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  1. #651
    ChiefK's Avatar
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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    These were mine (many years ago).

    ChiefK
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    Opinions based on thin air will always carry little weight.

  2. #652

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    In reference to the comments by BEM and DPHILL2, I too wish that some of the ARF's were offered as a RTC/F(ready to cover/finish) product.

    Morris

  3. #653

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF


    ORIGINAL: ChiefK

    I'm not hearing any discussion about engine rules changes for the 2-stroke variety. There's probably more 4-stroke flyers in SPA (especially in the ''Expert'' group) than 2-stroke flyers. In either case, O.S. is not the only option available. In fact, the Senior Expert class was won by a DB/OS .61 combo a couple of weeks ago.

    ChiefK

    SPA reminds me of the engine legal limit that was used in the current pattern comps that used to have 2=stroke limits and 4-stroke limits.....in F3A....
    Someone over there actually had a brain cell working and decided that there isn't any need for any limits now, because weight is the litmiting factor....

    Funny thing is, that in order for a IC engine to compete with the Electric motors run in them now, it would need a 50cc gas or greater...

    Learning is to man, as leaves and branches is to a tree, you can't do w/o it.... I hope SPA can figure that one out... .61 is and a .65 is not leagal? Really!....
    They figured out another way to contribute to the dumping of glow engines, for favor of Electric motors.....
    Great job SPA!....


    If you can\'\'\'\'t dazzle em with brilliance,baffle em with BS

  4. #654

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF


    ORIGINAL: kochj


    ORIGINAL: ChiefK

    I'm not hearing any discussion about engine rules changes for the 2-stroke variety. There's probably more 4-stroke flyers in SPA (especially in the ''Expert'' group) than 2-stroke flyers. In either case, O.S. is not the only option available. In fact, the Senior Expert class was won by a DB/OS .61 combo a couple of weeks ago.

    ChiefK

    SPA reminds me of the engine legal limit that was used in the current pattern comps that used to have 2=stroke limits and 4-stroke limits.....in F3A....
    Someone over there actually had a brain cell working and decided that there isn't any need for any limits now, because weight is the litmiting factor....

    Funny thing is, that in order for a IC engine to compete with the Electric motors run in them now, it would need a 50cc gas or greater...

    Learning is to man, as leaves and branches is to a tree, you can't do w/o it.... I hope SPA can figure that one out... .61 is and a .65 is not leagal? Really!....
    They figured out another way to contribute to the dumping of glow engines, for favor of Electric motors.....
    Great job SPA!....


    The displacement limits have been raised to 0.65 for 2 stroke and 0.95 for 4 stroke. You can see more here:

    http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_11224952/tm.htm
    Blake

  5. #655

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    Hey Fella's,

    I'm looking for a little assistance for a good friend of mine. I just sold him my new unbuilt Dirty Birdy ARF............[&o] He is planning on using his NIB Webra Speed 61 with a tuned pipe. This is his first plane with a pipe and I remember someone here in the Classic Pattern Forum posting some information on setting up motors on tuned pipes. If I remember correctly, I think Chuck (Atlanta 60) posted the information. Does anyone have the information? If not, can anybody give me a good starting point for the length of the pipe?

    TIA for the help with this......

    David
    Fly Safe and Have Fun ! ! !
    Ultra Sport Brotherhood #22

  6. #656
    woodie's Avatar
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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    I won a DB ARF in a raffle recently. Yahoo!!!! Have been going thru it checking stuff and deciding how to set it up. I know people are generally happy with the DB ARF so am glad it is available.

    Unfortunatley, My DB has some issues, some I can fix, some I can't/won't. First I wish we could get the DB ARF as a ARC rather than an ARF. The Monokote was horribly wrinkled and some of it you can't get the wrinkles out, particularly around the tips. One tip has a dent in it like it was dropped wing tip first on some rounded object. Hinging is a joke, one elev and both wings would need to be re-hinged. One aileron is almost 1/16" off center in the center hinges. Aileron is actually sitting higher than the trailing edge in front of it. Top of canopy is flattened, the flat spot is about 3/4" wide and doesn't seem to want to come out even with heat. And best of all, both wings are twisted about half a degree, unfortunately in opposite directions.

    My plan at this point is to see if I can get the wings replaced, the current wings would have to be stripped and cut open to remove the twist which is something I don't want to do.

    Sorry for this negative report and I am glad most people are happy with their DBs, just the luck of the draw. This one must have been made on a Monday or a Friday..... ;-)

    Woodie
    \"In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is.\" Yogi Berra

  7. #657

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    I never had to shrink my covering yet and it still looks good, but I'm not looking that close .
    Your right on with the hinges, it appears both of mine are hinged slightly high from center, but for and ARF it flys wonderful. I'm powered by a Nova Rossi, that's taching 14,400 static with an APC 11x7 prop and doing in the 90 mph range, easy, and flys wonderful. It ain't no pro built kit, but for China assembly it ain't bad.
    Woodie, sounds like I'd like to fly one of your birds, you pay lots of attention to detail, and sure your plane will fly better than mine when your all finished. For what it is, a 60 size, $299 plane, its a bargain, and for the price you paid, even better.
    You'd appreciate the quality of the Oxai models from 3D unlimited. Do a search and check out real pricing, $4800 planes, and you get what you pay for .
    Jamie
    In Bama
    Jamie
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  8. #658
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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    Jamie, I agree with you, it is pretty good for a $299 ARF, and I was very lucky to pick it up for a few $$$ spent on raffle tickets. Yes, I am 'very' picky about my plane setups so these little things are probably more of an issue to me than to some people, guess it comes from 40+ years of flying pattern planes. Setups, straightness and covering are pretty important to me. Some of my friends fly the Oxai planes you mention, and guess what, they are not perfect either... ;-) Some Oxai issue areas are somewhat surprising for a plane that cost that much money.

    I still have my first Dirty Birdy I built way back when. It is the glass fuse version, not built up fuse. Was fortunate enough to buy it back from the friend I sold it to many years ago. It's 30+ years old now, still in flying condition tho I wouldn't trust the original Kraft servos that are in it.....

    Sitting side by side, the two DBs look alike, but there are subtle differences, some for manufacturing ease, some for helping the modeler. Removable cowl, plug in stabs, etc. Canopy shape is a little different so I don't understand why they changed that. But all in all, my new DB will probably take to the air after a little 'enhancing' and it will be electric, not glo even tho I left my original DB as a glo setup.

    Woodie
    \"In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is.\" Yogi Berra

  9. #659

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    Let me know what your using for power and the watts your pulling?
    The Dirty Birdy flys better than any yet for its size. It's getting to be a popular choice for us here in the SPA.
    Check us out at
    Senior pattern.com
    I flew for Phil Kraft back in the day, and your right, use the servos for a paper weight .
    Jamie
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  10. #660
    woodie's Avatar
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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    Plan on using a 5S 5000mah pack, the Scorpion 4020-8 (approx 850kV) and a 11x7 or 11x8 prop. Same setup a friend is using in his DB, I think he is pulling about 65A. That equates to approx 1200w and the plane is fast, more vertical than necessary and can fly the complete CPA Masters sequence with good power. The Scorpion 4020-8 was specifically wound to give enough rpm on a 5S pack to be able to run the same props we used to use on the 60 size planes and not have to use longer gear to provide prop clearance for longer props turning a lower rpm.

    Woodie
    \"In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is.\" Yogi Berra

  11. #661

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    That's not a bad setup, but not comparable to my Caylpso with my Nova Rossi 60 on the nose . IMO you need to go 6S to get the duration your need for really good power thru the sequence. I'll be testing my first 2 meter El thru the winter, and I'm pulling 3100 watts on a 10 cell at 77 AMPs, that's proving OK power, at least bench testing. It ain't no YS 170, that's for sure, but electric is pretty neat, till it gets to hot, burns out an ESC, and or catches fire . Electric is all I mess with now with most all my other planes, but still stay glow with my SPA, CPA, and AMA birds.
    Jamie
    In Bama

  12. #662
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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    Jamie, all my 2M pattern planes are e-powered, have been for 5 years now. I use about 2900-3000 watts max during a F3A sequence and about 3500-3900 mah depending on the wind.

    Yes, 6S would give more rpm, not necessarily more duration. We chose 5S for convenience since our 2M planes typically use 2 5S packs in series so splitting them to use in 60 sized planes is 'convenient'. Sure a Rossi will spin the prop a bit faster (we are getting about 13K) with the 11x7 APC but the DB doesn't need the speed to fly well and it actually seems to have better vertical (more constant speed) than the glo versions. Bottom line, the Scorpion is purpose built to be a drop in e-power replacement for 60 sized motors. Will work with 5S or 6S, but be careful with prop load on 6S, the amps can climb quickly.

    Woodie
    \"In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is.\" Yogi Berra

  13. #663

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    Thats neat, and the only way I do it if I were competing in two meter stuff already.
    I bought the plane J Shulman flew this year at the preliems at the NATs so know the 3100 is a good number for 11 lbs, even if its not 3100 at the end of the flight . Thats my on drawback to pattern El stuff, but sure it could be adjusted to with time.
    Did ya fly at this years NATs? The last NATs I flew was in 83, then just quit pattern, but returned in 2000, and having the time of my life.
    What 2 meter birds you fly ?
    Jamie
    Jamie
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  14. #664

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    Just ordered mine today. Should be here 11/20 can't wait. Trying to decide if I should goold school and use my KB61 PDP with tuned pipe, or my OS65AX. I'm leaning toward old school no retracts, and my K&B with a tuned pipe.
    Jim Williams
    Club Saito Menber #621

  15. #665
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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    A buddy has a 65 AX on a pipe in his Vertigo (kinda like a P-8) and it just plain hauls the mail. It smokes the YS P-8 in the area no problem.
    Chris...

  16. #666

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF


    ORIGINAL: woodie

    Plan on using a 5S 5000mah pack, the Scorpion 4020-8 (approx 850kV) and a 11x7 or 11x8 prop. Same setup a friend is using in his DB, I think he is pulling about 65A. That equates to approx 1200w and the plane is fast, more vertical than necessary and can fly the complete CPA Masters sequence with good power. The Scorpion 4020-8 was specifically wound to give enough rpm on a 5S pack to be able to run the same props we used to use on the 60 size planes and not have to use longer gear to provide prop clearance for longer props turning a lower rpm.

    Woodie
    Woodie - did you ever get this setup flying in the DB60 ?

    If so, thoughts .. comments .. impressions

    ... inquiring thumbs want to know

  17. #667
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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    Alan, no I haven't finished the DB ARF yet although I have flown other peoples Classic Pattern planes with this motor setup. A Phoenix 7 and a Super Kaos. Both perform well using a 11x7 prop. You can fly the entire Classic Pattern Masters sequence with good power on a 5S 5000mah lipo if you are careful in the turn arounds. I think the Kaos weighs around 6.5 pounds, don't know what the Phoenix weighs.

    Don
    \"In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is.\" Yogi Berra

  18. #668

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    Greetings all

    I am on page 24 of the thread and have not seen or just misssed it, but has anyone tried a 55ax in this plane?
    I have a 55ax and a jett 50 laying around and hope on of these might work.
    Let me know your thoughts

    Thanks
    Wingspam

    If I make it look easy then your watching the wrong plane

  19. #669
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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    Saw that power setup in a Phoenix 6 and it worked great. Should be even better in the DB!

    ChiefK
    Opinions based on thin air will always carry little weight.

  20. #670
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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    I have a 55AX in a Kaos and it hauls. It'd help keep the weight down on a DB and makes plenty of power, especially on a pipe.
    Chris...

  21. #671

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    I run a Nova Rossi 60 with a Rossi muffler, taching out 14,200 static, and 14,800 with a pipe. Never enough power, he he he
    The DB is the bet ARF yet for SPA, and even BPA/CPA competition. I started my pattern beginnings back in the good old days of the mid seventies, and just love the old stuff, but enjoy 2 meter competition as well.
    My year normally has 21-23 contest to attend, and just hate it that I can't make our first of the year AMA contest in Apopka ( Tangerines) next weekend . Aging parents and Parent In Law has got me staying close to home now, but all a part of life, if ya live long enough.
    Jamie
    In Bama

  22. #672

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    Test flew mine a couple of weeks ago with a brand new OS61 FX and it really moves. The engine is still running in and getting better and better, what a plane. Have fitted the e-flite electric retracts (60 - 120 size) and they work well. First few flights I landed fast and this last flying session (flight numbers 3 to 5) was able to slow it down and still grease it in. Looking forward to many more flights and I will post some photos when I get around to taking some (hopefully in the next couple of weeks as have other planes I need to fly as well). Safe landings, Roger.

  23. #673

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    Looking forward to the pictures.

  24. #674

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    At last, a couple of photos of the DB 60 in our pit area. Really enjoy this plane and have about a dozen flights on it so far. Landings are so smooth and looks great performing routines from the 70's pattern era.

    Will try to get some flying photos soon.

    Safe landings


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  25. #675

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    RE: Dirty Birdy ARF

    I am looking for the ideal pipe length and prop combo for the OS .65 max ax
    any thoughts?

    Thanks
    Jon


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