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  1. #176

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Mine is almost ready to test fly...just checking incidences now. Unfortunately the right wing panel is at 0.8 deg and the left at 0.3.

    Looks like I'll have to find a way to install adjusters before I fly it.

    My finished weight with Shulze 32.80, Advance motor, significant gear re-inforcement, carbon spinner, light Falcon and TP 5000 is 4890gms...I have about 1.5" between the battery and motor for middle of the tube CG.

    Colin

  2. #177

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Just finished two days of flying my new Caelestia...finally!!

    Started flying with my radio setup from my Xigris (ya I am lazy:-) and CG on the center of the wing tube as per others.. Some minor adjustments to ensure the stabs were identical and the elevator halves were perfectly aligned. I also lowered the batteries as low to the wing plane as possible... this made for very axial rolls. Tracking/trim flights went ok but I needed some more adjustment on the radio as my very small mixes that I had built in to my Xigris data created K/E tracking issues. ( maybe I was too lazy LOL) Took all the mixing out (ex up & down line) and was amazed at the K/E tracking....awesome! Dialed in some slight throttle/rudder mix for verticals and adjusted the down line throttle /elevator mix (plane goes to canopy... as they all seem to do)... and voila... one very happy pilot! This plane speeds along pretty good compared to my Xigris. Some more very minor trimming and snap condition setup and some prop combination testing to slow my flight speed down a tad and I'll be ready to go.. (Started with a 20.5x14.5 Falcon Light (too fast) then used a 21x14 Falcon Light but will be trying a Mejzlik 22x12 when it arrives from F3A Unlimited) . Got the Spin99 brake working well and down line speed control is strait forward. Really looking forward to the next couple weeks flying as our BCPA Championships go September 8th & 9th in Victoria. My fellow flyer Michi Akimoto (see picture) is also flying his Caelestia and we are both very pleased with it's performance. I am still trying to get used to the colors as it's a big departure from my "normal" schemes... a little variety is always good :-)
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    Dave

  3. #178

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Dave, this model is very 'slippery' and definitely doesn't need a prop with high pitch. I started with the Falcon 20.5x14.5 and 30% brake (the most the CC will do without its trademark "screech") and it really accelerated on downlines. Switched to the PT 20x13 and downlines improved noticeably, and with a Mejzlik 20.5x12W I think (well, hope!) it will be spot-on. Also waiting on that prop from F3AU. I like the CG back a smidge, toward the back of the wing tube. It has taken me a while to figure things out, but really starting to get comfortable with the Caelestia.
    Bob

  4. #179

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Test flown mine yesterday with the Falcon 21.5X13 and really liked the speed control...not sure if it's the Shulze, the prop or the motor but with this combination it is amazingly easy to manage the speed.

    I started with the wing set at 0.6 degrees ( I did add adjusters) and the CG at the middle of the tube. After 4 flights I moved the battery back about 1/2 inch. I still don't feel like it's locked in on 45s so I may try a bit more incidence.

    This plane seems to need no pitch or roll mix, rolls, snaps and spins very well. It also weather vanes significantly less than the Xigirs...I'll actually have to fly the cross wind corrections.

    I still have to add the tips...what was that stuff Chad used to make the rails so that the tips are removeable?

    Update:

    I've now flown it with the tips and there is a difference...the wing feels a little more stable even as the plane slows down. The incidence was increased to 0.7 deg and the CG moved forward to the the middle of the tube...right where Chad told us to put it. I have 1% nose up with left rudder and 0% for everything else except the usual downline mix. I have basically copied Chads deflections and backed off the Ailerons a little in snap rate as my reflexes are just not fast enough to stop the snap exactly where I want it....particularly in the 1/4 - snap - snap - 1/4...that's a very fast snap.

    Colin

  5. #180

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    It was Evergreen Scale Models part # 294 - 1/8th angle stock.

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    Dave

  6. #181

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Wow that stuff seems CA resistant...just would not stick!

    Going to try some fresh foam safe CA next...what did Dave and Chad use to glue the rails with?

    Colin

  7. #182
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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Roughed it up with 100 grit and then medium CA!
    Chad Northeast

    www.f3acanada.org

  8. #183

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Ahhh...sometimes I forget the 'basics'.

    Thanks.

    Colin

  9. #184

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Hello to all
    I attach some pictures of my Caelestia, tested a few weeks ago.
    From the photos you can see the new position of landing gear (lower than the original), the addition of an inside plate in rear position and the new position of motor batteries and servo tray, very low!
    This position was chosen to improve the roll of the model as I had tested on my WindS.
    In flight, the model is very slow and "easy" to use.
    I put the CG a little ahead of the wing tube, to adapt it to my style of flying.
    I was very surprised because the model needs a few of mix to fly and is very neutral even in inverted flight.
    I really like the trajectories and rounding that the model can do.
    Also the spin and all integrated figure result very clear and precise.
    Snap rolls are very beautiful and easier to stop than my precedent model.
    The rudder is very efficient , this is very good especially in the F program.
    So the feeling with the model is very good and I am very happy, I hope to do well with it in the next Italian F3A Championship.

    A.Villa
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  10. #185

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Hi at all
    Continue the fly of Our Caelestia,(my and my son pilot)and after every fly i am very full satisfied as the airplane flies....
    very very well: we can test some monouvre very critical for P13 and F13 program and the model
    flies without any problem!, we have installed some little device on it ,to improve more the already exelent flying characteristics, taking into account our past experience with other models,shortly will be post the pictures.
    I think no need to spend lots of money for buy other modell more expensive,that fly same or certainly not better than Caelestia!
    (it is not only an opinion, believe me)
    Thank you Jp we are very happy by Caelestia and we think to have a very good aircraft for next F3A Italian Championship.
    Thanks
    Alberto

  11. #186

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    New planes arrived today ....
    JP
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  12. #187

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Excellent work with the landing gear modification. This model really needs a bit more ground clearance for the propeller.

    I plan to do such a modification this winter, but I am sure it will not be as professional looking as yours!

    Bob

  13. #188

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Finally found motivation to modify the landing gear, with some hope that this endless winter will finally yield to some warmer weather in the next couple of weeks.

    I didn't want to take any chances with prop clearance so I moved the gear plate exactly 1.5 inches down from the original position. Plenty of clearance now, even for a 22-inch prop.

    The gear plate is made from laminated 5-ply AC for a total of 10 plies, with 1/8-inch CF nomex honeycomb for the crutch support. I reconfigured the battery tray farther up on the formers and decided the whole structure was rigid and strong enough to remove the original cross pieces at the top. Much less hassle for battery access.

    Some epoxy with microballoons, backed up with FG cloth, was used to fill the (previously-damaged!) fuse slots for the original gear position. I will sand, prime and paint those later when the weather warms up, but for now the model is ready to fly.

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    Bob

  14. #189

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Hi
    Just received pics of my brand new Caelestia prepared by JP ZARDINI.
    Don't think I will have time to finish it for the French Championship beginning on the 25 of july...
    I should have soon a set of the new wings, home made by ZN.
    A new canopy with an integrated T-Canalyser is on its way too
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  15. #190

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    more pics...

    JP
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  16. #191

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    It looks like the gear position has changed...anything else?

    Can we see what the T on the canopy will look like?

    Colin

  17. #192

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    For the gear, it's a mod I asked for, to try 21,5 and 22 props, but not sure now if it was a good idea with the 3 blades prop coming.....
    The tail is custom paint.
    As soon I'll get the new canopy I'll post a pic.
    JP

  18. #193
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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    JP, would you be so kind to post raw component weights i.e. wings, stabs, fuse etc. when you have the plane in hand. Curious to know if there have been weight improvements (especially wings) since its release in 2011. Also was the landing gear location actually moved or did you request landing gear with longer legs from ZN to increase ground clearance?

    Thanks in advance,

    Glen Watson
    http://glenwatson.blogspot.com/ (pattern blog)

  19. #194

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Hi Glen
    Legs are the same, I just asked to change the location
    Don't think I'll we able to pick up the plane before the end of the month, but will let you know about weights.
    JP

  20. #195

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    I hope this is the new landing gear location for ALL future production, as well as assurance that the gear mounting plate itself is constructed properly.

    The original location of the gear simply did not provide enough prop clearance.
    Bob

  21. #196
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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    I flew mine with a 22" prop, never had an issue, other than cleaning grass off it
    Chad Northeast

    www.f3acanada.org

  22. #197
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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Bob,

    You did a very good job fixing a problem many if not most of today's models have. Landing gear on these models are mounted way too high up on the fuse and way too far aft, causing tip overs too easily. Couple that with rear rake on too many landing gear and it's an annoying issue. The fix is really simple, as you pointed out.

    Look at some of the BJCraft planes for example. Gear is high up and raked to the rear way too much. Gear that comes out straight from the fuse is far more functional and superior is all practical ways. Are there ANY full size planes flying today with rear rake to the gear? Good reason why not

    Longer gear is not the answer....longer gear are heavier; counterproductive.....

    Another area oftetimes overlooked, even by experienced builders,is tail wheel height. Shorter is better....
    ORIGINAL: cmoulder

    I hope this is the new landing gear location for ALL future production, as well as assurance that the gear mounting plate itself is constructed properly.

    The original location of the gear simply did not provide enough prop clearance.
    Regards,
    MattK
    (Rcmaster199@aol.com)

  23. #198

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Matt the BJ Craft planes being sold now have less sweep by 2 inches. They track really nice now and don't tip over. Mike
    Mike Mueller
    F3AUnlimited.com and Gator-RC Products
    1800 591 2875
    mikemueller@F3AUnlimited.com
    Team JR America

  24. #199
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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Good!....BJPark is listening to the market evidently.

    But his products are not the only ones. Seems I hear about such issues about other planes also....
    Regards,
    MattK
    (Rcmaster199@aol.com)

  25. #200

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    RE: CAELESTIA NEW F3A 2011

    Matt
    BJ and some others have told us that for the most part Asians fly off of paved surfaces. It's crazy some of the places they fly. Like parts of industrial parks and back roads.
    For that reason they like the UC close to the CG. I can tell you that a Nuance with the old gear handled fantastically on pavement. The rotation on takeoffs were really nice.
    On grass it's a different story and since so many of us fly on grass we needed a change.
    So much of what we use gets it's R+D from the buyers. That's nothing new and a product of a small market.
    Mike
    Mike Mueller
    F3AUnlimited.com and Gator-RC Products
    1800 591 2875
    mikemueller@F3AUnlimited.com
    Team JR America


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