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Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

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Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Old 02-14-2010, 06:15 AM
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Default Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Hi,

Is it any drawings avaliable for Hanno Prettners later designs that he was World Champion with?
And construction article if available would be nice to know.
I know some was kitted by EZ as ARF's andI suppose no detalied drawing was made for these (that You could build from)?

1983, Calypso
Drawing:
Construction article:
Kit: Modeltech

1985, Supra Fly (60)
Drawing:
Construction article:
Kit: EZ
Note: I have Supra Fly 2500 drawing and it is about 20% enlarged Supra Fly 60 so it should be possible to
scale down this drawing to get a Supra Fly 60 unless it is 60 size drawing avaliable.
Supra Fly 2500 drawing is available from VTH (in Germany)for 19 Euro.

1987, Supra Star
Drawing:
Construction article:
Kit: EZ

1989, Supra Star (same as in 1987 or modified?)
Drawing:
Construction article:
Kit: EZ

1993, Mystic (60)
Drawing:
Construction article:
Kit: OK (ARC), EZ (ARF)

I know it may be slightly out of "Classic Pattern" time frame but I try here anyway since the knowledge by people in this forum is outstanding.

regards,
Bo
Old 02-14-2010, 09:41 AM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Bo,

technically, anything pre '96 is considered classic by this forums standards so all these designs qualify for discussion.

Calypso: Modeltech did indeed kit the Calypso as an ARC. The instruction manual (attached) had a drawing of sorts which could probably be used as a basis to draw a full size plan along with some specs.

Supra Fly: The Supra Fly was kitted by OK (not as an ARC but a wood kit) in 25 size and came with plans which are arguably more detailed than the SF 2500 plans. To produce a SF 60, I would probably just scale up a CAD version of the OK plans, again, along with some useful specs. As you mention an EZ SF 60 was (might have been?) also available as an ARF but there would have been little there in terms of plans aside from the specs to be drawn from the model.

Supra Star: Little is know to me of this transitional model between the SF and the Mystic. I understand this was more of a show model than a competition model but I can't recall if Hanno won F3A in the SS years.

Mystic: Well, there is an ongoing thread on the Mystic with some useful info. Basically the Mystic was produced by Hanno in 60 (2s), 120 (4s) and BGX sizes - this last as a show model much like the Sensation. Like the SF, OK kitted a Mystic 30 which was slightly larger (but not much) than the SF 25. Again, this was a wood kit (I have one) not an ARC. Come to think of it, did the Japanese ever do ARC's? An EZ Mystic 60 ARF also existed (see Mystic thread) but was called the Mystic 90 (4-stroke). EZ tended to refer to model sizes by their 4-stroke requirements. Like the OK SF 25, the OK M 30 also came with plans which could also be scaled up to a 60 and 90 (2s - 120 4s) size to reproduce Hanno's two competition models in 91 and 93.

Sensation: After the Mystic, Hanno apparently withdrew from competition but continued to fly for shows (perhaps like QQ now) and produced the Sensation. I was seeking further info on this design as little is known about it. I doubt a plan ever existed in the public domain but perhaps in Hanno's archives... Apparently Yoshioka produced some scaled version of this model as an ARF. Maybe EZ and or Kyosho did too. I'm not sure what the relation between OK, EZ and Kyosho may be but I suspect they are all related. I suspect that EZ might be the ARF division of OK Models which might have been a subsidiary (but maybe competitor) of Kyosho.

I don't think much is know either about Hanno's 2m size models (Extra's and such) in terms of plans after the Sensation.

My 2c.

David.
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Old 02-14-2010, 10:14 AM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Supra Star: Little is know to me of this transitional model between the SF and the Mystic. I understand this was more of a show model than a competition model but I can't recall if Hanno won F3A in the SS years.
David, Far from being a show model the Supra Star won the 1987 & 1989 World Champs. To me it is the ultimate pre turnround F3A design. No commercial plan was published but fortunately I have one drawn up from the remains of an EZ ARTF.

Ray
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Old 02-14-2010, 01:53 PM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

I stand corrected. Thanks for the clarification Ray.

Nice photos and... pants (trousers for those across the pond)!

David.
Old 02-14-2010, 03:40 PM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Great information David and Ray.

Calypso - I suppose the Modeltech building manual could be used as a good starting point to make a drawing. Best would be to have a Modeltech Calypso unbuilt to take measurements on.

Supra Fly 60 - great to know the 30 seize drawings could be used and scale up, probably Supra Fly 2500 drawings would be a good starting point also.

Supra Star 60 - I would sure be interested in a copy of that drawing you have Ray, of course I will pay the price you ask for to havea copy (on paper or digital like a PDF that can be printed/plotted).

Mystic 60 - great there are drawing for the smaller Mystic 30 that can be scaled up. I will try to find paper copy or if anyone has it digital I would be interested in a copy.

/Bo

Old 02-17-2010, 01:00 AM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Bo,

what are you planning to do with these models/designs? Are you interested in building any one in particular or just creating a "Hanno collection"?

I hopefully will be receiving some info on the EZ Mystic 60 (actually called 90 - 4s). This will help to confirm the specs for the blown up Mystic 30 and see if there are any deviations in scale. I don't expect to be working on this any time soon though - other Japanese designs come first.

David.
Old 02-17-2010, 07:05 AM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Hi,
Building them unless I can find a kit (unlikely). Kind of Hanno collection, flying. All of them are after all WC models. Having drawings on them so it is possible to build them for future generations is valuable in my opinion.

/Bo
Old 02-17-2010, 11:58 AM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

I'm currently building a Blue Bird Hanno Prettner Calypso kit that I bought from Indy RC back in the 80's.
I traced out every single piece on it and also kept the bulkhead "negatives" because I plan to build it again. The plane is now on many sheets of paper but I plan to consolidate it all to one sheet one of these days. If I do I'll make it available.

This is one rock solid aircraft; it's built like a tank like we did it in the good-old-days. Foam core wings and stab are sheeted in 1/16 balsa and the fuse is all balsa and ply. Single center wing servo was kind of bogus so I build a servo box on each wing for dual servos and flaperon mixing.

I'm ready to cover and final assembly and can't wait for that maiden crash, er uh, flight.
Old 02-17-2010, 05:29 PM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Superdave123,

Would be nice to see some pictures of your Calypso now, and when it is ready. And when it fly later.

/Bo
Old 02-17-2010, 06:03 PM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?


ORIGINAL: bem

Hi,
Building them unless I can find a kit (unlikely). Kind of Hanno collection, flying. All of them are after all WC models. Having drawings on them so it is possible to build them for future generations is valuable in my opinion.

/Bo
Definitely Bo. Preservation of these designs is of utmost importance in my opinion. When Hanno passes, they will be perhaps harder to find yet and at the same time priceless in terms of historical value.

A very crude sketch of the Sensation that I whipped up from Will's photos. Maybe one day it could turn into a plan... (but I doubt it).

David.
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Old 02-17-2010, 06:59 PM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Hi,
I have now a Supra Star 60 drawing incoming that will arrive to me in some weeks. I will scan it and save it to TIF and PDF in case somone else would be interested to get a file to be able to plot the drawing on paper and build a Supra Star. I will post here when it is avaliable.

/Bo
Old 02-18-2010, 12:34 AM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Bo,

in that case you're weaponized! [8D]

An original drawing of sorts definitely allows it to be transitioned to a full CAD plan. Of the five models the SS and Sensation are the most elusive so good research! Would you consider producing a CAD plan yourself for a laser kit?

I look forward to gleaming into yet another of Hanno's designs.

Thanks, David.
Old 02-18-2010, 06:59 AM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Hi,

Thought you might be interested to know that I have nearly finished designing a look a like Sensation 2000, as I wanted to make a larger Sensation for a YS140/170 Size. I have a Sensation 40 size to work from and also some pictures I had found on RCU. I have stopped working on the drawings for now, as I am moving home shortly, but will carry on with the design/CAD work when settled. I would build a prototype first and see what needs changing, before releasing any more information on the Sensation to you guys.

Anyway enjoy the pictures of the Sensation CAD work so far.

Regards

Darren
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Old 02-18-2010, 01:25 PM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Darren,

very nice work! Do keep us posted with your progress on the prototype. It would be an original and interesting build to follow.

I see that you changed the planform of the wing and stab (with a couple of others changes to the fuse that I can see) - they appear less tapered along the TE and the tips. What's your thinking behind these changes?

I believe the rudder is also fully behind the elevator TE in the original (as in your colour scheme side view) so there is no clearance cut on the elevators. Did you decide to stretch the tail moment?

Lastly, I was wondering if Hanno's model had flaps - he seemed quite fond of them.

David.

P.S. What happened to Flywilly's post?
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Old 02-18-2010, 04:08 PM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

ORIGINAL: doxilia

Darren,

very nice work! Do keep us posted with your progress on the prototype. It would be an original and interesting build to follow.

I see that you changed the planform of the wing and stab (with a couple of others changes to the fuse that I can see) - they appear less tapered along the TE and the tips. What's your thinking behind these changes?

I believe the rudder is also fully behind the elevator TE in the original (as in your colour scheme side view) so there is no clearance cut on the elevators. Did you decide to stretch the tail moment?

Lastly, I was wondering if Hanno's model had flaps - he seemed quite fond of them.

David.

P.S. What happened to Flywilly's post?
David,

Thanks for the comments. I will keep you posted as to my progress on the prototype. I had copied the plan form from the Sensation 40 size, then change it slightly, but I will be changing the wing and tail plane plan form, the wing is a Naca12 and the tail plane is a Naca10. I will not be going for Flaps like Hanno's Sensation.

I have changed the Fuse shape slightly to accomodate a Pipe tunnel for a short Hatori setup for the YS. see picture attached. I had to move the undercarriage up to have the pipe tunnel. I have also gone for a one piece cowl setup aswell. I am trying to make my Sensation hit the 5kg rule so that I can fly it in FAI, So the drawing will change I am sure to get the thing lighter as I build the prototype. I am happy with the drawing for the Fuse, so that will not change.

Regards

Darren
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Old 02-18-2010, 04:39 PM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Darren,

Your fuse looks great and already very light. Are you thinking of some composites on or between sides or basically a wood frame? If the former, I would think you might be able to get rid of some of the fuse side material, especially between the wing and stab. Nice interlocking structure though.

The wing and stab planform have more of a "sport" look than a "FAI" look. You'd probably loose some squares going with a planform like Hanno's but is the additional area necessary? Hanno didn't seem to need it. The planform on the original looks - well, just so modern for a plane designed by Hanno (those are just my vintage memories talking though...) - I like it.

It looks like you're planning on a single piece wing and plug-in stab? Why are you thinking of changing the airfoils as well?

David.
Old 02-19-2010, 04:07 AM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

]
ORIGINAL: doxilia

Darren,

Your fuse looks great and already very light. Are you thinking of some composites on or between sides or basically a wood frame? If the former, I would think you might be able to get rid of some of the fuse side material, especially between the wing and stab. Nice interlocking structure though.

The wing and stab planform have more of a ''sport'' look than a ''FAI'' look. You'd probably loose some squares going with a planform like Hanno's but is the additional area necessary? Hanno didn't seem to need it. The planform on the original looks - well, just so modern for a plane designed by Hanno (those are just my vintage memories talking though...) - I like it.

It looks like you're planning on a single piece wing and plug-in stab? Why are you thinking of changing the airfoils as well?

David.
David,

The fuse will have some lightning holes in the fuse sides, it will be a Basic wood airframe, with a Clear Canopy and Fibreglass cowl. I have now changed the planform on the Sensation from your Photograph, but gone for a straight tip, as I want to try some SFG's. I think it looks more modern now, and yes Hanno's plane does not look much different than the planes of today. I am going for a single wing just to make things simple, and the plug in stab purely for transporting the plane.

Anyway, enjoy the new picture of the wing and tail planform, I like it and will stick with it now, once again thanks for the picture as there is not much information to go on about the Sensation, Now back to designing the wing on Profilli for all the ribs

Regards

Darren
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Old 02-19-2010, 09:19 AM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

When I remember correctly, Hanno used a all movable tail plus elevator. I had a picture, think it was at an artistic competition in Japan ....

Rainer Seubert
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Old 02-19-2010, 09:26 AM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

[link=http://www.prop.at/fame/prettner_gal.html]http://www.prop.at/fame/prettner_gal.html[/link]
At least the pictures are in English.
Old 02-19-2010, 05:20 PM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Darren,

yes! Now you have a Sensation - looks much better. The tip angle can easily be an option either in the rib angle for a built up wing or in a foam core depending on whether you want to use SFG's.

BTW, does your 40 size have a built up tail or is it sheet balsa? Also, is it airfoiled or flat?

When you're done with the design, I'd be very interested in building a 30-40 sized electric version - maybe with foam core flying surfaces (I can just build them slightly better, more accurate).

Keep up the good work!

David.

P.S. Rainer, UStik, thanks for the further info. Rainer, are you saying that he had a flying stab + elevator or just an adjustable incidence stab!? ALso, do you know if the photo in Japanese depicts the location of flaps and ailerons correctly on Hanno's model? It's hard to tell from his BGX version side shot. I do see what are probably two elevator servos recessed in the fuse in front of the stab, unless it is an MK type control device.

If anyone has further info on the Supra Star, that would also be most welcome.
Old 02-20-2010, 05:54 AM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

David,

The Sensation 1400, I have has a flat tail plane. The Sensation 1400 is where I originaly got the plan form of the wing, which is a lot different from the 2000 version.
I have decided now to go back to the original as I am not going to have much time to CAD the newer version up, I will have to do this at a later date.

I have got a price back from the laser cutters on the Version 1, and I am happy with the price. So will go with this, as this is a prototype I am not to bothered with the plan form of the wing and tail, the Colour scheme version 1, is not the same as the CAD work anyway (see picture attached).

Regards

Darren

p.s I have also included a picture from the manual of the 40 size, so you can cad it up
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Old 02-20-2010, 09:04 PM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Returning to the original inquiry of this post:
After considerable research, I have determined that Pilot kitted an all wood version of the Supra-Fly 60. It was never imported here in the US, however it was available as a finished (RTF) model from Ten-Plus.
Has anybody seen one (kit or Ten-Plus airplane)?
-Will
Old 03-01-2010, 01:21 AM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Hi guys,

I would love to get a copy of Hanno's suprastar plans.

Here is some pics of an aussie designed model called the Kryptonite. I think it was based on the suprastar, but I am not sure exactly how they differed.

This one I scratch built a while ago to suit a 480 size EP setup, with GP .10 retracts.

Plans were published in 1993 for the Kryptonite in the australian magazine, Radio Control Model News.

Cheers
Steve





Old 03-01-2010, 01:50 AM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Hello Steve,
as I was reading this post, I was also thinking of how similar the designs were the the Kyptonite, I bought a copy of the plans as soon as I saw them in the mag years ago. I never built one though, by the time I could afford a motor the designs had moved on, and the plans were put away. I ended up flying a Loaded dice which was a bit bigger. Matt13
Old 03-01-2010, 03:00 AM
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Default RE: Hanno Prettner later WC designs - drawings?

Carn guys, a little OT don't you think?

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