A Bad Day at Reno
09-18-2011, 07:45 AM
#26
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RE: A Bad Day at Reno
Well, I just hope accidents like this don't deter future air shows / races. Yeah it's sad but let's face it, the moment you purchase your ticket and sit in that seat, you assume all risk being there watching the show. The same holds for any event. I witnessed someone get killed at local nascar track.A car hit the wall in a turn due to a throttle stuck wide open, right wheel broke off, went sailing over the wall, over the fence and struck someone in the head. Do we stop racing? No.
09-18-2011, 07:53 AM
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RE: A Bad Day at Reno
stuntflyr had the most eloquent explanation I've seen. I saw the nose down photos and at first thought someone rotated the photo for dramatics, later found it to be ligit. I noticed first the tail wheel down and no pilot visable, I thought it may have been glare or photo shop of the cockpit and the picture was that of a takeoff or landing sequence, but in reality, the last moment.
As a rule, no racing or stunts above spectators. There is a "box" where those activities are performed. As for airshows, jets do turn over business/residential areas when they must. The lowest I have ever seen were when the F-22 came to Mather CA. For several years in a row they turned right over my house, three times per performance for three days.
About 150 feet high in full afterburner hard banked turn. I could see the pilot's helmet clearly, vapor cloud atop surfaces, shock waves in the flames and after it passed every car alarm in the area went off.
As a rule, no racing or stunts above spectators. There is a "box" where those activities are performed. As for airshows, jets do turn over business/residential areas when they must. The lowest I have ever seen were when the F-22 came to Mather CA. For several years in a row they turned right over my house, three times per performance for three days.
About 150 feet high in full afterburner hard banked turn. I could see the pilot's helmet clearly, vapor cloud atop surfaces, shock waves in the flames and after it passed every car alarm in the area went off.
09-18-2011, 07:53 AM
#28
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RE: A Bad Day at Reno
There are clear photos of the detaching trim tab. As to the cause of that, we await the NTSB metal analysis.
Re: spectators, it does appear there is no way to make them completely safe. We have lost spectators at auto races and drag races when cars went out of control.
I guess when you push a racing vhicle to the very edge of the envelope, things sometimes happen.
Tom
Re: spectators, it does appear there is no way to make them completely safe. We have lost spectators at auto races and drag races when cars went out of control.
I guess when you push a racing vhicle to the very edge of the envelope, things sometimes happen.
Tom
09-18-2011, 09:02 AM
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RE: A Bad Day at Reno
Couple Unaccounted For After Reno Air Race Crash
http://www.kirotv.com/news/29221836/...ihJYY.facebook
http://www.kirotv.com/news/29221836/...ihJYY.facebook
09-18-2011, 09:32 AM
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RE: A Bad Day at Reno
ORIGINAL: KW_Counter
Amish War Lord Stated:
I don't see where there is much you can do, they are flying over head and doing 400MPH.
Only safe seating would be 10 miles away in underground reinforced concrete bunkers.
Obiviously you have not been to the Reno Air Races (I have); when they are racing they do NOT
fly over the spectators heads. The only reason GG was overhead was because of the
problem he was facing!
I'm anxious to hear the NTSB's final report to know what happened to the best of their judgement.
KW_Counter
Amish War Lord Stated:
I don't see where there is much you can do, they are flying over head and doing 400MPH.
Only safe seating would be 10 miles away in underground reinforced concrete bunkers.
Obiviously you have not been to the Reno Air Races (I have); when they are racing they do NOT
fly over the spectators heads. The only reason GG was overhead was because of the
problem he was facing!
I'm anxious to hear the NTSB's final report to know what happened to the best of their judgement.
KW_Counter
I've been there but it was a year or two ago. LOL
09-18-2011, 10:02 AM
#34
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RE: A Bad Day at Reno
They would do the same thing over our old house in South Charlotte when they did fly over at the foot ball games.
ORIGINAL: freakingfast
stuntflyr had the most eloquent explanation I've seen. I saw the nose down photos and at first thought someone rotated the photo for dramatics, later found it to be ligit. I noticed first the tail wheel down and no pilot visable, I thought it may have been glare or photo shop of the cockpit and the picture was that of a takeoff or landing sequence, but in reality, the last moment.
As a rule, no racing or stunts above spectators. There is a ''box'' where those activities are performed. As for airshows, jets do turn over business/residential areas when they must. The lowest I have ever seen were when the F-22 came to Mather CA. For several years in a row they turned right over my house, three times per performance for three days.
About 150 feet high in full afterburner hard banked turn. I could see the pilot's helmet clearly, vapor cloud atop surfaces, shock waves in the flames and after it passed every car alarm in the area went off.
stuntflyr had the most eloquent explanation I've seen. I saw the nose down photos and at first thought someone rotated the photo for dramatics, later found it to be ligit. I noticed first the tail wheel down and no pilot visable, I thought it may have been glare or photo shop of the cockpit and the picture was that of a takeoff or landing sequence, but in reality, the last moment.
As a rule, no racing or stunts above spectators. There is a ''box'' where those activities are performed. As for airshows, jets do turn over business/residential areas when they must. The lowest I have ever seen were when the F-22 came to Mather CA. For several years in a row they turned right over my house, three times per performance for three days.
About 150 feet high in full afterburner hard banked turn. I could see the pilot's helmet clearly, vapor cloud atop surfaces, shock waves in the flames and after it passed every car alarm in the area went off.
09-18-2011, 04:14 PM
#36
Senior Member
RE: A Bad Day at Reno
The steam is normal for that plane. It uses a boil off cooling system and early in air photos on a better day showed the same steam.
Don
Don
09-19-2011, 12:25 AM
#37
RE: A Bad Day at Reno
http://www.aero-news.net/index.cfm?d...2-e56fa5bda288
"""""""""""""""""""""
An NTSB Briefing concluded late Sunday, with additional details, but it's obvious that they have dug in and are giving this matter very serious consideration. In addition to the many reports filed by ANN starting within minutes of the tragedy itself, we now know the following:
•The NTSB has recovered 'components' which may be part of the P-51's horizontal stab and elevator... possibly even the elevator trim tab, which is a specified point of inquiry (as noted in previous ANN reports).
•The NTSB has received a significant amount of photographic and video evidence some of which show the process whereby the elevator trim tab separated from the horizontal stabilizer.
•There is no evidence of the much-reported 'Mayday' call.
•The NTSB has completed the onsite portion of the investigation.
•Jimmy Leeward's Galloping Ghost had a telemetry system and cameras on board that fed memory cards as well as a transmitter that reported info to his support crew. NTSB learned about this while interviewing the crew. The ground data is in the hands of the NTSB and is being analyzed while memory cards found at the scene are being examined to see if they come from Leeward's "Galloping Ghost" and if they contain useful data. A great deal of physical evidence is being forwarded to NTSB labs in DC and elsewhere.
•The NTSB did make recommendations in 1972, as regards the issues of aircraft separation from crowds and populated locations. Those recommendations did result in 'acceptable' actions by the Reno Racing officials and that older matter is considered closed.
•A Preliminary Report is expected to be posted to the NTSB website by the end of this week. The Final Report, of course, will take considerably longer.
"""""""""""""""""""""
"""""""""""""""""""""
An NTSB Briefing concluded late Sunday, with additional details, but it's obvious that they have dug in and are giving this matter very serious consideration. In addition to the many reports filed by ANN starting within minutes of the tragedy itself, we now know the following:
•The NTSB has recovered 'components' which may be part of the P-51's horizontal stab and elevator... possibly even the elevator trim tab, which is a specified point of inquiry (as noted in previous ANN reports).
•The NTSB has received a significant amount of photographic and video evidence some of which show the process whereby the elevator trim tab separated from the horizontal stabilizer.
•There is no evidence of the much-reported 'Mayday' call.
•The NTSB has completed the onsite portion of the investigation.
•Jimmy Leeward's Galloping Ghost had a telemetry system and cameras on board that fed memory cards as well as a transmitter that reported info to his support crew. NTSB learned about this while interviewing the crew. The ground data is in the hands of the NTSB and is being analyzed while memory cards found at the scene are being examined to see if they come from Leeward's "Galloping Ghost" and if they contain useful data. A great deal of physical evidence is being forwarded to NTSB labs in DC and elsewhere.
•The NTSB did make recommendations in 1972, as regards the issues of aircraft separation from crowds and populated locations. Those recommendations did result in 'acceptable' actions by the Reno Racing officials and that older matter is considered closed.
•A Preliminary Report is expected to be posted to the NTSB website by the end of this week. The Final Report, of course, will take considerably longer.
"""""""""""""""""""""
09-19-2011, 03:34 PM
#41
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RE: A Bad Day at Reno
We are having an air show here in Houston in the middle of October. As much as I love avation , I don,t think I will be going. It,s just to soon with all of this stuff on my mind right now. If I do change my mind and go I.l be way the heck out on the road away from the show watching. Thats the cool thing about air shows. You can see the planes fly from far away. Man I sure feel sorry for all involved.
