warpnine

Tonight I started setting up the Logitech 2100T HH gyro (with the LTS-3100G digital tail servo) with the Dx6i transmitter. One interesting thing that happened when I set the servo type (to dedicated Logitech digital servo) was that the servo rotated about 90 degrees from what had been its center point when the gyro thought it was a default servo type (analog?). I got everything set up in the gyro electronics OK, but now am observing the following things:

1) The tail servo responds normally when I move the rudder control on the Tx.

2) The gyro gain of the Tx is set to 45% in normal flight mode and 55% in stunt mode - yet the gain indicator leds on the gyro constantly show 0-10%. The gyro travel adjust is 100% in the Tx with no sub-trim.

3) The gyro Tail Lock mode turns on and off correctly when the switch on the Tx is thrown. The gyro rate is set to fastest.

4) The tail servo does not react at all when the tail is rotated, either in rate mode or tail lock mode. (I hear the gyro making interesting humming noises though). I've seen how this is supposed to work in one of the set up videos on YouTube, where in rate mode the tail servo should briefly react to tail movement and in tail lock mode the servo should react as long as the tail is out of the last position set through the rudder control.

I have no indication that either the Tx or gyro aren't working correctly - it just seems like "something" isn't set up right... Seems like something isn't quite right with the Tx setup, since the gain seen by the gyro is so low. The Dx6i is mostly set up with the default settings with a few tweaks from some posts about HBK2 settings. I don't think there is anything particularly weird about the Tx set up though.

Not sure what to try next. Any thoughts or suggestions would be apprechiated!

Dave

darthdecon

actually you are fine with the way it is setup some radios display the normal or t lock mode different for example if in my jr 12x if i put the gyro sen in tlock mode then the percent can be changed from 0 to 100 in t lock mode if its in normal mode than i can only go from 0-50 percent before it hits tail lock mode,

another way to look at is 0-50 for rate mode on tx and on the gyro it will still read 0-100 percent of rate mode but in t lock mode on the tx is 50- 100 percent and on the gyro it will be between 0-100 percent so you setting up in your dx6i a t lock mode of 55 percent the gyro should olny read about 10 percent if you want to increase the percent on the gyro led you will need to go higher than the 55 percent on the tx, i know from my experience i couldn't go much higher than 63 on the dx6i with out tail wag but while heli is on and you increase the tx tlock mode percent you will see the led increase as well

so as long at the tlock green led is on it is in tail lock mode hope this makes some since to you i guess i'm not the best at explaining.

darthdecon

do you mean you cant spin the tail with the rudder stick

warpnine

Thanks for your reply!

No, the rudder stick makes the tail servo move as I would expect it to. What I meant in item 4 was that if I rotate the helicopter - the gyro doesn't seem to do anything to move the tail servo on its own. The tail servo seems to react as if the gyro wasn't there at all (only controlled directly with the rudder stick)...

I'll try bumping up the normal and stunt mode gains in the Tx tomorrow. Thanks!

warpnine

I played around with the gyro gain settings in the Dx6i and finally have the gyro moving the tail servo in the right direction! I have the rate mode gain set to 70% and the HH mode gain set to 25%. The gyro switch on the Tx is still able to switch between rate and HH mode too (which it was not able to do for a while, as I was messing with the gain settings).

I was going crazy for about a half hour because the rudder stick was moving everything fine and with the new gyro gain settings the gyro was moving the tail servo - in the wrong direction. Reversing the gyro in the radio didn't help and it took me a while to remember that the gyro also had a direction setting. Changing that made everything move in the right direction finally.

The tail servo is still "centered" a little off 90 degrees - so I don't know if I should try to use the Tx sub-trim to adjust it, or if that would mess up the gyro? I'm tempted just to leave it alone, since the gyro has already been set for the current limits of the servo the way it is.

Now all the electronics (new Tx, HH gyro, ESC, motor, and tail servo) are mostly set up - I just have to put all the dis-assembled parts back together. Currently the motor is out (pending a more symetricial pinion gear), the receiver has not been mounted (pending installation of new super-skids), and the tail servo linkage is out too. I'm not sure I can get the canopy on over the new ESC and larger 1800mah battery either - wish they hadn't made it so narrow in the front.

Off to watch "Burn Notice" on USA Network!

darthdecon

congrats on getting it to work those gyros rock if you ask me sometimes if you turn a servo horn 180 degress they will line up depends on the brand of servo and type of horn, and i know you have a 3100g so it might as my 6100g on my trex600 was able to do it. Yeah i have a trex canopy on mine because of space limitation, when i put my tower pros sg90's on the cyclic the front servo horn would even rub on the stock canopy.

good show that burn notice.

Zimatosa

Hey warp,

You have to use the sub-trim to remove the "creep" in the servo. If the arm is off center now but you got it to 90 degrees before you set up the the heli in HH mode, this is normal. The servo arm in HH mode is supposed to snap to one side or the other and then creep back toward the center very very very(very) slowly. The slow movement is called "creep". Use sub trim to balance the creep out between full left and full right rudder. It should stick and creep at the same rate from both sides....So, with everything on and ready to fly, go to the sub-trim for rudder and move the rudder one way and just let go. Do this the opposite way and just let go. You will notice that one way will creep back faster than the other, just move the sub-trim plus or minus until they creep at the same rate. Your HH mode will work the best this way....

I do not know if you were aware of this fact but when the gain in the DX6i is under 50% it is in rate mode. When the gain is over 50% it is in HH mode. Sounds like you set it up backward. Probably okay to leave it like that but it will be opposite than everyone else's set-up, granted theirs is set correct. Also for reference, every point over 50% on your radios gain has a value of 1.5% gain. Just think of a value of 50 on your radio as being ZERO. Anything under is rate and a negative gain and anything over is a positive or 1.5 for every full increment. Example: Your gain says 80...That would be a value of 45 gain in HH mode(30x1.5). If you notice in your gain settings, the value can be dialed up to 125%. That would be 112.5% actual gain(75x1.5, and way way too much!!!)...According to Finless, 32 actual gain or a value of 71.5, is "supposed" to be ideal for most Helicopters. This was an evaluation of 450 helis though...

Now that we are all confused, reread cause it really does make sense...To me anyway!! LOL

Peace, and may the Shwartz be witch ya!

Z

warpnine

Thanks for the reply Z!

When the tail servo was originally "centered" with the Tx, I could not put the arm on it at 90 degrees - so it is as close as I could get - about 80 degrees or so... Tonight I will try reversing the arm - to see if that lets it connect any closer to 90. I have attached the longest straight arm to the servo, because it looked like it would provide the most leverage - but maybe one of the shorter arms may fit better at 90 degrees. I'll see if I can take a picture this afternoon...

I'm guessing that I'll have to move my new 25A ESC that is mounted sideways under the front of the battery cage - since it doesn't look like the stock canopy will fit over it. I had seen a wider looking "bubble" canopy on one of the sites (and regrettably not on U.S. Hobby Supply) but now I can't find the link any more... I had no idea that a T-rex canopy would fit a HoneyBee, which implies that a CP Belt one may fit too. Not sure how much bigger it may be?

I was puzzled by the fact that if I set the gyro gain below 50% in the Tx, the "TL" (tail lock) light would come on in the gyro. For a while, when I had both the rate and HH gains set around 30%, I couldn't even get the TL light to go off at all (the switch had no effect). Any chance that I need to reverse the direction of the gyro in the Tx - to get everything back on the "normal" side of 50% again? (Right now it is set to "normal" ). I forget what that did when I was messing with it last night, except that it did not make the gyro move the servo in the opposite direction (that was what I wanted - only changing the "direction" in the gyro fixed that).

Thanks for your explanation! I'll try working with it more tonight!

Cheers - Dave

warpnine

Duh! I still had the gyro channel reversed in the Tx - so after fixing that and changing the gain settings to 30% for rate mode and 75% for HH mode - the tail servo seems to be moving correctly once again (as do the rudder controls)! The gyro switch on the Tx is working properly too, lighting up the TL light on the gyro when "on" (1 or down position). Thanks again Z!

Attached are two photos, one showing how my tail servo is "centered" (can't get to 90 degrees because of the way the arm and hub teeth align) and the other showing my big new ESC attached near the front of the battery tray - where I think it prevents the canopy from going on... I'll have to move it further back and maybe rotate it so it is right below the battery I guess. (If I do that, I'll have to find a different spot for the satellite receiver too... The gyro has been set to the limits of the tail servo, so even though it starts off true center, the gyro should not try to over drive it in either direction. I used the longest servo arm that came with it, to get the most throw distance and leverage on the tail...

As you can see I've not got the motor mounted (pending a fully symetrical pinion gear), not attached the tail rotor to the tail servo and done the mechanical adjustment, and have not attached the receiver(s) yet - waiting to get it all together and balance it... I'm planning to hook up with Michael this weekend, and I know he'll know how to finish preparing everything for flight! I want him to check all my Tx and gyro settings for sure too!

With all the upgrades, once it is all back together and adjusted properly it should be like flying a totally different bird! These are:
- Dx6i with AR6200 receiver
- 3900kv motor with HobbyWing 25A ESC
- Xtreme 43T tail drive pulley
- Logitech 2100T HH gyro with LTS-3100G digital tail servo
- 1800mah high-discharge battery (also with a new Align charger)
- "tough as nails" feathering shaft
- super-skids (yet to be put on)
- CNC parts for all rotor and tail components (yet to be put on)
- 10T pinion gear (yet to be put on)
- 1.2GHZ wireless camera (yet to be put on, and I have to learn to fly without destroying the helicopter first)

Everything but the camera from U.S. Hobby Supply!

Have a great weekend everyone!

Dave