplanes/cars/boats and so on. Carry at least one item in each catagory that looks like Barbie could be at the controls. Carry at least 3 different paint colors that could be interpreted as pink. Carry shiny things.

If the wife comes in as well, don't mention past purchases nor what they cost. Don't give any indication as to what a complete working product costs. Be vague on stuff like servo's, don't call them servo's but use the numbers. Incidentally walk past the pink section while talking. Remember, an airplane costs "rougly 75 dollar", a car "about 100 dollar", and so on. :P

DadsToysBG

My Feedback: (35)

I don't know if i do the right thing all the time, but if a customer is just looking or just wants to talk, I offer hot coffee or coke and show him my work shop. If I'm building something I'll ask for his advice. The best thing about my store to me is the table and chairs. Sit down spend an hour talking planes. If I don't get much done, there's still the next day.
Yesterday two boys came in and wanted to buy a car. They did't know what they wanted, so i went thru my speech about the difference in each car. Opened the boxes and let them see the cars, had them all over the floor. Then i left them alone, went back and asked if they had any more questions. Answered them and left again. They spent a hour with me and bought the car they wanted. Bought two with all the stuff needed to run them so I gave them a %10 discount. I'll make it back in parts later.
If what you do is not fun don't do it.
Dennis

LANNYBOB

i wish i had a hobby shop where i could go and sit down and shoot the breeze. must be nice in kentucky.

DadsToysBG

My Feedback: (35)

Come on up to our giant scale meet in July and I'll have the coffee ready. Example of what i was talking about with the wife issue. I had a man call about a car that I had here. Gave him the price and he showed up and put everything he wanted on the counter and i rang it up. He said after i gave him the amout that he had to get the check book from his wife. She was sittting in the car. I couldn't hear what was said, but I could tell from the look on her face that it wasn't going to happen so I started to put the stuff back up. All I saw from the window was him getting back in the car, never even came in to tell me he's sorry. Still don't know why he called in the first place or came to the store. But I sold the car three days later. That's business. Dennis

LT-40

My Feedback: (2)

I am bothered by all of these comercial hobby shops poping up and stealing the buisness of the more traditional shops owned by guys who know what they are talking about. For example, HobbyTownUSA for the most part it is a nice shop and has a fairly good selection, but when you have a question, the guy who they hired off the street doesn't have a clue. They say things like, "what is that?" "I dont know what you are talking about" "is that for airplanes or for cars?" I also don't like how only a small corner of the store is for airplanes, and the rest is toys, games, and stuffed animals. Hobbytron also has a lot of the same problems.
I just feel bad that a lot of the newcomers coming into this hobby are being lured towards these comercial hobby shops, and don't know that the other traditional ones even exist. The traditional shops usually have a better selection for a certain area of the hobby, are more friendly, and much more helpful. It makes a visit to the LHS fun! You are also way more likely to get started off on the right track because these are the types of shops that your fellow club members will visit.

LT-40

MinnFlyer

My Feedback: (4)

I would have jumped in earlier, but I've been a little busy this week.

I totally agree that the LHS MikeL and I use is the best I've ever seen. I have to travel 100 miles to get to it, but it's worth the trip!

And yes, even though I do reviews, I still have to BUY stuff. In fact, the guys at the hobby shop have said several times that now that I get "Free" airplanes, I spend more money there than ever!

rrragmanliam

My Feedback: (1)

WRONG!
No one's Stealing anything here LT-40. What your seeing here is known as free market capitalism. Choice and compitition are the rules of the game and I wouldn't want it any other way. I do support my LHS ( and it's a darn good one Thompsons Hobbies, Lakewood Colorado) by going there first, but will shop the mail orders for other items the don't cary.

Darren

sscherin

My Feedback: (1)

My big issues is out of stock items or poorly stocked. (so messy I can't find anything)

If you have balsa or a K&S metal rack in the store keep it stocked and in order.
I hate to spend 20 minutes digging through the rack trying to find something thats out of place or just plan gone.

Before you go home for the night do a walk around and put everything back where it belongs.

I know one LHS that stocks the shelves by brand.. Dubro here, Great planes here, a small confusing end cap of sullivan products over there..
Other strange things like the covering is 20 feet away from the covering tools.

Just put the screws with the screws, and somewhat grouped with like products.

Screws with nuts and washers.
Wheels with wheel collars and landing gear.
Fuel line, filters, tanks together.
clevises with ball links control horns and pushrods.

Don't charge extra shipping for special ordersunless you plan o getting it there tomorrow because I asked for it.
I had an auto parts store charge me shipping on a shock I needed one time then made me wait 2 weeks to get it because it was coming in with th general stock order.
Don't do that!!! I never went there again..


get it?


What do they do good?

They have the best selection of props in town.

Now my favorite LHS isn't the biggest or the best stocked but they do keep the basics in stock.

They are members of my Club.
Everyone working there flies and knows what I'm talking about when I have questions.