End All to Lipo Explosion Worries-Feedback
06-17-2005, 11:22 AM
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End All to Lipo Explosion Worries-Feedback
Hey folks,
Need your help on making a decision. First, a little background. I work for the industry leading Explosion Proof Products manufacturer. We make thousands of electrical products the majority of which are intended to safely sustain internal explosions. For example, in the presence of gasses (oil refineries, mining facilities... etc) regular household lighting fixtures could arc+spark, ignite gasses in the air and cause an explosion. In this situation, our industrial fixtures completely maintain any explosion within the unit, and the gaseous air is not ignited.
I am also an RC enthusiast and have recently made the switch over to lipos, and have been reading up a lot on them. Although I have not had any problems with them, I know there is a lot of concern about their inherent dangers. I personally store my lipos in one of my company's small junction boxes for added safety. I know if any one them has a freak flame out, the flames will not make their way outside. This is a UL tested and listed explosion proof iron box, 6"X7"X6".
Now here's where you come in. Last night I saw an ad for the Battery Bunker and had an idea. What if there was a similar (better) product available to lipo users that has been lab and field tested to safely sustain even greater explosive situations? Is there a need? My idea is to provide 2 types. One is solely for storage and is basically a metal box with a threaded, solid cover. The other would be for charging and would come with a glass window cover for viewing, and would also come with 2 wires thru a factory sealed hub ready for soldering connectors. You would connect your battery to the wires inside, replace the cover, and connect your charged to the wires on the outside. The battery can then be viewed while charging thru the glass part of the cover. We even have our own labs where these could be tested photographed+videotaped.
With enough feedback I might be able to get a small budget from our marketing dept. to try this out. I would get several lipos and a charger and blow them up inside our modified boxes. I have not done enough research to know how much these would cost, this is just a brainstorm. The way I see it, we already make these explosion proof boxes, they would be perfect for lipo users. And there is no way any other company would start making these specifically for lipo users because the start up costs would be too great. We already have evrything in place i.e. foundry, castings, machines, manpower.
I charge my batteries at home in my appartment. Something like this would be perfect for me, as I don't have a garage or any extra space. So folks, please give me as much feedback as possible. Let me know if this is a stupid idea that will never take off, if you think it's a good idea, make suggestions, ask questions. The more info I can put together for our marketing dept. the better.
I've attached a pic of what I'm thinking we could use for the charging unit. The wires would come out of the hub and would be sealed.
Thanks,
Fran
Need your help on making a decision. First, a little background. I work for the industry leading Explosion Proof Products manufacturer. We make thousands of electrical products the majority of which are intended to safely sustain internal explosions. For example, in the presence of gasses (oil refineries, mining facilities... etc) regular household lighting fixtures could arc+spark, ignite gasses in the air and cause an explosion. In this situation, our industrial fixtures completely maintain any explosion within the unit, and the gaseous air is not ignited.
I am also an RC enthusiast and have recently made the switch over to lipos, and have been reading up a lot on them. Although I have not had any problems with them, I know there is a lot of concern about their inherent dangers. I personally store my lipos in one of my company's small junction boxes for added safety. I know if any one them has a freak flame out, the flames will not make their way outside. This is a UL tested and listed explosion proof iron box, 6"X7"X6".
Now here's where you come in. Last night I saw an ad for the Battery Bunker and had an idea. What if there was a similar (better) product available to lipo users that has been lab and field tested to safely sustain even greater explosive situations? Is there a need? My idea is to provide 2 types. One is solely for storage and is basically a metal box with a threaded, solid cover. The other would be for charging and would come with a glass window cover for viewing, and would also come with 2 wires thru a factory sealed hub ready for soldering connectors. You would connect your battery to the wires inside, replace the cover, and connect your charged to the wires on the outside. The battery can then be viewed while charging thru the glass part of the cover. We even have our own labs where these could be tested photographed+videotaped.
With enough feedback I might be able to get a small budget from our marketing dept. to try this out. I would get several lipos and a charger and blow them up inside our modified boxes. I have not done enough research to know how much these would cost, this is just a brainstorm. The way I see it, we already make these explosion proof boxes, they would be perfect for lipo users. And there is no way any other company would start making these specifically for lipo users because the start up costs would be too great. We already have evrything in place i.e. foundry, castings, machines, manpower.
I charge my batteries at home in my appartment. Something like this would be perfect for me, as I don't have a garage or any extra space. So folks, please give me as much feedback as possible. Let me know if this is a stupid idea that will never take off, if you think it's a good idea, make suggestions, ask questions. The more info I can put together for our marketing dept. the better.
I've attached a pic of what I'm thinking we could use for the charging unit. The wires would come out of the hub and would be sealed.
Thanks,
Fran
06-17-2005, 12:03 PM
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RE: End All to Lipo Explosion Worries-Feedback
I would almost have to agree it's overkill. But I'm thinking of someone wants that peace of mind, why not offer something better than a clay pot. These could be right next to you while watching tv. Keep the feedback coming!
06-22-2005, 09:23 AM
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RE: End All to Lipo Explosion Worries-Feedback
ORIGINAL: hugequark
SNIP.........For example, in the presence of gasses (oil refineries, mining facilities... etc) regular household lighting fixtures could arc+spark, ignite gasses in the air and cause an explosion. In this situation, our industrial fixtures completely maintain any explosion within the unit, and the gaseous air is not ignited.
SNIP.........For example, in the presence of gasses (oil refineries, mining facilities... etc) regular household lighting fixtures could arc+spark, ignite gasses in the air and cause an explosion. In this situation, our industrial fixtures completely maintain any explosion within the unit, and the gaseous air is not ignited.
I'm not trying to be a pest, I'm just really curious if I have missed something here.
-And the other thing is, -NOTHING is truly explosion proof in regards to containing an explosion, -that's kind of a joke.
With a little hydrogen and oxygen, -or oxyacetylene, I guarantee we could blow most any enclosure wide open, -no problem!
06-22-2005, 10:53 AM
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RE: End All to Lipo Explosion Worries-Feedback
hugequark,
As a new Li-Po user (one of many, it seems) I'd be very interested in something like this. At the moment I'm charging in a homemade "bunker" consisting of an 8" x 8" x 8" hollow cinderblock, set on the garage floor with a paving stone on top of it. I have to worry about chafing the wires, and of course it's not portable. Storage is another issue; I have several packs which I carry around in a plastic fishing box and take care not to set in the sun or leave in the car for long periods. Other pilots have recommended that I go to an army surplus store and buy an ammo box, but I haven't done that. Neither have I made my own box out of drywall or whatever. Seems there is no good solution right now. If you could produce a container that would be safe for charging and double as a storage container (maybe the user would want to buy more than one) AND make it cheap enough -- say, in the $10 to $30 range -- I think you'd sell a lot of them.
I like the idea of a threaded cap with leads running through it and connectors on both ends. (Don't forget the leads for the thermal probe.) It would be nice to also have a sealed cap without the leads. Maybe that would be your conversion from charging to storage.
The "foamie" crowd use a lot of 3s packs, and have more than one. For example, I use 3s 1320s and own four of them right now. May I suggest storage for up to 4 at a time, and charging for one at a time? Or perhaps the container could be made for dual use, with 4 compartments and 4 threaded caps. You could simply go down the row as you used the packs, pulling each one from storage then using it, replacing it in the container, swapping the sealed cap for the cap with the leads in it, starting the charger and opening the next compartment to take out the next pack, and so on. There's now a 4-output Li-Po charger on the market. Your container would be a good companion for that.
If you're limited to the round cans like in the photo, maybe you could make a modular system by strapping the individual cans into rows or clusters similar to a 6-pack of beer.
Bigger packs (3s 2p and up) would require larger compartments and more specialized design. I'm not into the big electric planes yet, so I'll leave that issue to somebody else.
Great idea, though. I hope you can make a go of it. I'd definitely be in the market for something like this.
Duane Gall
RCPRO
As a new Li-Po user (one of many, it seems) I'd be very interested in something like this. At the moment I'm charging in a homemade "bunker" consisting of an 8" x 8" x 8" hollow cinderblock, set on the garage floor with a paving stone on top of it. I have to worry about chafing the wires, and of course it's not portable. Storage is another issue; I have several packs which I carry around in a plastic fishing box and take care not to set in the sun or leave in the car for long periods. Other pilots have recommended that I go to an army surplus store and buy an ammo box, but I haven't done that. Neither have I made my own box out of drywall or whatever. Seems there is no good solution right now. If you could produce a container that would be safe for charging and double as a storage container (maybe the user would want to buy more than one) AND make it cheap enough -- say, in the $10 to $30 range -- I think you'd sell a lot of them.
I like the idea of a threaded cap with leads running through it and connectors on both ends. (Don't forget the leads for the thermal probe.) It would be nice to also have a sealed cap without the leads. Maybe that would be your conversion from charging to storage.
The "foamie" crowd use a lot of 3s packs, and have more than one. For example, I use 3s 1320s and own four of them right now. May I suggest storage for up to 4 at a time, and charging for one at a time? Or perhaps the container could be made for dual use, with 4 compartments and 4 threaded caps. You could simply go down the row as you used the packs, pulling each one from storage then using it, replacing it in the container, swapping the sealed cap for the cap with the leads in it, starting the charger and opening the next compartment to take out the next pack, and so on. There's now a 4-output Li-Po charger on the market. Your container would be a good companion for that.
If you're limited to the round cans like in the photo, maybe you could make a modular system by strapping the individual cans into rows or clusters similar to a 6-pack of beer.
Bigger packs (3s 2p and up) would require larger compartments and more specialized design. I'm not into the big electric planes yet, so I'll leave that issue to somebody else.
Great idea, though. I hope you can make a go of it. I'd definitely be in the market for something like this.
Duane Gall
RCPRO
06-23-2005, 08:33 AM
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RE: End All to Lipo Explosion Worries-Feedback
IMHO LiPo's are a safe as any other battery. I carefully monitor how mine are charged and charge in the open and don't worry. I have charged hundreds of times this way. That being said, from a business point of view, market it right it will sell. People will buy anything!
08-30-2005, 03:34 PM
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RE: End All to Lipo Explosion Worries-Feedback
We had a lipo charging accident that resulted in a fire/explosion. It was probably caused by an improper cell count analysis by our Astro109 and my failure not to notice the bad readout before I turned up the amp dial after the 109's initial 3 minute Mode One of its charging cycle. We have a metal/ceramic covered charging venue but it didn't keep the thing from burning. We have an abundance of dry chemical fire extinguishers nearby and they quickly put out the fire but boy what a mess to clean up; lots of fine dust everywhere and a nasty smell too. We evacuated the basement and got the fans and two HEPA air cleaners going for 24 hours before returning. I was worried about hazardous residue in the smoke, dust, debris so I did a Google search and found numerous US-OSHA Material Safety Data Sheets for lipoly batteries which stated that there is no toxic output from such a fire since the material becomes inert (I've accepted this as gospel so if one of you chemists knows different please let me know ASAP). I'm going to charge outside from now on using a fire proof household safe. I may even try to drill holes for wire leads and then seal them to make the box airtight. I think such a heavy duty steel safe should be able to contain the "blast" and keep oxygen from feeding the fire and the charger will most likely detect the fault and cut itself off. I know lipos are safe if handled correctly but this incident has shown me that accidents do happen and I'd like to be prepared for the worst case.
