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  1. #1
    AllTheGoodNamesAreTaken's Avatar
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    Modeltech Matt Saphir

    Not sure if this is V1 (.60) or V2 (1.20 FS), but I'm looking for CG and control throw information as the seller didn't have any documentation. Also looking for engine recommendation.

    Thanks,
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    Don\'\'t just stand there, go get some glue!

  2. #2
    cllaurit's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    Built one years ago and I still have it somewhere. I will look to see if I can find the info
    Maneuver complete

  3. #3

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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    Hi,

    I have it, I have sent you a PM.

    /Bo

  4. #4
    doxilia's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    Great and timely thread start Jeff!

    I'm currently on vacation but somehow still managed to pick up one of these (V1) as well from a friend in Iceland. I should be receiving it early September. Bo, if you have any info that you are able to post here, I'd be interested as well. Unfortunately, I'm having technical issues accessing my main email account (what I use for RCU correspondence) from aborad so while the IT guys sort it out I'm out of touch with any communications I have received there.

    Jeff, I hope you decide to do a "finish" thread here - I'd be interested in following particularly if yours is also the V1 version. Aside from a slight difference in span (if any) and nose moment/FW location for the 120, I believe there isn't that much difference between the two. I think I'll probably be putting a YS AR into mine. However, it would be an interesting idea to put a Hanno into a Matt design!

    David.

  5. #5
    AllTheGoodNamesAreTaken's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    Hi David,
    I don't know what I'd show in a build thread. It's an ARC kit that has been 90% assembled. The PO filled in the retract wells, so I'll have to open those back up. But other than that???
    Right now I'm debating on a powerplant. I sold my last RF earlier this year so I don't have a RE engine to put in it. I don't own a four stroke to put in it either. I do have a NovaRossi .75 and Ultrathrust muffler that I think would be a good match power wise, but I'd either have to mount the engine inverted and have the muffler stick out the side of the cowl, or mount the engine at 7 o'clock to run the exhaust down the center (like the Calypso).
    I've got a lot of projects going on at once right now so I don't have a set place for it in my queue. I'll dwell on the covering design forever anyway....but the wife says it better have a lot of black - her favorite. So I'm thinking black, yellow and white. The cowl and belly pan have to be painted, so black is a good idea anyway since it's pretty easy to match the Monokote.
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    Don\'\'t just stand there, go get some glue!

  6. #6

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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    David,

    I have the orginal constructionarticle (in german language)published in FMT (Flugmodellund Technik) May, nr 5, 1988.
    If it is allowed I can post it here as PDF (not sure about the copyright).
    I have also Saphir I and II drawings in PDF (and TIF) but I also hesitate to post that here. It is shown both 2-stroke and 4-stroke engine mounting on the drawings.
    Wolfgang Matt used at F3A WC 1987 in France his Saphir I withWebra 61 LS (long stroke) rear exhaust. He used Saphir I also in WC 1989 in USA(not sure what engine he used that year, maybe he had moved over to YS, 2- or 4-stroke).Saphir II that he used in WC 1991 in Australiahe used YS F-120 AC.

    Image below from construction article showing the Webra 61 LS removed from Matt's Saphir I.

    /Bo


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  7. #7
    doxilia's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    Jeff,

    sure I follow your meaning. Still, it would be interesting to see how you go about the finish and engine/radio installation. Always provides some inspiration and points of discussion. Of course, if you feel up to it. The Rossi sounds like it would be a nice fit. The absence of a pipe should also make the wing install and removal more managable. The 7 o'clock option sounds good to me.

    I've got a Calypso on the bench so I might try to put the Saphir together this winter once finished with the Calypso. It would make for interesting conversation to set the pair down on the runway side by each!

    Bo, I just sent you a PM.

    David.

  8. #8
    RFJ's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    He used Saphir I also in WC 1989 in USA (not sure what engine he used that year,
    YS 120 4cycle. Here are the !989 results & a picture taken at the event.

    Ray




    Ray
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  9. #9
    Jon Wold's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    That's the Saphir I, the 60 size. You can't beat and OS Hanno in such a plane. I have the Modeltech ARF Saphir II 1.20 which is a lot bigger and heavier and the Hanno pulls it very nicely.
    F3A blog: http://www.aerowold.com

  10. #10

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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir




    ORIGINAL: Jon Wold

    That's the Saphir I, the 60 size. You can't beat and OS Hanno in such a plane. I have the Modeltech ARF Saphir II 1.20 which is a lot bigger and heavier and the Hanno pulls it very nicely.
    Hi,

    When You say the Saphir II-4T is a lot bigger - what do you mean by that?

    Specification onSaphir I and Saphir II-4T are as follow, taken from Matt's homepage.
    I can understand that Saphir II is slightly heavier with the 4-stroke but in what way is it bigger?

    Saphir I
    1989 - 1991
    Construction: Wolfgang and Günther Matt
    Type: F3A-Model
    Wing span: 178cm
    Fuselage: 160cm
    Weight: 4.0kg
    Engine: Webra 61 LS
    Radio Control: Webra FMSI
    Kit: Model Tech Co., Hong Kong
    Robbe GmbH, Grebenhain: www.robbe.de



    Saphir II-4T
    1991 - 1992
    Construction: Wolfgang and Günther Matt
    Type: F3A-Model
    Wing span: 178cm
    Fuselage: 160cm
    Weight: 4.3kg
    Engine: YS-120 (4T)
    Radio Control: Futaba/Robbe FC28
    Kit: Model Tech Co., Hong Kong
    Robbe GmbH, Grebenhain: www.robbe.de



    When You say you have a Saphir II-4T ARF made by Model Tech do You mean Almost Ready to Fly or do youmean ARC, Almost Ready to Cover? I have a Model Tech/Robbe Saphir I and it is ARC- basically glue it together and paint/cover it.

    /Bo


  11. #11
    cllaurit's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    Ran a Saphir 1 in the early 90's with a YS.61AR and I still have it (humm maybe I need to dig it out). Unlimited vertical but the plane likes to float on landings. I dialed in a bit of spoiler which helped.
    Maneuver complete

  12. #12
    Jon Wold's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    Bo, my saphir is 183 cm wingspan. It has a wide and beefy fuselage made for MK style softmounts and a long fourstroke pipe like they used to run on the YS 120. It is an ARF, very nicely covered right out of the box.
    Pictures here
    F3A blog: http://www.aerowold.com

  13. #13
    Jon Wold's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    F3A blog: http://www.aerowold.com

  14. #14
    AllTheGoodNamesAreTaken's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    Well, I don't think I'm going to use the NovaRossi. I mounted the big Ultathrust muffler and held it up to the firewall. In either the 6 or 7 o'clock position, I would have to cut a huge amount of the cowl off to be able to slide it over the head or muffler and I just don't want to do that....
    I'm going to keep watching the marketplace for a nice YS 61 RE or 110.
    Don\'\'t just stand there, go get some glue!

  15. #15

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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    I had a modeltech Saphir I about 20 years ago powered with an OS 61RF-ABC-P (pre-hanno) with a Performance Specialties piston/sleeve. The airplane flew well, but the wing was wayyyyy too heavy (and one panel was significantly heavier than the other). My MK Jokers were a lot lighter. I saw Matt fly the Spahir I with the YS 1.20SF at the '89 worlds. The airplanes were custom built in Japan (and were gorgeous - typical Japanese craftsmanship!). The plane was awesome in the air; Matt flew huge maneuvers and had power to spare - it seemed like he was accelerating in the verticals!
    I have a Modeltech Saphir II NIB that I planned to overpower (still waiting to be finished). I always wished I'd kept my Saphir I as it would have been perfect for a YS 91AC. Ah well, so many projects...so little time
    -Will

  16. #16
    cllaurit's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    Yes I agree the wing is "heavy". I also had one half that was significantly heavier then the other. The plane also is nose heavy, or at least mine was, I remember that I had a 1800mah battery behind th servos in the fuse trying to balance it out a bit more without adding some weight. In the end I needed to add some lead to the tail which did help the flying. I think if I were to do it again I would find a way to add the elevator servos in the tail. The other issue is the fuel tank, there is really no room to mount it on the CG which would have helped also.

    All in all this is a good plane and I would gladly do another one. All this talk about it made me go out to the garage the other night and dig out my old one. New battery, new plug and it might be ready to fly again (after sitting for 12 years).
    Maneuver complete

  17. #17
    AllTheGoodNamesAreTaken's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    This project might take flight afterall. I found a NIB YS 1.20 SC for $185 shipped. No exhaust though, so I'll have to see what path to take with that once it gets here and I can mock it up.
    Looks like mounting the servos in the tail is a good route to take. I post my progress here once I finish up my latest two projects. (A Top Flite Hot Kanary 1/2 covered and an Excelleron 50 - moving the servos to the tail to balance out the OS .61 SF-P that's in the nose )
    Don\'\'t just stand there, go get some glue!

  18. #18
    cllaurit's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    A 120sc is going to be hard to balance.
    Maneuver complete

  19. #19
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir


    ORIGINAL: AllTheGoodNamesAreTaken

    Not sure if this is V1 (.60) or V2 (1.20 FS), but I'm looking for CG and control throw information as the seller didn't have any documentation. Also looking for engine recommendation.

    Thanks,
    Jeff,

    did you build your Saphir?

    David.

  20. #20

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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    Hi Bem
    I've searched FMT plans list and can't find any reference to the Saphir 1 - any chance of getting your pdf of the plans?
    Thanks, John

  21. #21

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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    John,

    I sent a PM to You.

    /Bo

  22. #22
    AllTheGoodNamesAreTaken's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir


    ORIGINAL: doxilia


    ORIGINAL: AllTheGoodNamesAreTaken

    Not sure if this is V1 (.60) or V2 (1.20 FS), but I'm looking for CG and control throw information as the seller didn't have any documentation. Also looking for engine recommendation.

    Thanks,
    Jeff,

    did you build your Saphir?

    David.
    Hi David.
    No, I sold it in preparation for moving in with my fiancee. All I have left is my Komet..
    Don\'\'t just stand there, go get some glue!

  23. #23
    doxilia's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    Well, good for you Jeff. Congratulations.

    Did you sell your beautiful Dirty Birdy as well?

    Give it a little time and you'll be right back in business.

    David.

  24. #24
    AllTheGoodNamesAreTaken's Avatar
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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    Yep, the DB is gone too....[:@]

    Going through some serious withdrawls right now. No place to build, all my equipment is boxed up... I might have to head on over to the hobby shop to sniff some salsa just to keep my sanity.
    Don\'\'t just stand there, go get some glue!

  25. #25

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    RE: Modeltech Matt Saphir

    But the DB is in a good loving home and gets out often. LOL


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