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Classic pattern ARF

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Old 12-14-2018, 08:31 AM
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speedracerntrixie
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Default Classic pattern ARF

I just picked up a NIB ST .61 ABC and Jett muffler combo. I'm wanting a classic pattern airplane but I have no time to build as of right now. I'm looking into ARF models but not finding much. I'm leaning towards a World Models Intruder but would like to know what else is available. Web searches are not turning up much.
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Old 12-14-2018, 09:24 AM
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There's the Hanno Curare ARF.

Ralph
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Old 12-14-2018, 10:42 AM
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Always loved the Curare but that would be about 600.00 shipped. I do have a Saphir that needs recovering and a new cowl, Iím just donít have the time right now but would like to attend a classic event in Feb.
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Old 12-14-2018, 07:40 PM
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Perhaps not high enough performance, but the Tower Hobbies Super Kaos 60 ARF? It is very light assembly with preinstalled control surfaces and bolt-on tail. But I see it is on back-order (says mid-Jan). Still reasonably priced, more so than the World Models Intruder. A club mate got the Intruder and it is a very nice plane, but at a heftier price than the Tower Kaos 60. Still, neither one is set up for retracts, but that keeps it simple for everyday flying.

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Old 12-15-2018, 05:45 AM
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There aren't a whole lot of choices. I agree the Curare ARF is overpriced. I've owned a Kaos and an Intruder. The Kaos was forgiving, predictable, and very comfortable to fly. Nothing is easier to land well. The Intruder was a bit more stable in gusty wind and rolled better due to the greater fuselage side area. I scored better with it. It's a heavy plane though, definitely oriented toward scoring max points rather than being the easiest to fly (not that it was hard by any means).
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Old 12-15-2018, 09:12 AM
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There is also the Great Planes Ulrasport 46. But that is not a 60 size.

Until recently VQ Models sold the Taipan, a copy of the Ultrasport 60. A guy at the club crashed his and I'm rebuilding it to more resemble the original Ultrasport.

Last edited by hsukaria; 12-15-2018 at 09:14 AM.
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Old 12-15-2018, 09:15 PM
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Shawn. I believe the Dirdy Birdy is still available as an ARF. with the Tower Hobbies mess it is anybody's guess. The price is (Was) right... I have the plans, and if I didn't have so many pylon planes to build for Chris I would rough one in for you. If you really need one I will pull the ST61 out of mine and give it to you. It is a scratch build with a built up wing but it flies straight. It does have air retracts.

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Old 12-15-2018, 09:19 PM
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Default Great Planes Dirty Birdie ARF

Originally Posted by Pylonracr View Post
Shawn. I believe the Dirdy Birdy is still available as an ARF. with the Tower Hobbies mess it is anybody's guess. The price is (Was) right... I have the plans, and if I didn't have so many pylon planes to build for Chris I would rough one in for you. If you really need one I will pull the ST61 out of mine and give it to you. It is a scratch build with a built up wing but it flies straight. It does have air retracts.

Scott
The Dirty Birdie ARF was discontinued about three years ago. I was lucky enough to find somebody who gave up the build and bought partly assembled. It is an excellent flier. Too bad no longer made.
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Old 12-15-2018, 09:26 PM
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Originally Posted by hsukaria View Post
The Dirty Birdie ARF was discontinued about three years ago. I was lucky enough to find somebody who gave up the build and bought partly assembled. It is an excellent flier. Too bad no longer made.

Well Crap. I still have mine he can fly...

Scott
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Old 12-15-2018, 09:44 PM
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Another option Shawn. If you are up for a thrash, I have the roots and tips if you want to make a set of wings and stabs I can build a fuselage in a couple of weeks. It won't be pretty with film covering, but it will fly in Feb. Call Me.

By the way, I allowed you fly that electric POS at my club field this year............

Scott
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Old 12-16-2018, 04:49 PM
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Hey Scott, the offer is much appreciated. Iím pretty sure Iím going to go with the Intruder. Just need to wait until after the first of the year to order it. I promise to leave the electric airplane home next time. Iím thinking the 3W powered Reed Falcon will make the trip with me.
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Old 12-19-2018, 03:42 AM
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Originally Posted by speedracerntrixie View Post
Always loved the Curare but that would be about 600.00 shipped. I do have a Saphir that needs recovering and a new cowl, I’m just don’t have the time right now but would like to attend a classic event in Feb.

Closer to $472.35 USD shipped to North America. Exchange rate of the USD against the Euro is only $1.13 Lucky. The Canadian dollar against the Euro is $1.53 exchange ouch!!!

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Old 12-20-2018, 07:33 PM
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Only this ARF is available now: https://www.der-schweighofer.net/Cur...1640-mm-a91651
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Old 12-20-2018, 08:55 PM
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Originally Posted by speedracerntrixie View Post
Hey Scott, the offer is much appreciated. I’m pretty sure I’m going to go with the Intruder. Just need to wait until after the first of the year to order it. I promise to leave the electric airplane home next time. I’m thinking the 3W powered Reed Falcon will make the trip with me.
Hey Speed......
I had an Intruder several years ago.
It required a LOT of work to make it usable....
Like chopping the bottom of the fuse open behind the t/e to get access to that bulkhead that the elevator tubes are glued to.
They were so stiff and sticky the servo arm would flex.....the arm would have broken fore sure.
I replaced all that crap with Sullivan push rods....nice and free operating...worked fine.

It is also very tail heavy even with the OS 91 pump engine I used.
Your 2 stroke will probably need a LOT of lead in the nose.
It MUST be balanced at the main gear to lightly sit on its tail with an empty tank.....it flys best here.
The elevators were built wrong....flat on the bottom and airfoiled on the top.
Obviously...they were built on a flat surface...wrong!
It does not have enough rudder....hard to do stall turns but with a bit of throttle it works....most of the time.
Because of the small rudder....knife edge must be done at max speed.
The fuel tank area is very limited.
The cowling is somewhat fragile but can be made to work.
The covering has a tendency to blow off...seal the edges with thin CA.

The good points are....it's built to crash....it weighs 6 tons ready to fly.
But.....with enough power the vertical is not too bad for an SPA airplane.
It takes off and lands very nicely with that big wing.
The single elevator servo drives both elevators....they provide a slick device to couple both push rods....it worked well.
There is no way that the wing will fold with all that lumber and the aluminum tube and screws etc in the center section.
Find a Dirty Birdy.
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Old 12-21-2018, 05:02 AM
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Thanks for the heads up Dave. Looks like to really be happy with something I will need to do some building.
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Old 12-21-2018, 07:38 AM
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If you now plan on building, there are lots of options. Give Leo a call...

Scott
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Old 12-21-2018, 09:47 AM
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Had a look through my old MA's looking for articles I remember related to this airplane. Found one - the columnist was Eric Henderson - in the September 2007 issue, he reprints an associate's favorable letter relaying that the World Model's ARF had been re-issued with suggested SPA "improvements" including a revised symmetrical stab, lengthened fuselage, enlarged rudder, and a reduction in weight to better market to the pattern community. What got my attention is the side mounted four-stroke .91 and exposed elevator servo just in front of the stab with the interim, linkage drive to both elevator halves to offset the heavier engine... So there were apparently two versions of this ARF!

Not trying to sway your decision - just wanted to give the full story.

I understand the desire to side mount the engine - probably to optimize fuel draw in all attitudes. What I don't understand is why 4-strokes are allowed in SPA when they really didn't become practical until the '80's. BTW, I'm fine with this allowance and may consider it myself, but just wondering. Also, where do you find this device that allows driving two elevator halves with one servo or is it custom fabricated in this instance? Its a tiller arm driven by the servo on one side that in-turn allows driving the control surface from both sides via a cross-shaft/torque-tube supported in bearings.




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Old 12-21-2018, 08:57 PM
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Now that you mention it....I DO remember a later version...but I have never seen one.
Please remember that I am talking about the earlier version.
The earlier version like I had DID have a symmetrical stab....I was talking about the ELEVATORS.
The elevators are supposed to be symmetrical as well....just like the stab...but the elevators were built on a flat surface.
Can't do that with a symmetrical airfoil.
This made the flat surface on the top of one side of the fuselage and flat on the other side.
This caused a severe trim (roll) problem which forced me to adjust one elevator up and the other elevator down until it flew correctly.
Eventually I got it trimmed so it flew with no aileron trim and generally I was happy with the way it handled.
Overall I was not thrilled with it but for SPA it was...well....ok.
I will say though....to get decent flight performance I had to use 30% Cool Power Heli fuel and a 14x8 APC prop.
The engine pulled that prop pretty well with that fuel....I was not looking for rpm....it needs torque to lug that prop....but the airplane liked it.
I mounted the engine inverted. This avoids the weight of the cylinder and muffler hanging off to one side causing trim problems.

The elevator push rod coupler was a 2 piece plastic block that was screwed together....provided with the airplane.
The lower block had holes where the L bends of the ele push rods (and short servo rod) were inserted....then the upper block was screwed on top which sandwiched the push rods.
It worked well....no slop.

The airplane was so easy to land...predictable.....slow and controllable....when properly balanced on the main gear with an empty tank.
Put a piece of coat hangar wire to conform around the bottom of the rudder and heavy duty Du-Bro pinned hinges to protect against dragging the rudder on landings.
It's possible to over-rotate it and drag the rudder on landing when slow because the gear could be a bit longer.
It flew sort of like an advanced trainer with a lot of power.
Most of the time I was trying to stay awake on the landings....HEH
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Old 12-22-2018, 07:35 PM
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Since you have a ST61, if you can scrape up a header I will give you back the carbon fiber tuned pipe I made for your last classic pattern plane you never flew........ It should work as well with the Super tiger as it would have with the Enya........ I have one on mine, but I don't have an extra header.

Scott
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Old 12-24-2018, 07:38 AM
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Thanks Scott but the engine came with a red Jett muffler. I'm leaning towards building one of my Macchi for it but with a symmetrical airfoil and a bit more tip cord. Do it up with the traditional Speed Racer scheme. Pretty sure I can get the wing up to 650 sq in and a RTF weight of 6 lbs.
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Old 01-02-2019, 04:15 PM
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I need to go take a look at my Intruder and see what version it is. Crankpin flew several of these and never a complaint.
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Old 01-02-2019, 04:15 PM
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I have one nib but never got around to assembling it.
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