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rc diesel engines?

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Old 07-23-2012, 02:53 PM
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stalefishsk8er
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Default rc diesel engines?

is there an actual rc diesel engine tha can run off of diesel striaght from the pump or biodiesel, i mean used cooking oil?
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Old 07-23-2012, 04:12 PM
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Default RE: rc diesel engines?

Diesel fuel from the pump needs to be under tremendous pressure to properly atomize for combustion. The rc diesels usually run on either and something else..... Low flash point type fuel.
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Old 07-23-2012, 07:49 PM
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: stalefishsk8er

is there an actual rc diesel engine tha can run off of diesel striaght from the pump or biodiesel, i mean used cooking oil?
http://www.davisdieseldevelopment.co.../closelook.htm
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Old 07-24-2012, 05:56 AM
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: stalefishsk8er

is there an actual rc diesel engine tha can run off of diesel striaght from the pump or biodiesel, i mean used cooking oil?

No!

The model "diesel" engines run on Diethyl Ether, Kerosene and oil (same as glow oil). Usually for high power application a small quantity (1 -2%) of Diesel Ignition Improver is also required.
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Old 07-24-2012, 08:46 PM
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Default RE: rc diesel engines?

When I saw this thread I went right to Davis Diesel, they make their own fuel, so I didn't post.
Also the only engines for cars are like an O.S. .12 (I have several but don't want to convert) and an Axial .28, I have one of those too, don't want to convert...

Fuel
http://www.davisdieseldevelopment.com/diesel_fuel.php

Products...
http://www.davisdieseldevelopment.com/price_list.html

D12CA
O.S. .12 Diesel Conversion Head
89.95


TRX3.3K
TRAXXAS 3.3 Diesel head assy. including heavy duty connecting rod
159.95


AXL28ENG
AXIAL .28 Dieselized Engine with Tiger Drive and Starting Wand
299.95
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Old 07-25-2012, 05:39 AM
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Default RE: rc diesel engines?

As others have said, no. Glow engines and model diesel engines are both 'diesel' engines by definition, but they cannot burn automotive diesel fuel. Most full size auto diesel engines work by compressing and superheating air, then injecting fuel straight into the cylinder. This would not be possible with a small, model size engine.
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Old 07-25-2012, 05:13 PM
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Default RE: rc diesel engines?

Glow engines are not diesel engines in any sense of the term.
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Old 07-28-2012, 05:59 AM
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ORIGINAL: savagecommander

Glow engines are not diesel engines in any sense of the term.

Yes they are! Look up the Wiki entries for both.

Actually you can replace the Kerosene in model diesel fuel with pump diesel fuel. From my experience it

gives slightly less power but you can reduce both the oil content and the diesel ignition improver proportions a little as well.
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Old 07-28-2012, 02:06 PM
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Default RE: rc diesel engines?

Wiki entries? Really? Diesel engines are compression ignition, glow engines function from a chemical reaction with the fuel.
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Old 07-29-2012, 05:31 AM
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ORIGINAL: savagecommander

Wiki entries? Really? Diesel engines are compression ignition, glow engines function from a chemical reaction with the fuel.
Actually, no. It's a mechanical catalytic reaction, not chemical. Heat from the compression stroke is still required for ignition. It's a diesel engine, albeit a different one.
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Old 07-29-2012, 06:14 AM
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Default RE: rc diesel engines?

Quote:
ORIGINAL: proanti1


Quote:
ORIGINAL: savagecommander

Wiki entries? Really? Diesel engines are compression ignition, glow engines function from a chemical reaction with the fuel.
Actually, no. It's a mechanical catalytic reaction, not chemical. Heat from the compression stroke is still required for ignition. It's a diesel engine, albeit a different one.
There are distinct differences between a "diesel" and a "glow" engine, but the topic is RC diesel engines. As has been said, typical model diesel fuel is kerosene, castor oil, and ether. Some add ignition improvers as some engines are harder to get started and idle without it.

Model diesels have an advantage over glow engines in that the fuel is more completely combusted so there is less waste, diesels require less fuel to do the same amount of work as a glow, and the engine produces a substantial amount of torque compared to glow. The downsides are the smell - it really hangs on you, and you have to adjust not only the carburetor, but the compression screw as well. In an airplane scenario, thats easier to do than a car being that the loads imposed on the engine are so vastly different. IMO, a diesel would be much better suited for a rock crawler or non-racing MT, 1/8th scale or larger. However thats only if one really wanted to experiment badly..

In the airplane world, its not unheard of running 12x6 and 13x6 props on a .25/.30 diesel. My buddy's PAW .15 turns a 9x6 at 10,000-11,000rpm. My .29 glow, twice the size of the .15 turns a 9x6 at just shy of 13,900 on an untuned full-wave pipe. I find the PAW .15 numbers impressive. A sport glow .15 would be turning an 8x3 or 8x4 or even 7x4's if you want some real rpm from it.

I dont think Diesels should be put in cars. Converting a car glow engine over to diesel would likely require plugging of the boost port in the case, and using a much smaller carb. The timing on car engines is pretty gnarly compared to model diesels. many diesels dont have a boost port to start with.

Just my take on it..
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Old 07-29-2012, 04:47 PM
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Default RE: rc diesel engines?


Quote:
ORIGINAL: qazimoto


Quote:
ORIGINAL: savagecommander

Glow engines are not diesel engines in any sense of the term.

Yes they are! Look up the Wiki entries for both.

Actually you can replace the Kerosene in model diesel fuel with pump diesel fuel. From my experience it

gives slightly less power but you can reduce both the oil content and the diesel ignition improver proportions a little as well.
if i replace kerosene with pump diesel, will i get some black smoke coming out of the exhaust like my buddies truck? if so i would put stacks on it lol

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Old 07-31-2012, 06:25 PM
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Default RE: rc diesel engines?

A true model diesel engine (as used in full size cars and trucks) is almost impossible, mainly because of the need for a very precise fuel injection system. Diesels always run with a wide open intake system to have the maximum possible volume of air to compress for maximum heat. Power is controlled solely by the volume of fuel injected at the correct time. I remember someone once wondering if an ink jet nozzle and electronics could be adapted as an injection system. Not bad thinking actually .

A glow engine also uses compression to some extent because compression helps the catalytic reaction at the plug coil to begin, essentially because the compression packs more methanol molecules tighter against the platinum. They're sometimes called a semi-diesel.

Model diesels are a pure compression ignition engine because, like a glow, all the fuel is mixed with air just waiting for the air to get heated enough to ignite a part of the mixture somewhere inside the combustion chamber. Any type of burneable fuel could be used but only if the compression was high enough to reach the auto ignition point of that fuel. To keep compression to practical limits ether is added to the fuel because it has a very low auto ignition temperature and will ignite even when the throttle is closed for idling and volume of air inducted is very low. The ether essentially takes the place of a glow plug and ignites the actual fuel which is the kerosene. Because the ether is spread fairly evenly amongst all the kero, most of the mixture will start burning all at once (no real flame front) giving a very rapid rise of pressure in the combustion chamber and most of the fuel will be burnt immediately. This is where a model diesel gets its very high torque from but it's hard on the mechanical parts.
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Old 08-01-2012, 06:46 AM
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: proanti1


Quote:
ORIGINAL: savagecommander

Wiki entries? Really? Diesel engines are compression ignition, glow engines function from a chemical reaction with the fuel.
Actually, no. It's a mechanical catalytic reaction, not chemical. Heat from the compression stroke is still required for ignition. It's a diesel engine, albeit a different one.
catalytic reaction is not chemical? the cata comes from catalyst, meaning chemically reactive.

downunder has it pegged. read his post and leave it at that before you get more confused.
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Old 08-02-2012, 03:01 AM
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Default RE: rc diesel engines?

About the info on wikkipedia, Don't always believe what you read! any imbecile can put an entry in wikki and call it fact. It doesn't mean it is.
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Old 08-02-2012, 03:36 AM
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: controlliner

About the info on wikkipedia, Don't always believe what you read! any imbecile can put an entry in wikki and call it fact. It doesn't mean it is.
+2
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Old 08-03-2012, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: downunder

A true model diesel engine (as used in full size cars and trucks) is almost impossible, mainly because of the need for a very precise fuel injection system. Diesels always run with a wide open intake system to have the maximum possible volume of air to compress for maximum heat. Power is controlled solely by the volume of fuel injected at the correct time. I remember someone once wondering if an ink jet nozzle and electronics could be adapted as an injection system. Not bad thinking actually .

A glow engine also uses compression to some extent because compression helps the catalytic reaction at the plug coil to begin, essentially because the compression packs more methanol molecules tighter against the platinum. They're sometimes called a semi-diesel.

Model diesels are a pure compression ignition engine because, like a glow, all the fuel is mixed with air just waiting for the air to get heated enough to ignite a part of the mixture somewhere inside the combustion chamber. Any type of burneable fuel could be used but only if the compression was high enough to reach the auto ignition point of that fuel. To keep compression to practical limits ether is added to the fuel because it has a very low auto ignition temperature and will ignite even when the throttle is closed for idling and volume of air inducted is very low. The ether essentially takes the place of a glow plug and ignites the actual fuel which is the kerosene. Because the ether is spread fairly evenly amongst all the kero, most of the mixture will start burning all at once (no real flame front) giving a very rapid rise of pressure in the combustion chamber and most of the fuel will be burnt immediately. This is where a model diesel gets its very high torque from but it's hard on the mechanical parts.
Most current diesels actually have throttle bodies, they're just small because they lack an integrated MAF like you have on most multi point FI gasoline engines, they basically only consist of a butterfly valve. The 'diesels don't have throttle bodies' thing is a myth. Some don't but most do, especially of they're turbo charged.
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Old 08-03-2012, 11:56 AM
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Default RE: rc diesel engines?


Quote:
ORIGINAL: controlliner

About the info on wikkipedia, Don't always believe what you read! any imbecile can put an entry in wikki and call it fact. It doesn't mean it is.
Citations are generally required. Any idiot can edit a wikipedia link, but a little 'citation needed' thing will follow the entry.
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Old 08-07-2012, 04:04 PM
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Default RE: rc diesel engines?


Quote:
ORIGINAL: downunder

A true model diesel engine (as used in full size cars and trucks) is almost impossible, mainly because of the need for a very precise fuel injection system. Diesels always run with a wide open intake system to have the maximum possible volume of air to compress for maximum heat. Power is controlled solely by the volume of fuel injected at the correct time. I remember someone once wondering if an ink jet nozzle and electronics could be adapted as an injection system. Not bad thinking actually .

A glow engine also uses compression to some extent because compression helps the catalytic reaction at the plug coil to begin, essentially because the compression packs more methanol molecules tighter against the platinum. They're sometimes called a semi-diesel.

Model diesels are a pure compression ignition engine because, like a glow, all the fuel is mixed with air just waiting for the air to get heated enough to ignite a part of the mixture somewhere inside the combustion chamber. Any type of burneable fuel could be used but only if the compression was high enough to reach the auto ignition point of that fuel. To keep compression to practical limits ether is added to the fuel because it has a very low auto ignition temperature and will ignite even when the throttle is closed for idling and volume of air inducted is very low. The ether essentially takes the place of a glow plug and ignites the actual fuel which is the kerosene. Because the ether is spread fairly evenly amongst all the kero, most of the mixture will start burning all at once (no real flame front) giving a very rapid rise of pressure in the combustion chamber and most of the fuel will be burnt immediately. This is where a model diesel gets its very high torque from but it's hard on the mechanical parts.
... and both fits quite well to the HCCI definition. (Google will help ya, although I believe downunder knows this stuff already)
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