davidbegg

Not sure where to post this, this seems to be an alright place.


Check out this link!!!!!! Completely unbelievable.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bz1pyMfDPno

The actions of these people (and similar thoughtless idiots) make the hobby just that much more difficult for the rest of us. Flying sites are already precious without this sort of mindless behaviour.

Cheers

David

mboland

The comments on the 3 pages with this news are quite interesting, as nearly all are condemning them, and rightly so, with only a couple of mindless sympathisers.

I have heard they are looking at 5 years prison, and maybe being a prison ***** for that long might even wake them up (or not) but it needs to be a harsh example to any other morons out there that think this is cool.

We fight hard to keep our flying sites, as you say, and remain on the good side of the general public, and this bad PR just has everyone looking down their nose at us, especially as the media are finding it a real good one to beat up a frenzy of fear with.

No quarter and no sympathy for what is about to come down on them.

Morons, F^^%Kwits, ..... words are just not enough[sm=punching.gif]

davidbegg

Agree with you 100%.

Cheers

David

Props4ever

They sure are idiots and Morons to fly model airplane right under the path of real aircrafts landing approach!![:@]. What really got my attention is that park they were flying out off from, is that park sectioned by AMA to fly rc models there?, if so then AMA is also to be blamed for choosing this park right under the landing path of real aircrafts and also darn too close to the airport!!...

Don't jump on me as i clearly said: "IF SO"

Silent-AV8R

First, this took place in Australia, so the AMA is clearly not involved.

Second, AMA does not "sanction" parks, fields, sites, or anything else.

Third, if you look closely at the aerial shot at the end of the video it sure looks like a regular flying field to me and not a "park" per se.

But, still dumb. And not restricted to Downunder. A fellow in Las Vegas has demonstrated a similar affinity for flying his models near jets landing at McCarran. He has gotten the attention of the FAA who have indicated to him that they are not amused. Not sure what is happening there, but I understand that it is not going to be fun for the guy!!

mboland

In the news footage they show the airfield and the park from an aerial shot.
Here is the link
[link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bz1pyMfDPno]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bz1pyMfDPno[/link]
It IS a park, just a park, and is VERY close to the end of the runway (looks like about 1km)
The deed was done with a GWS Corsair foamy with camera on board, clearly visible in the shots of the wreckage.
The organisation over here in Australia is the MAAA and they would NOT, in any way shape or form, sanction model aircraft flying from a field in that location.
They liaise quite closely with CASA (Civil Aviation Safety Authority) about air safety of model flying, and we, as a club, have to apply for dispensation from CASA when we want to exceed 400ft as we are within the 6km radius of an airfield.
Besides which, being a public reserve, park flyers would be pushing good grace flying from there even without an airfield in direct line and so close.

It does raise a very pertinent point that I have been waiting to surface as the proliferation of park flyers has exploded onto the market.
Flying model aircraft in public parks had to raise some safety issues.
Don't you think this is where the finger should be pointing.
It might even help the argument for more sanctioned flying fields in safe areas.

qldviking

you araise a poinyt i have raised in several forums, yet have no reasonable answer to, but did get several nasty PM's from park flyers, and the fact that becvause they r parkflyers that they can fly where and how they like, and that they dont even have to be a member of any club. I wonder at the mentality or lack there off these fools, and I would dearly love to meet them, the doctors would have difficulty in removing their heads from thier (__!__), there not being much if any difference. Now i will bet the relevant government dept will now take the easy way out and hammer us law abiding club members instead of tackling the issue of free ranging so called park flyers. I agrere tyhere should be laws for parkflyers, some of those bozo's have no idea, no training, and no comprehension of what is safe flying, I have already witness'd one of these fly straight into a baby wagon under power, fortunately the baby wasnt hurt, but was freaked right out tho. yet you tell these bozo's anything, no matter how friendly a manner, all you get for your troubles is a mouthful of attitude with little sign of intelligence. To be fair there is a large number who are responsible, but he number of play station hero's is growing rapidly and they have no sense of responsibilty nor care about anyone else for that matter.

FlyerInOKC

My Feedback: (6)

The same Parkflyers may change their minds when they find themselves sitting in a jail cell with a hefty fine to pay like this schmuck! As for the the peabrained idiots with the flaming PMs, they may feel parkflyers can fly where and how they like whenever they like they need to remember however, you they only have that right provided it does NOT infringe on the rights and safety of others. You can't yell fire in a crowded theater and you can indanger another person, the courts have already ruled so. This idiot if he was in the states would trigger a Homeland Security investigation of himself he would NOT enjoy it. Interfering with a commercial aircraft like this guy did IS a Federal crime here and I'm sure down under.

ergocentric

AC 91-57

Robotech

My Feedback: (9)

I dare you, no, double dog dare you, to post that question over in the AMA forum on this site. [X(]

Montague

Fwiw, a club in VA was located for years near the end of the runway at Dulles airport. I'd flown there at contests on more than one occasion, and the club is a big one (I think 200+ members, not sure though).

One day a guy flying a corporate jet departed "low" and saw a model "at his altitude". He raised hell to the tower, and the next thing you know the airport police show up and make it known that the field is now closed.
(I have no idea how big or high the model was)

Now, I'm not clear on the jurisdiction of those cops, and maybe they could have won in court, but maybe not, who knows. The club now has a new field elsewhere.

At my club, we are located in a rather narrow bit of airspace between National and BWI airports, just outside of the DC no-fly zone. This makes for a fair bit of cessna-driver traffic plus military and police helicopters. We've had two cases in the last 10 years where a model and a Cessna-type plane were at roughly the same altitude, and the full scale pilot saw and reported the model. In the most recent case, the pilot was working for a traffic reporting company. The guy running the traffic reporting company and I had a rather nice conversation, and he went out of his way to avoid getting us in trouble. But we make real effort to stay low when there is full-scale traffic around.

Anyway, the point I'm not making well is that the FAA knows a lot about us, where we are, and what we do in many cases. And the AMA has the GPS coordinates of my field and might have known where the VA club's field was, more or less.

Stupid people like the kids who made that video need to be dealt with, and jail time isn't a bad way to go about it. But I don't expect the FAA to shut us all down because of one or two clueless idiots.

Now, if someone actually brought down or damaged a plane, the politicians might get involved, then who knows what might happen. But the FAA has been pretty reasonable, I think, and I'm not that worried about them.

FlyerInOKC

My Feedback: (6)

I think the form 91-57 Ergocentric posted is something modeller should be familar with and observe. It seemed pretty much common sense and easy to comply with. The AMA keeps an open dialog with the FAA and have the two groups have a good working relationship. I think as modellers we have a responsability to keep open dialogs with our local authorities and to imbrace the Parkflyers to help them succeed and to educate them. I was in a hobby shop when a young boy came in with his grandparents to by his first airplane. I made a point a speaking with then=m and giving them info on the local club locations and the AMA. I also gave them a membership form for the AMA and explained what the advantages are in membership. The boy and his grandparents now have a number of avenues for training and information over and above the hobby shop and hopefully this boy will be a lifetime member of the hobby. The future of the hobby may very well be those who start out as Parkflyers. I started with a rubberband kit, went to C/L and now I'm a long time R/C flyer. Nobody starts out in IMAA large scale or turbine powered aircraft you work your way up from something else.

dreadnaut

My Feedback: (5)

I would use a stronger word than ''idiot'', but it would get deleted. Back in the seventies, I was approaced from time to time by someone wanting to know if a model could be used to fly drugs over the border.

Stupidity is not a recent phenominon.

qldviking

sad to say tyhe politicians are getting involved here, The media is amking a big hoohaa about it and of course siome flea brained politicians are jumping in to score cheap points, an incvestigation is altready underway. As for raising this point on the ama threads I have already done so, only to be poopoo'd, its not gonna happen. well it has, so now what???? The only real option as i see it is that all rc'ers must be tested and licensed same as car drivers, and threow the dam book at fools like this. There should also be a law that no license etc, no kits available over the counter. Its sad that this is what i see happening in our hobby, but again, its the few fools, usually wannabe's, that will damage any hobby for the genuine. Of course the gov't will make more laws, usually useless, when instead they should just instruct the courts to throw the whole bookcase at these fools.

Montague

I'm not surpised the Aussie politicos are running around making noise. The question is, will they pass laws and provide money to enforce them, or just make noise so the voters think they did something.

Of course, depending on the wording of the laws there, they may need to do something to make a "book" to throw. I've no idea if a clever lawyer could get someone off the hook for some reason. Like "intent" or whatever works in AU. I'm not a lawyer here in the US or anywhere else .

qldviking

hmmmmm lawyers, should be a law against them too

davidbegg

One has to be polite!

AdamsBro

My Feedback: (14)

For whatever it's worth.

Our club is at a privately owned, publicly used small airport with an active runway, and we are an AMA associated club. There are special rules we have to abide by but so long as everyone follows them there is never an incident, plus we have a really awesome runway, additional to the paved runway are 2 grass runways on either side, so it works out nicely for us. Also, we see some very awesome full scale traffic at the same time, which is another added bonus. So it's not irresponsible to put a R/C field near, or at a full scale airport, just irresponsible people may make it bad for everyone else.

At any rate, I agree the plane with the camera headed for the passenger jet, thats just ridiculous, he deserves whatever punishment he gets.

FlyerInOKC

My Feedback: (6)

I disagree with you qldviking, while requiring a license sounds attractive I think it would kill the sport. It would eliminate the Parkflyers that attract so many new would-be pilots to the hobby and in many cases its the small electric stuff keeping the LHS open. The cost is going to be expensive because of the infrastructer needed to administrate it. I started out as a kid in this hobby if I had been required to have license before I started getting into building my first kit I don't think I would be flying today. I think the best way to handle it would be catch the imbecile flying the plane in the video and give him a nice long prison sentence and a heavy fine, then publicise his conviction.

brett65

My Feedback: (18)

Our field is about a mile south of the runway for Tinker Air Force Base, and we get to see F-16s, B-1s, and AWACS all the time. Their approach angle puts them way out of our reach though. If we tried to get as high as they are I think I would lose my 40 size planes from not seeing them anymore.

Stickbuilder

While I don't think that a wholesale licensing and testing program is the answer, everyone should remember that R/C flying has never before been a cheap hobby. With the advent of the little electric RTF planes, this has changed. Most of those who try it will move on to something else fairly soon, and won't ever be considered as a member of this hobby group.

I also don't feel that the AMA's Park Pilot Program is, or is going to be effective, since there is not all that much to offer the prospective member. Most of them feel that it's perfectly okay to fly in a park, church parking lot or in their back yard. Most of the clubs that I am involved with don't and won't recognize the lower level of membership, so it pretty much leaves them out in the cold.

Bill, AMA 4720

FlyerInOKC

My Feedback: (6)

I think your club is making a mistake by not welcoming them. It has been noted a number of times in the AMA magazine and from past experience in a number of clubs that some former R/C pilots use Park Flyers as an entry back into the hobby as well as a source for new members who go on to bigger and more advance airplanes. Your attitude is out of date and harmful to the hobby as a whole. That is as bad as saying if you're not a IMAA or Pattern flyer you are not a real R/C flyer. Or saying if you don't build instead of flying ARFs you are not a real hobbist. If you judge a pilot by the size of his aircraft using your argument we should do away with Free flight and 3D Indoor flying. If I was a Park Flyer who had been snub by your club I would treet your club as a leper when I moved on to something else or when your group was looking for community support when say a zoning question came up. Park Flyers are like anyone else and just as likely to have long memories. Don't cut your nose off to spite your face.

tIANci

We had a hero in our country recently, he was telling all on the forum how he rigged his 40 sized trainer with video and telemetry, flew from a high density residential area (took off from the housing road) and then flew like a few kms away and lost the TX/RX link. He found the plane about 3 kms away.

He was oblivious about the safety issues and the rest in the forum said NOTHING. I chastised him and many felt I was too harsh. This same hero then tries another stunt, better TX/RX and flies up to about 2,000+' feet high. How smart is he? Well, when I speak up they all seem to think I am a d*ck.

People like these should be strung up to dry slowly.

FlyerInOKC

My Feedback: (6)

And the same people will be the ones who scream the loudest if they or someone they know were hit by their so-called hero's airplane.

mboland

There can be debates and whatever about licensing park pilots and recognising them ad infinitum, but there is one simple solution you are all ignoring.

And sadly it will probably be the solution the authorities grab onto if more idiots create the situations, and that is to just BAN ALL PARK FLYING.

But unless more of us are prepared to speak up, and even take the extra step and go and check out that flyer in the local park to see if he has the right attitude and knowledge, we are going to see it happen.

Don't forget, current society is controlled by fear.