Extreme Speed Prop Planes Discuss the need for speed with fast prop planes (Screamin Demon, Diamond Dust, Shrikes or any REAL sound breakin'''' plane)

Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

Reply

Old 10-01-2003, 05:35 PM
  #1  
m.gramling
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (8)
 
m.gramling's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Atoka, TN
Posts: 1,788
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

I am in the process of building a Outlaw designed by Jerry Smith. I am almost to the part of where I need to start installing radio gear. Can somebody show me, or tell me how to mount the rudder servo, and where to run the push rod.

I am also thinking about putting the elevon servos on top of wing instead of bottom. will that be OK,

Here is my intented setup.
OS32SX w/ moosecan Needle valve will be on bottom, but willing to deal with it, to keep from buying another motor.

1-Hitec 225 on rudder
1-Hitec 81 micro on throttle.
2-JR 811 Digital servos on 6volt 720 Nimh Battery. Should give around 65oz of torgue.
4oz Hayes tank.
m.gramling is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2003, 08:00 PM
  #2  
Rocketman612
My Feedback: (84)
 
Rocketman612's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Enterprise, AL
Posts: 2,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

Hi,
Last year I started a thread of my Outlaw construction. Here is the link http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_24.../tm.htm#247421


I used Hitec 645 mg servos with a Webra 32/mousse can pipe. This plane is a thrill to fly. Follow the thread it's all there. I'm building number 2 now. Don't ask about the 1st Take care, Pete
Rocketman612 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2003, 04:19 PM
  #3  
Cactus.
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
 
Cactus.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: CamborneCornwall, UNITED KINGDOM
Posts: 6,136
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

cut a hol for it in the rib, face in of course. i've got a whole loada room for my Rx in there. my bay also goes back so far i can fit a flat batt pack the the space left. perfect.
Cactus. is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2003, 06:30 PM
  #4  
Rocketman612
My Feedback: (84)
 
Rocketman612's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Enterprise, AL
Posts: 2,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

Phillybaby,
How's it going? Curious about how your rudder servo looks. Any way you could post a picture? The rudder should be blocking any space along it's length as it gets mounted to the floor of the center bay between the #1 ribs. Pete
Rocketman612 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2003, 09:21 PM
  #5  
m.gramling
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (8)
 
m.gramling's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Atoka, TN
Posts: 1,788
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

What do you think about a hitec 225 mini on rudder. I think I have talked to a couple of guys using this servo on rudder and everything was fine. Tomorrow is my day off. so I should have it ready to cover by the end of tomorrow.

What do you thinking of putting my elevon servos on top of wing instead of bottom. that way I don't have to worry about any thing underneath, except for rudder servo.
m.gramling is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2003, 09:28 PM
  #6  
m.gramling
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (8)
 
m.gramling's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Atoka, TN
Posts: 1,788
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

Can somebody tell me what wood I need to build my elevon hatches with. My plans or instructions don't have it, Or I can't remember.

m.gramling is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2003, 02:16 AM
  #7  
Cactus.
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
 
Cactus.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: CamborneCornwall, UNITED KINGDOM
Posts: 6,136
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

will post a pic soon, but i chose not to block the bay with the rudder and mini throttle servo. both are mounted IN the rib, rudder on the right, throttle on the left. all thats poking out in the bay is the top of the servos. this has left me loads of room. like i said my hatch is also much bigger than per plan.
as for elevon wood... i used pre moulded hatches, at 4 quid a pair it's silly not to. if you HAVE to make them use 1/16th ply with 1/8thsq balsa around the edges
Cactus. is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2003, 07:47 AM
  #8  
Rocketman612
My Feedback: (84)
 
Rocketman612's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Enterprise, AL
Posts: 2,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

ORIGINAL: m.gramling

What do you think about a hitec 225 mini on rudder. I think I have talked to a couple of guys using this servo on rudder and everything was fine. Tomorrow is my day off. so I should have it ready to cover by the end of tomorrow.

What do you thinking of putting my elevon servos on top of wing instead of bottom. that way I don't have to worry about any thing underneath, except for rudder servo.
I would not use the 225 mini. This plane Cooks and if your going to flat spin or try other high speed and high G stuff then I don't think you will have the torque needed and you will strip the gears.

I have seen several Outlaws with the servos on the top and they fly fine. I believe I used 3/32 lite ply for the servo mount/hatch. See my thread. Pete
Rocketman612 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2003, 11:46 AM
  #9  
Kickin Chicken
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Leesburg, GA
Posts: 167
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

Hi M. Gramling,

I'm in the same club as Rocketman612, and I agree with him 100% about size of servo's ect., you caught me just at the right time, as I'm in the last stages of building another Outlaw, here some pictures where I install my servo's, hatch covers (stock) and such, don't look to close at the rest, this is not a standard Outlaw, this one is a experimental, plus I'm trying to cut back on the weight so I can add a homing device, not really but Rocketman knows what I'm talking about.
Charlie
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Ki18810.jpg
Views:	14
Size:	72.5 KB
ID:	65309   Click image for larger version

Name:	Oj26176.jpg
Views:	10
Size:	101.0 KB
ID:	65310   Click image for larger version

Name:	Lq36756.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	68.4 KB
ID:	65311  
Kickin Chicken is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2003, 12:10 PM
  #10  
Rocketman612
My Feedback: (84)
 
Rocketman612's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Enterprise, AL
Posts: 2,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

Charlie,
That's looking good. How much weight do you think you got out of the vertical stab? I thought these planes came in nose heavy?


m.gramling,
It's 1/16 lite ply for the servo hatches. Pete
Rocketman612 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2003, 02:58 PM
  #11  
Kickin Chicken
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Leesburg, GA
Posts: 167
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

Hi Rocketman,
Total weight without the covering is about 47 oz. with 50oz. my goal.
I took it over to Dan's yesterday for a final blessing, after what happen to my last one I wanted him to check it out before I covered it.
Dan showed me some tricks for next one but I hope it will be awhile coming, anyways you need to see the elevon's and wing tips.
Also this one was built only with Pica glue, no ca or expoxy to speak of. I also sanded everything as thin as I could and get away with, since having built my arm up from the B-29.
This is my 4th Outlaw and all came out tail heavy, that's why I moved everything forward about 3/4 inches.
Charlie
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Us54604.jpg
Views:	10
Size:	66.7 KB
ID:	65360  
Kickin Chicken is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-04-2003, 12:05 PM
  #12  
m.gramling
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (8)
 
m.gramling's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Atoka, TN
Posts: 1,788
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

kick-n-chicken,
I needed those photos yesturday. I couldn't really tell how to build my hatches. But it looks like I need to modify my hatches to be recessed inbetween the ribs instead of on top of them.. That set up looks alot cleaner than mine.

I have some 645's lying around. I might use. But I was saving them for my next project once I get this done. I also have a 605 that I can use. I ended up putting my hatches on bottom. But I think when I rebuild them I will move them to top.

As for motor, I am going to use a 40fp on moosecan. I don't want to buy a webra 32. I have a OS32SX & moosecan. that I can pull off of a plane if I am not satisfied w/ the 40fp. Since the 40fp weights more than the webra 32, that should fix the tail heavy problem. I know the 40fp won't give the speed of a webra or OS32SX, but I am gonna just play with this plane anyway.
m.gramling is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2003, 11:16 AM
  #13  
PaulSwany
My Feedback: (45)
 
PaulSwany's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Bartlett, TN
Posts: 4,810
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

Great pics guys.... after talking with m.grammling... I got a wild hair and started building my Outlaw last night..... Got the bottom framed and gonna start working on the top now.... Looking for a detail shot of the rudder linkage when the plane is complete....
PaulSwany is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2003, 03:47 PM
  #14  
m.gramling
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (8)
 
m.gramling's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Atoka, TN
Posts: 1,788
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

Paul,
how is the outlaw coming. If you need some pictures let me know, and I will post what I have.ii hopefully I can start covering this thing is the next day or so.

m.gramling is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2003, 05:56 PM
  #15  
PaulSwany
My Feedback: (45)
 
PaulSwany's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Bartlett, TN
Posts: 4,810
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

It's all framed... I just mounted the Elevon Servo's. Need to do the rudder servo and then cover it.... I think I figured out the rudder servo setup... Have you tried to balance yours yet?
PaulSwany is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2003, 02:48 PM
  #16  
m.gramling
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (8)
 
m.gramling's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Atoka, TN
Posts: 1,788
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

I will post some pictures of my rudder servo mounting tonight. I am gonna try and start covering tonight.

on my rudder servo. I mounted it on the inside of the compartment on the opposite side of muffler. the servo protrudes from the hatch somewhere around the front to the stabon hatch. And my swith is just in front of my rudder servo. But I will shoot you a pictues tonight. I haven't worked on my throttle servo. I was going to wait on that and worry about that during balancing.

AS for balancing, I figured I would cover it first then work on balance. because where my rudder servo is, I can move my 720mh 6v NIMh-battery, and JR R700 RX just about any where I want it.

As for the tank, I went with a dubro 4oz tank.

I haven't made up my mind on my motor yet. I am still leaning toward my 40fp. As long as I can get somewhat close to speed as your webra32 I will keep the 40fp on. But if your 32 out runs me like a topfuel dragster vs. an old pinto then I will swap to my 32SX
m.gramling is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2003, 07:40 PM
  #17  
Rocketman612
My Feedback: (84)
 
Rocketman612's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Enterprise, AL
Posts: 2,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

Paul,
Here is a picture of the rudder servo and pushrod. Use a long arm if you want to really spin it. Pete

PS sorry for the poor picture but I spend all my green on planes
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Wu61178.jpg
Views:	12
Size:	66.5 KB
ID:	67502  
Rocketman612 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2003, 07:51 PM
  #18  
m.gramling
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (8)
 
m.gramling's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Atoka, TN
Posts: 1,788
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

Paul,
here are the images of my rudder servo set up. the 1st pict. the servo that in the photo in not going to be used, thats why the hole looks a little sloppie. But it give you an idea.

2nd pict. Not the servo I am using either. I will actually flip the servo around to where the servo post is to the back of plane.. But I have it mounted on the side wall opposite of exhaust outlet. I just used some 1/4x1/4 hardwood for the rails. Then reinforced it underneath the rail w/ a triangle piece of balsa. It seams real sturdy.

hope these photos help. let me know if you need any other photos
I don't think I am going to start covering tonight But hopefully, I can start covering this week.
m.gramling is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2003, 07:54 PM
  #19  
m.gramling
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (8)
 
m.gramling's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Atoka, TN
Posts: 1,788
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

oops, sorry, I forgot to attach photos.
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Qo41234.jpg
Views:	10
Size:	34.9 KB
ID:	67512   Click image for larger version

Name:	Fb87897.jpg
Views:	9
Size:	40.5 KB
ID:	67513  
m.gramling is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2003, 05:14 AM
  #20  
Cactus.
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
 
Cactus.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: CamborneCornwall, UNITED KINGDOM
Posts: 6,136
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

WOAH!!!! Rocket that servo is on the bottom!!! what are you? mad or you have lots to spend on servos? you can save the servos and buy a better camera.
as for the other setup, out the top? draggy, fills with fuel..
this is so simple to get right guys...
the side that servo is now, cut a hole in the rib. slide the servo in. make the horn just shy of the lid ( in other words, cut the servo low enough so it doesn't foul ), and the push rod exits right at the back of the lid. at full deflection the horn JUST goes over the top of the LE
now you have a servo hiding in the nice dry fuz. you don't need to unscrew it to get the lid off.
as for elevon servos on the bottom.... sigh...
great invention servo covers.
if i really HAVE to i'll take the lid off mine and show you how to get it right

ok, first pic, elevon servo hatches. the servos sit in these, you them screw them to hard rails 1/16th below the surface.
second, a close up of the rudder horn, not the end is cut to avoid the elevon. see how it comes out nice and clean from the radio bay
third the radio bay it's self, nice and clean layout, LOTS! of room because i was smart enough to change the plan to suit me.
last, the rudder servo and note how my hatch goes much further back allowing a flat Ni-cad to sit flat right at the back. good for CofG with a 36 up front.
btw, 40Fp vs os 32? no brainer really... go with 6oz too..

now you know how to do it
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Gd93696.jpg
Views:	10
Size:	11.8 KB
ID:	67615   Click image for larger version

Name:	Up47877.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	8.9 KB
ID:	67616   Click image for larger version

Name:	Ot47090.jpg
Views:	14
Size:	7.3 KB
ID:	67617   Click image for larger version

Name:	Bu57997.jpg
Views:	12
Size:	19.6 KB
ID:	67618  
Cactus. is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2003, 06:04 AM
  #21  
Rocketman612
My Feedback: (84)
 
Rocketman612's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Enterprise, AL
Posts: 2,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

Phillybaby,
Nice setup thanks for the pictures. My outlaw builds different. The hatch and bay on mine per plans is much smaller with the % of vertical stab on the hatch roof being smaller and the anchored portion being longer than yours. Please post the measuremants for the length of your open bay from the spar back and the width of the mounted portion of the vertical stab, and servo locations. Thanks, Pete

Here's mine see the difference.
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Ca82791.jpg
Views:	11
Size:	65.0 KB
ID:	67619  
Rocketman612 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2003, 06:44 AM
  #22  
Cactus.
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
 
Cactus.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: CamborneCornwall, UNITED KINGDOM
Posts: 6,136
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

the elevon hatches start 9cm back from the te, the fixed fin is 11cm from the hinge line to join line. basicaly everything is as far back as possible before it pops out the other side. there is only just enough room for a flat Ni-cad to fit in the rear of the bay, so that should be enough to show how far back it is.
the bays total lenght from the back of the firewall to the rear and fin is 37cm
it might be too late to change yours, unless you built a totaly new hatch and cut away some fuz and fin, but putting the servos into the ribs should claim back some space for the Ni-cad and RX

just noticed your hatch doesnt go right to the firewall either, man i'm glad i ignored the instructions. mines just a bit of 1/16th ply all the way. makes everything easy to work on.
elevon servos on the bottom to... you do realise this is a belly lander????
i never put servos on the bottom on belly landers, asking for trouble. striped gears at worse, but over time the centering suffers from all the impacts. it's not too late to do it right...
Cactus. is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2003, 10:56 AM
  #23  
Rocketman612
My Feedback: (84)
 
Rocketman612's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Enterprise, AL
Posts: 2,629
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

Phillybaby,
Thanks for the info. I like the clean look you get with the servos on the bottom. I have not had any servo problems nor have the other Outlaws flying at out field. This one is almost done but I may change things around if and when I build another. I'm getting 2 short kits to have on hand. Pete
Rocketman612 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2003, 11:16 AM
  #24  
Cactus.
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
 
Cactus.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: CamborneCornwall, UNITED KINGDOM
Posts: 6,136
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

clean look is a matter of opinion.. once in the air you look at the bottom
personly i like to servos to stay clean
Cactus. is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2003, 12:47 PM
  #25  
m.gramling
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (8)
 
m.gramling's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Atoka, TN
Posts: 1,788
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Jerry Smith Outlaw Rudder Servo?

just because the servos are on top doesn't mean there gonna get exhaust goop on them. They are further out in the wing. And the moosecan exhaust outlet goes to the rudder hinge line. So the plane should be clean except for goop on the rudder.

started covering last night. I will post picts. when I am done.



m.gramling is offline  
Reply With Quote

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service