owenskt

I am new to the board, but I am looking into get one of the following planes as my first RC airplane:

HobbyZone Super Cub
ParkZone Piper Cub
Dynam Cessna EP400

I like the Dynam product for the price, the fact it has 4 channels, a 72MHz Tx/Rx, brushless motor, and a LiPo battery. I should be able to move the electronics to a new plane also, I believe.

I like the HobbyZone because it has a the training flight control system and should be easier to learn on. However, if I want to go to a new plane, I have to buy everything again.

I like the ParkZone because it appears to be a good compromise in hardware between the two, as there is a new version that has a brushless motor and a LiPo battery.

I want to learn to fly an RC plane, but I need to do it on a budget.

I would appreciate some insights from those of you who have flown any of these planes or have been able to learn to fly RC planes without breaking the bank.

Later,
Keith

SackOHammers

I started with the SuperCub and am glad I did.

As for having to buy the electronics all over again... the parkzone planes are so affordable it isn't like you're having to reinvest all those dollars again. You can find the Super Cub online for around $110 or $120 if you hunt. Thats about the same price, maybe a touch more, than most planes alone.

When you decide to buy up and get a radio, receiver, servos, batteries, charger, and all that stuff, you'll be spending more than $100 for just that gear. And you'll be spending $ for a plane.

The thing that'll probably save you the most money, is a flight sim. You can buy the fancy ones if you have the money, and they are certainly better than the cheap/free ones. However, the free one was good enough for me. I got FMS which is free, and the Esky controller for the computer ($15). I put in a few hours... yes, its not exactly like the real thing, the wind is consistent without any buffets.... but it taught me a lot about controlling and landing the plane. That $15 has been worth it.... because I haven't crashed my plane yet... my first flight went well and I felt confident because of my time with the sim.... also because the Super Cub is so docile... AND I knew that if I completely blew it... if I just freaked out and managed to drill it into the ground... that there was a good chance I could fix it with some cheap 3M packing tape from Walgreens and some 5 minute epoxy. Those two things gave me enough confidence to just go out and fly it.

Yes, the Super Cub is only 3 channels. But I'm glad I learned with it. If I wanted I could convert it to 4 channel by cutting ailerons into the wings... I chose to go with an aileron trainer instead. For that people are recommending Mini Magister, E-starter, Gemini, or Tiger Moth 400 (my choice, but not the most recommended choice). Its all up to you... and some people are just naturals with this stuff and get bored with the Super Cub. Me, I'm glad I got it and then plan to move to 4 channel as a second plane.

You'll probably get varied advice from different people, I'm still very much a newb.

ozrcboy

Great to see you passing it on SackOfHammers...

genepeele

I have been flying the Super Cub for some time and it is a great plane to learn on and is fun. It is extremely stable and tough enough for rough landings. I even flew mine into an electric pole and it survived with minor damage. I recently modified it with aelirons to get some aeliron experience and went to the 8 cell pack for more power. I will eventually modify it further with a brushless motor and li-pos. Even tho I am planning to go to a 2nd electric in the future for more speed and acrobatics I will continue to fly the Super Cub. In my opinion it ranks up there as one of the best. Welcome to the sport! Gene

India

Hobbico has a Piper J3 Cub that is 4 channel, or would it be better to go 3 channel to begin with?

owenskt

Thanks for the suggestions. I am thinking about getting a simulator too.

By the way, if I bought a 4-channel plane, but did not hook up the servos for the 4th channel, would it function effectively like a 3-channel. In other words, if the servos are not powered up and placed so the ailerons were in a neutral position, will the ailerons stay fixed? I figure they would, but I thought I would ask.

The Super Cub is tempting, but so is that new Parkzone Piper J3 Cub brushless...

SackOHammers

I have no experience trying it, but I imagine that if you took a plane that was designed to be flown with ailerons, and tried to fly by rudder only, you'd have a very difficult time.

I think 3 channel planes rely on a lot of wing dyhedral to enable a plane to turn when using the rudder only. I believe many aileron planes wouldn't have as much dyhedral or the characteristics to make it fly reasonably..... BUT! I could be wrong. My answer is based only on what I've read, not on real experience with aileron planes.

I'm putting together my Tiger Moth 400 right now for my first aileron plane. Just by looking at the wings... I imagine I'd have a tough time maneuvering it (landings) without ailerons.

For a first plane, from what I've read from J-3 owners, and my experience... I'm glad I picked the Super Cub over the J-3 as my first plane. This doesn't mean that I wouldn't get one in the future. People like them.

SackOHammers

Ah, I just read this thread:
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_6546349/tm.htm

Leo L gives great advice in there. He also mentions it is possible to fly the Minimag with the tail only. Leo L is a respected person around here. He has experience and his posts always seem very level-headed.

India

From what I've read on the specs of the Super Cub and J3, there's not much difference except the Super Cub has ACT and the J3 dont. The J3 you can get with 4 channel and brushless/lipo. I thought about a Cessna 182 3 or 4 channel, but I dont know. Any thoughts?

ozrcboy

Sackofhammers is right on the money - most planes built to fly with ailerons don't fly well with rudder only, but there are some exceptions (which tend to be planes built to fly 3 channel with "optional" ailerons) like GWS estarter and Multiplex Minimag.

Another fellow was asking about this j3 cub - do you have a link to the actual model as I think j3 is just the name of the real plane, so can't really comment on the model without a little more info.

Leo L

Hi Keith, Hi Aaron;

Welcome to RC flying!

The SuperCub is definitely the plane of choice for the beginner who will be learning on his/her own. Its a very forgiving plane that stands up well to the punishment that most beginners subject their planes to; yet it is capable of decent performance, especially if you go for the 8-cell battery and trim the wing tips (allowing it to fly faster).

I have not come across any J3Cubs or Cessnas that are a good first plane. All of the ones that I have seen are intended to be intermediate planes, i.e.: a good second or third plane. The most popular J3Cub is the ParkZone. It was my third plane and I still enjoy flying it, but it is definitely not for a beginner. It also has some very nasty traits that need to be corrected to make it a decent flyer. Horizon Hobby, parent company to HobbyZone and ParkZone, took notice and corrected all of the problems of the J3 when they produced the SuperCub. The SuperCub and J3 cost the same, yet the SuperCub is much easier to fly and yet has much better performance than the J3. That's why they just came out with the brushless J3. However, the brushless J3 still does not have a tail wheel, which means that its still a horrible plane for doing ground take-offs. The new FlyZone J3 looks like it should be a nice flying plane, but I believe that it has the same power system as the FlyZone Cessna, which means that it will be severly underpowered. If the plane is modified with a brushless/LiPo set-up, it should be a very nice intermediate plane.

The bottom line is that you should get the SuperCub as your first plane. Then, as you get better, modify it or move on to another plane. Many flyers who started with the SuperCub and who moved on to other planes continue to fly the SuperCub as a relaxing, fun flyer.

aeajr

My Feedback: (2)

Getting your first plane? What should you get

If you have an instructor, follow his/her advice as to what to get as your
plane. Getting info here is good, but
discuss it with the instructor before you buy.

If you are going to be helping a new flyer learn to fly,
this thread might be helpful. Here is the method I use to
teach:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=499281
Helping people Learn to Fly
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5767


SPACE

How much space do you have for flying? If you have totally
clear space of at least 600'X600', about 9 square acres, approx
4-6 squarefootball/soccer fields, then I can recommend one
class o plane.

If your space is more like 200X200 (one square acre or one
soccer field ) then a different plane is in order. If it is
ess than that, different again.

These are my own designations and are based on my subjective
ranking of the sace a new flyer should have when learning on
his own. An experienced fyer can fly faster planes in smaller spaces,
but a new flyer wants to have more space so you are not in a constant
state of panic trying to turn. Now, you
can get above the edges of the field and expand your space,
but if you lose control, you drop in woods, on top of kids or smash
someone's windshield. If that windshield is in a car is traveling
down a road when you hit the windshield, you could cause an
accident or worse.

So much for space. You get the idea.

I don't recommend most pretty planes as first planes. They
are too easy to break, too hard to fix and look bad in short
order. There is only one semi-scale plane that has a reputation of being
super tough that I do recommend, the HobbyZone Super Cub.

I feel a high wing three channel R/E/T plane is your best choice for a first
plane. R/E/T will require a little more learning than the two channel R/E
planes but is a better choice as a first plane, in my opinion. These use
the same control inputs as more advanced planes and can be flown in
more wind once you have mastered them in calm conditions.

Below I list electric planes for beginners. Some come ready to fly, some are
almost ready to fly (add your own radio gear) and some are kits. All of them are
electric. If you are looking for your
first plane, you should find something here to peak your interest.

If you are totally new to RC Flying, this article may be
helpful.


Six Keys to Success for new e-flyers
http://www.*********.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8492


READY TO FLY STARTER PLANES - Electric Parkflyers
No building - they practically fly right out of the box. These also
glide well so you can thermal soar with them under the right conditions.

SMALL SPACE FLYER
Can fly in 200X200 or even a large gym

Slow-V from Parkzone - $140 -
I have flown the slo-V.
Best flown in still to 3 mph breeze. This is the best choice for
people who only have a small space to fly or who have an indoor
place to fly, such as a large gym or similar space.
http://h1071118.hobbyshopnow.com/pro...p?prod=PKZ1300
Discussion Thread
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_2074785/tm.htm
Review
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/a...article_id=426
Video
http://www.horizonhobby.com/ProdInfo...240x180_nb.wmv
Night fly module on a Slo-V
http://rc-galaxy.com/messageboard/mb...ViewMsg&num=-8


LARGE SPACE - AT LEAST 600x600
That's about 4 Football/soccer fields

Shown in order or recommendation

Easy Star - RTF - $175
I have flown the Easy Star - Great plane for new flyers!
Super tough foam. Good parkflyer and a good glider
In the US the RTF package comes with a 72 MHz radio
system that can be used to fly other planes
http://www.hobbypeople.net/gallery/240025.asp
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXFXV0&P=ML
Easy Star - ARF - Add you own radio gear
http://www.hobbypeople.net/gallery/240009.asp
Build Thread
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=350408
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=459096
Videos
http://plawner.org/video/easygo.wmv
http://plawner.org/video/easystar.wmv
Mods, upgrades and more
http://www.mpx-easystar.de/
Add Ailerons - Start at post 195
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...&page=13&pp=15
Travel Box
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...5&goto=newpost


HobbyZone Super Cub - $159
This is the only semi-scale plane on my list. I have
flown this one several times. There are many excellent reports too
If you REALLY need a plane that looks
like something people would be in, this is the one I would recommend.
It also takes the same Xport accessories as other HobbyZone and ParkZone
planes so you can drop bombs, parachutes and attach
other accessories to extend your fun. It has a steerable tail
wheel so you can effectively taxi the plane. Great for ROG launches.
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...ProdID=HBZ7100
Photos and Videos
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...ProdID=HBZ7100
Other Excellent Video - Hi res for high speed connect users
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...25#post6040744
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showa...mentid=1051938
manual
http://www.horizonhobby.com/ProdInfo...ualCropped.pdf
Discussions on the Forums
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12218
http://forums.radiocontrolzone.com/s...21#post2130521
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...44#post6385310
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=550899


T-Hawk - RTF - Excellent Value - $160-170
This company is really putting together some outstanding
packages. I have flown the T-Hawk. Excellent first plane.
Get the Extreme value package. It comes with an extra wing,
tail and battery. This plane stands up to hard landings
Can be flown on 27 MHz or 72 MHz
http://www.readytoflyfun.com/thawk3chrtf.html
T-Hawk - Without Radio - add your radio and receiver
http://www.readytoflyfun.com/wittran.html
T-Hawk Buddy Box 72 MHz trainer system - $279
This is really unique!
http://www.readytoflyfun.com/t72rtfpatrpa.html
T-Hawk Discussion Thread
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...ighlight=THawk
Videos
http://www.readytoflyfun.com/thawkvideos.html


Aerobird 3 - RTF Electric - $110 -
I started on an Aerobird RTF. I have hundreds of flights on my Aerobirds. I
also thermal and slope soar this plane.
Flies well and stands up to hard landings. Their add on fun accessories for
night flying,
air to air combat and drop module add to the fun! The combat module makes a
great lost
plane locator, even if you don't plan to fly combat. Great keep in the car
plane - take off the wing and it goes back
in the box fully assembled. Most can't do that!
http://www.hobbyzonesports.com/Produ...ProdID=HBZ3600
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...ProdID=HBZ3600
AB3 Manual
http://www.hobbyzonesports.com/ProdI...nual_LoRes.pdf
AB3 Review with video
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/a...article_id=884



ESSENTIAL ADD-ONS AND POINTS TO CONSIDER

When evaluating costs, add the following items to your list.

For the Aerobird, buy 1 Spare wing
and tail ($15-25) and an extra battery pack (about $20 each)

The T-Hawk comes with spare wing, tail and two battery
packs, so factor that into the price and you will see it is
closer in price to the Aerobird than it first appears.

For the Slo-V, two extra props and 1 gearbox seem to come in
handy as this is a front motor plane and these parts really
take the damage of nose in crashes. Don't know about other
parts. The others are pushers so props are less at risk. Add that
extra battery pack.

For the Super Cub, get an extra 7 cell battery and a couple
of spare props. (about $30-35 total). No need for a spare
wing right away and you may never need one.

The Easy Star - add-on battery packs should be at least 7
cell 900 MAh 2/3A or 4/5A battery packs, about $25 each.
Be sure to check the balance with the different battery packs.

India

Thanks for the info. It was very helpful. The Super Cub sounds like the plane for me

Here is a link to the J3 Piper Cub...it looks like it has a tail wheel and is 4 channel...
http://www.redrockethobbies.com/Prod...e=HCAA24%2A%2A

JRickey

I started out with the Aerobird products. The commander takes a beating but the previous radio system was weak. I got a swift after my previous radio would have dead spots. The plane flew great but a couple of hits and it would not fly well due to design flaws in how the wing mounts. I ended up getting a slow stick and all of the gear and am overly happy with it. I spent $250 on two planes that are no longer useful other that the swifts guts. I paid $35 for the plane, $100 for the radio and reciever, $15 for the ESC and used my previous packs (NIhms at $20 each) and have a plane that is a excellent starter plane (probably the best). Since then I have bought another plane and modified the wing making it flat, clipping the wings and adding ailerons($50). And now I have a plane that I can float around with the original wing in a tight place or throw on the mod wing and rip it up a little. A side note is that I switched to lipos and a cheap brushless prior to the mods but I wouldn't recommend doing this till your comfortable with the original set up and your skills. I guess what I'm trying to say s that if your thinking your really going to do this you might want to pony up the extra $50 or so and get a plane that is a good beginner, easily modified for advanced flight and have equipment that can be utilized after the plane is no longer used. Next for me is waiting for my 6 channel comp. radio I bought on ebay, adding floats and messing around with adding flaps for a tradional STOL configuration. Its going to be me answer to the Polatis Porter

aeajr

My Feedback: (2)

JRicky,

congrats on your success with the Slow Stick.

Just FYI, the Commander is not an Aerobird product. The Commander is a Firebird series plane. They are fun, and fly well but I don't recommend them.

The Aerobird Swift is DEFINATELY NOT an beginner plane. I am not surprised you had trouble with it. Hobbyzone classifies that as a Zone 3 plane, for advanced pilots only.

owenskt

Leo, Ed, SackOHammers, ozrcboy,

Thanks for all the good info guys!

It really want a plane that is a miniature of one that is actually flown. It sounds like the Super Cub is for me. I had thought about an Aerobird, but I really want a preal-looking lane I can enjoy and has an upgrade path. It sounds like the SuperCub will take new gear, so I can learn how to handle more speed and ailerons with mods to the SuperCub.

The brushless J3Cub from Parkzone is very tempting, but I really want to enjoy flying and not constantly worry about crashing.

Thanks for your help,
Keith

Leo L

Good choice! Keep us updated as you begin to fly.

aeajr

My Feedback: (2)

I know you will enjoy the Super Cub.

You can certainly upgrade it later but my recommendation is to take the upgrade money and put it into a computer radio and a second plane. Then you will have two.

When you are ready, let us know and we can advise you.

Typically I don't dismantle and discard planes, I add planes. Over five years I
have accumulated about 24 planes. Some I purchased new, some used and a couple were
given to me. And I have given a few away myself. Sort of paying it forward.

About half are flyable or near flyable at any given time. I have 6 categories of
planes. Aerotowed gliders, thermal duration gliders, discus launched gliders,
slope gliders, electric gliders and electric airplanes. I have 1-3 in each
category that are flyable at any time. This way, when I look at the weather
report and plan my flying day, I have a choice of what I fly.

High winds from the north? Grab the slope planes.

Mild breeze, sunshine, lets go thermal soaring.

Don't feel like setting up the winch for the thermal gliders? Grab the electric
gliders, electric airplanes, the discus launched gliders, or maybe one of each.

Sal will be at the field with his tow plane? Get the aerotowed glider ready.

My friend Joe wants to learn to fly? Grab the Aerobird ( my first plane ) or
one of the simple gliders.

When flying day comes, I grab 2-3 of what I want to fly and off I go. So a plane
that I have mastered does not go to waste, it goes into the active pool for
enjoyment at any time. It doesn't take 24 planes to make this work. It might
only be 2 or 3, but however many you have, you can enjoy them all, forever.

Did you know that an Easy Star also makes a great electric glider? Did you know
a Super Cub can be used for slope soaring? My Aerbird was the first plane I
ever thermaled and the first plane I used for slope soaring. And you will see
experienced pilots buying them too, because they are just fun to fly!

Enjoy that Super Cub. It will be with you for a long time.

India

Well I think my mind has been made up for me
Gonna have to order a Super Cub. Can't deny the obvious when it comes to opinions about this plane. I'll have to put off ordering for a bit, but when I do, the Super Cub is on my list. Thanks to all who convinced me to go this route.

bowlind

I am new at rc flying and I have decided to get the super cub as my first plane. Is is recommeded to purchase extra parts as well or if anyone has any other suggestions please let me know!

SackOHammers

Well, how far away is your LHS (Local Hobby Shop)? If its close you might not worry about extra parts. If it is far away, maybe buy an extra propellor or two.
When I bought my Super Cub I also bought an 8 cell battery. I'm really glad I did... so when I go fly I have the 7 cell and the 8 cell... keeps me in the air awhile. The 8 cell performs much better, especially if you have some wind.
Other than that... not really.... I wouldn't worry about buying an extra wing.
The cowling can get beat up... you can buy a replacement for under $2, but honestly, it is just there for looks, your plane will fly fine without it. If you find yourself nosing over and scraping your cowling a lot... just fly without it until you learn to land a little better.

The best investment of time/money is the prepatory work you can do with some packing tape...you know, the clear 3M stuff you get at Walgreens or wherever. Place a single layer of it along the leading edge of your wings (no wrinkles). Also place some around the tips of the wings. If you want, you can also wind a few wrappings around the tail... sort of where the control rods come out... sometimes people will snap off the tail if they have a crash... but some tape there might prevent damage. So... this work doesn't really add much weight to the plane.. you won't notice it... and its not really necessary, but if you do happen to run into something... or the ground... then you'll save a little time in repairs.

There are several other modifications people recommend. You can find those in "The Official Super Cub Thread" on these forums... also the supercubclub forums.
Some people recommend ripping out the whole battery box under the plane (in a careful way) and regluing it back in with glue to make it stronger. I never did this mod and I've never ripped out my battery box during a rough landing so I'm not going to worry about it... but some people highly recommend it.

The one thing I'm really glad I did was replace the wheels. It rolls much better on grass with bigger wheels, plus they just look cool.
Here is a link to my wheel mod... you'll find other great ideas on those boards.
http://supercubclub.proboards78.com/...ead=1187757646

Have fun!

pvt.parts_usmc

hi, if you plan on teaching yourself to fly, and you are handy building things an like the satisfaction of flying something you put some work into, id go with polecats "Push-e Cat" kit ,its really hard to tear one up. they are made of EPP foam. an take a licking an keep on ticking. but if your not into the "building" scene, then a Easy Star, both great flying planes. theres alot nice planes out there,but id get something that the guts can be moved to other planes later on though, just my 2 cents.

owenskt

I thought I would follow up with y'all.

I just got my Super Cub. I got it with an extra battery and prop. My local hobby store also has a good selection of replacement parts if needed.

I'll let y'all know how the first flight goes. I am busy with the end of the year, so it'll be a few weeks (sigh...)

Thanks again for the advice and suggestions,
Keith