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  1. #101
    can773's Avatar
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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    There is a former at 165, you cut them ino the former and glue them there. That is exactly where mine are and working fine. Don't put them at the bottom.
    Chad Northeast

    www.f3acanada.org

  2. #102

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    OK, I saw the former but didn't think it would be robust enough. Will follow your suggestion.
    Bob

  3. #103

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Yesterday servos installed in wings and stabs, today control horns installed in ailerons, elevators and rudder.

    Once again, easier than expected. I just used a metal straightedge to mark the control horn line on the control surface in line with the servo casing. Laid the control horn flat on the control surface to line up the linkage hole with the control surface gap to determine position, then used a Dremel with a tiny drill bit as a mill and made the slot. Worked great. Gorilla glue - as used by Chad - turned out to be an excellent choice for the adhesive as it fills gaps and provides purchase to any and all available surfaces as it expands. I had not used it before but will do so in the future. It was a bit harder to find the center of the former for the rudder control horn installation. However, in the end I got them centered well and they seem to be quite snug and secure.

    Next to seal the gaps and to install the linkages. I have some 34mm Secraft turnbuckles on the way from F3AU along with the motor mount and canopy locks.
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    Bob

  4. #104
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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Gorilla Glue is great stuff, it's the same as the old Elmers Pro-Bond I use to use on all my 40% stuff years ago. It's great for sheeting wings, etc and hinging foam and wood surfaces.

    bholsten

  5. #105

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    It's always interesting to learn something new (well, new to me anyway!) about the properties of the materials and the applications for which they are best suited.

    I plan to make a stop by a Staples store today to get some vinyl tape for the control surface gaps.

    Chad (or anyone else) do you recommend taping both sides or only the bottom?
    Bob

  6. #106

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    The bottom is enough. You don't need to match it on the top.
    Doug Cronkhite

  7. #107

    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Functionally, no, as Doug said.

    Aesthetically, since you are using a tape that doesn't have temperature-activated adhesive, any dirt, grass, and other junk will stick to the adhesive side that is exposed. If it were me, I would probably use covering to seal the hinge lines.
    Ryan Smith

    Team JR | Thunder Power RC
    F3A Unlimited | Castle Creations

  8. #108

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    You should maybe use this.....
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  9. #109

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Thanks, gents! Good advice.

    J-P I cannot find the Dave Brown product on this side of the pond but I will find an alternative.

    I got the front motor mount installed today, and the elevator servo leads, and made some well-placed holes in the fuse for servo leads and air venting.
    Bob

  10. #110

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    I've always had good results with clear monocote. The best way to apply it is to use a straight edge in the slot similar to the photo you have from JP to keep it properly aligned. Use your iron set real low so it will just barely activate the adhesive and tack it in place every 1/8" or so. With the iron still set real low, finish ironing it in place. This method will avoid air bubbles. Then turn the iron up to normal monocote temps of 260F or so and go over it all again.

    Another option is Blenderm tape, a 3M product. It can be a little tricky to use because it grabs like crazy and it's stretchy. I keep it attched to the roll while I'm applying it and use a bondo spreader to push it into place one side at a time. By that I mean, do the aileron side first and then do the TE of the aileron cutout second. It may take a couple tries before you get the hang of it. I think Dubro packages Blenderm as a hinging tape for foamies. It's very flexible and lasts forever. I personally prefer clear monocote but have used both methods with great results. I normally use the monocote for covered wings and stabs and Blenderm for the rudder so I won't have to put a hot iron on the painted rudder post on my fuse.

    With the composite surfaces you're dealing with, Blenderm might be the better choice.

    Hope this helps!

    Verne Koester


    ORIGINAL: cmoulder

    Thanks, gents! Good advice.

    J-P I cannot find the Dave Brown product on this side of the pond but I will find an alternative.

    I got the front motor mount installed today, and the elevator servo leads, and made some well-placed holes in the fuse for servo leads and air venting.

  11. #111

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Bob, congrats on the purchase.  I may have missed it, but what motor are you going with and when can we see it fly?  For Pocono?  Dana
    Good Flying! Dana
    4449NSRC AMA

  12. #112

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Dana, it's coming along nicely and will be ready in plenty of time for Pocono. I flew at Ken Velez' Canandaigua event this past weekend so I didn't get anything done after Friday. Before departing Friday I finished up the rear motor mount for the Pletty Advance 30-10 and the Aeropoxy is now thoroughly cured and what, for me, is the most tedious task is now done. However; this was my first time doing a front/rear mount installation and it is definitely easier than making and aligning a firewall. I guessed wrong on the turnbuckle lengths for the control surface linkages, but the correct ones should arrive today if USPS tracking info is accurate.

    More photos soon, and I'm looking forward to seeing you guys at Pocono.

    The Canandaigua Sky Chiefs are a great group of people and we really appreciated their hospitality and the use of their wonderful and spacious facilities and immaculate field. Well worth the drive, and an added bonus was getting to meet the fine Canadian pilots who came to the event.
    Bob

  13. #113

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Hi, Chad:

    Do you have a photo with main batteries strapped into the battery tray to show where their exact position is when correct CG is achieved?

    What is the weight of your batteries?

    Thanks much,
    Bob

  14. #114
    can773's Avatar
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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Hi Bob,

    I will have to check if I have any pictures, but I know the packs start at the front of the gear plate. They are the TP 5000's G6 which are about 1180 grams.

    When running the 4400's I shove them about another inch forward of that position, they are about 100g lighter.
    Chad Northeast

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    I assembled the model and test-balanced yesterday and indeed the Sky 4400's that I fly will have to be pretty far forward to balance with CG at the center of the wing tube.

    No problem and still plenty of room to work. Just glad I didn't commit to a battery tray position before confirming this!
    Bob

  16. #116

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Final push today and could maiden tomorrow if I didn't have to go to work.

    AUW with Sky 4400 40C's is 4862g. My ESC (CC 85HV) is heavier than Chad's and I am also using an MPI spark eliminator arming plug which adds a little weight.

    I didn't put on the little wing-end SFG thingies yet, so those will add a few grams.

    Not bad for all composite and comfortably under 5kg.

    I used white vinyl Scotch electrical tape for aileron and elevator gaps and it works well. Took a little while to figure out how to get the tape down into the hinge line, but a little persistence paid off. Looks pretty good, actually.

    Photos later.
    Bob

  17. #117

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Very exciting Bob!  I hope you got out to do some flying this weekend with all the nice weather (hamster on crack and all LOL)!  Say, how did you program the 85HV for the Advance, setting wise?  Cheers, Dana
    Good Flying! Dana
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  18. #118

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    ORIGINAL: danamania

    Very exciting Bob! *I hope you got out to do some flying this weekend with all the nice weather (hamster on crack and all LOL)! *Say, how did you program the 85HV for the Advance, setting wise? *Cheers, Dana
    Dana, CC settings are (in no particular order) Throttle/ fixed endpoints, response medium Brake/40%, .5 sec delay, immediate ramp Cut-off voltage/auto-lipo 3.0v/cell, current limiting normal, soft cut-off Motor/ start power med, timing normal (maybe low later), PWM rate 8khz

    I'll change the brake to 30% if I get "the squeal"

    I think these are pretty good settings. If any of you experts feel otherwise please advise.

    Didn't get to fly this weekend. Mrs. and I were doing a long overdue spring cleaning and then dinner party preps (grilling filet roast and veggies while dodging thunderstorms), so the Crack Hamster was otherwise engaged. Next weekend and the one thereafter (Poconos!!) are all mine.
    Bob

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    With the Advance, is the esc set to inrunner mode, or Outrunner? Interesting motor really, want to learn more about it.
    Good Flying! Dana
    4449NSRC AMA

  20. #120
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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Hey Bob,

    Sounds like you are ready to go! I hope that your first flights go really well and you enjoy the plane!

    I will post some pictures soon how I put the winglets on to allow them to be easily removed for transport, yet still secure for flight.
    Chad Northeast

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  21. #121

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011


    ORIGINAL: danamania

    With the Advance, is the esc set to inrunner mode, or Outrunner? Interesting motor really, want to learn more about it.
    Per JLachow instructions elsewhere, settings are the same as those for the Evo, which is an outrunner. Identical, in fact, to what I had set for the Himax 6330-210.

    I ran the motor very briefly with no prop to check direction (had to swap some wires to reverse it!) and just one easy, low throttle run-up out on the deck with the prop for a superficial check of balance, motor security etc. No full throttle until I get to the field, where I can set the upper end point. Low endpoint seems spot-on right out of the gate. It is a VERY quiet running motor. Going to keep the same throttle curve as the Himax for now, but likely that will change.

    The MPI anti-spark arming plug works quite well.
    Bob

  22. #122

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    ORIGINAL: can773

    Hey Bob,

    Sounds like you are ready to go! I hope that your first flights go really well and you enjoy the plane!

    I will post some pictures soon how I put the winglets on to allow them to be easily removed for transport, yet still secure for flight.
    Probably next weekend if the weather co-operates. Yes, I would like to see how you attach the winglets. I was thinking this afternoon of drilling some holes in the wing's alignment dimples and putting CF tubes through the alignment dimples and then using CF rods thru the winglets to attach. But I will wait to see your method before committing.

    Also, how did you further secure the stabs? The stab adjusters are tightened down pretty well, and in the meantime I also used some clear packing tape for a little additional security. I am considering plugging the stab tube ends with hard balsa and drilling thru the bottom of the stabs to permit the addition of screws.
    Bob

  23. #123

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Had a little spare time this morning so I made the plugs for the stab tube ends and secured the stabs with screws. Feels much more solid and airworthy that way. I noticed in J-P's stab photo above that this what he did so it seems a common practice. Definitely measured this one three times before drilling! Some longer Hitec servo mounting screws were the perfect length and diameter.
    Bob

  24. #124

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Maidened today!

    The plane flies quite well and took very few clicks of trim to get it flying straight and level, but still a long way to go toward getting it contest ready, so maybe not in time for Pocono.

    However, I do have some issues with getting anywhere near full power with the Pletty Advance due to ESC and/or radio programming, which I worked on today when I got home and installed fresh batteries for the tachometer and got Castle Link running on the laptop. I was getting only 5200 rpm with the motor timing set ag medium and the PWM at 8khz, and afterward 5900 rpm with the timing set at high and the PWM at 24khz. Prop is a Falcon 21x14. I should be getting minimum RPM (in my wild guesstimate) of 6200 and perhaps more, so I'll play with the end points and throttle curve a some more tomorrow.

    Ground clearance with a 21-inch prop is nil, so make sure the grass is short!

    Conditions at Stormville today were absolutely sublime. Thanks to Anthony Romano for getting the photo and Bert K and wonder dog Lucky for the great company.



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    Bob

  25. #125

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Congrats on your maiden flight.

    Thats quite the pattern plane you have there.

    You should watch Chad fly the pants off that thing. It's quite the site to see.

    I think he's running a 22 x 12 apc @ 6275 !

    Our flying field today....great day, good weather.



    Happy Landings

    Flyer88
    Why is there never enough time to do it right, but always enough time to do it over ?


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