mvigod

I am taking a poll plus I want comments and feedback on the following:

Should vendors, retailers, distributors and reps (i.e. sponsored pilots) be allowed to advertise & promote their products within the user discussion forums at will?

Right now RCU rules state that commercial vendors cannot do this. So if somebody asks what is the best 30%-40% plane any user could chime in and answer but the vendors or retailers (or pilots) could not come in to tout their own stuff since they obviously have a vested financial interest. Some vendors are not happy with this long standing rule since they cannot promote and advertise in the discussions at will (and for free mind you). They feel it is incorrect to allow a 'regular' user to post that he loves a product while they cannot tout their own stuff.

My view is that an obvious bias exists when a product somehow benefits you financially. Also if unfettered posting for commercial advertisers existed what would stop a vendor from posting 50 times a day pushing their products? Some have suggested putting a limit on how many posts they could make but that is not possible to keep track of and moderate.

A vendor CAN however answer any questions that are posed directly about their products. If you have a technical question or something about a vendors products he/she can chime in and answer the question. However within the post they cannot advertise or promote.

Do you, the members here at RCU, agree with this rule in whole, in part or not at all? Please vote and post comments or suggestions!

Chuckr53-RCU

My Feedback: (40)

Marc,

If I ask what the "best" 30-40% plane is, I don't want someone trying to make a buck off me by selling me their flavor of the day. I want honest opinions from people like me...other flyers with nothing to gain...just sharing their honest feelings, opinions, and experiences. If I have a question for the manufacturers and sellers, I can contact them directly.

The current rule is fine the way it is.

beardking

My Feedback: (4)

I like it how it is. If the vendor sees incorrect information posted they should have every right to defend themselves, but essentially allowing them to blatantly advertise I think would be wrong and annoying. I like how the rep from CEN has presented himself (or herself) in this forum. Not once have I read a posting of his saying CEN products are better than their competitors. He just gives the information that people are asking for and every once in a while throws in a tease about a new product (1/8 scale monster truck).

mvigod

Vendors can correct misinformation of course. That is not what is in question here. What is in question is if they can add unsolicited promotion to the discussions or add their comments and toss in an add along with it.

Teachu2

My Feedback: (133)

The rule is fine as is. I posted a This vs That, Which Should I Buy? thread last week and got PM'd by both vendors! I thought that was a perfect way to handle it.

If you allow vendors free access, who will pay to help support the forums?

hroachen

I voted yes, my reasoning is that if I were to ask a "what is the best product for such and such application" type of question, I might get a bunch of answers, but if a vendor is not allowed to tout their own product I might never even hear of it.

I do think that vendors or their reps should identify themselves as such when posting though... As long as they're required to do that, I'd have no problem with it.

theox

In whole.

Ledgendary

Only to answer questions not to place adds! We get good but, sometimes misinformed info on this forum and it would just not be the same if there were a ton of adds cluttering up the threads when most of us just want to get a tip or talk about how are weekend of bashing or flying went!

As stated above "I like how the rep from CEN has presented himself (or herself) in this forum. Not once have I read a posting of his saying CEN products are better than their competitors."
I also would like to see more of these kind of posts from the reps and here about whats new or what's in the future plans of the manufactures!

bdtsr

My Feedback: (5)

Advertising, no. Supporting the product and assisting the people with problems or questions, yes. The banners are fine, we do not need vendors popping into threads (unless asked for information) just to sell their products.

maverick

My Feedback: (12)

My position, and as you know, I feel very strongly about this, is that vendors, reps, sponsored pilots or in fact any party that has a commercial interest in a product cannot blatantly use these forums to promote their own business by posting into discussion forums.

That model of totally free speech is what Usenet is all about and it can be seen there that the forums would just degenerate into SPAM from commerical posters and the quality would be lost. There is also no way to limit how many times a commercial entity can post, so it must be none at all.

If they want to promote their products there are legitimate ways to do this by paying for a banner ad for example.

Also if you decide to allow commercial posts in discussion forums then why would any person pay for a banner ad? You would see your banner ad business and what revenue it is currently bringing in go away completely.

Marc you have to stand firm on this one. The way it works now is good. My only suggestion would be to have more surveillance to track the current commercial posters and punish them by removing their posting rights. Right now some of them try to get away with it and their posts stand for a while until a mod can delete them.

They know the rules and blatantly break those rules to promote their own business.

It is like an Attorney in court asking a question they know they aren't allowed and then having the jury disregard it. Well by then it is too late and the jury has already heard it.

Also if a commercial party does take part in a discussion thread, they should be made to very clearly publish their commercial relationship. It is most important to be able to weigh up their post with the understanding that it has a commercial intent.

A small link to the commercial website in the signature block is not enough for people to identify them as having a commercial intent. They must be forced to publish what there relationship is to the commercial entity for everybody to see.

sizam

My Feedback: (6)

Well, I have some mixed feelings. Like Chuckr says, if I ask 'what is the best X', I want to hear from people who have either used several types of X's and have an opinion or have had a particularly good/bad experience with some X. I however, don't want to hear that one X is so good just because that's what you sell. Obviously vendors could go on forever about how good their product is, in fact they fill whole websites with it But (always a but), sometimes even after several people have said they like this or that about an X, not every X is represented and thats where a vendor could help.
If vendors posted a VERY SHORT blurb about their X and a couple sentences about why its great, I'd appreciate that. Then I could say "What do others feel about this X that nobody else has mentioned". But I don't want to see a novela by the vendor about why their product is good, AND I'd like it clearly labeled that its a vendor talking about the product.
So, I think it'd be fine if vendors could post 'my X is nice because of yadda yadda', but have a rule that they have to keep it short. Then, after looking at all the products I can even ask two vendors at once to compare each other's product! I think this could work out.
Couple caveats, if I'm in a thread about a Powerflite battery pack, the Duralite vender should NOT be able to come in and say "Look at my stuff, its better" unless someone starts to compare them. Vendors also should be able to start a thread "My X is so cool, look at it!", even if its a new product they would like to announce, thats what ad space is for.

Of couse this is all assuming that the vendors obey the rules, if they can't, then I'd say keep the rule as it is.

Bax

My Feedback: (11)

I also agree that vendors/support staff should only post to answer questions or correct misinformation. They should also identify themselves.

JimBrown

My Feedback: (2)

I like the way it works now. Don't change it.

In regards to the "whats the best product for x" comments above, keep in mind that there is nothing stopping a vendor from sending a PM in reply to such a question, should no one happen to mention their product in the original thread. Should the originator of the question then want more information from other users, they can then ask about it in a follow up message in the thread they started.

Regards,
...jim

Rocketman612

My Feedback: (85)

If it ain't broke don't fix it

Pete

koopster

I would have to agree that vendors should only be allowed to defend their products. What has been the most help to me has been the open and candid advice and comments from others in the group that are speaking out of their own experience. It is hard enough for the average Joe to be unbiased, it is virtually impossible for a vendor to be unbiased.

This forum is by far my biggest source of information and inspiration. Well done!

Just my "somewhat biased" 2 cents worth.

Koopster

BR289

My Feedback: (106)

I really dont like the idea of someone pushing a product on me,and then if I purchase it,and it isnt what they say it is,I basically am stuck with it.
I would like to see a forum for vendors though,sort of a "Manufacturers Forum".That way they can be asked about there products,and others can read what they have to say about a particular product ( sort of like the little "sub-forums" with futaba,OS,etc...)
As far as members asking each other their thoughts,well that should not be for vendors to interfere with,by pushing their products. Just my "Two Cents"

FLYBOY

My Feedback: (11)

If someone asks about a particular plane, I don't mind the vendor answering along with everyone else, but I would rather not have them popping in trying to sell thier product on any post they want. I think you would see them posting ads on every post put up, and I would rather not see it.

Leave it as it has been, and let them answer questions on their own stuff if one is asked, but don't let them post at free will trying to sell their stuff.

otterdriver

I like it the way it is now.But it might be nice to have a thread just for SALES OR CLOSE OUTS. Like we already do with product announcements & manufacture news. KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK. Thanks, Mark,

pinball-RCU

I voted "no", but this is a very complex issue. Chuckr53 says But, as the famous cartoon says, "On the Internet, nobody knows that you are a dog." Of course you want honest opinions, but on a forum where being anonymous is the norm, you really don't know if the posts are honest or not. Sometimes I wonder... Out of left field comes this post saying, "Hi guys, I just ran into a wonderful product, you ought to check it out!" Was it a vendor? I don't know.

With this in mind, if you don't allow honest vendors to tout their products, but the system allows unethical ones to do so by pretending to be honest modelers, haven't you inadvertently encouraged folks to be unethical?

On the other hand, if you change the rule, I can envision a scenario where anytime anybody on the Beginner forum asks, "What is the best trainer," a certain vendor would always respond, politely, "Please take a look at ours before you decide." That doesn't sound too bad, but what if every trainer vendor decides that to compete, they must do the same? Then, everytime someone asks that question (which is a lot, by the way), you'd instantly see 20 responses, not good!

The root of the problem is anonymity, which I'm not ready to give up (yet). So, I vote "no" because things seem pretty good the way they are. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

wfortney99

My Feedback: (310)

Sadly many vendors will abuse any posting priviledge granted them ultimately cluttering "most" discussion threads with their products. Perhaps escalating into arguments between vendors ! It's a poor marketing person that can not find an marketing opportunity in most threads.
IMHO it's opening a "Pandora's Box" that you won't be able to close.

1g1yy

My Feedback: (1)

I voted NO -- but I like Marks ( cubdriver ) idea of a section for vendors sales, closeouts. I would probably skim such a section daily.

gsferrari

I think the idea of this section of the forums is to allow members who are passionate about the hobby to trade/sell/buy and move on with their interests. Bringing in vendors will not allow those who want to sell - to sell, or those who want to buy - to buy because of the pressure.

Even a separate vendors section is not a great idea. They make enough money on their own - I personally dont wanna see them in here as well!!

John Wells

My Feedback: (10)

I'd rather see it left the way it is. The problem isn't the vendors that are honest and professional (and we have several), it's the ones that go overboard and say anything to sell their product. If allowed, no one could properly regulate that and I think it will become a problem.

Woodsy

There is already a vendor forum section for radios so the manaufacturers can give direct answers to direct questios on there products.
i would have no problem with providing the same thing for all vendors providing they are an RCU sponsor.

So you can have say a Thunder tiger or OS forum as a sub section of engines just like the radio gear and batteries do.

if the companies want to advertise in the forum dedicated to them whey not, we already know its a duralite or Hitec section and as such are biased towards that product

Flyfalcons

I think if a vendor pays RCU for the advertising space then those companies and their reps should be able to talk about their products. It upsets me to no end when someone is asking a question about a new product and the only person qualified to talk about it is the mfg or their rep, but their post gets deleted!!!