Atlanta 60

My Feedback: (18)

handglider..

Yeah..I had seen your Curare thread a while back...Nice Going!!

Looks to me your about there arn't you...Pretty Dang Schweet!!

Have Fun...

Chuck

Pattern One

My Feedback: (73)

I received my Curare short kits from Pass Time Hobbies today. William did an excellent job with this. He is talking about doing the Atlas. Any interest? If so, let William know.

Atlanta 60

My Feedback: (18)

Excellant GlockGuy!! This kit is some pretty darn nice stuff isn't it...I sure hope you will join in posting some pictures ect during your build!! Do you know what your going to power it with yet?? Retracts?? Trike or T'Dragger??

So what is an Atlas?? Do you have a photo??

Have Fun!!!

Chuck

Nathan King

How exciting!

I won't be missing a single post of this one.

speed-panzer

My Feedback: (1)

...this is an Atlas....

Jim_Purcha

My Feedback: (8)

Plans still available from Model Airplane News[link=http://www.rcstore.com/ME2/dirmod.asp?sid=521FEB3C003A47F1B2FD524B47FF0DF7&nm=Test&type=EcomBB&mod=E%2DCommerce%3A%3AProduct+Catalog&mid=D30FB4BBE3764A5694C4972616B7262A&tier=3&id=A35F86E84665470891C7E7AB71883394&ntier1=Plans&ntier2=Planes&ntier3=Pattern&ntier4=&ntier5=]Wolfgang Matt's Atlas [/link]

Pattern One

My Feedback: (73)

Chuck,

Not sure what engine yet. I have several on the shelf. Retracts for sure. I like the classic look so the first one will be tri-gear. Wm at Coosbaylumber also cut some thicker fuse sides for me so a 91 four stroke tail dragger may be in the future.

Leo

djr1007

Since the originals used Webra speed 61, I was thinking OS61 at first. But the new OS75 fits the same space and MACs has a pipe and header for it. So I've got both on order now.
I'm not sure you could squeeeeez in a 4 stroke.

pimmnz

I have been flying one for a couple of years now in local pattern contests, with an OS .61SF. Pretty much ballistic at 6.75 lb with trike retracts. You will need to be very careful about the weight of anything you put in the nose, mine is carrying lead in the tail with the battery (1100 mah nicads) placed over the wing trailing edge. IMHO, and I fly both, the Atlas is a better pattern aircraft than the Curare, for the pattern it was designed for. Plans I used were from RCM&E (now Magicalia) and it is an all wood (no foam) model.
Evan, W.B.#12

Atlanta 60

My Feedback: (18)

Wow..That Atlas is neat lookin'...I need to go check and see if that is on the SPA list??

I was eventually gonna do another Curare as a SPA ship with fixed gear and a four stroke or non piped 2 stroke...And I kinda wanted to do a Daddy Rabbit...But I'm liking the looks of that Atlas alot!! There is so much cool stuff out there...lol

So you guys are gonna be beating me to the build table I'm sure...I had a few things jump ahead of the Curare...Which is actually kinda a good thing...Like djr1007 has mentioned to me...I wanna do the Curare "Right"...These other kits will kinda get me tuned up a bit...

Have Fun!!

Chuck

CoosBayLumber

My Feedback: (1)

Well, everyone is sort of correct in their earlier assumptions, but not totally correct. The new semi-kit is based upon four different sources of information. It comes closest in general arrangement to that of the M.A.N. plan, which can be ordered today, but not totally there too. I also used a plan from Sweden, one from Poland, and the noted MK plan. The whole aircraft looks to be an evolution over a period. I think the M.A.N. plan was a collection of "Good" points placed on to paper. I have my doubts as to how certain things were built considering the technology then.

There were problems with each plan. The one from Poland actually had very little useable information on it, but it did have some critical dimensions. The angle at which the anihedral Hoz-stab set at was different on all plans, but on the Polish one is cited 9 degrees and in way or another on each plan that seemed correct. It matched one side of one plan but not the other side etc.

I used the M.A.N. plan as the basis for curves even though it had lottsa problems. May be my copy of it but first thing I noticed after grabbing the measuring stick was there appeared no way you were going to stuff big of a wing into the assigned slot. It was too big in chord by about 3/8 inch. Am used to adjusting things after doing a few dozen plans for old time models, and maybe expected a bit more out of this.

With the chord for the wing being too big to fit the fuselage slot, it meant the bulkheads inside the fuselage had to be moved a bit forward and towards the rear for the wing to fit tightly. The Polish plan was also helpful in that it mentioned the chord, and the number of ribs and their spacing for the wood wing version (including the tailfeathers too). And as with many of us, we all seem to have one or two of the airfoil programs on the home computer. The cited airfoils on each plan flat did not look anything like which was on any one of the A/C I had seen. I found one cited in an older Prettner project, and tried it. That matched. Apparently once you like an airfoil, it sticks with you then. The Polish plan was helpfull in citing a one degree of incidence too, for that wasn't mentioned on the MAN plan, but sure showed up on every plan.

The MK plan showed the sides pretty good, how to measure them etc, but there in big ink note on each plan about swinging the engine direction to fit offset. Those plans pretty well ignored this feature, I had to make up and cut out a left and right side in balsa for to get the proper noted sidethrust. On each plan was an obscure implication, "Oh, didn't we tell you.... Well after you try and fly it, just add in a bunch of washers and then..." Well, not on my models, for is easier to angle sand off some excess material on the table than once built. Is even easier for the laser to cut off that extra 1/16 inch on each side.

On the MAN plan the nose gear somehow got shorter by 1/2 inch as it retracted. No actual brand for the gear was noted, but the Supra by Indy Models was pretty popular then. I only have a main wing set, but cannot see any way to that the gear reach could shorten up by 1/2 in in retracting. I thus had to move things around in order for the noted Hobbico unit to fit and keep same wheelbase.

The Swedish plan said whose retracts to use, but those were no longer available. You could get them via Asia, but only with purchasing a kit. Many-many hobby shops have the very popular (and cheap) Hobbico units. The resemble the old original ones too. You just need to own a wire bending pliers to get the proper angles then. Even as such I expanded on the wheelbase just so the nose would stay down tight. See radio note below. I used a elderly FMA type of servo for the retracts.

Other funny situation was each plan showed the main landing gear to retract flush with wing surface. Not on my old Supra gear. For when the gear is extended, the tires are supposed to touch 90 degrees to the surface. I did this by bending the wires a few degrees, and thus let them go in a bit diagonal when retracted. Takes longer to think how to solve such than to accomplish.

Another simple revision was in that the MAN plan cited to use 5/16" balsa for the rudder. That must be readily available, like in my junk box someplace, or at the store. Nope. Instead, I built the rudder of thin plywood with laminated balsa.

Another easy to obtain slab of wood is the 9/16" balsa as used on the wing tips and rudder leading edge. Yeah, Like I know exactly where I can put my hands on some. I made the thickness out of laminated balsa instead. Then to save weight in the rear (and obtain a more favorable C.G.), the remainder of the fin was made up from laser cut ribs and sheeting.

One of my plans cited an O.P.S. 10ccm glow engine but according to written accounts, the original supposedly had a Webra 10ccm Speed engine. These today when found in OK shape are more expensive than ordering the model from Asia. I have two Webras. One near useless as it is with near zero compression and takes 1/2 day to start up. Then a standard one (now with a bent crankshaft). My test A/C still has it mounted in with all the dirt from a crash in 2006. I am not into hotty aircraft anymore, for once an A/C flies vertical, it goes out of my sight into the glare of the sun. The used Webra easily made the Curare go vertical. So as a revison I set up the new plan up for a very common GMS 2000 glow engine, or a late model Webra 10ccm.

There is some 1/4 aircraft plywood cited on each plan. I originally built the parts from laminated 1/8 inch plywood, as there wasn't but one chunk of 1/4 inch here in 2006, and most everything involved in plywood went in to Back-order around May. It was on the boat someplace in the Atlantic, due to arrive....? After examination of pieces after the 100 MPH crash, none of the substituted material failed. This seems a bit heavy to me, and perhaps 3/16" or lighter could have been used. Save a few grams here too.

Using modern light weight radio gear and servos I had found creates an imbalance for C.G. then. This A/C was designed for a German built Simplot radio of 1970's vintage and everything in the fuselage is spread out to accomodate such. To get a good C.G. balance I have to push everything to the front firewall, and use extra heavy batteries to boot. That new lightweight gear may be reliable, but it unwittingly causes some C.G. problems too.

The M.A.N. plan cited a fuel tank capacity. The other plans just indicated the general vicinity of where to install one. I found a used Kraft, and thinking back that was popular in the middle 1970's. Least got a size and outline now. Then found a DuBro and it is a bit stubbier, but actually fit better.

There isn't anything within N.A. which can be readily obtained even close to fitting the diameters of the tires. As expediency, I use treaded DuBro tires on mine.



As of today, am off again working on an Atlas now. This plan doesn't have too many descrepancies in it, 'cept for the usual wing chord versus fuselage fit, but have become accustomed to that.

'sides that it is easier too.

Wm.

pimmnz

Wm, I built my Curare and Atlas from the RCM&E (English) plans, both still available, and no parts/fit issues I could find. No foam either. Might be worth a look to save some time and angst...
Evan, W.B.#12

RFJ

Thiese are some rough scans of the RCM&E Atlas and Curare plans.

Most RCM&E and RM plans available from http://www.myhobbystore.com/default.aspx

Ray

piroflip2

hi navav2002

do the wings have snap flaps? if so will you drill holes through them as Hanno did in later versions?

regards piroflip

RFJ

This is the flap/spoiler setup as used at the 1977 World Champs.

Ray

pimmnz

The RCM&E drawing shows (near as I can tell) the 1975 version (the SPA legal one) and shows the simpler flap with the spoiler extension and no holes. Well, thats what happened when I built mine from them anyway.
Evan.

CoosBayLumber

My Feedback: (1)

Ray......


Am on one of those public library computers, so have to be quick here or some kiddie will get mad.

The RCM&E plans are difficult to come by for those in N.A. I also have not figured out what era they are supposed to represent. Do not know reason why they at RCM&E handed out a story back a few months ago, but had inquired more than year ago as to availability, and received excuse that firm was sold, wait.

Then, you got to wait a bit longer.

Then.....

OH, did you ask about something?

Can't you get a copy of requested from a stateside dealer?

It may have been printed and available back when, but is not now.

You need to tune into web site for only things we have available are posted there. We have nothing else.

I looked at modern web site back in May, nothing available except for perhaps a dozen of some very modern A/C designs over past three years. Also was note that plans and parts were only available to those within the U.K. and no where else. You can send in money, but do not expect to get anything in return. Got note from them to try one of the old timey plans collectors. If they don't have what you want then it is not available anymore. Ever again too.

Nope. RCM&E issued a catalogue to those of us in N.A. about two or three years ago. It was old even then. It had a lot of plans listed, but unless you actually knew the number of what you wanted, sorry if we don't show that as being available then it is not. try back in a couple months. They did however have Ghost images from 3-D plans in older issues. That OK?

The M.A.N. plan service goes through periods where they say they don't have a certain one, then very next issue has a picture and issue number for the plan your are looking for. Oops, guess we had it all the time.



Wm.

pimmnz

Wm, go to `www.modelflying.co.uk' then click on thr `hobby store' link thingie on the L/h side. Navigate to the model airplane plans link then select your favourites. Curare is illustrated and you can buy online if you wish. Seem to be friendly enough bunch.
Evan, W.B. #12.

RFJ

WM - as Evan says they seem to be a bit more organised now. I got a plan from them recently using the on line ordering with no problems. I think the company was sold at least twice over the last year and is now owned by something called Magicalia Publishing Ltd. The plans division is at http://www.myhobbystore.com/default.aspx

If you still have problems let me know and I can order what you want and post it to you.

Ray

CoosBayLumber

My Feedback: (1)

Has anyone here sucessfully flown a modern Curare INVERTED?

It may be me and old eyes, but flat cannot fly straight and level out front of me 200 feet. If you can, tell me how?

Am working on an Atlas now, and suspect it to be easier to fly inverted when finished.


Wm.

djr1007

Wm
I'm a bit confused here (and worried). I thought you indicated that you had built and tested the modifications/corrections you had made to the plans.
Didn't that include inverted?
Or, are you talking about some other version of "Modern Curare"?
Was planning to start the build this weekend, I'm going to hold off now until your reply.
Thanks.

CoosBayLumber

My Feedback: (1)

Well, due to age and enthusium, I am not exactly the best Pattern Flier. When flying inverted, I need to stop and think which way to move controls.

Oops, guess down is really up now.

Once I figure that out, it sort of Esses as it goes by. Hopefully there is no need for up/down flight adjustments, and it will fly straight on by. OK, when WAY up there at the top of the square leg, but down low..... don't talk to me. I'm thinking. Is up really up or is it down? Is Right really away or closer towards me? Gee why do they make everything so complicated?

I used to think the wavy flights were due to the C.G. shifting during inverted flights. But then read how others are having trouble too. Then thought came to me forward or aft shifting of the C.G. ought to have little to do with Right and Left.

Maybe it is not all me.

Wm.

pimmnz

I have had no trouble with Curare inverted, other than the usual `up is down' thing, but then I trim my pattern models to fly `S&L' at something less than full throttle speed. This way I have to hold just a little down pressure for inverted level flight, which reminds me fairly clearly which way to push for `up'. Other than that it has no weird things happening, but I fly mode 1 so aerobatics is probably easier than for the usual U.S. mode. Both Curare and Atlas are very neutral flying airplanes, Atlas is a little bigger and slower than Curare, and may be easier to fly accurately in a pattern situation, I find Curare needs to be flown very deliberately in order to get the best from it, but then that could just as easily be me...
Evan, W.B. #12.

rc_heli_flier

My Feedback: (12)

Here is the link to the Curare plans:

http://www.myhobbystore.com/ProductD...e-09c8734d577d

I bought them a few months back so I know they have them available. It took about 4 - 5 weeks to get them once I placed the order.

NM2K

My Feedback: (14)

---------------


Me too! (build thread)


Ed Cregger