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Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

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Old 07-13-2011, 05:28 PM
  #26
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

THe Orange Receiver that is sold by HobbyKing has a short, about 1" aerial. The one shown in the wreckage has a aerial approx. 5" long. PLease advise if you had modified the Rx. or what make of receiver you were using. Many modellers are using the Orange Rx. without any problems.
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Old 07-13-2011, 07:14 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

Great lookin' 4*! Sorry about the crash... Looks like the pilot's expression in the last photo says it all. Good luck with the re-build.
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Old 07-13-2011, 07:15 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

misterv, the 6-channel OrangeRx has the short antenna. The 9-channel OrangeRx has the longer antenna. The Rx you see in my photos is the 9-channel.
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Old 07-13-2011, 09:23 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

Kamot. You could have still had a voltage drop internally through vibration or subpar connection. I HAD A SIMILAR MAIDEN DAY with a 300, crash sounded the same . About 45 degress down and the throttle picked up (still got the deepest bury record from that). Turned out the entire servo tray vibrated loose. At that point, up elevator will give you up throttle. She was a haulin when reunited with Terre Firma. Soft spring ground put the motor elbow deep. Sorry for your loss, hope you can get up quickley either way
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Old 07-14-2011, 02:15 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

A long time ago, or it feels like it. A old timer that can build, fly and fix just about anything. He gave me some simple advice. Keep a ragged out trainer around. Before you go out and fly your new plane. Put all the radio gear in the old trainer and give it a few shake down flights. It took a while for me to get on board with that advice, But, that is what I do. Some of my flying buddies even use the old trainer. Something happens like your mishap. The radio is suspect. Stick the whole works in the trainer. It has saved a lot of grief.
What happened to your plane is any ones guess. So far all those that have replied to your post have dished out some good advice. Some have tried to cheer you up with some fun things. They are sharing their many hours of flying, repair and just good natured advice. The good thing about this hobby is so many good folks.
Now I got to get back to fixing my muffler bearings.
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Old 07-14-2011, 02:58 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

Was that guys last name Kraft? LOL
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Old 07-14-2011, 04:43 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

you still need the satallite rx to go with it. or should have it on there,for the proper range. it has two sat, ports if it' as a nine ch..........RON
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Old 07-14-2011, 04:55 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...dProduct=13418
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Old 07-14-2011, 06:42 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

Quote:
You could have still had a voltage drop internally through vibration or subpar connection. I HAD A SIMILAR MAIDEN DAY
Definitely food for thought! Thanks for that.

Quote:
Keep a ragged out trainer around. Before you go out and fly your new plane. Put all the radio gear in the old trainer and give it a few shake down flights.
Awesome advice, thanks!

Quote:
you still need the satallite rx to go with it. or should have it on there,for the proper range. it has two sat, ports if it' as a nine ch
Thanks for that. It's confusing because different folks say that the sat. receivers do not increase range but actually just give the Rx more angles to pick up the signal from. [&:]
In any case I do not fly out very far from where I stand. And 'standard' receivers "used to be" good for a mile, so what the heck are they now?
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Old 07-14-2011, 07:27 AM
  #35
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

I'm looking for a link but there is a really good video on youtube where a guy does a comparison range test. He does two test. He uses an alarm that goes off if the receiver loses signal. The first test he put the receiver in a pot and walks off until he can't here the servos moving in the pot. Then next test he puts his radio in a buckets then hops in his car and drive off until the alarm goes off on the reciver in his car. The Futaba receiver was good for like 1.2 miles wile the OrangeRx one was good for 4000 feet or so.


I'm going to try the drive off test with mine.
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Old 07-14-2011, 07:31 AM
  #36
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

So question, brown outs caused by temp loss of good supply of power, correct?

I am kinda a newbie, 3 flights would be pushing my gut feeling for battery life. I do have a voltage indicator. Never done 3 flights on a single battery. Considering flights are both 10 mins. That is 25-30 mins that battery has been on considering pre-flight checks and all.

My bat is also the same size as the one in the video if that is the one you used in your plane.


Just a simple observation, opinion, not flaming anybody or any piece of hardware or vendor.
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Old 07-14-2011, 08:55 AM
  #37
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

Kmot, I noticed in one of your previous posts that you velcro'd the receiver in place but no mention of padding around it? If so then vibration could be the cause of the brownout ....

Brand name does not necessarily assure a good receiver. I had a brand new multiplex 9CH receiver (72Mhz) which was on its 5th or so flight in my 50 size helicopter completely die (it was well padded and mounted) on me. Luckily I was hovering and it only fell a few feet but it was a bugger to cut the motor with the blades spinning fast just above arm and head (in hindsight should have just let it run out of gas). Tested the receiver afterwards with different battery etc and totally dead. Sent back to Hitec for replacement and never found out what failed internally.

So far have had 0 problems with JR transmitter and Spektrum receivers, but mileage can vary with any technology/brand.

I think the idea of testing any equipment in an old hobo airplane is great (or even a parkflyer) before using in a new one.

Sorry about your crash, I followed your build thread and you did a great job on the build!

Hopefully you will be up in the air again soon. Keep us updated.

Oh, and I believe you are correct about the satellite receivers, they enhance the angle for the signal to be received and as far as I know do not extend the range.

Dave

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Old 07-14-2011, 09:04 AM
  #38
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

The article posted on WWW.MODELAIRPLANENEWS.COM on May 30, 2011, now on page 8, titled "2.4GHz : Is It All It's Cracked Up To Be?" will explain why some of us are experiencing technical difficulties on 2.4GHz band.
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Old 07-14-2011, 09:14 AM
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

Hey Dave, Can you provide the link to the article. Tried to find it.

Thanks
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Old 07-14-2011, 10:43 AM
  #40
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

The article is also posted on GOOGLE.    Type in the following:    2.4GHz : is it all it's cracked up to be?
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Old 07-14-2011, 11:25 AM
  #41
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

Kmot... where did you get your pilot... I need one like that...
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Old 07-14-2011, 12:15 PM
  #42
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

sorry kmot
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Old 07-14-2011, 01:15 PM
  #43
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

Gooseman: The first two flights were no longer than 3 minutes. The final flight was less than 2 minutes. The total time running including taxi to the runway and back 2 1/2 times, was around 12 minutes, according to what is on video.

davevh: Yes, it was velcro'd and had no padding. My error. I got complacent because of electric planes.

Guitarman52: It is a Slimline brand, and they have several interesting pilot characters.

weezle: Thanks.

I started an attempt at repairing the fuselage, and even glued back together the front end. But it looked rough and crappy, and would have required bondo and such. When I got to the part of the fuselage where it broke in half I tried lining up the breaks and after having a good hard look at what it would take to rebuild it, and what it would probably look like afterward, I decided it was not what I wanted to do. This plane was gorgeous. I do not want a patched up Frankenstein.

The wing is salvageable. I am keeping it and will rebuild it some day. I cut the tail off of the back half of the fuselage for a 'crash trophy', and threw the rest in the rubbish after I salvaged all the hardware.

I have other kits to build and fly. It's over for this one....
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Old 07-14-2011, 03:19 PM
  #44
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

The orange 2.4 Specktum recievers are plagued with the same DSM2 problems as JR/Spectrum recievers.
The Orange 2.4 Futaba recievers are bullet proof.... there are guys flying jets with them. I have them in 3 gassers.

Never...Never wrap you 2.4 reciever in foam! They need air to stay cool.

Chris923
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Old 07-14-2011, 04:36 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

A couple of points no one has brought up,
1) you said the battery was 1-1/2 years old, was it sitting all of that time?
2) Did you cycle it before putting it back into service?
3) with the aerodynamic loads on the control surfaces, you will get considerably higher current draw from the radio system then you will on the bench.
I would recommend applying a load while reading the voltage, I use 1156 automotive bulbs to discharge my battery packs, they draw about 2 amps per bulb so 1 or 2 would be sufficient to replicate the loads that might be seen in flight. For more than one just wire them up in series.
I know the pics aren't an 1156, but an 1157 that's what I had handy at the time, the concept is the same.
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Old 07-14-2011, 05:45 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

I have bashed planes worse than that many times. It is inevitable since I have over twenty years in the hobby. If I have other planes to fly I put the deceased in a corner for a week or two and forget about it. Then I pull it out and look it over closely. 99% of the time I say this ain't so bad. I then rebuild it. Sure it gets a little heavier but in many cases our planes can handle extra weight with no ill effect.

If you had two good flights and crashed on the third. I would suspect the battery especially if it was older. I cycle mine four to five times before I put them in service and they have to accept 85% or more of the original MAH. I then check the voltage before every flight. If they are not at 5.2 or better (four cell) then I recharge. Learned that many years ago. I have not lost a plane to battery failure in over ten years.

Good luck.
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Old 07-14-2011, 07:49 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

Probably you are all correct. I was negligent with my battery. I did not cycle it because it is a NiMh. I thought only NiCd's needed cycling. I did charge it and use it up quite a lot while installing and setting up the radio. I then charged it up again but probably only to 75%. However I only had the plane in the air for about 7 or 8 minutes total.

I cannot replicate the failure on the bench. Some people blame the Rx because it is Orange. Some people blame the battery. I still have not figured it out.

But there is some good news, at least. I cleaned the engine today and the crankshaft did not get bent. The engine is still in great shape, only the needle valve extension got bent. Yay!
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Old 07-14-2011, 07:56 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

And I found this.
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Old 07-14-2011, 08:32 PM
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

Supposedly nimh is less likely to develop a memory, but I have noticed with some of my electric cars that after a long lay-off the first few runs are no where near as long as they should be.

Quote:
But there is some good news, at least. I cleaned the engine today and the crankshaft did not get bent. The engine is still in great shape, only the needle valve extension got bent. Yay!
Ah, the silver lining to this particular cloud.

Looks like you have the opportunity to shorten the wing by at least one bay by the looks of the picture of the wing.
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Old 07-14-2011, 08:44 PM
  #50
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Default RE: Four Star 60 dies on maiden day.

Hey Kmot. Use plenty of glue to make her nice and stong. leave about 4 inches off the nose and Fit the 400 [>:]

I lost my 4 Star 40 due to radio failure, The so called pilot didnt know how to use the radio..Or fly...
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