Register

If this is your first visit, please click the Sign Up now button to begin the process of creating your account so you can begin posting on our forums! The Sign Up process will only take up about a minute of two of your time.

Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst ... 2345 LastLast
Results 76 to 100 of 123

Thread: ethanol


  1. #76

    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Elizabethtown, NY
    Posts
    332
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    As far as our devolving family structure goes , from what i see the providers of said families are having to work more and more and more hours each week just in order to survive and provide for their children in the face of a ten fold increase in the cost of living due to VERY POOR decisions made by our Gov't and designed to take more money out of the pockets of already struggling families and put it their own pockets, which as i said forces the providers of said families to work more hours and spend less time with their families and have less of a positive influence on their children which are left to let their brains rot with video games and cell phones and computers and such , kids nowadays have no interest in going outside to play or go fishing or engaging in school activities no they are very much desocialized and thats due purely due to the fact that todays parents are completely immersed and swamped just trying to cope and survive and provide food and shelter for their children in an alarmingly declining economy.
    I'm not a parent of dependant children but I can tell you this I've worked 100 plus hours a week EVERY week since I was 15 years old I'm now 48 and what i see is , as of late it's not enough to survive anymore let alone prosper to the point where I can save for my own retirement let alone provide for a house full of dependants.
    Anybody who is Numb enough to advocate anything that nets them a staggering increase in their day to day cost of living is only slitting their own throats as well as everybody elses and shouldn't be allowed to vote as those who stand to benefit from your gullability plan on sticking it to the rest of us in the process!!!
    \"Q\" If you could have one super power what would it be?
    \"A\" The ability to leap tall blondes without them screaming

  2. #77

    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Over da rainbow, KS
    Posts
    4,817
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    multi trillion dollar complexes
    I don't think that most people know what a trillion dollars is. If you piled a trillion dollars in million dollar stacks, how many stacks would you have?
    - Supplementary insipid innocuous inane vacuous proclamation

  3. #78
    JollyPopper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Mountain Home, AR
    Posts
    2,147
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    This subject comes up periodically and always with the same results. There are the naysayers who wave their reports and studies saying how bad ethanol in gasoline is, and they show pictures and give examples of what this stuff does if left in a container or carburtor for a long period of time. Then you have the other side who claims the stuff is the best thing since sex and they know this because they have 14 or so vehicles that have untold hundreds of thousands of miles on them and only get used a half dozen times a year so there are long periods of time between starts and they never have ever had a fuel related problem. I guess you could argue with the reports and studies because that is impersonal, but you can't argue with the guys who have a half million miles on their 1994 vehicle and there is a lot of idle time on them because they only use them a couple times a year to haul up a 1,000 lb. hay bale from the back forty. For you guys who really like this stuff, you can buy it. Why not add a few gallons to your tank before you fill up? If a little bit is good, more ought to be better. Right?[:'(]
    \"In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice; In practice, there is\"

    Intolerance is not to be tolerated

  4. #79

    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Elizabethtown, NY
    Posts
    332
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    "CP" you should follow your own conspiracy theory and take a really long hard look in the mirror my friend you may be less traveled and isolated from the real world on your lil 100 acre lot but the rest of us are not.
    As far as a credibility gap goes would you really like me to provide intimate details and further drive home my point that your about a big bag of hot air and your claims have ZERO basis to discredit me because I disagree with you, as i'd be absolutely happy to see you fall flat on your face and in a public forum.
    Once Again your tactics are lame and predictable when you cannot Explain away something you don't agree with you resort to personal attacks WOW not like I didn't see that one coming, I was wondering what took you so long to resort to your "TRUE COLOR" and less than respectable charachter attacks !!! Disappointing at best !!!
    \"Q\" If you could have one super power what would it be?
    \"A\" The ability to leap tall blondes without them screaming

  5. #80

    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Sterling, VA
    Posts
    883
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol


    ORIGINAL: HighPlains

    Interesting article CP.

    MIT has a professor that has done some work on direct injection of ethanol in high compression engines to prevent knocking at high compression. Ford has been working with him on the technology.

    I have also noticed that the Honda Fit has a long stroke engine, 73 mm bore and 89.4 mm stroke which goes against the last 60 years of automobile engine design. That should get the last little bit of thermo energy out of fuel with the extra expansion of gases.
    Because water binds with Ethanol to some extent water can be used as an anti-knock compound and the water vapor increases power output buy providing steam pressure in the cylinder.
    RC Aircraft/ Three Laws Safe.

  6. #81

    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Over da rainbow, KS
    Posts
    4,817
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    If a little bit is good, more ought to be better. Right?
    Funny you should mention that, because there have been some testing with flex-fuel vehicles that show fuel in the E20 to E30 percentages give better mileage that what they can account for from the BTU content alone. If the compression ratio was raised, I would expect that, but flex-fuel has to be able to run on E0 gas too.
    - Supplementary insipid innocuous inane vacuous proclamation

  7. #82

    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Over da rainbow, KS
    Posts
    4,817
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    Because water binds with Ethanol to some extent water can be used as an anti-knock compound and the water vapor increases power output buy providing steam pressure in the cylinder.
    Water vapor does slow down the flame front, thus helping with knocking. Several WWII fighters used methanol/water mixes to increase power at high altitudes. It's not so much steam presure, but rather more mass that does the work.

    In model engines, nitro will burn in air fuel mixtures that straight methanol will not support. It is the extra mass of fuel (nitro is heavy) that gives the extra power. Most of my 65% nitro engines required the needle valve to be turned out 1 full turn over the setting for 15% fuel. At that setting, a .40 sized engine ran 3 oz of fuel per minute where a .60 sized sport engine normally is about 1 oz/minute.

    - Supplementary insipid innocuous inane vacuous proclamation

  8. #83

    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Over da rainbow, KS
    Posts
    4,817
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    Anybody watching tonights episode of "boys and men"? 7 to 35!
    - Supplementary insipid innocuous inane vacuous proclamation

  9. #84
    combatpigg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    arlington, WA
    Posts
    17,678
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol


    ORIGINAL: warbird addict

    ''CP'' you should follow your own conspiracy theory and take a really long hard look in the mirror my friend you may be less traveled and isolated from the real world on your lil 100 acre lot but the rest of us are not.
    As far as a credibility gap goes would you really like me to provide intimate details and further drive home my point that your about a big bag of hot air and your claims have ZERO basis to discredit me because I disagree with you, as i'd be absolutely happy to see you fall flat on your face and in a public forum.
    Once Again your tactics are lame and predictable when you cannot Explain away something you don't agree with you resort to personal attacks WOW not like I didn't see that one coming, I was wondering what took you so long to resort to your ''TRUE COLOR'' and less than respectable charachter attacks !!! Disappointing at best !!!
    Those "high lights" of your past, most recent posts aren't personal attacks, they are just high lights of some your most notable "handy work" here. Just to keep recent viewers of this forum up to date.
    Yes, I WOULD like to see you further discredit my claims by providing your "intimate" details..[8D]
    WHO GUNNA FEED MAW KEEEIDS..???

  10. #85
    combatpigg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    arlington, WA
    Posts
    17,678
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol


    ORIGINAL: warbird addict

    As far as our devolving family structure goes , from what i see the providers of said families are having to work more and more and more hours each week just in order to survive and provide for their children in the face of a ten fold increase in the cost of living due to VERY POOR decisions made by our Gov't and designed to take more money out of the pockets of already struggling families and put it their own pockets, which as i said forces the providers of said families to work more hours and spend less time with their families and have less of a positive influence on their children which are left to let their brains rot with video games and cell phones and computers and such , kids nowadays have no interest in going outside to play or go fishing or engaging in school activities no they are very much desocialized and thats due purely due to the fact that todays parents are completely immersed and swamped just trying to cope and survive and provide food and shelter for their children in an alarmingly declining economy.
    I'm not a parent of dependant children but I can tell you this I've worked 100 plus hours a week EVERY week since I was 15 years old I'm now 48 and what i see is , as of late it's not enough to survive anymore let alone prosper to the point where I can save for my own retirement let alone provide for a house full of dependants.
    Anybody who is Numb enough to advocate anything that nets them a staggering increase in their day to day cost of living is only slitting their own throats as well as everybody elses and shouldn't be allowed to vote as those who stand to benefit from your gullability plan on sticking it to the rest of us in the process!!!
    I would love to see the look on my Great Grandfather's, Grandfather's and my Dad's face if you were to bleat this story about your hardships and for why our society has degraded to them.
    Last week you claimed to work 80 hour weeks your whole life...now it's 100...?
    WHO GUNNA FEED MAW KEEEIDS..???

  11. #86
    combatpigg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    arlington, WA
    Posts
    17,678
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol


    ORIGINAL: JollyPopper

    This subject comes up periodically and always with the same results. There are the naysayers who wave their reports and studies saying how bad ethanol in gasoline is, and they show pictures and give examples of what this stuff does if left in a container or carburtor for a long period of time. Then you have the other side who claims the stuff is the best thing since sex and they know this because they have 14 or so vehicles that have untold hundreds of thousands of miles on them and only get used a half dozen times a year so there are long periods of time between starts and they never have ever had a fuel related problem. I guess you could argue with the reports and studies because that is impersonal, but you can't argue with the guys who have a half million miles on their 1994 vehicle and there is a lot of idle time on them because they only use them a couple times a year to haul up a 1,000 lb. hay bale from the back forty. For you guys who really like this stuff, you can buy it. Why not add a few gallons to your tank before you fill up? If a little bit is good, more ought to be better. Right?[:'(]
    I've never claimed that ethanol is better than straight gasoline. If I had it my way, I'd have an unlimited supply of pure Sunoco High Test that I could use to top off a L88 427 that has a pair of 750s on a tunnel ram...for my daily driver.
    As for the Jeep with 330,000 miles, it got used everyday up until I retired. Last year it only got 5000 miles put on it, though.
    WHO GUNNA FEED MAW KEEEIDS..???

  12. #87

    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Over da rainbow, KS
    Posts
    4,817
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    CP, did you know that October is national black helicopter month?
    - Supplementary insipid innocuous inane vacuous proclamation

  13. #88

    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Elizabethtown, NY
    Posts
    332
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    #1
    My service decorations include the Navy Sea Service, Navy Unit Commendation, Meritorious unit commendation ,Navy expeditionary as well as some others I can't remember
    Be happy to serve you up my DD214 along with a heaping helping Crow for you to digest right along along with it!!!
    #2
    The guys name was Petty Officer Second Class David Marks "ET2" we were both Asroc Guards Stationed aboard The USS R L Page FFG-5 built in 64 and comissioned in 65 at Bath Iron Works Bath Maine originally designated as DEG-5 and #5 of 5 Brooke Class Frigates i'll be happy to look up his info from the Page Crewlist website and with his permission pass it along to you so that you can ask him for yourself about the incidents in question!!! if you still need more convincing.
    #3 an 4
    I've owned MANY , MANY just such motorcycles to name a few 99 FZR 1000 , 99 YZF R-1, 04 954 RR, 05 ZX10, 07 YZF R-1 most of them were bought from a guy named Gil at CENTRAL MAINE POWERSPORTS in Lewiston MAINE their #is 207-689-2345 feel free to call them and speak with gil and ask him about the guy from Lisbon who just sold his LOADED M109r and what kind of bikes he builds and rides while you're at it ask him about the 07 race prep R-1 I traded in and about the kid who got killed on it and whether or not he asked me to come in and talk to the kids father about it being a bad decision. if I havent bloodied your nose enough already.
    #5
    There is ample information available on the subject matter of vapor fueled vehicles making 100 plus MPG and how the technology was squashed and erased from recent memory by big oil, but I'll bet you cannot see it from up there on that "HIGH HORSE" of yours

    ORIGINAL: combatpigg

    I think almost everbody knows someone who claims...

    ...to have been decorated with a bunch of medals..
    ...to have seen guys on guard duty routinely put .45s to their head, then pull the trigger
    ...to have owned 190 mph, 190 hp motor bikes but for some reason forget why they sold isuch epic machinery just 3 years earlier.
    ...to have been called by a motorcycle dealer to drop everything and try to talk a 18 year old kid's father out of buying him a 190 mph bike for him..because the father kept calling it a ''toy'' and that it was undoubtedly a ''death sentence'' that the dealer had no power to stop on his own.
    ...to have the inside scoop on how the inventor of the 100 mpg engine was murdered by ''Big Oil''.
    Sorry Guy, but there's a definite ''credibility gap'' forming here.
    \"Q\" If you could have one super power what would it be?
    \"A\" The ability to leap tall blondes without them screaming

  14. #89
    Sport_Pilot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Acworth, GA
    Posts
    13,375
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol


    ORIGINAL: HighPlains

    Interesting article CP.

    MIT has a professor that has done some work on direct injection of ethanol in high compression engines to prevent knocking at high compression. Ford has been working with him on the technology.

    I have also noticed that the Honda Fit has a long stroke engine, 73 mm bore and 89.4 mm stroke which goes against the last 60 years of automobile engine design. That should get the last little bit of thermo energy out of fuel with the extra expansion of gases.

    Long strokes don't improve expansion of gas, the ratio of expansion is the same for both long and short stroke. What it can do is to make it easier to attain a high compression ratio with plenty of clearance for valves without use of pop up pistons. This is the main reason diesels have long strokes. Not for torque nor for expansion.
    Glow Head Brotherhood #15

  15. #90

    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Elizabethtown, NY
    Posts
    332
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    Do I need to back up my work history with payroll records and rub your nose in that too? or have you had enough yet?




    ORIGINAL: combatpigg


    ORIGINAL: warbird addict

    As far as our devolving family structure goes , from what i see the providers of said families are having to work more and more and more hours each week just in order to survive and provide for their children in the face of a ten fold increase in the cost of living due to VERY POOR decisions made by our Gov't and designed to take more money out of the pockets of already struggling families and put it their own pockets, which as i said forces the providers of said families to work more hours and spend less time with their families and have less of a positive influence on their children which are left to let their brains rot with video games and cell phones and computers and such , kids nowadays have no interest in going outside to play or go fishing or engaging in school activities no they are very much desocialized and thats due purely due to the fact that todays parents are completely immersed and swamped just trying to cope and survive and provide food and shelter for their children in an alarmingly declining economy.
    I'm not a parent of dependant children but I can tell you this I've worked 100 plus hours a week EVERY week since I was 15 years old I'm now 48 and what i see is , as of late it's not enough to survive anymore let alone prosper to the point where I can save for my own retirement let alone provide for a house full of dependants.
    Anybody who is Numb enough to advocate anything that nets them a staggering increase in their day to day cost of living is only slitting their own throats as well as everybody elses and shouldn't be allowed to vote as those who stand to benefit from your gullability plan on sticking it to the rest of us in the process!!!
    I would love to see the look on my Great Grandfather's, Grandfather's and my Dad's face if you were to bleat this story about your hardships and for why our society has degraded to them.
    Last week you claimed to work 80 hour weeks your whole life...now it's 100...?
    \"Q\" If you could have one super power what would it be?
    \"A\" The ability to leap tall blondes without them screaming

  16. #91
    combatpigg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    arlington, WA
    Posts
    17,678
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    ORIGINAL: warbird addict
    Hate to be skeptical but it's been my experience having served in a combat zone that what's in the best interests of big gov't will get you killed and from what I've seen their philosphy is no different concerning the civilian sector, big gov't has and always will protect it's own survival ahead of and before yours and mine, been there done that and have the medals to prove it.
    I know about the award criteria for those medals and they don't qualify your opinion above anyone else's and they sure as heck don't mean you had to do anything other than your basic duty as a soldier [sailor].
    Here you are again ranting against someone besides me, referring to the time you spent onboard the USS RL PAGE as your "trump card....[8D]".......
    ...Dude I tried to add something constructive but you have to once again take it off topic and start with the name calling crap so heres my final reply, shut your mouth you're a punk plain and simple , I'm nobody's F@#$%n mother I think my DD214 will clearly drive that point home! Mouthpiece! people like you are a pimple on the ***** of people trying to accomplish something here who are using this forum as it was intended and have some kind of an input that gets heard by big buisness, so save your childish ***** name calling nonsense for when you're face to face with me....

    warbird addict
    12/21/2012 10:26 PM
    Status: online Sorry what did I miss I was busy mixing up a batch of beer brew so I can wait six months to drink it LOL You've got a pretty polluted sense of the world my friend , My freezer is full of Deer meat, my bills are paid, I work over 80 hours a week ....
    Which version of "the truth" is it..? 100 hours EVERY single week since you were 15 is a far cry from 80+. Plus that post time was about 1:30 AM your time..hmmm, interesting.


    ORIGINAL: warbird addict comments in "Models are not toys" thread.........
    I was in the service with a guy who use to take the 45 from the guy he relieved on watch and put it to his head and pull the trigger with the assumption that the guy he relieved hadn't loaded it or played with it or left a round in the chamber ultimate show of trust until one night the weapon went BOOM luckily missing him with the round ricocheting all around the metal bulkheads damned near killing them both......
    This is one of those urban legend stories that I'll bet many have heard various versions of. I'm sure PO2 Marks would back you up on this whopper if you paid him enough. I'm not so sure if the ship's commander would though.
    It looks more like you fabricated this story to try to drive home a point about dangerous things being treated like toys.
    Your motorcycle story [that you submitted to drive home your same message about RC models not being toys] just doesn't pass the "smell test" either. What were the odds that you work 100 hours per week [7 days per week @ 14 hours per day] but were somehow able to dash on down to the bike dealership at the drop of a hat to try to save the boy's life..? What were the odds that a seasoned and experienced bike builder and seller needed your assistance anyway..? What are the odds that he took the father's money anyway after having wasted your valuable 100 hour per week time to talk him out of the sale..? What are the odds that you wouldn't be able to remember why you sold this bike just 3 years ago when you've only owned a handful of these special road racers..? What are the odds that only 10 days later the boy would have killed himself on that bike..?
    Just wow, man.
    As for that phone number......
    I could furnish you with a phone number that will give you a guy at the other end who will swear I made Evil Knievel's jump for him across the Grande Canyon and that the bike was confiscated after the jump by GIBs because it was equipped with one of those "vapor carburetors" The jump would have been successful, but the GIB's hit the machine with a magnetic pulse that spoiled it's trajectory.........[8D]
    If all your stories are the absolute truth, then you could charge Stephan Spielberg to hang out with you.
    WHO GUNNA FEED MAW KEEEIDS..???

  17. #92
    Sport_Pilot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Acworth, GA
    Posts
    13,375
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    The 100 and 200 MPG carb story has many versions of the story and sometimes include people swapping out the carb without the owners permission while sitting in the drive. These stories actually evolve from an actual even in the 30's for a carb that supposedly vaporized the fuel. While pre vaporizing the fuel will get some added efficiency it will not be near 100 MPG and actually less than the present day fuel injection. Even so the design was proven to not even work, as there was a flaw in the design. There were various fake testomonials of these exageratedhigh MPG claims that were semply not true. Also, especially in the 30's there was no reason car manufactures would suppress such technology. And it would surely have been used in WWII if it had worked. I think the Ford's and Rockefeller's were enemies, and doubt they would have colaborated on such a ruse. See the link below to see what snopes says about this.

    http://www.snopes.com/autos/business/carburetor.asp
    Glow Head Brotherhood #15

  18. #93
    JollyPopper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Mountain Home, AR
    Posts
    2,147
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    "Various fake testimonials"? Hobby King wasn't around in the '30s, were they?
    \"In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice; In practice, there is\"

    Intolerance is not to be tolerated

  19. #94
    combatpigg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    arlington, WA
    Posts
    17,678
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot


    ORIGINAL: HighPlains

    Interesting article CP.

    MIT has a professor that has done some work on direct injection of ethanol in high compression engines to prevent knocking at high compression. Ford has been working with him on the technology.

    I have also noticed that the Honda Fit has a long stroke engine, 73 mm bore and 89.4 mm stroke which goes against the last 60 years of automobile engine design. That should get the last little bit of thermo energy out of fuel with the extra expansion of gases.

    Long strokes don't improve expansion of gas, the ratio of expansion is the same for both long and short stroke.* What it can do is to make it easier to attain a high compression ratio with plenty of clearance for valves without use of pop up pistons.* This is the main reason diesels have long strokes.* Not for torque nor for expansion.
    The long stroke gives the expanded gas more time to push against the piston. Stroke [length] is what you plug into the formula to find torque, no..?
    WHO GUNNA FEED MAW KEEEIDS..???

  20. #95
    Sport_Pilot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Acworth, GA
    Posts
    13,375
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    The long stroke gives the expanded gas more time to push against the piston. Stroke [length] is what you plug into the formula to find torque, no..?
    The piston is pushed for the same amount of time for a long stroke as a short stroke. That is totally determined by the RPM not the stroke. For torque you will find that this is the stroke times the pressure on the pistion. For a given stroke and the same displacement the long stroke will have less pressure, but a longer stroke so the torque will be exactly the same. However a long stroke has more friction loss, and poor breathing due to smaller valve or port areas, thus it will turn slower and must be timed for better torque. Thus the myth that you must go to a longer stroke to improve torque. That and the fact that diesels tend to have longer stroke, but that is give more clearance for the valves at a very high compression ratio.
    Glow Head Brotherhood #15

  21. #96
    combatpigg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    arlington, WA
    Posts
    17,678
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot

    The long stroke gives the expanded gas more time to push against the piston. Stroke [length] is what you plug into the formula to find torque, no..?
    The piston is pushed for the same amount of time for a long stroke as a short stroke.* That is totally determined by the RPM not the stroke.* For torque you will find that this is the stroke times the pressure on the pistion.* For a given stroke and the same displacement the long stroke will have less pressure, but a longer stroke so the torque will be exactly the same.** However a long stroke has more friction loss, and poor breathing due to smaller valve or port areas, thus it will turn slower and must be timed for better torque.* Thus the myth that you must go to a longer stroke to improve torque.* That and the fact that diesels tend to have longer stroke, but that is give more clearance for the valves at a very high compression ratio.
    The short stroke makes it's best power at much higher RPM than the long stroke design to be able to produce the same power. The short stroke simply leaves less time for the air moving in and out to complete their cycles versus long stroke. I doubt Mazdas' engineers would settle on the long stroke design for alky fuel unless they felt it was the most efficient way to extract the most power.
    WHO GUNNA FEED MAW KEEEIDS..???

  22. #97

    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Posts
    4,060
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    I haven't read the whole thread, and probably will not. I have always thought it was not a good idea to use a food crop to produce fuel. However, there is a lot of research going on on biofuels. I look at a site, Science Daily Magazine, which publishes press releases, and the like, about scientific research. There are processes which take CO2 and make a fuel much like gasoline, for example.

    I scanned an article in the local paper which gave figures to show that there are more green jobs in the USA than fossil fuel jobs. I think they included organic farmers on the one hand, and the guy who sells you your beer and cigarettes at the convenience store on the other hand. Regardless, in a couple of years the USA will be the world's largest fossil fuel producer.

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0107171707.htm
    Here is an example, where genetically engineered bluegree algae are producing good stuff.

  23. #98
    Sport_Pilot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Acworth, GA
    Posts
    13,375
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol


    ORIGINAL: combatpigg


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot

    The long stroke gives the expanded gas more time to push against the piston. Stroke [length] is what you plug into the formula to find torque, no..?
    The piston is pushed for the same amount of time for a long stroke as a short stroke. That is totally determined by the RPM not the stroke. For torque you will find that this is the stroke times the pressure on the pistion. For a given stroke and the same displacement the long stroke will have less pressure, but a longer stroke so the torque will be exactly the same. However a long stroke has more friction loss, and poor breathing due to smaller valve or port areas, thus it will turn slower and must be timed for better torque. Thus the myth that you must go to a longer stroke to improve torque. That and the fact that diesels tend to have longer stroke, but that is give more clearance for the valves at a very high compression ratio.
    The short stroke makes it's best power at much higher RPM than the long stroke design to be able to produce the same power. The short stroke simply leaves less time for the air moving in and out to complete their cycles versus long stroke. I doubt Mazdas' engineers would settle on the long stroke design for alky fuel unless they felt it was the most efficient way to extract the most power.
    That is simply a function of the fact that a short stoke engine has more room for bigger valves and ports, thus better breathing at high RPM. Also less friction because of slower piston speeds. Set up for the same timing as a slower higher torque but longer stroke engine, the short stroke engine will be havethe same or very slightly higher torque than the long stroke. Very slightly better because of less ring friction.
    Glow Head Brotherhood #15

  24. #99

    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Over da rainbow, KS
    Posts
    4,817
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    I have always thought it was not a good idea to use a food crop to produce fuel. However, there is a lot of research going on on biofuels.
    All fuels are biofuels, but at a very long time scale. At our present level of technology only ethanol is ready for volume production, and even to get to this point ethanol has taken about 25 to 30 years. Others like algae are decades away from large scale production, due to problems with growing the specific types (there are about 3000 varities) that produces oil, learning how to stress the algae to make the oil, and worst problem of all is the extraction of the oil without expensive dangerous chemicals. No doubt GMO algae will play a significant part of energy production - someday, but not very soon.

    I calculated the total amount of oil used in the past 140 years of the oil age. 1.1 Trillion barrels (1100 billion barrels), or just 42 cubic miles of oil. Spread over the entire Earth's surface it only amounts to 0.0135" or slight more than the thickness of 3 sheets of copier paper. Virtually nothing in other words.

    Look at the annual energy consumption of the entire world, and realize that all of the energy has come from the sun, sometimes over millions of years. Ever wonder how long it takes the Sun to produce that amount of energy?

    About 500 pS, or the length of time it takes light to travel 6 inches (at 186,000 miles/second).
    - Supplementary insipid innocuous inane vacuous proclamation

  25. #100
    combatpigg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    arlington, WA
    Posts
    17,678
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: ethanol

    HP, are you saying that only 6 seconds worth of the Sun's total output was needed to grow the bio mass that decomposed into oil, the energy it took to recover that amount [42 cubic miles] and then the amount of energy that got released when the oil eventually got used..?
    42 cubic miles seems like a ridiculously small area.
    I've heard the same about the cubic area of all the gold that has ever been found...IIRC it would fit inside a 20x20x20 meter cube...which sounds way too small to me.
    WHO GUNNA FEED MAW KEEEIDS..???


Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst ... 2345 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:28 PM.

SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.