flyerdarren

I'd love to. I can't wait to go.

Jim C.

so what are you saying?? for your info i WAS IN IRAQ AND I KNOW HOW IT FEELS.. that was the most ignorant thing anyone has said..... and you have the gall to sit there and berate me for just trying to figure out what the deal is.... maybe you should be the one who goes there..

MikeL

My Feedback: (3)

Do not resort to calling other RCU members names. Show the maturity and respect that a US Serviceman should. Many of the folks who have posted in this thread have done their duty, and your attitude (GraupnerFan) is a disservice to them.

Instead of defending yourself, take stock of what people are trying to do here: help you find a way to overcome your attitude problem and enjoy the hobby.

Jim C.

my bad.. but that just pi$$es me off when the chair jockies tell me to go to iraq like that.. i generally am very respectful and mature but when you say something like that to me.. well .. you just seen what happens.. and it is a disservice to me!! and im not about to sit here and get belittled. i had enough of that in basic training. i have read every word on trying to overcome this and its appreciated .. and i aplogize if my "tone" is poor.. its not meant to be THAT bad.. and i will try to be more "tactful"

mike: dont you ever go to sleep?!?!?!?!

MikeL

My Feedback: (3)

I'm running a 101.7 fever at the moment, so sleep would be nice.

I don't mean to try and belittle you. I appreciate what you've done for your country and your commitments. I can feel your frustration coming through your posts, but the guys here really are giving you some decent advice. You've put a fair bit of time into this thread, and I think you're genuinely wanting to enjoy your hobby over there. The guys here are just sharing their experiences and what worked for them. It's a whole lot easier to benefit from guys who've been there and done that than to try and reinvent the wheel--believe me, I know.

Jim C.

makes sense.. thanks.. hope ya feel better!

David Cutler

At the risk of sounding pompous here, (for which I apologize) I have seen the course this thread has taken literally hundreds of times on the Internet over the past couple of decades.

When a generalization is made (something that this medium tends to encourage as there isn't enough data to go on at any particular time) then things get heated.

There are lots of advantages to this written medium in thread form, but it also, I'm afraid, tends to encourage us all to fill in information about people we correspond with, and risk getting it wrong as a result, thus adding to the flames.

My guess is we all now have entirely the wrong impression of each other in this thread, and we are really arguing heatedly with a person who doesn't really exist.

My 2c worth, (for what its worth!)

-David C.

Jim C.

hahahahahhaah WHAT??!?!?! im floored by this one.. please explain.. if your implying that im just trolling.. sorry but your wrong on that front.. i dont play that stupid game.. as i dont have the time to do so!!!

MikeL

My Feedback: (3)

If I may, David was thinking that the thread was degenerating away from the issue of how to get you flying at German flying fields. You gotta admit we weren't exactly being friendly.

flyerdarren

I get what you're trying to say David, and yes it is too easy to generalize about people. Most of people I've encountered over here involved with this hobby have been very nice. But this guy took the cake as far as rudeness goes. So maybe this thread had a little venting involved. I guess my point is that when tried to show this guy some respect and asked what we needed to do to fly there. He was just rude and loud and animate about us not being there. So, we found another field, and I am in the process of becoming a member there. They were polite to me and explained the process. I have no patience for guys that are that rude. It's his right to be a mean old guy. But it's my right to badmouth him.

BasinBum

My Feedback: (2)

So you've been there three years and havn't joined a club? Do you speak German or did you just assume what the guy was saying?

How "far up the road" did you go to fly? Where you within 3 miles, close enough to shoot someone down?

You could have had the same response anywhere in the world and from the "tone" of your posts here you come across as pretty confrontational.

You guys really sound like the stereotypical "Ugly Americans" and it not hard to believe you had a problem with a local. If you love this hobby as much as you say why would you not have looked into joining a club already?

I also find it very ironic that someone who bleeds red, as you say you do, uses a German company's name in your handle. Maybe we are a little conflicted, don't you think?

On another note...MikeL, I agreed with your first post in this thread. I guess it takes a fever for us to see eye to eye!

David Cutler

<sigh>

OK, I'll try ..

Somebody thought, wrongly, that saying you should go to Iraq was needed, to make the person he thought you were, shut up. He didn't know you were actually, not that person who didn't go to Iraq, and you reacted heatedly.

At the same time your friend responded saying he would love to go, which was also not the response the originator of the comment expected.

When you saw somebody showing you their experiences in Germany you thought, probably wrongly , that they were trying to put you right, when they could easily have just been adding to the thread in a perfectly innocent way.

There are a few more in this thread that I won't bore us all in repeating.

You also laughed at me in your last message, which I could have taken seriously, as you have no idea who I am, and whether I deserve to be laughed at.

. . and yes, MikeL is right in saying this thread has drifted beyond recognition. Another example of what happens when we fill in the gaps that are inevitable in this medium.

Enough of this, I'm off to bed!

-David C.

David Cutler

Hi BasinBum,

What are youuuu doin' in this thread?

You know you are far too sensible to get involved in this one!

<hides>

-DC

David Cutler

Hi Flyerdarren,

Phew! Thanks for that!

I thought I was going crazy here!

Maybe I still am!

-DC

flyerdarren

Basin Bum,

To answer your question, I ave been here for almost three years, but I just recently jumped into this hobby with both feet. And we went up the road to another club, where we welcomed. By the way, it's that second club we went to that I will be joining. And I speak enough German to know that he wasn't being very nice.

Jim C.

i was only laughing cuz i thought you thought i was being scitzo(spelling) and after some thought and many re-readings, i too got what you are saying. i didnt mean to insult you in any way. we are on american freqs here at the moment.. however, they (the clubs) dont have a problem with that but they would like you to be on their freqs. (already discussed a while back)

jmayle

GraupnerFan,

Maybe the gentleman that you spoke to that day has had to deal with Americans who were not so nice. I was a member of a German club for 5 years and I loved it, but I could also see how they get frustrated with us. I think if you went back to join the club, you would receive a different reception, at least I hope you do. Yes, when I joined the German club they made me fly with an instructor for the first month, but after a couple of flights, he stopped coming to my side when I flew. Give it a try and let us know how it goes.

Tank

scottrc

The guys that just show up at a field and fly without inquiring permission deserved what they got. Incidences like this is why clubs are getting more and more reserved. Sure YOU were insured, but there are always those who are not and cause damages. This same thing goes for hunting, mountain biking, or any other recreational sport. Because people are inconsiderate of the property owners is why property owners are getting more defensive.

It doesn't matter what country or nationality your dealing with, you caused mistrust between you and the other guy who was resposible for his field, whether he was a landowner or club representative, you should have sought him out and asked to fly.

I travel all over and fly at many fields. I have never had to "join" a club, just either had to sign a waver, or pay a few bucks to use the field, and most of the fields, a few bucks was worth it, but I never had any doors slammed in my face by inquiring to fly. I've had to put up with a few grouchy safety officers and club "know it alls", but that is just part of life.

Herky

My Feedback: (4)

I know this may be off topic, but...

Does anyone know of any rc airplane or helicopter clubs in SW Germany ie Kaiserslautern military community or nearby?? I know there's some other army or air force guys out there who would know. Thanks

Stan

P-51B

My Feedback: (5)

AFter reading through this thread, I think that you have hit the nail on the head ScottRC.

Cactus.

My Feedback: (1)

one, two skip a few, getting dull, ok from what i did bother to read:

you see the germans one way, what you might not realize is that all yanks are also painted by a tar brush by the rest of the world as a lould arrogrant race, just like you are all now picturing me with my bowler hat, red bus outside, sipping tea.
When i went to germany i was surprised by what i found, no hitler harsh voice tones, not a mullet in sight, just a bunch of nice people, paris however was a different matter, give them all the sterotypes you want, they lived up to it fine.

anyways, i found out theres a club in the area i visited and when i go back first thing i'll do is find out whos there and if it's ok to fly, if my UK insurance and frequency is ok there, not just whip out the Cougar and go scare the grass with the elevator.

Our club being in one of the UK's tourists hotspots allows visitors, but a call or mail to the chairwoman doesnt go amiss or to ask someone there flying at least. turning up and seeing a stranger there without warning is a little off putting.
you got what you deserved, sadly some of the thread just reinforces the arrogrant bit of the percived US attitude.

Herky: theres a club in Lambsheim near Mannheim

IronCross

After reading this thread and the replys etc it is easy to see where the term "ugly american" came from. Unfortunatly you would run into the same problem attempting to fly at our field without permission. It is a sign of the times. To many libility issues these day.

Jim C.

i am surprised this thread has re surfaced. everyone has their own opinons ...so..... ok whatever. we were there you werent. maybe this was a touch outta line but i just thank god i am leaving this place to go back home. FINALLY!! i cant get on that plane fast enough.


ps. there isnt anything there to be liable for.. its all open. so that really doesnt have merit. i had the proper insurance at the time and that allows me to fly where ever i want ( with permission on private land)

MarkNovack

My Feedback: (3)

I flew for 4 years in Germany and never had a problem. When I went the first time I asked permision. No problem. That day the treasurer came out and I handed him the money for a membership. No club that I have ever flown with in Germany was "state owned" and the land was owned or rented with money from dues, donations, and club events from fly-ins (flugtag) to selling food during the local fest. I flew in Walldorf outside of Heidelberg, and I have also flown at several neighboring clubs. I was always welcomed with graciousness and never bothered other than making sure that I signed in my radio frequency.

Of course, before I just decided that I could fly wherever I pleased, I made phone calls, checked the rules, and ensured I complied with their frequencies. Now that I live in Belgium where I belong to five clubs and fly at ten others, I still visit Germany quite often. I always bring and airplane and have never been chased off.

I participated in every flugtag, youth day, fest, and lawnmowing. I receive annual inivitations to fly at several fly-ins in the region and go when contest schedules allow. I have made many annual fly-in friends, networked in business with manufacturers, got to practice my German which is quite functional because of the flying days, and never miss the grill with bratwurst and brochen.

That probationary period you mention is a standard in EVERY type of club. It provides an easy avenue to get rid of truly rude of dangerous individuals. It also takes a higher than majority ratio vote to expell a probatee so one has to really be disliked by everyone. What person would wnat to fly in a club where 80% of the members dislike them enough to vote to expell? I believe the Walldorf club asked one member in 30 years to leave. It was not an Auslander either. They even tolerated the alcoholic American contractor with his nut case girlfriend who would stand behind the pits making love chants and meditating to aliens...everyone thought it was comical.

So, from an American who was there, is still there regularly, and will be there regularly for the rest of his life, Germany provides wonderful opportunities for flying, with friendships, fun, and an overall rewarding experience.

Regards,
Mark

yakman

you see the germans one way, what you might not realize is that all yanks are also painted by a tar brush by the rest of the world as a lould arrogrant race,


You forgot gullible.