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Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

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Old 10-30-2010, 12:03 AM
  #26
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

No, I didn't see it. Was it today?
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Old 10-30-2010, 12:15 AM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!


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ORIGINAL: Taurus Flyer

Frequent flyer,

When I read the whole story, my advice is, slow down and take care of your health.
First do what is really important or is this your profession?

Cees

Don't worry when one loves what he does it's all fun, not work. It's not my profession it's my hobby. There really is no profit, it's just to spread the old Classics that I loved to see fly years ago and to own one now!
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Old 10-30-2010, 12:26 AM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

frequent flyer,

I was more worried about the materials and the way to handle it professionally.
You are not the first with allergies rising without even building an airplane yourself.

I use very little of that stuff, only some epoxy 2 component glue.

Cees
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Old 10-30-2010, 06:58 AM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

Quote:
ORIGINAL: Taurus Flyer

frequent flyer,

I was more worried about the materials and the way to handle it professionally.
You are not the first with allergies rising without even building an airplane yourself.

I use very little of that stuff, only some epoxy 2 component glue.

Cees
Thanks for the concern. I always excise caution when using Resins. I have a spray booth and breathing mask. Or sometimes I just do it outside if it is warm enough. So far no alergies.
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Old 10-30-2010, 07:07 AM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

Frequent flyer,

Just as airplanes do fly, allergies do rise from level zero and sometimes in a very short time. Be happy you don’t have allergies and be careful not become allergic for the materials you use. Because you write you are not allergic, maybe you are unknown about the risks.
It was just a sincere advice no more no less, success with molding and have fun.
Cees
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Old 10-30-2010, 01:36 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!


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ORIGINAL: dhal22
Don, i have a Skymaster. I have (mostly) stripped the wing and control surfaces of plastic cote and will glass and paint them someday. sounds like another shipment to Redondo Beach someday.

Don, should i send my Wild Beat fuse to you for the same reason? it is 90% complete. I know Will has interest in the plane.
David,

two excellent ideas. Well, at least with regard to the Skymaster.

As this plane is relatively rare, and if I recall, your fuse was not in the best of shapes, it could just make for a good plug. Repairs done for the purpose of a plug might be somewhat different than those made to end up with a flyable fuse. Things like lightness and proper interior finishing need not be worried about too much when making repairs for the purpose of a plug. I noticed that Don did considerable work on both the DB fuse and the Magic deck to end up with a usable plug. If Don is willing (and it sounds like he is), it might be worth while to discard the repair plans to render a flyable fuse and simply use the fuse as a plug. Given Don's availability and the fact that he is deep in the process of making molds currently, it might be a good time to send him the fuse, allow him to make the necessary repairs and make the mold. Then, you could simply finish your model using a new fuse with the existing wing and stab. It sounds like a better option to me.

Like the EU-1A, the Skymaster is a little more involved since it consists of three glass pieces: the fuse, the canopy/deck and the engine chin cowl. I've always liked the clean, simple lines with a hint of "what was to come" of this plane and I also particularly like the engine/pipe setup "a la" Magic with exhaust behind the wing TE - very integrated and stealthy. If I understand correctly, the SM is also a much better flying model than the Magic.

With respect to the Wild Beat, perhaps both you and Don might end up with a finished fuse at the same time. I'll just comment that I have another, smaller, model which is part of this series by Akiba - the Wild 7. I believe also a very rare kit of the very high quality kind in MK's lineup. Although designed for a 4 stroke 120, I'm particularly keen on an electric alternative (I know that's not your style David), since I'm not very keen on large displacement glow engines (primarily due to cost reasons). However, as designed, the Wild 7 is not very well suited to electric power (if I recall correctly), but perhaps with a few modifications and the making of a glass fuse (a removable top for example along with plug-in wings), this model could also be brought back into existence as a larger classic for either glow or electric.

It must be the weekend... I'm writing too much. 'nough said!

David.
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Old 10-30-2010, 02:33 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

I don't think I've ever seen a Skymaster. Anyone have a photo?
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Old 10-30-2010, 03:25 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

i'm looking Ralph.
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Old 10-30-2010, 03:35 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

David,

i sent Don a PM.
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Old 10-30-2010, 04:45 PM
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Old 10-30-2010, 04:57 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

Quote:
ORIGINAL: R_G
I don't think I've ever seen a Skymaster. Anyone have a photo?
Ralph,

there is a very nice series of shots of a Skymaster in a thread which I'll have to dig around for. In the meantime you might want to take a peek at this thread:

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_7506585/tm.htm

Here are a couple of snaps of the Skymaster 20 and the 60. I've never seen a real SM 20 in the "flesh" so to speak. The scheme by MK is not my favorite but the model is fantastic.

David.
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Old 10-30-2010, 06:59 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

Here are some pretty good shots of the MK Skymaster 60 in the finishing stages.

These pics are from an "auction site" ad and I was fortunate enough to win the bid... [8D]

I'm very happy with the plane as it is very well built!! You never really know what your going to end up with buying something off the internet because the pictures can hide some "important details"...But she's nice and straight and will make a good airplane...
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Old 10-30-2010, 07:21 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

Then here are some shots of a finished Skymaster which belongs to RCU member "Zubba"
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Old 10-30-2010, 08:05 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

Quote:
ORIGINAL: frequent flyer

That would be great. I've wanted one for a long time. If chuck doesn't have time I can do it for you. Chuck wrote me a few weeks ago and was going to send me a Beetle and a PA2 I believe it was but I have not gotten them yet. Maybe if we could get ahold of him he could sent all three in the same box to save on shipping. It would be great to make mold of those three great classics!
Dhal22...P.M sent.

I've recently had a change of heart on the Beetle and PA2 and won't be sending them...

Take Care...

Chuck
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Old 10-30-2010, 08:09 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

Thanks for the photos guys! I can see why there's an interest in this model....a typical Sexy MK airplane!

Chuck, looks like yours will have flaps/speed brakes?

RG
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Old 10-30-2010, 08:31 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

wow Chuck. i didn't know you had that plane. how does it compare to my fiberglass fuse version?
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Old 10-31-2010, 09:55 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

Great to see the pictures of the Skymaster Chuck Thanks.
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Old 11-03-2010, 05:56 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

I was eager to see the thread reposted with an interest in learning how to make molds and parts from molds. Although beginning as a pattern flyer I like a lot of people moved to giant scale. I'm getting back into the classic pattern planes I flew as a kid but still build giant scale. Thus the moniker FLAPSDOWN.

I've seen the Dave Platt video and read RC Scale International articles on mold making but wanted to see what other methods and materials are in use. I'm not sure what the best products are, where they can be sourced, and the methods to make the best parts available.

Thanks.

Bill
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Old 11-03-2010, 06:49 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

Bill, why learn? just order a popular fuse from someone here and you've got it delivered in a week or 2. pretty easy in my book.
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Old 11-03-2010, 07:15 PM
  #45
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

Quote:
dhal22 -
Bill, why learn? just order a popular fuse from someone here and you've got it delivered in a week or 2. pretty easy in my book.
I don't know about FLAPSDOWN, but I like to feel the satisfaction that I built it- All Of It.

It is not the easy way, nor the fastest way, or the least expensive way, but at least I will have the knowledge and the ability so I would never have to totaly rely on any supplier.

Plus I could also "pay it forward" and help someone else as well.

How does the saying go? "Catch a fish for me and I will eat for today. Teach me to fish and I will eat for a lifetime."

Brian
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Old 11-03-2010, 07:17 PM
  #46
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

Quote:
ORIGINAL: frequent flyer

Quote:
ORIGINAL: Taurus Flyer

frequent flyer,

I was more worried about the materials and the way to handle it professionally.
You are not the first with allergies rising without even building an airplane yourself.

I use very little of that stuff, only some epoxy 2 component glue.

Cees
Thanks for the concern. I always excise caution when using Resins. I have a spray booth and breathing mask. Or sometimes I just do it outside if it is warm enough. So far no alergies.

< Message edited by frequent flyer 11/1/2010 4:47 PM >
frequent flyer,

I see you did edit the post, so my next advice,
Finish you 1/3 scale Pitts first, we like bipes.

Success Cees
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Old 11-03-2010, 09:39 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

Brian,

that is definitely an interesting way to look at it. Personally, my feeling is that when it comes to classics, if you want to truly feel that you started from zero, then you should really start with the plans and build the entire airframe from wood. However, may of the classics never existed in the forms of plans - at least the plans were not released publicly. One such example would be the Atlanta but there were many others. The only way to build one of these classics would be to have a glass fuse and at least the wing and stab airfoils and planforms. In the absence of that, good luck rendering an Atlanta into flyable form!

With that said, we should all be very grateful to Don and the various modelers who have kindly offered their rare collectible original fuses in order to produce a mold which allows them to be replicated. Likewise on the wing/stab airfoils & planforms. I would mention that until one has built a classic starting from a glass fuse and foam cores, one doesn't realize the extent of work involved in producing a flyable model. Perhaps it's because I am much more used to working with wood (I've built far more wood models than glass/foam models), but I can build a wood model is a fraction of the time it takes to build a glass/foam model. And when i say build, I mean the time to have the model ready to fly. Granted, many glass designs were cast as such because of the complexity of building them from wood. Typical examples of complex wood builds would include the Aurora and Beetle.

I take my hat off to anyone willing and interested in learning the trade of mold making, fuse layup and core cutting - all arts by themselves. Bill, head over to the composite forum and enjoy spending the rest of eternity learning all about molds, layup and such. RCU is an amazing source of information and sharing.

David.
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Old 11-03-2010, 09:41 PM
  #48
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

Don,

in other news, how's your CNC cutter coming along. Have you been able to start setting it up.

The thought of that Speeda is waking me up in the morning! [8D]

David.
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Old 11-03-2010, 10:20 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

My apologies to dhal22 if any offense was taken as I have great respect for him.

My reply came from angst that I hold against the arf empire. Anything you can build or want to build should be snatched up quickly, becuase the only way you'll continue to fly it in the future is through arfs or if someone knows how to do it themselves.

Also, I certainly wasn't taking anything away from Don as I hope he knows I hold deep respect for everything he is doing as well through short correspondances I've had with him.

It was a knee-jerk reaction to what I interpreted as the easy way out. You simply never learn anything.

Brian
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Old 11-03-2010, 10:33 PM
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Default RE: Making Molds of Classic Pattern Plane Fuselages & Parts to Keep them Alive for all of us to Enjoy!

@ I Like Bipes
Can I share a different perspective for you please if you will indulge me,,
I fly control line stunt. My plane I built for competition last year is a classic legal plane called "Avenger" I drew the plans,, reworked structure,, and technique while remaining true to the aerodynamics. I built it, convered it, and painted it and now fly it,, I have over 80 hours in the plans,, I have aproaching 400 hours in building and finish. I LOVe to build and paint. My other passion currently is pylon racing,, I fly a design I designed and build, Last year I lost 4 of my Mongooses racing, had to build new ones... I have another stunter in process to build over the winter. I flew a Kaos 40 for the first time here about a month ago and FINALLY I found an airplane that I enjoy sport flying. So I am looking to fly something like this for my weekend plane,, I dont have time to build from the first stick of wood, My time is dedicated for building to my competition airplanes already,, I remeber reading about pattern and seeing the airplanes, the Mach One, Dirty birdy, EU1, all of them, when I couldnt even afford to fly control line,, just buy magazines and drool. So now, I can fly them, but I dont have time to build from scratch, so ,, should I give up my competitions stuff, or should I buy and ARF like the new Pheonix 7 so I can enjoy these great airplanes,, well maybe I can save some time by getting a glass fuse,, and foam wing, then I can spend the time finishing it. We all gotta be aware of the fact, we all have different priorities. There are still a LOT of people that build. In the club here, we have two families with teenage kids that fly,, but better, they are building too! I did a demo on covering with iron on film last night at our meeting, I had their attention for over an hour while I covered part of my wing,, its still there, but the people doing it are doing it because the want to, instead of because its the only way to get a plane, like it was when we were kids,,
its all good,, all of it, the new Pheonix 7 ARF will make more people aware of these great airplanes that have never been exposed, that can only be good,, I want to see more of them,,
I would try to attach a pict of my Avenger so you can see what I am talking about,not sure I can see how to do that though,, Thanks for indulging my ramblings,, its all meant in a positive way,,
Mark Scarborough,
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