warbird addict

Well all I can say is that if seeing things for what they are rather than what I'm being TOLD they are makes me a conspiracy theorist I'll gladly keep my tin hat thanks LOL

acerc

Does that mean we won't be getting our free healthcare? LOL

That's called sarcasm for those that don't know it!

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

OK, scrap the ethanol fuel "program" and redirect all that corn to food.
What are the short term effects of doing that..?
Corn prices drop below what is profitable for the farmers to operate. Some of the big, corporate farmers adapt, but the little guys suffer. I live where miles of corn is grown by "little guys" who look like they could use $10,000 worth of dental work and who drive old cars and live in run down farm houses. These are the guys who are barely able to support the local dairy and beef industry with what corn is worth. They work from sun up to sun down 365 days a year with huge expenditures and huge risk, yet they aren't getting rich. Last year's drought was the worst since before I was born, it was a historically bad year.
OPEC fossil fuel suppliers seize the opportunity to "teach" us an object lesson for daring to escape from their stranglehold on our dependance to them within 5 minutes after we scrap the ethanol program.

Long term effects of shutting down ethanol fuel.....
I shouldn't need to explain any of this to those who have been reading along and who are "adult enough" to know that new technology rarely comes along to hit a grand slam on opening day. Any movement that is made away from fossil fuel must be able to obey the laws of economics for the long term. This is a sad fact, but that is the truth about what it takes for a revolutionary commoditiy like ethanol based fuel to reach full marketable and practical status. It is my understanding that subsidies for ethanol production expire this year. Subsidies have been given a bad name, but they have historically proven to be of value to modern, civilized society to inspire progress in the area of science and discovery.
Brazil most likely had reached a point of economic desperation/ruin where fossil fuel costs reached an unliveable point in everyone's life for them to decide that ethanol based fuel was the way for them to go...?

warbird addict

E-10 is a wolf in sheeps clothing bottom line or you can choose to believe what the media tells you to believe you decide but when astronical amounts of money are involved don't believe for a second that the people who stand to make that money won't lie to you and tell you what you want to hear as they have a significant interest in your believing what they have to say and theres more to the story than what you are being told for obvious reasons known only to those who would have you believe it.
I've had people tell me grand stories wildly fabricated and intricate to screw me out of 20 bucks do you think for even an instant somebody including our Gov't and big oil wouldn't screw you for billions? and lie to your face about it?
Think again!!! The long con is getting you to believe they are acting in your best interest.

warbird addict

To those who would advocate the use of E-10 ask yourself has it's mandated use positively affected their ability to heat their homes, fuel their vehicles or feed their families or grow their buisnesses/ savings for the future , has it become easier or harder to do those things are we as a nation prospering or failing economicly as a result of it?
Has the world economy benefited from it ? not from what I'm seeing but then again I tend to be a realist and not a "blind conformist", no I generally tend to ask myslef why would somebody tell me this and whats in it for them and make up my own mind and where that much money is concerned in all cases you're going to be the one to take it in the shorts if you you believe what you are being TOLD to believe by those who would stand to profit from your believing it.
Believe what you want but it all boils down to how month is left at the end of the money as to whether or not it's a good thing or a bad thing

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Do you really think that a revolutionary alternative to burning gasoline should/could materialize out of thin air without some people getting rich off of it..?
Yes or No
Are you really blaming America's devolving family structure and values, lower education standards, loss of jobs to overseas workers, humongous tax burden to pay off/appease our welfare culture, increase law enforcement, etc. on E10..?
Yes or No
I own quite a few gasoline powered implements that only get seldom use and rarely have any trouble with them. I never use stabilizers and rarely do I ever experience stale fuel in any of them. You can smell it when it goes bad, it smells like varnish/shellac. Over the years I've had to de-gunk a couple carburetors and run fine music wire through some tiny passages...just like anyone before my time who has ever let gasoline powered equipment sit too long.
This thread is timely because it reminds me to go fire up my tiller, leaf blower, weed eater, chain saw, lawn tractor, pressure washer, generator, farm tractor and an old truck I use 10-20 times a year.

KaP2011

My Feedback: (17)

There's another player in the ethanol game that is also making huge profit from it, bigM. I won't say there name because they'vewent after the little guymany times in the past.It's only possible to grow corn at the rate they do because of GMO corn.

Sport_Pilot

Ethanol works fine if your car is set up for it. So cars made after 2000 or so should be fine. However the cost and fuel millage make gasoline much better. I suspect the envrionmental issue for ethanol is a hoax as well.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Yeah, I "spilled the beans" once at an AG forum about Monsanto's "terminal genetics" and they dispatched a flat black helicopter to my place that flew a grid pattern over my crops, dousing them with gamma rays and Agent Orange.......[8D]

Sport_Pilot

That is true. But also the higher the peak temperture the higher the efficiency. The higher compression raises the peak temperature which is another plus for high compression. BTW ethanol allows higher compression (than lower than 100 octane gas), but has a lower peak combustion temperature, thus less efficiency.

Sport_Pilot

Nothing is here to stay. I am expecting a huge energy revolution in a decade or so. We will be using electric motors without batteries someday.

Sport_Pilot

He is no longer on Fox. At one time he was on CNN, so what does Fox have to do with this?

Sport_Pilot

I have been using E10 for about 20 years and just replaced my Honda HR21 about 3 years ago. I bought it in 1981. So buy good equipment made for the fuel and you won't have these problems. It sounds like you may need a fuel filter.

Sport_Pilot

Yeah, a lot of poor quality equipment is not made for ethanol. Buy Honda and the better Briggs and Stratton stuff and you haveno problems.

Sport_Pilot

If you buy equipment with good seals and gas caps, to include the gas can,this won't happen. For equipment with vented caps, put some tape on the vent before storing. That is where the water is getting in, especially on the cheaper equipment.

Sport_Pilot

Why not grow cotton instead of corn? Or wheat, flax, strawberries, etc.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

[link]http://rtec-rtp.org/2012/10/16/the-high-compression-gambit/[/link]

This article goes into what it takes to optimize an engine for alky based fuel.

topspin

Abso;utely,

HighPlains

My Feedback: (1)

Interesting article CP.

MIT has a professor that has done some work on direct injection of ethanol in high compression engines to prevent knocking at high compression. Ford has been working with him on the technology.

I have also noticed that the Honda Fit has a long stroke engine, 73 mm bore and 89.4 mm stroke which goes against the last 60 years of automobile engine design. That should get the last little bit of thermo energy out of fuel with the extra expansion of gases.

josonalico

I've always bought my gas for my planes from  I think it's time I start buying all my gas from now on from them. 

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

It's pretty amazing to see what design engineers are able to come up with today with all the rapid prototyping equipment and decades worth of solid knowledge to launch new ideas. The need for camshafts, massive valves and other engine driven components that require wasted HP to actuate will go bye-bye someday. HP wasting cooling of present day cast iron and cast aluminum parts will get phased out eventually with higher temp materials.
The long and skinny cylinder makes sense for high compression. You can fire it sooner giving the expanding gases more time to exert a more steady push against the piston and more time to complete the combustion process with less unburned gas getting farted out the exhaust.
Engine dynamicists would need to know the practical limits of extreme rod / stroke ratios and how to cope with any longevity issues.

KaP2011

My Feedback: (17)

Oooooo, you said the M word, you gonna be in trouble now.

warbird addict

Revolutionary alternative to burning gasoline ?????? No I think it's a revolutionary way for Big Gov't and Big OIL to lie to us about the REAL reason for our having to burn this garbage.
I'm in agreement with you in the matter of welfare and other such handouts , however The piss poor decisions that our Gov't makes which only serve to further make our dollar weaker and our day to day survival more and more expensive so much so that there has been a very distinct degredation in class standing wherein the former lower middle class have become sub poverty level and very much in need of such handouts to survive as well there are those and many of them who take absolute advantage of them, but I've also seen and witnessed a major influx of foreign nationals imported by our own Gov't namely Somalians who are handed EVERYTHING, food ,housing, utilities, transportation, multi trillion dollar complexes built for them, which only further drives up we the taxpayers burden ,so lets not blame it all on our LAZY'S that don't want to work, the economy is such that hiring is down and buisness closures and layoffs are up, mortgages are failing, banks and auto mfgrs "the backbone our industry" are failing and yet Big Gov"t devises yet another "SCHEME" designed to take yet more of our money by handing us E-10 which has proven to do nothing more than further drive up our day to day cost of living across the board,"POPULAR OPINION" and it has been clearly advocated by "SOME" naive people that E-10 is a means to reduce our dependancy on foreign oil ? BY FORCING us to make yet even more trips to the pump by writing into law that we pollute our fuel with something that makes us burn 25% more of it.
In the 60's a man invented a gasoline vapor system that would drive a 4200 pound vehicle over 100 miles on a gallon of gas, the technology was bought and buried by Shell oil co.
That man followed up and became very vocal in the media about why his technology wasn't being developed and marketed by Shell oil co. , he was later found dead in his car beside the road of mysterious causes
The very same technology was picked up by another man and improved upon in the 70's when he went public with it, "He was told told shut his mouth and play along or his and his families safety couldn't be guaranteed and this was told to him by a public official only after it was obvious that he and his family were being closely watched by obviously Gov't pepole in an obviously gov't vehicle did he strip the vehicle of it's revolutionary fuel saving technology and sold it did he finally get left alone , in the videotaped interview he stated very clearly that it was in fact the Gov't that was watching him and he was very definitely scared for his and his families welfare, my point is if this technology existed as far back as the 60's where they were able to get over 100 mpg then why is it that we are now being sold a "BILL OF GOODS" that has us forced to use something that nets us less than 12 MPG in the same basic V-8 engine? $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ maybe!!!!!! yeh that sounds like a much better explanation to me than all of the other sheeple believe everything they are Told explanations I've been offered so far , hey everybody is entitled to believe what they want, but unless you do some real digging your making a half informed decision on what to believe, it's been my experience that "POPULAR OPINION " and the easy explanation are never the way to bet your future.

HighPlains

My Feedback: (1)

There is a good reason for GMO corn. It allows plants to tollerate drought better, kill some pests without having to use pestasides that would kill good insects, and adapt better to different soil types and climates. Without that and chemical fertilizers, the world's population would have topped out at about 2 billion, mostly starving people. Fortunately a German chemist (Fritz Haber) learned how to make NH3 (anydrous ammonia), and Carl Bosch figured out how to make it at a industrial scale. about a century ago. Of course all that German ability with chemistry also helped them make nitrates for explosives and later chemical weapons.

NH3 is made from natural gas (CH4), since that is an easy source of hydrogen. I think NH3 could also be the solution to the Hydrogen Society, as it is easy to store as a liquid, and is transported by pipe underground in our existing infrastucture. It also contains 50% more hydrogen than H2, so only a fuel cell that works with NH3 is the only thing keeping electric cars off the road. Battery technology will never get there to supplant liquid fuels. There was even a pickup truck that was set up to run on a mixture of gasoline and NH3 vapor by a university a couple of years ago.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

I think almost everbody knows someone who claims...

...to have been decorated with a bunch of medals..
...to have seen guys on guard duty routinely put .45s to their head, then pull the trigger
...to have owned 190 mph, 190 hp motor bikes but for some reason forget why they sold isuch epic machinery just 3 years earlier.
...to have been called by a motorcycle dealer to drop everything and try to talk a 18 year old kid's father out of buying him a 190 mph bike for him..because the father kept calling it a "toy" and that it was undoubtedly a "death sentence" that the dealer had no power to stop on his own.
...to have the inside scoop on how the inventor of the 100 mpg engine was murdered by "Big Oil".
Sorry Guy, but there's a definite "credibility gap" forming here.