Extreme Speed Prop Planes Discuss the need for speed with fast prop planes (Screamin Demon, Diamond Dust, Shrikes or any REAL sound breakin'''' plane)

OPS .45 DF first runs

Reply

Old 11-29-2016, 02:36 PM
  #1  
MJD
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
MJD's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Orangeville, ON, CANADA
Posts: 8,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default OPS .45 DF first runs

Somebody has to post something..

I haven't progressed much in the workshop for a while, but employment is not a bad thing. Just finished a major install project (month on site) and hope things get a little quieter through Dec as the flying season becomes a fading memory.

Just committed the first two runs on one of my OPS .45 DF engines. Been fondling them for too long, needed inspiration.

Fuel: 15% nitro, 23% total oil syn/cas
Prop: Run #1 Eliminator P-8 7.375 x 8.25, Run #2 P-10 7.375 x 7.75
Weather: dry and a few degrees above freezing
Pipe: OPS open pipe
Carb: Jett 11mm borrowed from the OPS .65

Run 1 short - warmed up and madly cranking the needle in to avoid drowning, staged and rich saw close to 22k but the behaviour and tach said it needed a bit less load for early static runs. Shut down, cooled off, and switched to the P-10.

Engine starts and handles like an OPS.. i.e. too easy so far.

Run 2 - happily jumped on the pipe, running staged but real fat 22,500-22,700, slightly leaner and cleaner, saw 23,700 but a fair bit to go yet. Engine was tight again soon as it cooled down. Target in the air (for straight line speed) per the overseas speed freak's experience and advice is 26.5k. Should move a Demon along ok.
MJD is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2016, 03:23 PM
  #2  
MJD
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
MJD's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Orangeville, ON, CANADA
Posts: 8,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I'm looking forward to following up with the K&B 7.5's after the OPS, and comparing apples to apples on the test stand. Haven't run those yet either. Folks say the APC 7.4x8.4 was a good prop for it, I picked the P-8 as a close substitute.
MJD is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-29-2016, 07:45 PM
  #3  
Pylonracr
 
Pylonracr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 846
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

How does that big block do on your fancy carbon fiber pipe????????????
Pylonracr is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-30-2016, 06:45 AM
  #4  
MJD
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
MJD's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Orangeville, ON, CANADA
Posts: 8,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

It was running similar rpm to a MAC open pipe. I haven't taken/sent you a pic yet, but the inlet is taking a bit of a browning/beating from combustion temps, and I worry the resin may be starting to break down. I'll get some pics for you.

It sure is light, and it sure looks trick!
MJD is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-30-2016, 07:48 AM
  #5  
Pylonracr
 
Pylonracr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 846
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

What temp is it running? I post cured the pipe at 425F and the resin is supposed to be good to 390F. It does get brown from heat, that is normal. Let me know if it has issues and I will take it up with the manufacturer of the resin system.

Scott
Pylonracr is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-30-2016, 02:07 PM
  #6  
MJD
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
MJD's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Orangeville, ON, CANADA
Posts: 8,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I'll poke at it with clear mind/eyeballs and get some pics, but we ought to email on this topic from here on.

If I owned a temp gauge I could tell you something more helpful. The local hardware import chain has a sale on now and I saw one there.
MJD is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-30-2016, 06:02 PM
  #7  
MJD
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
MJD's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Orangeville, ON, CANADA
Posts: 8,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

This is also in the lineup for some bench running, and yeah I'll get video this time.

I don't expect it to threaten CP's 202mph Nelson FAI Demon, but it'll will be good fun nonetheless.

I like the integral exhaust stub, no need for exhaust options on such a singular purpose engine.

Picco 40 FAI

Yeah this ain't earth shattering excitement but there were too many cobwebs on this forum..

Thanks Jeremy BTW - it shined up really nicely too.
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0444.JPG
Views:	130
Size:	221.3 KB
ID:	2191845   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0446.JPG
Views:	130
Size:	295.5 KB
ID:	2191846   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0448.JPG
Views:	119
Size:	145.0 KB
ID:	2191847  
MJD is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-30-2016, 06:41 PM
  #8  
resourcecapital
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: houston, TX
Posts: 55
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

that is a picco in the pics not ops
still a good motor.
one problem is your pipe it looks to be too small at the max diameter that looks like an fai pipe
a nitro pipe is much fatter at the large bell u should pop up to 28.5 on 25% nitro u also have a little too much oil these motors when I ran them
liked 18% with a little caster I used 3% added.
in the boats I used to run on an audio tach I was getting over 30k on 50% (OPS)
resourcecapital is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-30-2016, 06:58 PM
  #9  
MJD
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
MJD's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Orangeville, ON, CANADA
Posts: 8,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by resourcecapital View Post
that is a picco in the pics not ops
still a good motor.
one problem is your pipe it looks to be too small at the max diameter that looks like an fai pipe
a nitro pipe is much fatter at the large bell u should pop up to 28.5 on 25% nitro u also have a little too much oil these motors when I ran them
liked 18% with a little caster I used 3% added.
in the boats I used to run on an audio tach I was getting over 30k on 50% (OPS)
Don't worry, I'm not crazy. The thread might refer to OPS .45's, but that post has "Picco 40 FAI" underneath the pictures, and it is an FAI .40 with an FAI pipe. I should get vid and pics of the OPS running if the weather is okay this weekend.

It's half OPS, it's the same P.
MJD is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 11-30-2016, 07:06 PM
  #10  
resourcecapital
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: houston, TX
Posts: 55
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

did not see it till u mentioned picos have many parts that will change on to an ops I have over 30 ops 40/45/60/65/67 motors plus many spare parts I run most on 30%+ cold plugs I do have a custom rossi 65 that has a titanium rod
that that run on 75% custom cf prop that is approx. 10x10 has spun over 32k making a different pipe not fat enouth when it comes on the pipe.
I enjoy going fast turn left go faster and repeat.
resourcecapital is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2016, 09:45 AM
  #11  
boater
My Feedback: (2)
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Sacramento,, CA
Posts: 126
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Most boaters who have run OPS 45's would tell you to change to a RPM rod (or Keeley) to avoid heartbreak. Hard to find now, maybe resourcecapital can help. Same for Picco 45.
boater is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2016, 02:46 PM
  #12  
MJD
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
MJD's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Orangeville, ON, CANADA
Posts: 8,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I think boats may be harder on the rods with the rpm jumping up and down in rough water, not sure? I'd be interested in upgrading the conrods if available, though I haven't looked too hard yet. I'll try our domestic OPS and boat sources for starters.

Regards 10x10 props - a strong .90 will struggle to spin it at 16k, and 32k takes about 20hp. So if the .65 ran over 32k I'd expect to see a 6-10 on the front. Highly modified VAE and other 10cc performance engines used in F3 speed are running 26-27k in the air on props 8" or only a hair bigger, 10-13 pitch. A stock OPS .65 DF will run in the lower 20's on a 9-10.
MJD is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2016, 02:22 PM
  #13  
boater
My Feedback: (2)
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Sacramento,, CA
Posts: 126
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

This guy has alot of OPS parts for marine 45/67/80's in case you are in need. g8tkeypur@roadrunner.com I think he is in New York State, but unsure.
boater is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2016, 04:05 PM
  #14  
MJD
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
MJD's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Orangeville, ON, CANADA
Posts: 8,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Bill Hughes is also a good source for OPS parts, at least aero.

There is a marine supplier in Quebec with OPS parts, I got a .67 p/l set and a couple of other things.
MJD is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2016, 05:08 PM
  #15  
airraptor
My Feedback: (66)
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: fairfield, CA
Posts: 4,191
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I was thinking the same thing 32,000 on a 10x10 is a bunch of power I bet he meant 22,000 or 23,000
airraptor is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2016, 07:05 PM
  #16  
resourcecapital
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: houston, TX
Posts: 55
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

no I ment 32000 this motor was specially built for one purpose 70%nitro very narrow rpm range on a custom pipe motor was guaranteed to run for 90 total minutes. this motor cost well inexcess of 1000$ it was designed for the purpose of the class d world speed record. fuel usage is inexcess of 6 oz per minute. most motors people are used to just like standard car motors are designed to last for many hours of use. compare this motor to a funny car engine that produces 5000 hp. runs for 1 run and needs to be rebuilt. essencially this is what I have. this is not normalls aspirated it uses compressed intake similar to what ys did on one early motor. that is why the very high numbers in conjunction with the fuel.
resourcecapital is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2016, 09:15 AM
  #17  
MJD
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
MJD's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Orangeville, ON, CANADA
Posts: 8,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

What 10x10 prop did you use on it? I'm curious because the tips would be doing mach 1.24 at that rpm.
MJD is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2016, 09:42 AM
  #18  
Pylonracr
 
Pylonracr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 846
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

A 10x10 cut down to 7" diameter maybe, but over 30K on a 10x10........... No...........
Pylonracr is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2016, 11:35 AM
  #19  
MJD
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
MJD's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Orangeville, ON, CANADA
Posts: 8,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

That's why I'm curious.

A 10x10 at those rpm will need in the area of 20 horsepower. Highly modified .60's (example OPS VAE .60, Novarossi) on pipes as used in F3 speed are run up in the 26-27k range. We're talking 5 - 6hp tops. And a limited life span. Typical props 8x12, 8.5x11 range. Add all the nitromethane you want and totally tune the exhaust and intake system to get the volumetric efficiency up, and you might get an 8x10 into the upper '20's - in flight.
MJD is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2016, 06:20 PM
  #20  
airraptor
My Feedback: (66)
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: fairfield, CA
Posts: 4,191
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I would love to see a video i bet that thing screams when running
airraptor is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2016, 07:21 PM
  #21  
LGM Graphix
My Feedback: (22)
 
LGM Graphix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Abbotsford, BC, CANADA
Posts: 5,535
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by MJD View Post
This is also in the lineup for some bench running, and yeah I'll get video this time.

I don't expect it to threaten CP's 202mph Nelson FAI Demon, but it'll will be good fun nonetheless.

I like the integral exhaust stub, no need for exhaust options on such a singular purpose engine.

Picco 40 FAI

Yeah this ain't earth shattering excitement but there were too many cobwebs on this forum..

Thanks Jeremy BTW - it shined up really nicely too.

Now I want it back hahaha
LGM Graphix is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2016, 07:55 PM
  #22  
MJD
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
MJD's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Orangeville, ON, CANADA
Posts: 8,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

If I launch the Demon pointed west with an autopilot, you'll just need to pick it out of the air with a 12 gauge when it flies over. Easy. 15 hours at top speed, lessee.. 15 hours x 60 minutes/hour = 900 minutes x 3oz fuel = 2700 oz = about 21 gallons.. no prob.

I'll brew up some 80/20 fuel and fire it up this weekend.
MJD is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2016, 08:29 PM
  #23  
LGM Graphix
My Feedback: (22)
 
LGM Graphix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Abbotsford, BC, CANADA
Posts: 5,535
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Lol
LGM Graphix is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2016, 08:30 PM
  #24  
LGM Graphix
My Feedback: (22)
 
LGM Graphix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Abbotsford, BC, CANADA
Posts: 5,535
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Hey did you finish the FAI racer you were putting the Nelson in?
LGM Graphix is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2016, 05:53 AM
  #25  
MJD
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
MJD's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Orangeville, ON, CANADA
Posts: 8,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Not entirely - I got the cowl all reworked but needs a layer of light glass to homogenize it all together, installed servos, touched up some nicks and dings. Well on its way for the next thaw.

This year has been a dramatic example of the folly of working a little bit each on several projects. I have several projects all well on their way.. as to finishing them, well the theory is that winter is the time to do that.
MJD is offline  
Reply With Quote

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service