Everything Diesel Discuss R/C Diesel engines here.

Club PAW

Reply

Old 10-30-2013, 01:14 PM
  #1  
brokenenglish
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Amboise, FRANCE
Posts: 196
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default Club PAW

Gentlemen,
I think we need a "Club PAW". There can't be many people messing around with diesels today who don't possess one, and no other manufacturer has done so much, for so long, for diesel-loving aeromodellers. I have only admiration for the whole operation, from Gig's start right through to Tony and Paul's work today.
I remember thinking that Gig's first "PAW Special" looked "right" at the time, and I still think that today.
I first flew a PAW 1.49 in 1961. Since then I've flown quite a few more PAWs, and I now have a couple of RC TBR engines flying...
So let's inaugurate a Club PAW!
All those in favour:.... Great:
None against, that's what I expected!

Now, I've been putting off building a KK Falcon for years, due to procrastination concerning choice of engine... I didn't realise that the obvious was staring me in the face... I saw a brand new PAW 60 RC TBR, from an American collection, on eBay, and it immediately occured to me, after only about 30 years of muddled thinking, that it was the obvious choice for the KK Falcon (for me).

The engine duly arrived and was given 40 or 50 minutes of gentle running, on the same day that I received it.

I've just given it it's second running session, which you can see here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xl1HLZADAI

PS: I expected a 60 diesel to be a bit "virile", but this PAW is a real ***** cat. I can't fault it...
No batteries, no starters, no electrics and, most important, NO PROBLEMS!
brokenenglish is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 01:58 PM
  #2  
AMB
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: winter park, FL
Posts: 6,748
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Total agreement have an 03--2-06s-an 09,15,19 and 40 no issues quality engines still in production all rc I really like the exhaust rings small stack easy to pipe the exhaust away from the plane keeps things nice and clean martin

Last edited by AMB; 10-30-2013 at 02:03 PM.
AMB is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 05:30 PM
  #3  
Recycled Flyer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: SydneyNew South wales, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 1,346
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I have the PAW 15DS, an old 19DS and two 40's.

One of the 40's (black finned) has been fettled by Tony Eifflender and is noticeably more bouncy when flicking it over and to my amazement uses a smaller than standard venturi diameter as set up for control line stunt.
Recycled  Flyer is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2013, 02:10 AM
  #4  
Mr Cox
 
Mr Cox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Karlstad, SWEDEN
Posts: 3,760
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I have a few .55, 1.0 (cc) plus a few of the .09 and .15, all in RC version. The engines work very well but the carb is a little too crude for my taste, they work even better with an adjustable low end.

Here is a short video of a .09RC in a Thunder Tiger "Scooter"; http://rcuvideos.com/video/TT-Scooter-with-PAW-09-RC
Mr Cox is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2013, 10:33 AM
  #5  
j.hiner@comcast.net
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Downers Grove, IL
Posts: 466
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I have a PAW .40 RC that I fly in SAM Texaco. Model is enlarged Lanzo Airborn at 1629 sq. in. wing area. Jack
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	PAW .40 RC.jpg
Views:	114
Size:	701.0 KB
ID:	1935317  
j.hiner@comcast.net is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2013, 10:35 AM
  #6  
j.hiner@comcast.net
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Downers Grove, IL
Posts: 466
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default Big Airborn with PAW .40

Model flys well at 120 ounces. Jack
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Airborn 1600 PAW .40 (640x480).jpg
Views:	184
Size:	334.4 KB
ID:	1935318  
j.hiner@comcast.net is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2013, 10:40 AM
  #7  
j.hiner@comcast.net
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Downers Grove, IL
Posts: 466
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default Paw .15

I also have a PAW .15
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Picture 017.jpg
Views:	119
Size:	459.8 KB
ID:	1935320  
j.hiner@comcast.net is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2013, 04:23 PM
  #8  
Recycled Flyer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: SydneyNew South wales, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 1,346
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by j.hiner@comcast.net View Post
I have a PAW .40 RC that I fly in SAM Texaco. Model is enlarged Lanzo Airborn at 1629 sq. in. wing area. Jack
Jack, what size lumber are you spinning upfront with that 40?
Recycled  Flyer is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2013, 04:36 PM
  #9  
j.hiner@comcast.net
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Downers Grove, IL
Posts: 466
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

17/12 prop at a click or two below 1/2 throttle gives 3,000 RPM and takes off short grass in about 10 feet. Then throttle back a bit and slow climb at 2,800 RPM. About a 10 minute motor run on 28 cc of fuel. Might do better with the original size Airborn at a bit over 1300 sq. in. wing area. Maybe a four stroke diesel next. Jack
j.hiner@comcast.net is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2013, 06:49 PM
  #10  
Warren B
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Melbourne, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 66
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I totally agree with the sentiments of this thread.
PAW's may not be the most exotic or quirky of diesels, but they are dependable, easy to operate and throttle surprisingly well.

I have 3x0.55's, 049, 06, 09TBR, 15RC, 19TBR, 35, 60 TBR all RC and a lone CL version 2.49 DS.

Not all are in planes at the moment, but quite a few get a regular "air"-ing.

Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Sharkface flying (1).JPG
Views:	550
Size:	2.80 MB
ID:	1935473   Click image for larger version

Name:	DSC01697.JPG
Views:	486
Size:	1.39 MB
ID:	1935476   Click image for larger version

Name:	Windbag 002.JPG
Views:	492
Size:	1.41 MB
ID:	1935482   Click image for larger version

Name:	Quivver 3.JPG
Views:	532
Size:	2.39 MB
ID:	1935494  
Warren B is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2013, 12:58 AM
  #11  
brokenenglish
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Amboise, FRANCE
Posts: 196
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Good to see Warren and Jack on this thread.
I think it was posts by Warren and Jack that made me realise that the big PAWs are an excellent OT RC option. I'm absolutely delighted with my 60.
PAW isn't really one of my "specialist" collection marques, but the early ones are very collectable and the later models are just about the best practical RC diesels.
Looking at my collection listing, I have 9 non-RC engines and 6 with RC carbs., as follows:

1 PAW 80, 1 PAW 100 Mk II, 1 PAW 100 RC, 1 PAW 100 RC Mk II, 1 PAW 1.49 cm³ TBR RC, 2 PAW 1.49 cm³,
2 PAW Special 2.47 cm³ (originals - the first PAW), 1 PAW 2.49 cm³ Mk III, 1 PAW 2.49 cm³ Mk IV, 2 PAW .19D Mk II RC TBR,
1 PAW .60 RC TBR and 1
PK 25/86 0.86 cm³.

I've thought for a long time that we have a lot of discussion about correcting all sorts of faults, on poorly made engines (OK, it's normal that we should be discussing problems...), which means that quality, no-problem engines are under-represented!
Fortunately, we have the Mills and ED threads but, even then, other engines seem to creep in...
Maybe I'm just getting old!

Last edited by brokenenglish; 11-01-2013 at 01:01 AM.
brokenenglish is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2013, 03:52 AM
  #12  
steve111
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Wollongong, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 393
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

A PAW 249 was my first 'proper' engine (ie not a reed-valve 049) back when I was 14, and I've had a soft spot for them (and diesels in general) ever since. Currently I've got an 06 BR, 3 149 DS, a 149 Contest (the Schnuerle one), 2 09 DS, a 249 DS, 249 Contest, 19 DS, 19 BR, 19 TBR and a 35 TBR. I like them all, and they've all flown except for one of the 149s which I bought a few months ago and has only ever run once on the bench.
steve111 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2013, 11:20 AM
  #13  
RDJeff
My Feedback: (11)
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Anchorage, AK AK
Posts: 442
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Love 'em all! I have a .09, a.15, a .29, a .35, and a .40, most are throttled. The .40 is in a Goldberg Cub that is all ready to fly, but will have to wait for winter to go away. Can't wait to fly that one!
RDJeff is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2013, 02:01 PM
  #14  
erik58
My Feedback: (4)
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: easthaven, CT
Posts: 201
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

love 'em all the ones I don't have are some of the smaller ones. haveto build some more plane so I can fly them all
erik58 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2013, 09:37 PM
  #15  
qazimoto
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Central Coast NSW, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 1,344
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

This shiney new PAW 15 TBR GTS2 was delivered to a CCMAC member this week via D.O.

It's the high RPM Goodyear racing version.

It came with a note signed by Tony Eifflaender on running in.

The interesting bit is his recommended flying fuel.

10% Castor, 32% Ether, 58% Paraffin, and about 1.5% IPN.

Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	pawgst2001.jpg
Views:	1493
Size:	118.2 KB
ID:	1936175  

Last edited by qazimoto; 11-02-2013 at 09:41 PM.
qazimoto is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2013, 12:34 PM
  #16  
AMB
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: winter park, FL
Posts: 6,748
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

the real surprise to me is the 10% castor really seems low it is a BB engine however never saw that low % of castor in any engine diesel or glow maybe I missed something martin

its for sure Tony E knows what he he is doing--engine life at that castor % ??

Last edited by AMB; 11-03-2013 at 12:41 PM.
AMB is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2013, 01:10 PM
  #17  
brokenenglish
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Amboise, FRANCE
Posts: 196
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Martin, This is for specialist racing applications.
In fact, it's a good demonstration of the difference.
Tony obviously knows all about fuels for PAWs, but this fuel is very different from the general mixes that HE recommends in the instructions, when you purchase a new PAW.
In UK "Phantom racing", races have been won by PAW 1.49s running on virtually no oil, but the engine needs a rebuild after the race...
brokenenglish is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2013, 01:26 PM
  #18  
AMB
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: winter park, FL
Posts: 6,748
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Broken English--- that makes sense even in full size engines in car racing need a rebuild at the high revs they turn but the idea is to win
carries over to our model Aircraft let em scream and win, less oil less viscous higher revs--
for us sport and fun flyers they last for decades with a well built engine turning moderate rpms
most of my flying done 9000 -10000 tops a few times 12000 regards martin
AMB is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2013, 01:46 PM
  #19  
AMB
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: winter park, FL
Posts: 6,748
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

off subject but was is the term for flying a plane on its side wing vertical to the ground
AMB is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2013, 03:07 PM
  #20  
qazimoto
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Central Coast NSW, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 1,344
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by AMB View Post
the real surprise to me is the 10% castor really seems low it is a BB engine however never saw that low % of castor in any engine diesel or glow maybe I missed something martin

its for sure Tony E knows what he he is doing--engine life at that castor % ??
At least a season. My old PAW 15 GTS normally runs down to 15% oil and it's still good after five years.

The difference between these engines an the ordinary ones is that they're never run lean.

Modern diesels are a lot more robust than those from the classic era.

Ray
qazimoto is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2013, 03:19 PM
  #21  
AMB
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: winter park, FL
Posts: 6,748
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

just remembered knife edge martin
AMB is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2013, 11:08 PM
  #22  
brokenenglish
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Amboise, FRANCE
Posts: 196
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by AMB View Post
off subject but was is the term for flying a plane on its side wing vertical to the ground
Martin, when I'm flying, it's called a trimming session...
brokenenglish is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 06:33 AM
  #23  
andrew b
Senior Member
 
andrew b's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Wyke, Bradford, UNITED KINGDOM
Posts: 196
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default PAW 35 in RM80 Pasadena



This is a Pasadena that I've been working (on and off) for a while, still got a fair bit to do but it's getting there.

Andrew
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	DSCF0004.JPG
Views:	448
Size:	87.9 KB
ID:	1936774   Click image for larger version

Name:	DSCF0007.JPG
Views:	453
Size:	313.4 KB
ID:	1936775   Click image for larger version

Name:	DSCF0008.JPG
Views:	458
Size:	318.8 KB
ID:	1936777  
andrew b is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2013, 06:40 AM
  #24  
brokenenglish
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Amboise, FRANCE
Posts: 196
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Very nice. I'm so pleased with my other RC PAWs, so I shall probably end up by getting myself a 35 one of these days.
brokenenglish is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2013, 02:57 PM
  #25  
andrew b
Senior Member
 
andrew b's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Wyke, Bradford, UNITED KINGDOM
Posts: 196
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Re my RM80 pasadena, does anyone have an idea of the all up weight? Either I've been to generous with the tail feathers OR I've been economical at the front!! It looks like I might need 180g of lead up the front to fetch the C of G forwards.
andrew b is offline  
Reply With Quote

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service