tenacious101010

My Feedback: (97)

HELP NEEDED! I am new to building with a composite fuselage. I have no instructions but need ideas on how to attach the built up vertical stab to the Composite fuselage.
I have an American Eagle BT-13 fuselage and am building the vertical stab and rudder from balsa. I am not sure if I could attach it flush to the stub of the fuse except for the spars extending into the fuselage or cut out the opening and insert the sheeted stab into the opening. I would appreciate any suggestions on how to put this together. Pictures would be a great help!
Thanks, Denny

Ed Smith

I do not have pictures because I am not doing one right now. Here is how.

Remove the top surface only of the fuselage fin fillet. Make the balsa fin 1/2 longer with the extra length at the root. Sand or file this extra length until it slides into the fuselage stub. Align, glue and blend.

Done.

Ed s

KC36330

just glue it directly to the fiberglass, extend only the spar and TE into the fuselage and support it/glass it in. if it works on our 200+ MPH jets it'll work on your -13

tenacious101010

My Feedback: (97)

Well, looks like a 50/50 split, I appreciate both inputs. I am sure that both will work. I am still not sure what direction to head, at this time I am leaning a bit more towards the "mount it flush except for the spars" method. I would appreaciate many more inputs on the subject.
Thanks again for your help, Denny

daven

My Feedback: (1)

Not familiar with the plane, but it looks like the thickness of the Vert is pretty meaty, I'd sand to shape and just glue it straight to the flat part.

Ed Smith

One would think I had never done this before. I told you what to do. If the fin snaps off on the very first nose over then you will know why.

Ed S

P.S. I notice that none of the "Experts" suggested cleaning off any mold release wax residue from the "Just stick it on" area.

tenacious101010

My Feedback: (97)

Ed S, Relax. Dont be so defensive, all are posting in good faith to be of assistance and appreciate their inputs. Relax, I dont know how many times you or anyone else has done this. Just because you "told me" how to do it, doesnt mean you are the only one who has sucessfully attached a vertical stab. It seems according to your post, your method and only your method will work satisfactorally. I doubt that may be the case. I will figure out which way I will do it and I doubt I will do it in a way that it will fall of if it noses over.
No, they didnt say to clean off the mold release wax, or not to use school glue or to use glue and not masking tape or yellow stickies to attach it. Like you, they probably made some assumptions as to my building skills. I appreciate your input, but the attitude that seems to come across in your last post makes me think I prefer not to have your input. I am sure many here would do it the same way as you have suggested.
Thanks again, I will consider your method.

Through the history of man, there have been many shortages. Shortages of Potatoes, Water, Gas, and many other things but never a shortage of advice. But Good advice, well, at times it can be hard to find or separate from the bad advice. I recommend anyone who seeks information to gather it from many seperate independant sources, then when you get the vast majority of inputs that are similar, you most likely have the answer that you are looking for. I have found this a sucessful method in many instances. Thanks again to any that offer advice.
Denny

KC36330

pull your panties out of a wad there Ed, should we hold his hand as he mixes the epoxy too or do you think he might have enough common sense to figure out a few things on his own?

Ed Smith

Well, the post started of with this

I am quite sure the poster has common sense. What was needed though was sound advice from somebody with many years of experience. That is what was given.

See the picture. I built four of these from scratch, my own molds for the fuselage. They had exactly the type of vert stab attachment being discussed. As had many others. Do not be shy, show examples of your work.


Ed S

tenacious101010

My Feedback: (97)

I hated to do it, but had to block the first person on RCU. Such a shame for a place meant to support fun and relaxation.
I am able to sort the good advice from the bad, so please refrain from attacking others, its just so pathetic. I am sure they had the best of intentions to start with, but its just too weird for me. Shows a real lack of depth and surely erodes ones reputation, amazing how cheap people will sell their digity and self respect.
Denny

KC36330

here's pics of the fins of the F-18 I've just finished up (it'll maiden Saturday weather permitting), you can see the bolts that hold the fin on (aluminum pin in the front), one on each fin and then the main spar (carbon) is also clamped from inside the fuselage, no glue at all.......



my F-15, it has two fins held on with nothing but a single #6 screw up through the bottom of each like seen above, it has no clamping just the single screw.........


my Byron F-16 (ducted fan so slower then the two above but still hit 140ish) the original fin was injection foam that was nothing more then glued to the top of the fiberglass fuselage (hopefuly everyone sanded the mold release off ), i rebuilt the fin with balsa sheeted foam with balsa LE/TE to make it more scale. the trailing edge extended down into the fuselage and was glassed in, not necessarily for support of the fin but because the rudder had an internal linkage that ran down the TE into the fuze and it supported it to prevent flutter.......


FEJ F-16, it would only hit 180 w/ P-70, fin is held on just like the F-15, just a single bolt up through the fuze, the bolt was just in front of the TE and allowed the LE to lift about 1/8" if forced by hand, but never had any problems in flight........

tenacious101010

My Feedback: (97)

KC, I like the bolt on option, it would actually solve one of the issues with making scale hinges for the rudder, thanks for sharing the images and information.
Denny

Ed Smith

Now we are getting somewhere. Several pictures of excellent work. It just needed that challenge. despite the criticism I did some good after all. What else do we want to know????

Ed S

KC36330

you're welcome. back in the days of ducted fans i had never used a bolt on fin or I'd of likely modded and did the same with the Byron above, it makes things allot easier if you never need to store/ship them.

tenacious101010

My Feedback: (97)

Hey KC, The last F-16 picture you posted. The image of the tiger head on the tail, is that from an F-16 of the 906th in New Jersey?

KC36330

that's a Belgium 'tiger meat' F-16 paint scheme. their flag is on the top of the fin.

tenacious101010

My Feedback: (97)

Ahhh, cool, It looked like the 906th tiger emblem. I was an F-16 maintenance Instructor in the Air Force and worked with them, even got a chance to fly one of their F-4s before they converted to the F-16. Great looking planes, one of these days I will have to get an RC F-16.
Denny

SCALECRAFT

My Feedback: (13)

Hi

All good suggestion.

Here's what has worked for me.

I have a similar situation on my BT glass fuse P 51D. what I did was put a vertical spar that extends from the base of the fuse, passes through the H stab and supports the V stab as it is almost as tall as the V stab.

Kinda locks all the surfaces together.

Keep it light.

Steve

daven

My Feedback: (1)

Ed, the original Larson Dago Red Q40 (roughly 2000 vintage) had a wood verticle that was flush glued to the fiberglass fuse. No pins, no plates, no nothing. The verticle is also not very wide 3/16" at widest, so not much area in contact other than Epoxy / micro balloon fillets I made.

This Q40 has been used and abused for about 8 years and just got a fresh paint job (not the planes fault) this past winter. I have yet to have issue with the Vertical coming loose installed this way, and as you well know this plane exceeds 185 mph.

I am quite confident that a flush mounted attachment would be more than sufficient to hold that Verticle on.

You are correct, that I should not have assumed the wax/mold release was removed prior to gluing.