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  1. #1

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    Check your control surfaces people!

    I explain in the video what happened. If anyone has seen my Discontinued GP Fokker Dr1 rebuild and "bash" thread; http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_10..._1/key_/tm.htm then you will be amazed on what is done to this bird by this winter. No matter how small of a adjustment is made in your radios, make sure you check your controls before flight. Someone was talking to me when I was assembling the plane for flight and I was side tracked. I'm not blaming him- I'm blaming myself because I should have known better no matter what, I think that's why it hurts so much.


    [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjq0Aaj69wo&feature=plcp[/youtube]


    I have already stipped the covering and removed all items from this aircraft. I will be starting a rebuid and bash thread at RC Groups in a few days.


    Pete





  2. #2
    countilaw's Avatar
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    RE: Check your control surfaces people!

    It's only normal that when I set my plane to taxi, before I move onto the runway, I check my control surfaces. Not only to see if they are working, but to make note of the degree of motion as well as direction . It's a good habit to develope and maintain before each and every flight. Not just one time when you finish the plane, but before each and every flight.

    Proper flight line habits including safety are very important. They should become second nature and if they are, you will lose a lot less planes. And you can use all that time you spend rebuilding, to building that new bird.

    Frank
    AMA #5810
    CPA # 73
    Contest Director
    AMA Introductory Flight Instructor

  3. #3

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    RE: Check your control surfaces people!

    Dude....I have to ask..........what does that mean "your hand accidently hit the switch, reversing the aileron servo's"????

    I have been flying RC for 40 years, and in all that time, I have NEVER had ANY servo on ANY switch, that would reverse it in flight!! Now maybe you plugged the aileron servo's in, in the wrong spot on the receiver, I've done that........BUT A SWITCH???

    Please explain what you mean..........[X(]
    RC MANIAC-PRO BRO 1900-AMA# 95841

  4. #4

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    RE: Check your control surfaces people!

    ORIGINAL: RC MANIAC119

    Dude....I have to ask..........what does that mean ''your hand accidently hit the switch, reversing the aileron servo's''????

    I have been flying RC for 40 years, and in all that time, I have NEVER had ANY servo on ANY switch, that would reverse it in flight!! Now maybe you plugged the aileron servo's in, in the wrong spot on the receiver, I've done that........BUT A SWITCH???

    Please explain what you mean..........[X(]

    Not to be a wize arse, but people can have 50 years and it could happen. I have seen a guy who has been flying since the 1950's with a early AMA number do it once at a club I once belonged to. (Nicest guy you would ever want to meet and he wasn't cocky like some Ol'timers I know) For your info I'm not a spring chicken if you know what I mean, even though you might have 30 years on me. So let's stop the BS.

    I have a JRSX600 and the way you get to the settings you get it to ailerons, then push the left switch down until you scroll down to aileron travel adjustment on the face. While I was redoing my throws ( the recommendations in the original directions was to little, role rate was horrible) I accidently hit the wrong button and didn't know I did it because my eyes were on the manual control throw meter on the wing, not on the radio for that split second. I looked back at my radio and I noticed I was adjusting the trim all of a sudden, and Not travel adjustment. So I put my trim back on "0" like it originally was and got it back to travel adustment- not knowing that I hit the reverse aileron setting when it went up to trim.

    So you see, you can have 60 years in and still screw up. Just because you have 40, 30, 20 or 10 years in doesn't mean you know everything in this hobby. It can happen to anybody and most everyone I met has one time or another missed catching the reversed ailerons. It just took me 10 years to join that club. I too used to boast that in my 10 years I hadn't ever done it, and scoffed at anyone that did it. Well- what comes around goes around and it finally bit me in the arse. I boast no more!

    I originally had planned on highly modifying and "Bashing this plane to be even more realistic and scale this winter, but because of my "Duh" moment, I have now already started the project a few months early. Both of my planes made Page 82. in the March issue (Pearl Harbor Addition) because my "Bashed" Fokker DR1 got a lot of attention at one of the shows I attended. If any of you seen my work with my GP Fokker Dr1, then you would know this crash ain't nothing, but I learned so much.

    Yes, next time I will bring a check list and follow it everytime I fly. ( I do it when I fly the full size so why not) It's a good idea because you never know when you might get a little distracted and for a split second not pay attention. As you can see, this sort of thing can happen.

    Let me reiterate- All I did was adjust my control rate in the ailerons a few weeks earlier. Normally from doing that it wouldn't switch the servos to reverse. But because my hand hit the wrong button, eyes on the plane not being aware- voila!

    So in other words, my hand accidently hit the reverse servo switch function. Same as reverse servo switch where I come from. I posted this to teach everyone that this can happen to you, so always check your control surfaces. My pain can be another ones gain and don't ever be complacent like I was. 10,20,30,40 years don't mean a darn thing to me. When I think I know it all, or feel that I'm too good to think things won't happen, I'll quit the hobby because by then I will have stopped learning.

    And please Frank, don't call me Dude- I have a name.


    Pete

  5. #5
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    RE: Check your control surfaces people!

    Pete, I didn't call you dude.

    The main jist of my posts is that before every take off, check your control surfaces. Not just that they move, but for direction as well. Even at contest, before my assistant releases my plane, we check surfaces. He calls out what he wants to see, as in left aileron, and I move left aileron. He is checking for movement and the direction.

    Everyone should do this before every flight. Just a suggestion in my opinion.

    Frank
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  6. #6
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    RE: Check your control surfaces people!

    Just did this myself on Sunday after rebuilding the wing on my GSRyan. I went through all the pre flight battery test ect. but even after checking all the contols I still missed the ailerons being reversed. Scared the crap out of me as the plane started banking left a little after liftoff I pushed the stick right and went over left even more, somehow my brain registered what was happening and I pushed the stick back left and got it flying. Had to go around the pattern for a reversed control landing with some cross wind. I made it back in one piece some how. I 'm shaking just thinking about it It just did not register with me when I checked the controls that right was left. You can't be too careful.
    If what you believed to be true was false would you want to know the truth?

    "You shall know the truth, and the truth will set you free".

  7. #7

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    RE: Check your control surfaces people!


    ORIGINAL: raptureboy

    Just did this myself on Sunday after rebuilding the wing on my GSÂ*Ryan. I went through all the pre flight battery test ect. but even after checking all the contols I still missed the ailerons being reversed. Scared the crap out of me as the plane started banking left a little after liftoff I pushed the stick right and went over left even more, somehow my brain registered what was happening and I pushed the stick back left and got it flying. Had to go around the pattern for a reversed control landing with some cross wind. I made it back in one piece some how. I 'm shaking just thinking about it[img][/img]Â* It just did not register with me when I checked the controls that right was left. [img][/img]Â*You can't be too careful.


    Wow! Fantastic job! I'm glad you got it back.

    With me whenever I just do a aileron setup even when I have it right, she will bank a little to the left or right after takeoff. Normally I will compensate by stick until I get the plane high enough, then I'll just trim it out.

    Unfortunately, I couldn't get the plane high enough to have it register in my brain what was happening. But that's OK, she will fly again and I won't make that mistake again. I was amazed at the support I got fom my club, family and friends. Everyone at my club said it has happened to them at one time or another, and said I wasn't a true ol'timer member until it has atleast happened once. I'm now a part of that club, so if I see it happen to someone else, I can feel the pain and offer encouragement.

    That's good flying raptureboy. I met a few that were lucky enough to get it back in one piece, and I know how rare it is in this hobby. There should be a hall of fame for that kind of stuff IMO.


    Pete

  8. #8
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    RE: Check your control surfaces people!

    Sorry to see that mistake, but it does happen often,, It happened to me last about 20 years ago, before my first Computer radio I'd swap RXs between planes,, Well I forgot to reverse the Ail. and pretty much the same thing happen that happened to you, but going about 3 times as fast into a paved runway the plane was totalled.

    Since then, Every flight, I check Ail. direction along with the other surfaces right before I roll out to the runway, Every time.
    You're so smart,, you figured out how to read this!! Or maybe ya just got lucky??

  9. #9
    Villa's Avatar
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    RE: Check your control surfaces people!

    There is a bad habit I see at our field many times. I frequently discuss it with the offender. Many do not take it well. The bad habit is right after they start the engine, they reach over the engine and remove the glow driver. That is very dangerous, but it is not the bad habit I am referring to. Then, they grab their radio and work the controls to see if they move. Then they put the plane on the ground and take off. Well, from the front of the plane we all can tell if the ailerons move, but most people cannot tell that they are moving the WRONG way. Please think about this. Have the responsibility to speak with the offender. He can kill you with his plane. Get into the habit of checking the controls from the rear of the plane. From the front the controls will be backward with respect to the left/right side of the plane.

  10. #10

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    RE: Check your control surfaces people!


    ORIGINAL: Villa

    There is a bad habit I see at our field many times. I frequently discuss it with the offender. Many do not take it well. The bad habit is right after they start the engine, they reach over the engine and remove the glow driver. That is very dangerous, but it is not the bad habit I am referring to. Then, they grab their radio and work the controls to see if they move. Then they put the plane on the ground and take off. Well, from the front of the plane we all can tell if the ailerons move, but most people cannot tell that they are moving the WRONG way. Please think about this. Have the responsibility to speak with the offender. He can kill you with his plane. Get into the habit of checking the controls from the rear of the plane. From the front the controls will be backward with respect to the left/right side of the plane.


    I agree with you fully, Villa. But it's how we get the point across that gets people mad or not at you. If they reach around the prop in a unsafe manner then I would right at the time they were doing it say, "Please be careful around the prop- I'd hate to see you hurt by it." It gets better results than acting like a Safety Officer, who was a retired Marine at Boot Camp and had a overdose of steroids for breakfast.

    For myself, I have seen Safety Officers overdoing it taking the fun out of the hobby for others; being strictly by the book is a bit of a pain. I, on the other hand, feel that if a guy wants to taxi his aircraft from the pits to the field he should be able to do so. Not everyone's back is good and to hunch over his plane and push it out can be just as harmful.

    If no one is standing in front of you, my club and I see nothing wrong with it, despite what the AMA has in its rules. Not once in my 10 years have I seen a plane go full throttle soon as the plane was set on the ground, and not have the operator be able to close the throttle in time. I'm not saying it can't happen, but it is very, vary rare that it does.

    But standing in front of the plane or on the side can be dangerous while running and I've seen props shed a blade or 2 in my time. Once I saw a propeller fly off because the bolt and washer wasn't on tight enough, just missing the operator when he started the plane up.

    Life is full of risks, so it's not up to anyone to hold someones hand like you would a small child, or get all over them like a policeman with a erection when I see something wrong. There is a right way and a wrong way. One Safety Officer from a club I was once a member of would say nothing until it was time for the monthly meeting. Then he would mention it without naming anyone and bring it up in the report. For instance the reversed aileron crash I had, he would say, " Everyone try to make sure you check your control surfaces before every flight. A member of our club only made a throw adjustment and somehow hit the wrong button, on the wrong setting, reversing his ailerons. So check them if you want to keep your plane a little longer."

    He's been Safety Officer for 4 years and they keep voting him in because he's good at getting the point accross without embarrassing anyone.


    Pete


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