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  1. #1

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    Fuel for old engines

    I have grand children that I would like to show what I did in the 1950s. I built 2 Ringmasters and am building a flite streak.
    I bought a brand new Fox 35 stunt I have a Torpedo 29 a Torpedo 19 a O&R 19. So I need Fuel with castor oil only. I live in South east Kansas I get my R/C fuel from a club at Coffelville they only use Bryon and order cases. I normaly only use less than 2 gallons a year in my Sato and Super Tiger. I used to ocasonaly go to Joplin(2 or 3 times a year) but since the tornado both the hoby shops are gone. I had thought I would just by the fuel from Fox. The Fox fuel is $23/gal they only sell cases. I found Sig has fuel for $13/gal +$14 handeling +$27.50 hazmat + shipping. So that is the sad story. I found out at the drag strip near Joplin I can buy methanol for $3-$4/gal. So were to buy Castor oil and Nitromethane? I bought a 4oz bottel of castor oil at walmart and I tryed to mix it with a small amount of Bryon and it would not mix. I pored it in and it just sat on the bottom I mixed it up came back an hour later and it was seperated on the bottom. Dose any one know what other sorces I might find. I kind of sospect that I don't need the nitro. Joe Fisher the 67 year old kid.

  2. #2

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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    you should be able to get castor oil from Sig and Klotz has castor oil as well. You should be able to get Nitro from Klotz as well, it will be about 30.00 a gallon plus shipping not sure if they sell it in quarts.
    I want my Six Dollars!!!!

  3. #3

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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    Just add enough caster to the fuel you can get to raise the oil level overall to 28%. The synthetic today isnt the same stuff we had to use in 1970.

  4. #4

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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    Joe

    There are active control line groups in Wichita and Tulsa and Topeka. For small lots, I would try to contact them to find a hobby shop in one of those places.



  5. #5
    Sport_Pilot's Avatar
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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    Castor oil sources: Sig, Fox (call its not on their web site), Morgans (again call), many go kart and motorcycle shops, and VP. Nitromethane, VP, Torco, and Angus. VP and Torco may not sell to you direct. VP's web site will show their distributers, call them and they can give you a list of their end point customers. Some distributers may sell direct. No hasmat feefor castor oil.
    Glow Head Brotherhood #15

  6. #6

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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    According to the Bryon web site they use either 18% or 20% total oil content, this is pretty common and all you need to do is add 12 oz. of castor to a gallon of fuel this will bump your total oil content up to around 25% to 27% depending on what fuel you're using and you will be good to go.

    This is where I get my castor. http://brodak.com/castor-oil-quart.html
    Good luck
    Dwayne


  7. #7

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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    Thanks guys. I was hoping I could find something local Friday I went to a Motorcycle shop in Chanute and they had never heard of castor oil HaHa.

  8. #8
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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    Red Max fuel http://www.fhsoils.com/model.html would custom blend whatever the customer desired.

    They're in South Carolina and will quote you shipping etc. Give them a call.
    Good flying wit ya today

  9. #9

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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    i went to a motorcycle shop friday and they had clotz castor. it is called beanol or something like that. Tower Hobbies carries this as well.
    I want my Six Dollars!!!!

  10. #10

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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    sorry Klotz BeNOL tower has it in pints for 9.39 i know Klotz has it in quarts as well.
    I want my Six Dollars!!!!

  11. #11
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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    ORIGINAL: Joseph Fisher

    I have grand children that I would like to show what I did in the 1950s. I built 2 Ringmasters and am building a flite streak.
    I bought a brand new Fox 35 stunt I have a Torpedo 29 a Torpedo 19 a O&R 19. So I need Fuel with castor oil only. I live in South east Kansas I get my R/C fuel from a club at Coffelville they only use Bryon and order cases. I normaly only use less than 2 gallons a year in my Sato and Super Tiger. I used to ocasonaly go to Joplin(2 or 3 times a year) but since the tornado both the hoby shops are gone. I had thought I would just by the fuel from Fox. The Fox fuel is $23/galΒ* they only sell cases. I found Sig has fuel for $13/gal +$14 handeling +$27.50 hazmat + shipping. So that is the sad story. I found out at the drag strip near Joplin I can buy methanol for $3-$4/gal. So were to buy Castor oil and Nitromethane? I bought a 4oz bottel of castor oil at walmart and I tryed to mix it with a small amount of Bryon and it would not mix. I pored it in and it just sat on the bottom I mixed it up came back an hour later and it was seperated on the bottom. Dose any one know what other sorces I might find. I kind of sospect that I don't need the nitro.Β* Joe FisherΒ* the 67 year old kid.
    I will soon find my formula for a fuel that is fine using mostly current fuels with some added castor. It works on Fox 19, 35, and several others. Most of my models ae 10 -30 years old and still fly fine when I mow the back yard adequately to fly them. I am on a break for yard work right now but will get back this pm.

    Meanwhile try this provider for everything needed for toy-airplane BUILDERS.

    http:www,aircraftspruce.com/contactus.phb

    The VW Van was just before I left for my last USAF Model Airplane Championships, Aug. '67. I won first in CL Stunt, and C Free Flight plus places in several lesser events.
    Been in this sport for a while now. Left the USAF, 2-'68 for UAL.

    Best of luck to you. I have one grandson now 20 years old that at 14 he was flying everything I had, RC and CL. But alas at about 16 he came down big time with G & G disease and now as a Soph in college (Navy ROTC) he has no time for toys - other than the live ones - You know G & G: Gas and Girls.
    Have fun with your grand children while you can.
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    Horrace Cain AMA L-93

    Peace is the brief glorious moment in history when everyone stands around reloading.\" T. Jefferson

  12. #12
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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    Horace, just from the pictures, just wanted to say, your granddaughter is cute as a bug with your transmitter and large scale Fokker Eindecker. That VW bus is a classic and so are those planes next to it. [8D]

    I remember watching the fliers at Keesler AFB, Biloxi, MS in 1965 - 1966. One had an immaculate RC Goldberg Shoestring Racer. I was amazed how well it flew on multi-channel then, just like the real thing. I was in 5th grade then with my first CL kit, a Scientific F6F Hellcat built-up with Cox .020 Pee Wee.
    George Hostler
    Clovis MADS AMA Club, Vintage R/C Society (VRCS)
    And we know love by this, that He laid down His life for us, and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren. 1 John 3:16

  13. #13

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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    Gald I started this tread It is fun. I was at Keesler in 1963-1964 and went to the Air Traning Comand contest at Lackland. I got theard place in rudder only with my Ambroid Charger OS pet .15 ,Controlair mule transmitter Controlair 4 reciver(I built from kits) . Stunt I Crashed my Nobler.
    I found out I can get the Ethonal in Chanute and I will get the castor from Sig. I will try it with out the nitro. Aperentaly I can get the nitro mix with methonal 50/50. I will see what happens.

  14. #14
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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    Yes sir Joseph, that Controlaire Mule TX & RX with OS Pet .15 and Ambroid Charger are real classics. Outerzone.co.uk has the plan:

    [link]http://www.outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=2903[/link]



    ... if you ever wanted to build the plane again.

    I remember eying the Nobler in America Hobby Center's airplane catalog. It had a classic look about it. One of these days I might scratch build it. The other was the Shark 45.

    RC was expensive enough that I got my start out of high school back in 1972 with an Ace RC Pulse Commander on 27.995 MHz (Brown) and Adams Actuator on a Top Flite RC Schoolboy with Cox .020 Pee Wee. Crashed many times, repaired many times, taught me a lot about flying.

    I sent a a mail order to Hobby Shack back in 1973, wanting to install an OS Pet .06 standard in my Goldberg Junior Falcon for a hotter rudder plane. Instead, Hobby Shack was out of the .06 and substituted the OS Max.10RC engine in its place at no extra charge. At only 3 ounces weight, that was the best upgrade for an .049 plane. I installed it in a Top Flite 39" span Schoolmaster on Ace pulse rudder only with auxiliary quick blip sequential throttle (hi-med-lo back to hi). It would haul the Schoolmaster at a 45 degree climbing angle up to altitude. half throttle was like flying with an .049 engine. Idle I could practice low passes. Noise was the same loudness as an unmuffled .049, but sounded muffled at 1/2 throttle or less.

    There would have been a good chance that you would have crossed paths with my family if we were there a year earlier.
    George Hostler
    Clovis MADS AMA Club, Vintage R/C Society (VRCS)
    And we know love by this, that He laid down His life for us, and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren. 1 John 3:16

  15. #15
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    RE: Fuel for old engines


    ORIGINAL: Joseph Fisher

    Β*Β*Β*Β*Β* Gald I started this tread It is fun. I was at Keesler in 1963-1964 and went to the Air Traning Comand contest at Lackland. I got theard place in rudder only with my Ambroid Charger OS pet .15 ,Controlair mule transmitter Controlair 4 reciver(I built from kits) . Stunt I Crashed my Nobler.
    Β*Β*Β*Β*Β* I found out I can get the Ethonal in Chanute and I will get the castor from Sig. I will try it with out the nitro. Aperentaly I can get the nitro mixΒ* with methonalΒ* 50/50.Β*Β* I will see what happens.
    Well we were not far apart. I did not make the ATC in 63 or 64 but did the 65-66-67.

    Here is that fuel formula that works with all my OLD engines, that I fly every so often. Fox 19, Fox 29, and Fox 35s - 36, and .40, included along with even some .049, 074, and .15. Regardless of the other opinions, a good friend now gone, but once was an engine man fo a magazine, FM, I seem to recall told me this and he was RIGHT!
    Small engines need lot of oil vice nitro. My cox .049 fly sport very easy to start and needle with the formula below. I always had trouble with my 1/2 A speed and FF engines by using high nitro as it was said one must do. When I learned it was all about OIL, I never had anymore problems.

    No problem getting the fuel basics and just some Castor needed as the only extra.

    64 Oz. (1/2 Gal.) of 10% nitro, 18% oil (Standard 80-20 syn-castor)

    32 Oz. (qt) 5% Nitro 16% oil (Std 80-20 syn/castor)

    Add 14 Oz. Castor Oil

    RESULT: 110 Oz. fuel: 7.8% nitro, 27.8% oil at 56% Castor and 44% Syn.

    It works fine for me.
    Horrace Cain AMA L-93

    Peace is the brief glorious moment in history when everyone stands around reloading.\" T. Jefferson

  16. #16
    Hossfly's Avatar
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    RE: Fuel for old engines



    ORIGINAL: Joseph Fisher

    Β*Β*Β*Β*Β* Gald I started this tread It is fun. I was at Keesler in 1963-1964 and went to the Air Traning Comand contest at Lackland. I got theard place in rudder only with my Ambroid Charger OS pet .15 ,Controlair mule transmitter Controlair 4 reciver(I built from kits) . Stunt I Crashed my Nobler.
    Β*Β*Β*Β*Β* I found out I can get the Ethonal in Chanute and I will get the castor from Sig. I will try it with out the nitro. Aperentaly I can get the nitro mixΒ* with methonalΒ* 50/50.Β*Β* I will see what happens.
    Well we were not far apart. I did not make the ATC in 63 or 64 but did the 65-66-67.

    Here is that fuel formula that works with all my OLD engines, that I fly every so often. Fox 19, Fox 29, and Fox 35s - 36, and .40, included along with even some .049, 074, and .15. Regardless of the other opinions, a good friend now gone, but once was an engine man for a magazine, FM, I seem to recall told me this and he was RIGHT!
    Small engines need lot of oil vice nitro. My Cox .049s fly sport very easy to start and needle with the formula below. I always had trouble with my 1/2 A speed and FF engines by using high nitro as it was said one must do. When I learned it was all about OIL, I never had anymore problems.

    No problem getting the fuel basics and just some Castor needed as the only extra.

    64 Oz. (1/2 Gal.) of 10% nitro, 18% oil (Standard 80-20 syn-castor)

    32 Oz. (qt) 5% Nitro 16% oil (Std 80-20 syn/castor)

    Add 14 Oz. Castor Oil

    RESULT: 110 Oz. fuel: 7.8% nitro, 27.8% oil at 56% Castor and 44% Syn.

    It works fine for me.
    Horrace Cain AMA L-93

    Peace is the brief glorious moment in history when everyone stands around reloading.\" T. Jefferson

  17. #17
    Sport_Pilot's Avatar
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    RE: Fuel for old engines


    ORIGINAL: Joseph Fisher

    Thanks guys. I was hoping I could find something local Friday I went to a Motorcycle shop in Chanute and they had never heard of castor oil HaHa.
    Look for a shop specializing in racing. It is not use in street bikes.
    Glow Head Brotherhood #15

  18. #18

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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    If you make it to St. Louis, Schaffer's Hobby on Gravois is where I get my Sig fuel. I drive up from Austin TX, so it is really no trip for you.

  19. #19

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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    just for clarification, all of my OS Pet engines were .09. Were there really .06 and .15 Pets?

    My first OS was a MAX-I .15, followed by a MAX-II .15, and several MAX-III .15's, etc.

    I had Pet .09's starting with the 2 screw, no fins version. I never had a OS .06.

    George

  20. #20
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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    Bro. George, re the OS Pet .06, in 1973 or 1974 I mail ordered one from Hobby Shack. They were out of stock so they sent me an OS Max .10 RC at no extra cost. According to Sceptre Flight Engine Tests, there was also a .099 displacement Pet.

    I don't have any of the Pets, but from what I've read they seemed to be decent engines in their own right.
    George Hostler
    Clovis MADS AMA Club, Vintage R/C Society (VRCS)
    And we know love by this, that He laid down His life for us, and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren. 1 John 3:16

  21. #21

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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    I still have it went to look at mine it is MAX-III  OS 15  I put a picture an the gallery I couldn't figure out how to put it here

  22. #22
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    RE: Fuel for old engines


    ORIGINAL: Joseph Fisher

    I still have it went to look at mine it is MAX-III OS 15 I put a picture an the gallery I couldn't figure out how to put it here
    At the bottom right of theReply to Messagebox is thisClick here to upload images and files!click it and navigate to you picture

    Ken
    \"As for Me and My House, We Will Serve the Lord\"
    Club Saito Member 775
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  23. #23

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    RE: Fuel for old engines


    ORIGINAL: Joseph Fisher

    I still have it went to look at mine it is MAX-III OS 15 I put a picture an the gallery I couldn't figure out how to put it here
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  24. #24

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    RE: Fuel for old engines

    ORIGINAL: GallopingGhostler

    Bro. George, re the OS Pet .06, in 1973 or 1974 I mail ordered one from Hobby Shack. They were out of stock so they sent me an OS Max .10 RC at no extra cost. According to Sceptre Flight Engine Tests, there was also a .099 displacement Pet.

    I don't have any of the Pets, but from what I've read they seemed to be decent engines in their own right.
    I think that may have been a typo on Hobby Shack's part. It was probably why they substituted the .10.

    This pic shows a Pet-II .09. The upper right shows a MAX .10. The three lower engines are Pet-III .09's.

    I no longer have the earlier versions of the Pet .09.

    George
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  25. #25

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    RE: Fuel for old engines


    ORIGINAL: Joseph Fisher
    I still have it went to look at mine it is MAX-IIIΒ* OS 15.
    My MAX-I .15 was a CL version and served me well, but I eventually traded it to a friend. My MAX-II .15 is a combined CL and RC version, which I still have. My MAX-III .15's were all bought as RC but I converted one to CL.

    From what I remember the MAX-I introduced OS to the American market (in the .15 size). The MAX-II were improved but short lived because they were shortly replaced by the MAX-III which were used for quite a few years. I THINK the MAX-III was the last of the steel fins. All subsequent models have a drop-in liner.

    George
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