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  1. #1
    sparky4lawndart's Avatar
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    Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    Let me start by saying that I'm cringing at the responses I might get...

    Today was a beautiful SoCal day @ BlackStarr Bob Swenson OCMA (www.flyocma.com)... I had my sukhoi with dle 20 out, a new T28 foamie, a many times repaired FlyZone FW 190, a little Saito 50 on a low wing Sonic, and my Sig 90.

    The Sig90 has a YS 120 with a long pipe and today was the first day the motor was really great... It was flippin' awesome in the air... never had a plane track like that... fast with a 15/10prop... with no wind to land into it was way fast on a two landings... The third didn't end well... I was trying to use the throttle kill with my left hand while the plane was a foot or two off the deck... it porpoised and broke the landing gear and slid into a pilot area fence post...

    the ARF is $439... a new wing is $220 with $22 mechanical retracts...

    see pics below and you tell me whether I should try to fix it or pull the motor and scrap the plane... I'm feeling really dumb so any guidance is much appreciated...

    total damage that I can see right now.... both retract areas are pretty bad with damage on mounts and top and bottom wing surfaces... The fuse has damage as well wear the trailing edge of the wing met the fuse...



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    President of the not so scale, almost ready to fly, soon to be scrap, warbird brotherhood
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  2. #2
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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    That bottom of the fuse pic is really hard to sort out, But it appears very saveable ..Post a few more pics of it where there is nothing behind the plane to distract from the damage. Just lay it on the floor or hold it up the wall...

  3. #3
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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    Looks very fixable to me.
    Takeoffs are optional, landings are mandatory
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  4. #4

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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    WOW you have to fix that! it is nothing

  5. #5

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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    Sparky
    I wouldn't be jumping up and down goingoh boy oh boy I get torebuild something, but with all the other planes you said you have to fly, why not give it a go and see how well you do. What do you have to loose, and you may surprise yourself. Just take your time, you won't know until you try.

    Jim

  6. #6
    sparky4lawndart's Avatar
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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    Sorry I haven't posted additional pics... my phone won't take pics anymore... (latest update)...

    so... I bought some sheet balsa, a leading edge strip, a quarter inch square strip, and 5 minute epoxy...

    questions.... if you can see the leading edge that remains ends at a rib on both sides... can i square the ends and insert a new leading edge or do i have to so some trick joint (rabbit, notch, or angle)?
    President of the not so scale, almost ready to fly, soon to be scrap, warbird brotherhood
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  7. #7
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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    Looking at those pics it's not bad at all . Not worth buying any new parts in my opinion except for the little bit of wood, glue and covering needed to make the repairs. Put it on the side for a few days and look at it again and again and eventually it won't (shouldn't)look that bad to you and you can jump right in and start repairing it. I do that with planes that have much worse damage and everything looks better after you walk away from it for awhile.
    Brian Ray

  8. #8
    sparky4lawndart's Avatar
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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    just a quick question.... someone said I could spray 3M spray adhesive into the wing to make it stronger... is that "bull$%!^" or real?

    Also, since there's damage on both sides of the wing and on the left and right panel, I'm going to remove all the old covering and make sure there's nothing hiding... any easy way to remove all that convering other than sand paper?
    President of the not so scale, almost ready to fly, soon to be scrap, warbird brotherhood
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  9. #9

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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    The best way that I have found to remove covering is with a heat gun and lots of patience... it will just peel off.

    As required you can also use some packing tape to put on the covering and pull the covering off SLOWLY!

    Basically the glue loosens up with the heat and off it comes!

    Once the covering is off - then you can see what other damage is present.

    Also - ONCE you are finished the repairs you could add glue to the entire structure to add strength - but I DO NOT recommend that. You add too much weight and gain too few benefits.

    As discussed above - the plane is definately worth repairing, take your time and have some fun with it!
    It's Time to Kick the Tires and Light the Fires!

  10. #10

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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?


    ORIGINAL: sparky4lawndart

    Sorry I haven't posted additional pics... my phone won't take pics anymore... (latest update)...

    so... I bought some sheet balsa, a leading edge strip, a quarter inch square strip, and 5 minute epoxy...

    questions.... if you can see the leading edge that remains ends at a rib on both sides... can i square the ends and insert a new leading edge or do i have to so some trick joint (rabbit, notch, or angle)?
    you have all the basics but a word of caution in most cases your not going to need 5 min epoxy for most wood joints CA or a wood glue like tight bond is fine for repairs, for landing gear areas 30 min epoxy is a better alternative because it allows for workability, if you use 5 min you better be sure of your wood placement/ alignment or your in for more work than its worth, in most cases.

    your repair looks prety basic, you might want to just do a small patch instead of stripping off a bunch of covering, you can always do that later, here is a pre/post crash pic of a kit I built some major wing repair(the stickers on the wing are replacements) and the whole forward section of the fuse needed to be repaired, but a little tactical covering application and its good as new.

    I also totally stripped and reconfigured my NEXTAR as well after a major crash, repair, and retirement, I decided it wasn't dead yet, notice patches on the wing as well, from a early crash
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  11. #11
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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?


    ORIGINAL: sparky4lawndart

    just a quick question.... someone said I could spray 3M spray adhesive into the wing to make it stronger... is that "bull$%!^" or real?

    Also, since there's damage on both sides of the wing and on the left and right panel, I'm going to remove all the old covering and make sure there's nothing hiding... any easy way to remove all that convering other than sand paper?

    To answer your question: it IS "bull$%!" 3m spray adhesive is "contact cement" It's good for laminating, but that's it!!!

    Frank

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  12. #12
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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    If you lived on the east coast you would have your winter projectsorry it sucks to crash a plane right after it starts performing well. I would fix it and make it better. Once you get into it you will be glad you did. Try not to use too much heat to remove covering as it can make it harder to get off. Any little pieces can be removed by sanding and using some acetone. Dry fit everything first then glue it with 30 min epoxy or wood glue. Iprefer gorilla glue but you have to be careful you don't use too much. Lots of help on here so just ask if you get stuck. Good luck!
    If what you believed to be true was false would you want to know the truth?

    "You shall know the truth, and the truth will set you free".

  13. #13
    sparky4lawndart's Avatar
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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    I've bought three rolls of Monokote (red, white, and blue)... a bunch of balsa sticks (assorted sizes including sheets)... I've got 8 ozs of 30 minute epoxy...

    I get my new phone tomorrow... I'll have pics before I start...

    thanks
    President of the not so scale, almost ready to fly, soon to be scrap, warbird brotherhood
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  14. #14

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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    Cutting at an angle gives more surface area for adheasion.........everything everyone said is great advice.........I rebuild all the time, can't afford to keep buying new. Stix are cheaper than a whole new plane .
    I've also built original models from pieces and parts I find in the trash cans. Some wierd looking stuff but if the CG is correct, they all fly pretty well....can try doing tricks and stuff with a rebuilt model.

  15. #15
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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    Look down the page a bit at the "Older H9 CAP" thread. I thought all I need was a new wing but basically I hung the canopy in the air and built a new plane under it I had a bunch of wood aready so it was just my time invested in the rebuild.

    Your plane is VERY fixable, and yes about the 3M is bull.

    Ken
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  16. #16
    sparky4lawndart's Avatar
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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    I used a heat gun to remove all the covering from the wing... there's a lot of fiberglass at the wing root and inside leading edge (but none at the landing gear area).. the wingtips are molded glass (once the covering was gone they just sort of fell off). There's bits of damage everywhere... small punctures, dents, cracked ribs under the sheeting (fully sheeted wing BTW). It took me an hour to remove most of it especially tough around the airlerons (it was 4 colors deep in some places)...

    The ailerons were mounted with metal hinged do-hickeys... To remove them would damage the wing further.. what do you think? Just do it or is there a trick to putting monokote on a wing with ailerons already installed... (as i wrote that I envisioned pulling a piece of Monokote through the space between wing and control surface and tacking it from the other side)

    I'll try to cut a long shallow angle on the leading edge on both sides to help with a longer adhesion surface... more pics tonight.

    thanks
    President of the not so scale, almost ready to fly, soon to be scrap, warbird brotherhood
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  17. #17
    sparky4lawndart's Avatar
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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    here are some pics of the wing

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    President of the not so scale, almost ready to fly, soon to be scrap, warbird brotherhood
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    3rd place - ProAm Sportsman - U.S. Scale Masters 2014 GunSmoke Qualifier
    Warbirds over the Rockies 2014 - Best ARF Bash
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  18. #18

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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    I could have had it repaired in the time it has taken to take the pictures and create this thread..................FIXITALREADY!!

  19. #19
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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    Sebo... ouch! vicious... this is my first fix.. and with no build experience.. I'm guessing here.. "measuring twice, cutting once" kinda thing

    30 minute epoxy is applied and that's it for tonight...

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    President of the not so scale, almost ready to fly, soon to be scrap, warbird brotherhood
    Member of the Scale Squadron of Southern California
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    3rd place - ProAm Sportsman - U.S. Scale Masters 2014 GunSmoke Qualifier
    Warbirds over the Rockies 2014 - Best ARF Bash
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  20. #20

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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    Sorry, Ididn't mean to be vicious......I'm just anxious for you to take the steps to rebuild........document them so we can all see how you are doing.
    It will be a good building experience...........THe first r/c plane I ever built was from what was left over in a trash can. Learned a lot from it. Wishing you the best. Cordially, sebo.

  21. #21
    sparky4lawndart's Avatar
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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    went crazy and bought fiberglass material from HomeDepot and used epoxy as the resin...
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    President of the not so scale, almost ready to fly, soon to be scrap, warbird brotherhood
    Member of the Scale Squadron of Southern California
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    3rd place - ProAm Sportsman - U.S. Scale Masters 2014 GunSmoke Qualifier
    Warbirds over the Rockies 2014 - Best ARF Bash
    Frank Migliaccio
    949-636-5666

  22. #22

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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    Lookin' Good!

  23. #23

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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    ORIGINAL: sparky4lawndart

    went crazy and bought fiberglass material from HomeDepot and used epoxy as the resin...
    Fiberglass comes in all kinds of thicknesses. I doubt Home Depot carries what I'd be using on this wing repair. Go light, and remember the CG all around on this plane when you're done. Adding a pound or two by the end of this chore is possible if you're not careful. Trimming and tweaking on your maiden flight will be an obvious step to anticipate, as well as a faster drop in altitude when you cut your throttle approaching your landings. Just remember you're saving $439 and anything that flies from here is nearly free, and borrowed time for the model. You do good work from the pictures, but didn't catch the guts of the wing, how much went into the structure you planked over?

  24. #24
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    RE: Should I try to fix it or buy the replacement?

    Today was the re-maiden of the Zen 120...

    I put a 7 channel receiver in and a pair of new 15lbs electric retracts to replace the mechanicals that used to be in there...

    funny... I'm pretty helpful (try to be) and learned that I had in the last two weeks loaned out a full gallon of YS 20/20 glow fuel since I wasn't using it and only had enough for 1 tank today...

    bolted her together, filled her up.. checked all the surfaces and she started after 3 seconds on a fresh plug...

    leaned her a bit and she was ideling amazing... I have video soon...

    everyone was shocked that this was the same plane that tried to beat the fence post 2 weeks ago.

    walked her to the flightline and taxi'd out and she transitioned beautifully... i had all the pros around me giving me pointers and commenting on how well the Zen was tracking... with a 15X8 prop, she was fast... too fast... pulled virtical and just kept on going.. lots of pull on that motor.

    7 minutes of flying around... I dropped the gear and cut the throttle on the downwind leg and came in... not wanting to make the same mistake I made 2 weeks ago I kinda ignored all the instructions being yelled at me (even the guy in the back screaming "flapperons!!!, use the flapperons!!!".

    she crossed the end of the runway fast, i just floated her 6 inches off the deck waiting for the speed to bleed a bit... she rolled out 150 feet past the end of the runway... in the dirt.. btw... glow planes have an onboard dirt adhesion super magnet built in..

    I have to figure out if "flapperons" are an option with my RDS8000 radio (it'll be tricky with channel 2 and 6 on different servos)... I think I can get it right...

    You guys were great... I have another thread starting shortly as my new BH FW190 rolled a landing gear mount right out of the wing...

    not alot of damage but I've got a little confidence now that, with what I've done in the last week, I have her back in the air in a week...

    thank you, brethren... Sebo... you were right.. just do it and move on!!!

    President of the not so scale, almost ready to fly, soon to be scrap, warbird brotherhood
    Member of the Scale Squadron of Southern California
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    Spitfire Brotherhood - Member #202
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    3rd place - ProAm Sportsman - U.S. Scale Masters 2014 GunSmoke Qualifier
    Warbirds over the Rockies 2014 - Best ARF Bash
    Frank Migliaccio
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