Flyin Beagle

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I read a lot of names for various aerobatic maneuvers, and do not have a clue as to what a lot of them are. I was hoping some of you veterans could help us noobies out by telling us what these are. Here are a few off the top of my head. Please add to the list with descriptions, or a website that could help.

Flat Spin, Tip Stall, Torque Roll, and all of the other various types of rolls, Split S, Knife edge Etc...

Thanks

WoofDog

Here is one site that has some explained.
http://www.scootworks.com/rdrc/aerobat.html

brett65

My Feedback: (18)

The tip stall is not an aerobatic maneuver, its something that happens to a plane that doesn't have any lift on the outer portion of a wing. It will fall, like a roll to the side that tip stalls. It happens alot in warbirds I think.

jetmech05

before i can tell you about a split s..let me tell you about an Imelman (m-mel-man) turn.....the aircraft does a 1/2 inside loop..then rolls upright at the top of the 1/2 loop...the aircraft gains altitude and reverses direction..a split s is the reverse of an Imelman...the aircraft does an outside 1/2 loop and rolls wings level at the bottom of the 1/2 loop....the aircraft losses altitude and reverses direction..

Bob Mitchell

I thought in a split S the plane rolled inverted at the top, followed by a half loop to reverse direction.

Charlie P.

Lets, see: there's the twisty thing, the big round thing, the corkscrewy one, the figure 9, and that crunchy one that ends the day.


http://www.geistware.com/rcmodeling/...ics/aresti.htm


http://www.imacnw.com/info_corner_me...gman_Paper.pdf

http://www.geistware.com/rcmodeling/...ics/maneuvers/

Enjoy.

And, no kidding, find a three or four inch toy airplane and just try and visualize the necessary tx inputs as you move ith through a series of maneuvers. It does help to get the spacial juices flowing in your mind.

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)

Charlie,
You don't even have to get as fancy as a toy airplane. I used a few craft sticks (popsicle sticks) and made a small airplane with them. Took about a minute and a few drops of glue to put it together. I keep it in my flight box so that I can use it to show my students what I want them to do. It's amazing how such a small visual aid can help them to see what they are going to do in the air.

Ken

overbored77

My Feedback: (11)

I keep something like this in my field box. built mine from a piece of 1/4 inch balsa,
printed a picture off the internet and taped it to the balsa to get the shape. then I added
wings and a tail and glued it together. finished it off with some momokote. It is a great visual
aid when learning to fly or learning new aerobatic manuevers.

Blazer1

My Feedback: (1)

Here is a very good thread that shows the various maneuvers.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_4459958/tm.htm

Rufcut

Hey, that's exactly my repertoire![&:]

Gray Beard

My Feedback: (-1)

Now if we could just talk Ed Moorman from the now gone forever RC Report magazine to publish his Fun Aerobatics in a small book form the world would be a better place!! I was doing stunts for years {poorly} that I had no clue as to what they were called until I started to read Ed's article each month.I have cut them out and taken them with me to the field when I knew a student wanted to learn something new. Ed even talks you through every step and lets you know what type of planes will do what stunt best. Way easier then me trying to tell the student what to do while he if flying. Yes Ed, I miss your dribble already!!![&o]

CGRetired

My Feedback: (1)

Hey Bearded one:

I didn't even KNOW they had a name!!! What I was doing, to try to set up an approach turned out to be a maneuver... WITH A NAME!!

Then along came Ron.. my Instructor. He said, "You know what that was?" I said, "What what was?" He said "That last maneuver". I said.. I didn't know that was a maneuver!!

He gave me the pattern sequence for the Sportsman maneuvers and I learned from there. Now, I just do them, but in no particular order.

CGr.

Gray Beard

My Feedback: (-1)

CG, I knew I was doing maneuvers but I couldn't even keep the names of the ones I knew straight in my head, still have that problem. Then along came Ed and I have some of them figured out now. Sometimes?? I too was given the Basic and sportsman, that helped a lot too. Having someone next to me {my advanced instructor} scoring, removed a lot of my fun though. Made me a lot smoother pilot but you know!!!!!

overbored77

My Feedback: (11)

Graybeard,
I flew about 5 flights with CGretired as my instructor (yup 4 flights and soloed, Man is he good) I put the trainer away after 2 weeks
and started flying a tiger 2. I had maybe 5 or 6 flights on the tiger and was getting pretty good at loops and rolls and flying a straight
line when the gentlemen referred to in CG's post "RON" walked up behind me and asked me to do 3 rolls in a row, I screwed that up
pretty bad and we continued to work on those 3 rolls until I could do them without deviating from my current heading. It was now late november
and getting cold so we worked on the loop and vertical line for a few flights and the season was over. February comes around and we started
right where we left off. he handed me the Pattern sportsman routine and explained every maneuver and proceeded to instruct (sometimes raising
his voice) until I could fly every maneuver semi respectable. In may I was asked if I would like to attend a pattern competition? I figured I would give it
a shot so I went. The first flight of the day had 3 men sitting in a chair behind me with clipboards ready to judge, the guy in the far left chair was RON,
talk about pressure. I love flying precision aerobatics and can't seem to stop, I have to say though that I haven't had as much fun flying as I did those
first five flights. I enjoy flying but I feel like everytime I takeoff with an aerobatic plane I am being judged and have to fly perfect, It does take some
of the fun out of it.

MasterAlex

I found [link=http://www.bruce.ogilvy.clara.net/index.html]this[/link] site a few years ago and was impressed. Choose the downloads page and then select 10. "Flying Areobatics". It will download a set of HTML pages that you can view from your computer even when you're not connected to the internet. I found the diagrams and explanations very useful.

-MA

d_bodary

My Feedback: (85)

Try nsrca.us
on the left hand side go to Judging/Flight sequences click on
Center of the page scroll down to Power point presentation of 2007 patterns.
Click on one or more Sportsman, intermediate, advanced or Masters.

Either one has not only a nice drawing but also the description of each.

Nathan King

Beat me to it!

Gray Beard

My Feedback: (-1)

Chris, joking aside, learning to fly precision is the way to go. I never had any plans to fly pettern or IMAC and my instructor had a stroke before I finished all of my instructions so I went back to being a Sunday flyer. I was a lot smoother pilot though and it showed a lot. This year I have two IMAC planes and one pattern plane {old school plane} with another old pattern plane on the bench. I have gotten bored with just cutting holes in the sky so I'm thinking of getting back into the IMAC type of flying and maybe fly the two IMAC contests we have in my area this year. I'm working now on getting my two IMAC planes into top trim so I don't have to do as much of that pilot stuff when flying. I will still be taking out my little Hots to the field just in case the air gets too thick and needs some holes punched in it, you never know when that is going to happen but I like to be ready!!

CGRetired

My Feedback: (1)

Absolutely right on, Gray Beard. What I do, though, is make sure anyone that I train or give advice to, is to tell them to make sure they can fly straight and level. You cannot do any of the maneuvers until you learn to fly straight and level. And that means learning how to properly trim, both mechanically and while flying in the air.

That first part, mechanical, may need some explanation for the "uninformed". Most of us maiden, trim, fly, land. Then repeat the refuel and fly, land, then repeat....you get the idea.

To fly any maneuvers with or without precision needs a bit more. Without precision, well, for the most part, we all do that. But to fly WITH precision takes a little more time.

Each plane is built (kit) or assembled (ARF) according to our talents abilities and capabilities to follow instructions. Most kits/arfs are fairly simple so that just about anyone, including me, can build/assemble with a minimum amount of effort and some basic knowledge of mechanics. If we have a question about something, well, RCU Beginners Forum, here we come. With most ARF's, for instance, if you can read, you can assemble. Kits require a bit more but modern kits are pretty much pre-cut and ready for glue.

So, we get our kit/arf, and go home, and think it over, and build/assemble and, voila, we have a plane ready for maiden flight. If we are reasonably competent, they are built straight and strong. (ok.. straight.. some manufacturers are a tad short on the use of proper glue, but that's not the discussion here).

Now, after proper pre-flight (fuel up, engine tune, range check, and so on) we fly our maiden, get it up there, do our basic trims, get it to fly right, and then we get going with our day's fun activities.

Precision now steps in. After we trim out, and fly straight and level, with hands off, we're happy, right? Not so for pattern, or to fly the maneuvers and have them not only look right, but to set up the next maneuver, because that's what goes on with Pattern. One maneuver follows another. If, for instance, you exit the Split S wrong, well, if your next maneuver is a set of loops, well, if you are not straight and level, you can not directly enter the next maneuver. Often, that is not the fault of the pilot, but the fault of the mechanical setup of the airplane.

If, for instance, you have split elevators, and one is a degree off (for example) from the other, then there will be a tendency for the aircraft not to fly exactly straight. Same goes for all other control surfaces. They must be set up, one by one, to make sure they are straight, and more appropriate, will fly the plane straight with no tendency to push, pull, twist, roll, whatever.. the airframe while trying to fly it straight and level. We usually adjust the trim (elevator trim for instance, to stop the tendency to climb at one particular throttle setting) to remove those tendencies. The thing to do now is to land the plane and remove that trim then adjust mechanical (clevis in or out) to compensate for that tendency to climb at that throttle setting). There is more to it than that, but you get the picture.

There is a web site, I'll have to find it, that has a complete description of how to go about this process. If you want to fly pattern, you will have to spend a lot of time with this mechanical setup... meaning several tanks of fuel, perhaps on several flying days, to get it all right. This usually works best with someone, that has knowledge of this process, around to help.

Sorry for going on and on, but I thought it worth it to put this out for those interested in pattern flying, to get the idea that it takes time to set them up right. The best part of this, though, is what I've been told and I've personally witnessed (Overbored77 for instance) is that it really makes you a better pilot, even if you don't compete (like me.. I don't, I don't have the time but I enjoy flying my planes with precision) you will be a better pilot and your flying days are more enjoyable, even if you go just to fly and do things in no particular order, like I do.

CGr.

CGRetired

My Feedback: (1)

One more point. Some may wonder what this sort of discussion is doing in the beginners forum. Well, it helps inform those of you that are just starting out, of what is available for you after you learn to fly, solo, fly a few flights, then think "Is this all there is?" Well, no this isn't all there is. In fact, you have just scratched the surface. 3D, Pattern, Pylon. SAM (Society of Antique Modelers), sport flying, scale, large scale, warbirds, the list goes on. Each has a discipline that you have to develop in order to do what you want to do. The above is just one aspect of our hobby,.

CGr.

overbored77

My Feedback: (11)

Another point to remeber about aerobatic flying, while it's nice to fly a purpose designed aerobatic plane like a Pattern plane or an Extra, Edge, Ect.
these types of planes aren't needed for learning aerobatics. A trainer is a great way to start flying aerobatics. Trainers don't roll axial, loop as easy,
hold a knife edge or generally fly as nice as a sport model, so why use one for learning aerobatics? They help you to develop the skills you will need
to transition into a more advanced plane. If you can fly a straight line, roll without losing altitude or major deviation of heading, pull a smooth ROUND loop
(sounds pretty easy, but try doing a symmetrical loop starting and ending at the same altitude and your first attempts will dissapoint you) all with a trainer
than when you do move into a sport model plane you will be suprised how much better your skills will be, and how much better your flying will look, to you
and others. (if you care what others think).

Like Ken, Minn, and all the other experienced pilots say. Don't shelf the trainer too quick, it is suprising what they are capable of, add some more throws
to the surfaces and maybe some more power see what those flat bottom high wingers can do. You will be pleasntly suprised.

Nathan King

Quote edited for accuracy.

P.S. I consider properly trimming a model to be a never-ending proposition. Plus, there's always something that gets a little out of whack just by flying it for a while.

I remember a student that became amazed when I did a nice crisp (fairly-slow) perfectly axial roll with his trainer. He was getting cocky, so I had to remind him that while he was doing well, he shouldn't stop learning or start being content with mediocrity. Should've seen his face!

Trainers will do it too, they just take a little more coaxing.

sonny2

A split "S" is started from straight and level flight,then a half roll to inverted, and then pull to a half loop tostraight and level flight. You described an outside half loop

Ed_Moorman

My Feedback: (1)

Sonny2,

The split-S you describe is a "pattern" split-S.

To do an RC scale split-S maneuver, you raise the nose 30 degrees, roll inverted, then pull through.

The scale method is the same way I taught it in a T-37 as an Air Force pilot training instructor for several years.

All of my RC Report maneuver cards are availavle from RC Report Online at [link=http://www.rcreport.net]RC Report Online[/link]

CGRetired

My Feedback: (1)

Yeah, the pattern maneuver has equal distance from the beginning of the maneuver, to the end of the maneuver.

The pilot flys to the center point of the field, rolls inverted, holds it a few seconds, then pulls in enough elevator to pull the aircraft around, completely vertical (no roll or no drift left or right) to a heading that is directly opposite of the start of the maneuver, with straight and level flight, with wings level. The larger the "loop" is shows more demonstrated control for the half loop.

It all happens pretty fast, and requires that the aircraft be set up properly for straight and level flight, hands off.

There are other setup issues, such as what the plane does when it is pulled to inverted at full throttle, with hands off. If it goes straight up, then it is set up properly. If it goes left, or right, it needs some adjustment. There are more, but that's not the point with this thread. This is all available for you to read in the Pattern forum.

It takes quite a bit of time, many flights, and a lot of patients to set up a plane. both mechanically (mechanically adjusting throws to be absolutely symmetrical) and electrically (mixing and servo adjustments) to do these maneuvers absolutely correctly.

CGr.