Kmot

My Feedback: (24)

Wow. [X(]

I read often about the lousy LHS's some guys have to deal with. I think I must be blessed becaue I have a great LHS only 5 minutes away from me. He stocks 95% of what I need it seems. I hardly ever have to have him "order it" because he already has it in his store. And he has all the latest products as soon as they are available. It's funny, from the street the store looks sorta like a 'hole in the wall' but once inside, wow. It is Smith Brothers Hobby Center:

http://www.valleybest.com/smithbros/

And, I am also only 5 miles away from a local Hobby People store.

DadsToysBG

My Feedback: (35)

Thank you, I'm small but i carry most of what you guys have to have to keep flying. Just to answer a few questions. My Wildcat 20% is 17.95 a dollar off per gallon if you buy a case.. My monocote is $12.95. I am a RC'er first and a store owner second. All or most of my customers are also my friends at the field that I fly at. I know that I have to compete with the internet and has stayed in business for over 10 years. I have my good days and bad. Can i own a Corvette with the profit from here NO, but i fly nice stuff as long as I keep the numbers down. Still I know that I can't carry everything out there. When a item only sells once or twice a year I can't afford to keep it on the shelf.
To rcpilet, come here and order that much and watch me have it here in 3 days and no shipping and my sales tax is 6%. And I wll match any price you give me. Dennis

Bob101

I've heard (well it happened before I became a member of the club) that the reason the local hobby shop owner and the local clubs are not on the same wavelenght is that the owner got pissed when the 2 clubs started getting their fuel by the pallet at cheaper prices rather than the LHS, I can see his point - but I also know people would go and he had NO FUEL at all or only 30% heli fuel or whatever when good old 10-15% is king around here as probably 80% or more of the flying is the "sport" flying variety.

Schumacher RC Superstore

I cant believe the thread topic! You would not say such things if you had a clue. It goes against the good old motto of "Support your local hobby shop". That is a slap in the face of the people who spend time and money stocking items so that YOU can have the luxury of instant gratification instead of waiting for the mail or big brown truck.
Now some scary truth. The 2 major players you mentioned happen to be distributers who supply hobby shops at wholesale, yet sell direct to the customers as well. Great Planes, a distributer, sells to the public as Tower Hobbies. Horizon hobby, the other major player, sells direct from the Horizon website. They dont even stick with retail prices, but offer deals that the hobby shop must now compete with. The distributers make money selling to hobby shops at a profit. When they sell direct to the public they make even more.
Lets work with a simple $10 retail price item. Horizon Hobby or Tower Hobby(Great Planes) pays $3 for the item. Hobby shop buys usually at %50 off retail. They pay $5. Now when both offer the same item at the same price, lets say $7.99, who makes more money? Hobby shop makes $2.99, Distributer makes $4.99. Who is doing YOU the favor?

Oh, by the way, try to buy a JR radio or Team losi products from Tower hobbies, or an O.S. engine or duratrax from Horizon hobby. Try to get Serpent or Schumacher from either. The "Big" players are nothing more than importer/suppliers with little to no ethics.

gboulton

My Feedback: (15)

To address a few comments/questions:

1) Yeah, my hobby shop gives me the "I can order it" pretty frequently as well. Meh...ok, fine by me. Either they order it or I do. 6 of one half-dozen of the other, imo. I'm just not seeing a whole lot of difference between it taking 3 days to arrive as THEIR order, and 3 days to arrive as MY order. *shrug*

2) "Online, i don't have to pay taxes." - yeah, you probably P&M about the lousy roads, poor schools, or lack of community facilities in your town/county/state too, right?

3) "I can sit here in the comfort of my own home and..." - Yep...and miss out on the hangar flying, s**t-stirring, and general commraderie of fellow rc'ers too. Granted, you get that same sort of thing here on RCU...but somehow...to me, at least...it just ain't the same. I mean, if I said the same things to some of you lot that I just said to my LHS owner about an hour ago, my post would be 'heavily edited" at least.

4) "My LHS doesn't have a build room/chat area/etc" Ok, gotta admit..some don't. And ya know what? When they go out of business, they're gonna whine and complain about how "$BIG_COMPANY drove me out of business!!" and never once consider the things they might have done to DISTINGUISH themselves from $BIG_COMPANY. Not really a whole lot you can do, in that case.

===============================================

The 'truth" (if there is any in all this) I think is this : This whole thing is pretty subjective. If your interest is having thiat specific plane, with this specific motor and servos, and having it in the air as quickly as humanly possible...then, yeah...large online retailers are probably your best bet. Everything you need is at your fingertips, without so much as leaving your chair. And ya know what? There's nothing "wrong" with that. if it works for you, so be it.

On the flip side, however, there are, to some of us at least, certain values on the companionship of this (or any) hobby. This hobby serves me because, to some degree, it satisfies an insatiable appetite for AVIATION. I just love stuff that flies, period. Don't care if it's a bipe, or a blimp, or an Extra, or .40 size, or a 50%er...heck, I even think birds are pretty ****ing neat. This hobby allows me the opportunity to be aorund things that fly, and JUST AS IMPORTANTLY, around PEOPLE who like things that fly too. I've made genuine FRIENDS in this hobby, whose company I enjoy on a regular basis...both on and off the airfield.

My community matters to me too...where I live is more than an address. I didn't just buy the first 4 walled box I could find...I CHOSE a particular community for a great number of reasons. And, bottom line, whether you acknowledge, admit, or recognize it or not, SUCCESSFUL BUSINESSES HELP A COMMUNITY...whether they are car dealerships, tea parlors, or your local hobby shop. Since I LIKE my community, and want GOOD THINGS for it, I see an inherent value in SUPPORTING THE BUSINESSES THAT OPERATE HERE, where appropriate. No, i won't buy things of no interest to me JUST because they're being sold here, but if I WANT to buy an item, I would GREATLY prefer to buy it HERE instead of elsewhere, if that's an option.

Is there a limit? Sure...if a particular item is significantly more expensive at the LHS than online, then I'm likely to shop online. In my experience, however, one learns that even in those rare cases, there's a REASON for the extra expense...often one that makes it worth the money. perhaps the item is a genuine article, as opposed to a knock-off...or perhaps there is a better warranty, or better support, or any number of things. But, in general, my LHS at least MATCHES (or sometimes even beats) the prices I find at the major big box stores. (as pointed out above, they order from them frequently).

Of course..as I said above, it's all about what you (and your LHS) value. If the relationship means little or nothing to one of you, or if the community is unimportant...then so be it. It's really that simple.

================================================== ===

Finally, DadsToys, I have GOT to swing by your shop some time soon. The wife's folks are up in Louisville, and we're likely heading that way over the Christmas holiday, heading right through BG on the way. If I can work out our travel to be by there when you're open, expect a visit from an obnoxious bald guy who somehow wedged a 25% PW Extra into his wife's mini-van...in between the luggage and kids.

DadsToysBG

My Feedback: (35)

This is one thing that really grips me, and it is a reason when politican's call me i tell them when they fix the sales tax i'll start voting again. Even the mail order houses should collect and pay state sales tax. If I don't collect and pay the tax I go to jail and i won't do that for anybody. I'll bet that if you look on your state forms there is a place to state what you bought on-line and you are supposed to pay the tax then. If you don't you are braking the law. So talk about not paying taxes, someday that will change. All i want is a level playing field. Dennis

ira d

I buy from Tower a lot and i think they are a nice company to shop with and i do enjoy
not paying sales tax, however i do think in the spirit of fairness all vendors should
charge tax based on there local rate the same as if you went to their store in person.

As for as the LHS the good ones are few and far between in my area, i have to go 20-25
miles in either direction and when you factor in the traffic it takes a lot of time to visit
either one.

There is one other store that is closer its part of a chain but their selection and stock
leaves a lot to be desired.

LANNYBOB

havent all of you guys out there noticed that every r.c. associated company now has a web-site. not many local hobby shops that i've been too have web sites. they expect that word of mouth is going to bring people to their store. only a small number of shops have what were looking for the rest stock 10,000 traxxas tires and 40,000 cases of high octane 25% car fuel. no wonder i walk out. its now 2006 and this hobby isnt about
free flight look what i made out of tissue paper crap. dont you know. electrics have exploded in the past five years yet local hobby shops (3 of them) dont have not one motor. what the heck man. look around and smell the nitro.

YNOT

There were thousands of shops that thousands of people put their hard work and dreams into, now unable to stay in business due to the importer and distributor are selling the equpiment, retail. A shop can not stay in biz when it makes 20%, and they are still more than tower or horizon. Thousands of people have lost their dreams of owning a hobby shop and having to start a new life after the close of their business. All this, for you ***** about. They can't carry everything. They can't put a million dollars worth of equipment into the shop and even if they did, they STILL won't exactly what you want.

You wishes have really already come true, Tower and Horizon are taking the LHS out of business. It's been happening for 30 years. How long you been playing with this stuff, a weekend?

Go away, a great hobby like this, don't need you in it.

Rcpilot

My Feedback: (78)

I got no problem buying from a guy who has most of it in stock most of the time. So you don't have an item once in awhile or your sold out. I'm okay with that. I know next week you'll have 15 more on the rack. I'm not even going to ask you to compete with Tower. I have never asked a guy to compete with mail order. There is a cost for the convenience of being able to drive right down and get it--right now while I'm in the middle of a project and need it RIGHT NOW. I just don't want to be taken to the cleaners for a couple 8/32 bolts and some epoxy. I got absolutely NO PROBLEM supporting a good hobby shop. A good hobby shop is usually run by a guy who flies too. He knows what ya need to get a busted engine back together. He knows you need 10 feet of fuel tubing sometimes. He knows guys want some medium CA, 1/4--20 nylong bolts and rubber bands to carry in their field box. And he stocks that stuff regularly.

It's the clueless hobby shop owner who I have not a shred of sympathy for. It's the guy who has to order EVERYTHING because he doesn't stock ANYTHING that drives me up the wall. If all you are going to stock is 3 pieces of 1/4x1/4 balsa and 2 RTF electrics--I hope you end up going out of business. The guy I talked about in my first post was about as clueless as they come. He would order 5 of the same thing every week and sell all 5 on the first day. Then he'd be out for a week. Common sense tells you to order 10 or 15 next week and then when a guy comes in--you'd have a couple on the shelf.

As far as paying the taxes on it--I pay plenty of sales tax already. I seriously doubt the taxes on my hobby money is going to fix a pothole or get the elementary school to quit begging me for money every week. I'll have to continue to shop the internet for some of my hobby stuff.

I DID find a good LHS today. RC Hobbies is booming in the Denver metro area. They've got stores in Thornton, Boulder, Lakewood and a few other places around town. I went into the store in Thornton today and was extremely happy to see an excellent selection of hardware, props, tanks, fuel, batteries, engines, radios, and ARFs. Not too many kits, but they have to stock what sells and I can't blame them for that. I spent about $15 today and will be back next time I need something. [sm=thumbs_up.gif]

JettPilot

My Feedback: (6)

Man,

You have it backwards. There should be NO sales tax for anyone. Look what no sales tax does for the mail order companies. Having no taxes would stimulate your business also. Taxes stifle business, and yet you are advocating more taxes.

I understand you want to level the playing field, I totally agree with that, but it should be NO sales taxes rather than more taxes that will hurt everyone. Government will spend as much money as we could possibly give to them. What makes for efficient government, less money in taxes. Government will watch their spending when they are FORCED to, it will never happen while we give them more and more money.

If your shop is like you say it is, its AWESOME. I have NEVER seen a shop like that. The ones in my area suck, NO one hangs out there, and they dont have much stock. I only buy fuel there. There was a good hobby shop where I used to live, a very expensive, upscale area, lots of stock and good for buying small parts that I needed now, but not a hangout, everyone bought and left. That guy sold mostly car stuff, but was smart. Good modern stock, in an expensive area, the owner did drive a corvette, an expensive motorcycle durring the summer, he makes a TON of money off the place. Maybe you should relocate to an expensive area and get into car stuff big time. Thats where the profit is, and remember to carry some neat stuff for us plane guys also.

Sad fact is, most of use ar stuck with small shops that have high prices [:@] , sell old picked over stock [:'(] , and never have what we need. BTW Tower and Horizon are a bunch of hard working americans that need a job and need our support.

JettPilot

t_burley

My Feedback: (59)

am curious as to what your position is with these companies?

so what if THEY need a job. everyone does. AND if it wasnt also for all the small shops around
the good ole USA, then they (Horizon, Tower) wouldnt be as busy as they are already. these shops
as stated before ORDER from them! I do not see your point here, other than some other reason
you have behind this? it makes no sense.

these shops are everywhere, and they need to be continually supported by the modelers. These shops
although may not be like what I have locally, or others here that have been talked about, should
be supported just as much as the big companies they buy from? I just dont see why YOU think it is
so important to support those "hard working Americans" only, and piss on the small town shops.

you dont think the small town shops should be supported also? are THEY not also "hard working Americans"?

Racers Haven Hobbies - Bakersfield California
B & F Hobbies - Bakersfield California

Two hard working American run businesses at THEIR best

WILDCATONE

O.K.
Don't really sit around and read all the stupid BULL_HIT on these forums, but this one caught my attention especially. To all you PRO-TOWER/HORIZON fans and patrons out there, just one quick question to you: WHAT DO THESE COMPANIES CHARGE TO SHIP YOU A GALLON OF FUEL, A CASE OF FUEL, AND IF YOUR ORDER MEETS THE $150.00, WILL THESE LARGE MAIL ORDER HOUSES EAT THE SHIPPING COSTS ON THE FUEL AS WELL????

Just to add a little thought, our town lost one of the best little hobby shops around 11-12 years ago due to the owners health. Friends, family members,club members, and fellow modelers helped out to keep the shop going while the owner was receiving treatment. This guy was not just a shop owner, he was a modeler who would help you before he would help himself. The shop closed any ways.
Within a year, a fellow club member, who already had a full time job, took it upon himself to open up a hobby shop where his fellow modelers could purchase well needed stuff like FUEL,glow plugs, and other everday stuff needed for the flyers in this area. He still works his full time job and runs his hobby shop 6 days a week and flys on his only day off.
SO, MY HAT IS OFF TO MY LOCAL HOBBY SHOP(for you mail-order men/women---LHS) because there is something out there other than sitting in your bean bag chairs, eating cheezy puffs in your underwear, doing whatever in front your computer and ordering from someone that dont give a rats A $ $ who you are and what kind of junk you fly and how your kids soccer team done last nite

And my LOCAL HOBBY SHOP has never been out of the fuel that i run, and i burn anything from 5-10% on the big glow sucking engines to the YS 20/20 blend in my YS engines and sometimes burn even 30% heli fuel in them, and to boot he keeps AMSOIL in stock.
So, I will continue to keep supporting this shop. This shop also has a flight sim. there for newbies to check out. See if TOWER or HORIZON will let you come by and give it a free try on the simulator before you or someone you know wants to get into the hobby and spend the bucks. And to you newbies that read this, give your local hobby shop a chance, they are usually there when you need a answer on a technical question. 9 times out of 10, a local hobby shop owner is also a fellow modeler who has been around these products at the field, and know what works well, works ok, or just what products to stay away from. You can go to area swap meets and see the useless junk out there that is not needed, that a caring local hobby shop owner would not sell it just to get the sale!

AGAIN, THANKS TO YOU LOCAL HOBBY SHOP OWNERS AND KEEP UP THE GREAT WORK.

WILDCATONE

Cyclic Hardover

My Feedback: (3)

I do both LHS and Mailorder. My last visit to my LHS went as follows.

1. Ordered what I want

2. Arrived when i wanted

3. Was actually what I wanted.

No problems here!

GRANT ED

Am I the only one her who thinks this thread is a troll?
When ever there is a thread about supporting your LHS everyone jumps on the bandwagon and agrees and now someone post that we need to support tower (yeh cos I bet they are really struggling ) and all of a sudden everyone thinks we should dump our LHS for tower!

YNOT

I have already had one post removed from this thread for the words I used towards JP and thats OK, the Mods had justification to do so. The very humorous PM's I received from many of you, was worth having the post removed. Glad so many of you agreed with me

After researching JP a bit, he should be ashamed for what he said, due to the time he has been in the hobby. 28 years-ish. I bet it if were not for the LHS, he may never have discovered r/c. Yea, a family member or friend may have gotten him interested, but you know the LHS was involved somewhere in his 28 year history.

It's like your the egotistical jerk jet guy at the flying field, that makes most other people not want to fly there and runs new people off.

It this was a troll, it would be post number 7.

JPMacG

My Feedback: (2)

LOL.... JP's original statement was obviously sarcasm. He is in favor of the LHS, not against.

But personally, my opinion is that Tower has done some good for the hobby. If I were restricted to shopping at my LHS I probably would have given up RC out of frustration by now. I support my LHS and will continue to give him business whenever possible, but his stock is very limited, his prices are high, he is sometimes successful at ordering stuff, sometimes not. I'm jealous of you all with the great LHSs.

Cyclic Hardover

My Feedback: (3)

If you read it again, it looks to me like he was making a sarcastic joke. I don't know about those things meaning Tower and whoever are putting the locals out of business. Like Kerry and is comments a few weeks back about being "stuck in Iraq" that went bad. I understood exactly what he meant which comes from the 60's where as if you weren't in college, you were in Vietnam but many of the younger people today didn't know thats how it worked. So the comments did not work out right.

Either that or one of the local yokel stores really ticked him off!

livindead

nope ..i will only buy from my lhs.....buy local it good for your local economy...your money stays.[for the most part].in your city..gives people jobs and any way its kinnda nice to get out and see those silly buggers....i love those guys..dont know what kindda shop you go to but mine is the bomb...good people good product and the prices are very average..or lower..Hobby Haven Urbandale Iowa if your in these part check them out....they also have a web site but i dont recall the address right now

JettPilot

My Feedback: (6)

No LHS ever really ticked me off. Just poor selection, nothing in stock, stuff that is 10 years behind the times, and high prices [:'(].

Mostly its just how they gang up on Horizon and Tower, saying "support us", dont buy from those "out of towners". How do the poor folks at Tower and Horizon survive with hundreds and hundreds of businesses all trying to drive them out of business. Tower and Horizon are people just like the rest of us trying to eek out a living in a very competitive business.


JettPilot

LANNYBOB

hey living dead that hobby shop in iowa is located at hobbyhaven.com

Cyclic Hardover

My Feedback: (3)

Okay, so much for that observation. Now heres mine on my LHS. I do use mail order "sometimes." I use the Tower catalog as a reference and since GP Hobbico and Tower or Hrizon are all cousins, My LHS orders straight from one of them and everybody makes a buck and I get my stuff.

One problem that can happen in some LHS is that they don't like to order and force what they have on you, thus the reason for mailorder. Or some LHS order it whenthey get around to it and you never know whenit will show up. MY LHS of choice here is one of the best in the business.

If there is a problem with an order, they let you know right away. If it's on a 3 week back order, who cares, it's great just to know about it instead of calling them up every day. We have the best of all sides here. One store that really cares and goes all out. One store that doesn't and one in the middle. I avoid that one also because with that attitude, you never know whats going to happen

t_burley

My Feedback: (59)

tell the truth here about your affiliation with these companies. and then maybe pull your head out so you
can breath and understand that the small LHS's all over buy from these companies. So those
poor ole Americans working for the afformentioned companies can have Christmas bonuses for their
families this year.

come on, answer the questions here. your thread makes no sense. your sarcasm is weak, and you do not
understand Economics at all

JettPilot

My Feedback: (6)

Ok, you caught me, I own both Horizon and Tower hobbies, and am trying to drum up some business so I can afford to buy a turkey for Christmas dinner and maybe a new pair so shoes for the kids....

JettPilot

Jim Thomerson

Back in the '70's when discount mail order was going strong and I could save 50% by mail order, I decided to spend $300 a year at local hobby shops just to help the along, and the rest mail order.

Now there is one more or less real hobby shop 40 miles away and a closer HobbyTown which sometimes has something I want. Friend went to the more or less real hobby shop looking for motor mount stock; they had none, and had never had any. Anyway, my situation is that my pharmacist knows me by name but no one in a local hobby shop know who I am.[&o] I buy stuff from cottage industry people, vendors at contests, swap meets, ebaY, and stop in at Lone Star on the way to Dallas contests. I have ordered from Tower a couple of times and got good service.