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RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

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RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

Old 01-24-2004, 10:32 AM
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Loopman
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Default RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

I guess P.T.Barnum said it best;"You can fool some of the people all of the time and all of the people some of the time." That is the apparent credo of 95% of the reviews in all of the RC rags except "R/C Reports", Gordon Banks and the rest of his crew are the "Paul Harvey's" of RC. Case in point - Erick Royer corresponded with me prior to doing the review on the Giant Scale Planes Corsair. I told him about all of the problems I had with the fibreglass bubbling in the sun, the weak spar problem and the nasty customer service I had from Irwin and his crew at GSP. When all was said and done he still produced a glowing review of the plane! I'm confidant that his review caused many to buy that plane and eventally suffer the same problems I did.

The best reviews unfortunately come from those of us who purchase these planes and become the "beta testers". We learn from each other what is garbage and what is "a keeper". The wealth of knowledge on this site transcends any magazine review.

Happy Flying!

LOOPMAN
Old 01-24-2004, 10:42 AM
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tailskid
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

BUT.....did Erick's plane have the same problems as yours?

Jerry
Old 01-24-2004, 10:47 AM
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Jerry Sigur
 
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

Well, let's face it, the magazines aren't going to trash an advertiser's
product and face possible loss of advertising dollars. The only mag
with any credibility is R/C Reports. Only reason to buy the other mags
is to get the latest advertisements.
And yes, having other modelers from all over the world withwhom
to exchange ideas and experiences is a wonderful and enormous
resource.

Jerry
Old 01-24-2004, 10:55 AM
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Loopman
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

Well,
Let's see, the plane came from the same manufacturer, same distributor! I am not alone in suffering the same problems as many others with this same plane! When a reviewer makes statements like "GSP really did their homework on this model..." and "Well constructed fibreglass fuselage, wing center section and cowl" that to me say's he is selling a product not actually doing an honest review.

Happy Flying!

LOOPMAN [>:]
Old 01-24-2004, 11:05 AM
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tailskid
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

Have you discussed this with him? With the editor?

Jerry
Old 01-24-2004, 11:24 AM
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JWN
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

As Jerry said, a magazine will not print a poor review of a product from one of their advertisers. And many times, they will not print a poor review of a product from someone who is not an advertiser in hopes of getting them to buy some ad space. I used to fly with a gentleman who wrote a "readers review" of a model for one of the airplane rags. The review was honest and outlined problem areas as well as those areas he thought highly of. When the review was published, all of the negative had been removed. When he asked why he was told flatly that they will not print negative reviews. They only print praise. It was at that point that I stopped believing magazine reviews. That is, until RC Report came along. I trust their reviews, but they are the only ones.

John
Old 01-24-2004, 12:03 PM
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suitcase
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

I too know a man who writes for a couple of rags, mostly electrics. He is a great builder and flyer but he did say that the mags don't like to read a lot of bad stuff about a particular model he's reviewing. I remember one, an A10, that he said was just so-so, very under powered, and he wrote that "it needs a little more power". He's been a big help to me, giving pointers and buddying me while learning to fly.
Old 01-24-2004, 01:28 PM
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polstery
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

discussion falls on deaf ears here, I have found
Old 01-24-2004, 03:23 PM
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EkRr
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

Loopman

At the time when I did the GSP Corsair review, I did a lot of research on the plane before accepting it. I talked with you about the fiberglass problems as well as a few other members. I have exchanged photos and construction notes. I also spent time talking with better than 15 people who had the plane and loved it. I talked to Irwin at GSP and expressed the concerns before I even opened the box. Mind you he was not advertising with us at that time and only started recently in the last couple months (more than 8 months after the review. So there was no biased in terms of keeping an advertiser happy.

I took the panels and placed them in the hot sun for hours as instructed by other members and saw no sign of warping. I honestly was not able to replicate any of the problems that anyone has seen. I found some minor things that I addressed in the review, but when it came to the plane that I had in my possession, I was honest with the review. I could not give a bad review or make comments based on other peoples planes. Only the one I had. The plane had several flights on it and they were all uneventful. I never saw any signs of fiberglass failure. Trust me, I would have loved to have seen some failure, espectially when putting them in the sun as I could have saved the countless hours of building and reviewing on the model, by simply sending it back.

Understand that there are hundreds of these models sold and even though there were a dozen or so guys on RCU that did not like them I spoke to many who did. The problem is human nature is to talk about something we do not like, therefore we do not see as many posts where people say they love something unless asked specifically. Everyone loves to shout out in the boards that something sucks!. I was real careful on this review as I knew the bad press it was getting. I really could not replicate the problems.

I have seen 2 models from other well known companies with different manufacturer lot numbers where one was perfect and the other was no so perfect. They are still assembled by people in china and you never know what could happen one week from the next on a production line. That being said, is it possible that myself and some of the other happy pilots got one lot, and you and other unhappy pilots might have received a different lot? Maybe?

-Erick
Old 01-24-2004, 03:26 PM
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EkRr
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

Oh, and as far as the customer service. I CAN NOT report on that in a review. A manufacturer would be out of his mind to provide bad service to a reviewer, so in all honestly, for the most part - we always get good customer service. It is not fair for us to report that in a review as the review is of the product and not the service. This is unfortunate, but if I said they had excellent CS, then that would be tainted as I am the reviewer. That is why RCU is here. Is you want to know about customer service on a company, just ask online and you will hear from the "customers"

Erick
Old 01-24-2004, 03:56 PM
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Loopman
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

Erick,
Nice to hear from you! I appreciate your input to this thread. The fact of the matter is that you and the other "happy owners" are the minority here. I believe the pictures of your review plane show moderately cold outdoor conditions that would definitely have effected the outcome of the planes skin wrinkling in the sun. Also, it would not just be the sun that would cause the wrinkling but the temperature on the aircraft's FRP surface.

All this is nice but I will still not sway from my statement that most reviews are a covert attempt to sell the product, not protect the consumer. I bear you no ill feelings as you were just doing your job.

Happy Flying!

LOOPMAN
Old 01-24-2004, 04:42 PM
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apalsson
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

ORIGINAL: Loopman

All this is nice but I will still not sway from my statement that most reviews are a covert attempt to sell the product, not protect the consumer. I bear you no ill feelings as you were just doing your job.

Happy Flying!

LOOPMAN
Loopman,

I think it's important to keep in mind that the reviewer's plane is the only one he builds of that particular kit and he might not see problems you may have experienced with your kit.

Another thing to remember is that even though a magazine reviewer probably won't slam a product from an advertiser, I have found that if you have good product knowledge, you can read between the lines of the review and understand if cheap materials are being used, etc.
For example, a review on a particular ARF might state that the covering materials used are "pre-painted glue-backing film" instead of Ultracote or Monokote. The reviewer won't say that the covering material is rubbish, even though most of us would agree that the materials described are, if we know the materials.
It's then up to your product knowledge to read the review for what it';s worth.

I have found most of the reviews on RC Universe pretty good and true to what the product actually offers.
Before purchasing a 1/4 Taylorcraft, I actually communicated directly with the reviewer (Erick Royer) and found his comments, both offline and in the review quite accurate and informative.

Let's not generalise and let's not slam all review writers if we don't agree with one review or have been unlucky with a faulty product.

Regards

Ari Palsson
Sydney
Old 01-24-2004, 04:54 PM
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

Yea, I remember the guy Suitcase is talking about telling us about a model he was reveiwing that was a POS. He said he can't fix the problems even if he could. The mag editor sent him a Kill fee that covered his time and the article went in the trash. So he said the real junk stays out of the mag.
Old 01-24-2004, 05:52 PM
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tailskid
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

JWN, because I am fortunate to write for two mags (RCM and RCR), do you believe only the reviews I do for RCR?

Jerry Festa
Old 01-24-2004, 06:10 PM
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

Loopman

The pics are in the fall, but it was late summer when I started the review. I flew it in the early fall and then shelved the project to get some other things out of the way, so when I finally got to the static outside shots it was late fall with an early snow (late oct).

So I did have experience with the plane in hot and cold conditions and still did not see anything that you described. Maybe I am the minority, but I just stated the facts on the kit I had.

No Hard Feelings

Erick
Old 01-24-2004, 09:30 PM
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jrf
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

No, you will never see a review that says "DON'T BUY THIS PIECE OF JUNK!". The magazine would be sued in a week and out of business in a month. Actually, there are very, very few true pieces of junk on the market these days, and if you were selling one, would you send it to a magazine for review?

Yes, there are some airplanes that are less than they are claimed to be, and no, these reviews don't get published. You can't condemn a product based on one bad example, and one is all the reviewer gets to see.

So READ BETWEEN THE LINES. If you don't see any reviews of a certain model, either they are selling so many that they can't spare one for a review, or no reviewer has been able to make it work.

Jim
Old 01-24-2004, 10:25 PM
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

So READ BETWEEN THE LINES. If you don't see any reviews of a certain model, either they are selling so many that they can't spare one for a review, or no reviewer has been able to make it work.
more likely the latter of the two...[:@]

Anyone ever see a magazine review of a Lanier Comet? (almost certainly not... )
Old 01-24-2004, 10:39 PM
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MinnFlyer
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

ORIGINAL: jrf

So READ BETWEEN THE LINES.
Exactly. We like to use tack.

So when we're building, we say to ourselves:

"What #&$%ing Genius came up with THIS stupid &$*#%ing way of doing it?"

But we write:

"I didn't care for their mounting method, so I...."

Old 01-24-2004, 10:49 PM
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Loopman
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

Well,
I guess it's true " One man's garbage is another man's treasure". I will stick with reading the real reviews here on RC Universe, the ones written by us and not by the reviewers. It is very sweet to be able to receive free stuff, write a glowing report, get paid by some RC rag and get to keep everything to boot! Personally I could not write commercially for the same reasons I do not participate in politics.

Happy Flying!

LOOPMAN
Old 01-25-2004, 01:53 AM
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loading
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

I wouldn't say they are worthless. You ussually get some good pics and maybe some good building tips. Most these guys can sure build a plane. But when it comes to how the plane flies or the quality of the kit/arf, I come here.
Old 01-25-2004, 01:56 AM
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robert waldo
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

I agree, but even rc reports is suspect on occasion, ref. there glowing report on the dynaflight F-82. Based on there report I rushed out and bought the thing and did actually build it after spending an extra 30 bucks on replacement wood. They probably supply a ringer for the reviews. When a customer does point out a problem with a product in the forums it's about the problems HE'S having , the typical rebuttel however is an undertone of almost rudeness directed at the person complaining about the product , you would almost think the suspect company was replying. Bob
Old 01-25-2004, 02:06 AM
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

Consider how many models some reviewers put together and fly. Dick Pettit expertly reviews more airplanes for RC Reports in a year than I'll buy in five years! That experience level affects the reviews because the "pro" reviewers have less problems than an average modelers will. So maybe the "pro" reviews are somewhat biased, nothing comes without a point of view. But how much should we trust "Joe Modeler's" comments? Joe also has a monetary stake in what he's writing, he paid for the thing. If it doesn't work well for whatever reason, he may feel vindictive and be looking for someone to blame. We don't know his skill level, degree of experience, if he can fly a trainer or not, etc. etc. When a product works for some people but not for others, I have to wonder about those others. Take everything with a grain of salt. It's not just what you buy but also how you prepare it and use it that determines the results.
Old 01-25-2004, 06:39 AM
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

I also belive in Santa theTooth fairy and Easter bunny. along with reviewers
Old 01-25-2004, 08:12 AM
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Loopman
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

Hey no insult to any reviewer but I've got a buck that says I build as good or better than most of them. I always try to improve the way the plane goes together, adding triangle stock where needed, regluing suspect glue joints, pinning firewalls, rebuilding retract bracing. The plane in question that I complained about had received my usual "improvements". I could not however improve the quality of the fibreglass material used to construct the plane nor could I improve the type of attitude I got from owner of said company when I identified the problem I had, and reviews do rate CSR reaction from time to time. Seems that I have drawn together the modest wrath of several professional reviewers here. Discussion and debate are good!

Happy Flying!

LOOPMAN [sm=tired.gif]
Old 01-25-2004, 09:33 AM
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Default RE: RC Kit Reviews - Worthless!

<<...We like to use tack...>>

I always preferred glue, myself.

But whatever floats your boat...

.

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