exverbrenner

Here's a very talented young lad having his maiden flight with a 33% YAK 54, on the same powerplant i'm running in my Raven, but with a lot more "cojones"[:@]

http://www.e-flightline.com/movies/A...%203-30-06.wmv

the plane is only about 4 lbs heavier than mine but the yak is definitely a new gen aerobatic plane, with the raven some of the stuff this guy's flying is simply not possible. eat your heart out!

roger

dentdoc

My Feedback: (3)

Very Impressive!!

exeter_acres

My Feedback: (2)

nice flying....but it just sounds .... wrong

seanucd2000

My Feedback: (1)

I don't own any electrics and am impressed how far they have come in recent years. But, I am curious how much money in motors, batteries, speed controllers and chargers it takes to make that giant plane sound like a foamy? Amazing.....

patternflyer1

My Feedback: (11)

Alot.
The batteries aren't cheap...
But the electrics are a fairly worry free setup. I don't think I'll go back to glow. Well, except right now as I lost my electric Eclipse last week. [&o]
I run the Axi's and they are fairly priced. Motor and Esc are like $430 bucks. The batteries cost around 11-1200 for four batteries, which is two sets.
Of course mine is just a pattern setup, not a 33%.
Chris

Futurase

My Feedback: (10)

I must say, Kyle is about THE BEST 3D pilot I have ever seen. I have seen many and been flying for bout 22 years and like to think I am a fairly accomplished 3D pilot myself I have seen video of him flying a Funtana and etc, but that was some kind of impressive. He 3D's like it should be done. Smooth. Anybody can bang the sticks. A Yak is a very neutral plane and that one fliues great, but Kyle made it look unreal. Chip Hyde, Bill Hempel, no one is a better 3D pilot than Kyle. IMAC and pattern Quique is pretty well king and Mark Leesberg, but Kyle can stand toe to toe with anyone for 3D.

Great job Kyle. What motor was that or was he using a couple Hackers???

Norman Ross Jr.

exverbrenner

it's a NeuMotors 2215/1,5Y with 6,7:1 gears on an APC/E 27 x 13 with CCPHX110HV controller, all for less than 1k $...talking bout costs, it would be hard to find a smoker with that ooomph for that amount, period. ok, the batteries....but they are getting cheaper by the day[:@]

roger

patternflyer1

My Feedback: (11)

Could go with an axi. No gearbox for probably half the price.

Futurase

My Feedback: (10)

No AXI will make the power that NEU does. That setup pulls OVER 100A. Any AXI would blow up at those limits.

Norman Ross Jr.

patternflyer1

My Feedback: (11)

Lol, another Axi hater I see...
Do you have proof that this will happen or are you just talking smack?
I happen to know that Axi does make a motor. Even two.
They have the 5360 goldline for up to 15000 grams. And they have the Double 5330 gold. I run a 5330 F3A motor in my pattern ship and it max's at 85 or so with 10 cell Tp's. Trust me when I tell ya it's a great motor. Too much power for the plane. So I set the throttle at 80 percent on a switch so that I don't need full throttle. Therefore not using the full amperage either.
I'll be running the Axi in my 33%. Anyone wanna buy a zdz80?

Futurase

My Feedback: (10)

I am not a AXI hater. I own one. A smaller 4130/16. I run a 6S2P on it and it is a great motor. I think a AXI is a great motor, but the numbers are nothing close to the NEU motor. The Neu motor is designed to handle a insane amount of amps. I know of now AXI that can handle 4.5 Kw or so. None. If they make one please show it to me. Itis not on their web site.

No outrunner makes that kind of power except the Plettenberg and it is a amp monster too and anything Plettenberg isn't cheap. They are great motors though.


No one would love to see a AXI or cheaper motor succeed in this realm, but I know of none currently that will. There sure is a world of distance in your pattern ship and a 33% scale aerobat. Probally about 15 lbs difference. That is if you have a 2M plane.


Norman Ross Jr.

patternflyer1

My Feedback: (11)

Ok, my bad. Sorry. But, goto http://www.modelmotors.cz/downloads/...006-lowres.pdf
Page 23 I think.
The 5360 Axi handles up to 33 pounds, 30x10 wood prop. Jeti 90 speed control, with 10s lipoly's.
I think my 33% with the zdz will be 24 to 25 pounds. 13 or 14 pounds heavier than my 2m ship so your right on that. But, there were ney sayers that said the Axi wouldn't work for pattern. And it is. And by far. I don't know about the new line of hacker outrunners, but it has alot more power than the hacker inrunners. And the hacker is a great motor. So is the neu. Not saying anything negative about it. It is a really good motor. I will make the Axi work in my 33%. It will be awhile because I'm setting up another 2m pattern ship as I just lost one. But it's next on the list. I'll have a thread on it good or bad to inform all.
Yes it has to be proven, but we have proven the Axi in F3A works already so we'll give it a try in the 3d field.
All this electric stuff is so interesting. I'm loving it.

Great, great video. Just what I needed to get motivated to put the final work to this 33% Extra. And also, to sell the zdz and go electric.
Chris

Joacim

The pletenberg Predator is one size bigger than the BAM and handels more power... 11kwatt! (30x10" 48v, 212A, 6035rpm, 88%, 10176w)

Motors same size as the BAM, Pletti Terminator and actro 60L, this year there will come more outrunners designed for 4-8kwatt 800-1400g up to 15s Lipo

I recon the dubbel Axi can do the same jobb, but the efficiency will drop becas of the dubbel motor, dubbel controller design.

exverbrenner

hi chris!

don't wanna argue with you about the quality of axi's, i'm using 5330/18's myself on my patternships since last year. but you can really save your money, forget about that 5360 and the doubleaxi, i saw prototypes in pipers, that's ok. but for an extra, replacing a zdz80, no way. these are scale-type motors, like the actro and the rs from germany. the kV is way to low, you get only between 3000 and 3800 rpm on the prop with 10S, and if you start loading it up, it'll go, the windings aren't made for 100+ A. and you either need that or 12 to 15S to get the desired rpm's. unless you want the first ECO-Extra[:@]fact is, the design of that/those outrunners prohibits output over 3kW, and to fly my 20 lbs raven as it was meant to be flown, i need at least 4kW, 5 would be better, but i still hesitate to go over 10S (charging, handling, danger...) i've got 4kW now, on 35V at 115A, and the Neu2215/1,5Y still stays cool, because steve neu currently makes the most efficient electric motors in the business, producing some 92%. the loss, 8% friction&heat of 4kW is 320W, still a good soldering iron. that axi at 115A will run around 77-80% efficiency, producing about 800W of heat. that will work for 3 minutes...and the damn thing is heavy, 1350gr for the single, 1550gr for the double, that Neu with gearbox (yeah, i know, it sounds like your mom's 30-y-o-kitchen-aid[>:]) comes in at a lean 990gr. in old money, that's saving between 13 and 20 oz. all with much, much less power. sorry again, but it's comparing Yugo's to Porsche's

roger

Joacim

If the KV is to low, go with one that has a higer KV, its just a matter of winding and voltage.

For high power you need to go over only 10s

are there any dyno tests done on the BAM, 92% on 4kwatt load?

http://www.plettenberg-motoren.com/U...tschrauben.htm

http://www.plettenberg-motoren.com/U...tschrauben.htm

Adamg-RCU

For anyone wondering if sponsorship is worth a business' investment, just take a close look at this thread and the other AXI thread in this forum. In both you will see two or three people claiming the AXI is superior to everything on the market and at half the price, and in both you will see that no one believes them because they haven't put that motor in the top placings in a big competition.

-Adam

patternflyer1

My Feedback: (11)

For the record. I am not sponsered and neither is Tom. I have no affiliation with Axi or rcmodels in canada. You on the other hand are affiliated with rctoys in canada.
Adam, I am not claiming that Axi is the best thing on the market. I said it has more power than the Hacker inrunners IMO.
Don't be a axi hater.... Or do, what do I care? I guess I should follow you around the forums and talk about the crappy dragonfly servo's I bought when you guys first started selling them. Cuz they did suck!!!!!!!!!!!
And just like when the hackers started being used. Everyone talked smack about them then, but they've caught on. And in a big way. Just like the Axi's will. And for the record, Tom had 2 Pletty's, and I saw them and they were down on power compared to everything else that I have seen.
You may be a good pilot Adam, but this show's poor business ethics in my opinion. And to think that I was thinking about ordering some 4200's from you because of the price you pm'd me on the 5300's.

Now as for this thread. I could be wrong, and apparently am. Maybe the Axi won't work for this setup. Thanks for pointing that out Roger. I will probably go with the neu then.
I can't wait... This video is sweet!!!!!!!!

More video's!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Adamg-RCU

Perhaps this is my fault, but you didn't hear what I was trying to say. No where in my post did I make any comment on how well the AXIs work. The point was about effective marketing - convincing people to buy something.

And yes, Draganfly-brand servos are about as low-quality as I've seen. You reporting your own, me reporting my own, experience with a product is always OK.

patternflyer1

My Feedback: (11)

I gotcha adam, my bad. Apologies and I'll buy the beer if I ever get the chance at meeting ya.
All I am trying to do, is let people know what my experience with the Axi is. And believe me, I would say the truth if it sucked. I'm only trying to let many, many people who have pm'd me, or emailed me about this F3A motor know that it is a great new alternative in the 2m pattern world. Of course people think it won't work, it's fairly untested at this point.
My whole thing in this thread was thinking I could make the 5360 work in a 33%. As it seems, its been told that it won't work. I may try one anyway as, what do I have to lose? That Neu looked awesome though. Great power. I saw a neu in a 2m giles I think at the Lancaster contest. It seemed ok on power. Looking forward to seeing it again.
Chris

exverbrenner

dear patternflyer1, it's time for an excuse to you...just came back from the field, i made the maiden flight with my 3-meter-extra 300CS by www.fly-fan.sk , powered by nothing else than a double-axi 5330/F3A with a kV of 235. the plane has a TOW of 28.7 lbs and i use an APC/E 27 x 13 cut down to 26. batt's are 10S4P8400 Hyperion Litestorms. current per motor is 85A for a total of 170A. two Hyperion 90A Opto controllers are used. static thrust is at least 50 lbs, the plane goes vertical unlimited. dynamic flight path is comparable to a DA100, close to a DA150. so far about my BS talk...Axi have changed the windings, and now it works! just recharged the litestorms, 7Ah for that 10 min flight, although just with your basic pattern moves, no show. anybody out there using the double axi/F3A as well already? just one more thing, to save money, time&nerves: don't try a bigger prop on this thing. i tried a mejzlik 28 x 12 on bench testing, and it blew the controllers. not even at full throttle, but at roughly over 50A. what happened? well, as you overload an outrunner, because of its bigger inner resistance, it seems to start some sort of "backfire" on the controllers. one or if you are very lucky both then get out of sync, shut down. on the one-axle-double-axi, if just one shuts down, the full load goes to the other one still in sync, and that will blow as sure as hell!

roger

oh, btw, the oil stains under the engine are not from my plane, i swear to god!

patternflyer1

My Feedback: (11)

I had a good feeling the double 5330 woulld work. And work well. I'm glad that you tried this and made it work for you. Most people are too scared to try something new. They stick with what everyone else makes work.
Good job man..

Anyone wanna buy a new zdz80?
LOL
Chris

Andrewg

There is a dyno test at Neu motors of the 2215/2Y on 20 volts - its at 92% at high voltage it will go higher

You may complain it isnt fair but its done by the same guy who did the other tests on this page on the same dyno - most of which have been published. Neu is the only guy who puts his dyno tests out - not even plettenberg publishes as much information.

The 2215 was a power monster I have seen 260 amps at 31 volts and it wasnt warm after the run. 2230s are available on request now.

Every Neu motor I have used has seemed to meet the dyno results v other motors and the electrical characteristics like the Io are very consistent regardless of voltage indicating excellent materials & design.

BTW I distribute Neu in Australia - however I sell Neus because I have found they outperform anything they go up against - excellent competition motors.

exverbrenner

update on the big extra: the double axi 5330 in the end was a bad choice, it has blown more controllers than they could supply...the interference between the two rotors running on a coupled axle is just too much to synchronize, if you push the power envelope to the max. so steve neu came up with the solution - the GBAM 2230/1Y/6,7. i have now logged about 30 flights, and no problems so far. the setup is 15S2P10Ah thunderpower xtreme, jeti spin 200 controller, fuchs 3-blade carbon prop 30 x 13. the GBAM is feeling fine at 52V on 211A load (yessir, thats 11kW or 15bhp in olde money) and even in 90 degree weather, everything is holding together. the plane now has a TOW of 35 lbs and a static thrust of at least twice that. engine run time, measured on the tx timer on more than 25% throttle is 7 minutes with 20% SOC left, that's around 10 minutes of pattern flying. jean-claude spillmann, who won 4th in last year's tucson shootout, after seeing the plane fly, said the power is now on par with a DA150, and he has to know it...

Eggert

..In Denmark at least two guys are flying AXI with very, very good results. Among all the many electrics they are the coolest ( Not cool but coldest !) setups to use flying pattern ships. Why ? Because they are not pushed to their limits flying a 5 kg model. They claim to withstand the highest amps for the longest time of all the motors used for 2x2 pattern. Since the physics still apply to our world, if anybody has heard something else please let me know, the only downside with the AXI is the large cobber/ drum weight og 653 gramme.
And I fly YS 160. I am not sponsored in any way but I like to see a troublefree setup....

dunaman

And what about this one in Brazil?!?!!!
YES!!!!!!Hardcore too!!!
http://br.youtube.com/watch?v=N1tVc1...=110&Itemid=41