Evil Homer

Yello all
Be coming over to the States in the next couple of months and would like to pick up a Diamond Dust to bring back with me, where can i buy one of these?

Also read a lot about the MVVS engines being used, how about Rossi's, how do they fare?

Cheers
Steve

sydclement

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Squid;
www.diamonddustrc.com.
Syd

Evil Homer

Has anyone taken a diamond dust and used a Nelson Q40 engine running carbon props, how did it go!!!!
I know these engines dont like draggy frames but i think DD should be ok with this combo, any thoughts?

Dustflyer

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Squid,

Do Nelsons have throttles? That's one of the nice touches of a Jett, a fantastic throttle. I know after launching my Dust I like to throttle back and take a breather before I open it up and let 'er rip.

SYD!

Hey man! Just want to let you know I am still alive! A little bogged down with little ankle biters right now. Am really lovin' the little critters but am still looking forward to getting out with my mini-Dust. Super Patriot is half-done and stealing every minute I can to complete it. Engine is broken in and ready. 16,800 with a 10X10 on Magnum 15. Yeah Baby!

Looking forward to seeing you soon! Call ya...

Gene

Razor-RCU

My Feedback: (50)

Dustflyer: Super-Patriot? Aren't you putting a big Jett (76/90) on the Pat.? I seem to remember a thread about that---

The Rossi-45 is a very strong engine but is heavy.... I think an MVVS-40 (quickee version-) or GRRT-40 would be better suited to the DD--- (Nothing wrong with the Rossi )

Keep us posted y'all!
james

Evil Homer

My Nelson is having a Jett carb fitted to it, so it will be throttled, any thoughts.
Cheers
Steve

C roundy

Now this is right up my alley!, about 2 years ago I had Jeff Gilbert himself build A "Clipped wing D'Dust" for an interesting engine that Dub Jett custom built for me. The engine is a F.I.R.E. 50 with counterbalanced spinner and an A.A.C. liner cut with very high port timing specificly optimized for the APC Q40 7.4"x8.25" carbon prop. Right from the start the engine was a startling and rare combination of throttlability and very strong H.P. peak @ about 26K to 27K R.P.M. It starts and idles 3.5K, and rev's instantly and furiously to about 23.5K on the ground when needled the perfect amount rich to hang in there without sagging for a full throttle only flight on the 8 ounce bladder tank I installed. I self start and launch my belly sliders by holding the silicone pipe coupler, thats the only reason I had Dub set me up with a carb. at all (so the pipe does'nt get to hot to fast. I logged about 500 flights on the airplane in about 1year before I failed one of the JR 4735 elevon servos in flight (upon examination I had worn a bald spot on the servo's potentiometer wiper, and I almost managed to save the model dammit!)[:-].
Anyway, remember this was a 2.9 pound Clipped Dust with even lower frontal area than the stock Dust. But here is a rundown on its flight characteristics:
With a conservative 40 degree launch angle, and a smooth pull to vertical, she would be going about 130 m.p.h. within 4 seconds and 400 ft. Split S turn for a diving radar pass gave 185mph on an average day, repeated long level passes yielded 176mph on radar pretty damned consistantly on the 15% nitro / 20% oil fuel mix that I normally ran. This airplane handled so impeccably that it was not only an absolute joy to fly, but almost even more importantly to me it allowed me to focus on the nuances of my motor/pipe/prop combination's performance while loading down and unloading in the extreme high gee close, tight, and precise pattern that I normally flew ( about 1 split S every 2 seconds for most of the 4.5 minutes that the 8 ounce tank gave me, passing generally 30 ft in front of my face at 20 ft high averaging maybe 160mph. Then A few passes slamming 50 degrees elevator 20 ft in front of my face from 180mph for an absurdly square corner to vertical with 10 rolls per second, diving pass and do it again a few times until the tank suddenly sucked tight and deadsticked me, pitch up and out as neccessary to set up an aproach for a 17mph airspeed touchdown usually within 15 ft of me). The fastest corrected airspeed I ever established with radar was about 193mph off a diving pass while running an apc 7.2"x8.6" nylon composite prop on 20/20 fuel.
Among the things that fascinated me with this model was the fact that I had originally put this small prop / high rpm engine on a whiplash with disgusting results, that combo at 4.7 pounds was an excercise in extreme launching skills to get it to fly out at all, rather than slowing down and sinking in.[:@] After outdoing myself to get it in the air at all, I would have to fly this huge, wide, low gee course to keep the speed above 100mph below that it would mush pathetically and bleed speed even worse. Top speed in level flight was 140mph.
So you can imagine how thrilled I was every time I flew the light, crisp, and nasty fast cornering Clipped Dust, having known in my heart and mind that this little lump of Jett Engineering high rpm metal was capable of one hell of alot more speed / handling / and sheer adrenalin fun than a heavy airframe can hold!
Back full circle to your question squid1 I never ran my nelson Q40 engine on a dust (yes I have One) but you should fairly accurately be able to expect similar rpm's and results with a recent model, good condition N-Q40 with slightly less prop (7.4"x8.0" carbon Q40 prop, or 7.2"x8.3" nylon composite prop). I don't think the side exhaust will change the drag much one way or the other compared to my big assed pipe, coupler and pipe mount directly behind the cylinder,... but I personally stick with the rear exhaust, full wave tuned pipe engines on my speed planes for outright superior H.P. at extreme rpm's compared to the quarter wave tuned pipes like the nelson ultrathrust, or Jettstream mufflers, and especially for lateral balance during extreme gee manuevers (remember, you cant just hang a weight in the wing tip to achieve lateral balance at 1 gee static, it will be grossly disproportionate at 30 gees!). And As fast as a Dust can be, its the handling characteristics that really set them apart from other "fast" deltas.

I have gone a different route for the replacement airplane, and I expect my beloved, custom built "Clipped Wing Diamond Dust" #2 to be delivered to me by Jeff Gilbert any day now after a long wait (he's not in the best of health guys so any prayers could'nt hurt...) With #2 I will be using a new Jett B.S.E., F.I.R.E. .50 timed to wail the steeper available APC Q-500 props (8.8 by 9.25,9.5, and possibly 9.75 pitch at 19.5K on the ground. This will lower the frequency of the high amplitude vibration the servos are exposed to and hopefully solve the problem that killed #1 Clipped Dust. obviously the pitch velocity will be somehat lower, but as amazingly well as I found out the 7xx" diameter Q40 props to hold speed thruogh the almost constant high gee manuevers with this airframe, obviously the higher pounds of thrust with a bigger diameter prop setup will reduce speed bleed off even further during the most brutal of aggression therapy sessions.[sm=sunsmiley.gif] And I actually suspect that terminal velocity may come up a tad too,... after all we do have a lot of crap hanging out in the breeze on these sweet little practice planes; motor, pipe, tank, servos, linkages, etc...

I neeevveer quite got around to putting my nitro modified Nelson F3D cheater engine on the first "Clipped" although I had planned to.... I just was having such a ball with the airplane the way I had it set up that I just did'nt quite get to it...bygones........ And with #2 I will not consider doing it until I get through the summer fly-in / demo flight season but it is definately still in the plan if this one survives long enough. I first must complete to my satisfaction and extreme enjoyment a full set of datapoints and qualitative assessments of handling characteristics with the new primary airframe/engine/pipe/prop combination before I risk it to that unholy 31,000 rpm hand grenade that I call my Nelson "cheater" motor. On my Richard Verano F3D special that frightening thing yielded 212mph on 6.8"x8.25" carbon prop straight and level, long pass, no diving whatsoever....

So as you can see I have kind of worked to get myself squarely in the middle of what it really takes to answer the questions your asking across the last few years

Best Regards, Chuck Roundy

sydclement

My Feedback: (1)

Hi Gene:
Glad your still around. Getting ready for a funfly next Sunday and
after that I want to get back to some prop testing. The winter and
spring was bad around here for speed planes.
Hows Billy doing? Got a Dynajet for my next Whiplash..

Later, Syd

Dustflyer

My Feedback: (13)

Razor,

Yes, I am doing a kit Patriot with a Jett BSE FIRE 90 and side-mounted MACS quiet tuned pipe. I tuned and broke in the engine and can get 16.8K with a 10X10 and Magnum 15% sport fuel. Won't be the fastest Patriot in the world but should move out pretty well. I'm using BD retracts and enlarged the firewall and front end for the Jett and a slightly larger fuel tank. Believe it or not the engine is only about 6 ounces heavier than an OS 46FX. To help offset the weight I am using heavy servos; Futaba 9303 brass geared numbers for elevator and rudder and heavy FMA Premiere PS705MBB metal geared servos for throttle and retract valve. Together they add another 4 ounces or so above standard servos.

The airplane is all framed up, I just need to put everything together and cover it. Hope to have it flying this summer. Am looking forward to having a fast little airplane with landing gear for a change!


Squid,

Hmm.. A Nelson with a Jett carb, sounds interesting.


Syd,

Haven't talked to Billy in a while but hear he's got a garage full of jets now. Is that true Billy?

A Dynajet? Now that sounds interesting. If you can get it running and keep it running it should be good for a few thrills, laughs, maybe both! I remember "Miderror" sent me a video of one on a Dust. All I remember was some guy with a blowtorch trying to start it while waves of gasoline fumes wafted upwards. It's a miracle everyone didn't get incinerated in one giant fuel-air explosion. They finally got it going, flames shooting everywhere seemingly out the back and front simultaneously. I can't quite remember how in the world they launched it but a few seconds after it got airborne it flamed out.

The sound? Someone on RCU once described it perfectly: A 12 guage shotgun blast repeated 30 times a second!

Are you sure you want to try it? I gotta give you a call, we need to talk! Of course if anyone can pull that off it's you, so if you go ahead with it I want to be there. I'll bring my asbestos suit!

Hope to see you soon...

Gene

sydclement

My Feedback: (1)

Gene;
Your talking about the old setup for the Dynajet.
The new setup uses methonal and nitro mix run through
a fuel regulator and spinner nose cone and servo fuel
cutoff.
The Dynajet guys don't have to put up with all that stuff
of the 1960s The new setup is cool and safer than the past.
Some day someone will figure out a throttle for these noisy things...

Syd

Dustflyer

My Feedback: (13)

Syd,

What can I say? You are THE MAN!

Talk to ya....

Gene

FlooredCOBRA

I had great results with the MVVS GRRT and Diamond Dust combo. I have no idea how fast it is since we really havent tried to measure before. But it impressed some turbine guys before. They gave me thumbs up and said it was very fast, so comming from them i felt pretty good it was hauling.

FlooredCOBRA

pic

FlooredCOBRA

Here is a pic I took today. I was hoping to have videos on each plane but my friend with camera didnt show up today. So looking at tomorrow to make the videos hopefully.

Buddy of mine just ordered his DD and it should be here pretty soon. I been telling him how fun and easy it was to fly. Usually people see it fly and say " I cant handle that thing" I try to explain it really is a very easy plane to fly and all. I let him fly mine today and he fell in love with the plane even more. Should be fun having to DD at or field now.

kec70nova

I have a diamond dust with an os 46fx, performance specialities cylinder, piston, and pipe and mine does 145mph. The motor idles and transitions as well a a stock os. This is the best combo I have seen, the rossi/dubb/nelson motors don't do that and mine has been for 2 years just as strong as it did on the first day. Just a suggestion.

FlooredCOBRA

rossi/dubb/nelson motors don't do that

What do you mean by this?

Also what kind of rpm's are you getting and what prop with your OS46fx? How did you come up with this 145mph number? Just curious sounds a bit high for a 46FX

huey-pilot

My Feedback: (17)

I built a Diamond Dust last year and installed a Webra .40 with a 9x7 prop, flew it until I started having engine problems so as an experiment I installed a Nova Rossi RX 21FR with an APC 7x5 prop. I found that the Nova Rossi pulls out better from launch and is much faster, I don't know how fast it is but with the Webra I could fly it at full throttle with some comfort and with the Nova Rossi I find that I fly a lot of the time at reduced throttle settings. The ground RPM for the Nova Rossi is 26200 with the APC 7x5 and the Webra turns 14000 with the 9x7 prop.

kec70nova

Flooredcobra,

My 46fx has different cylinder, piston, and pipe, and it puts out around 1900 rpms. Our club has a radar dector as well.

Rudeboy

That's a very nice idle....

How much do you have upfront dollar wise when you count the FX, the cylinder/piston from Shadel and the header and pipe...?
I think you're better off buying a Jett (or maybe even a Nelson) straight away...

FlooredCOBRA

A buddy of mine just got one of those new .46AX I think it is called. I am curious to see how it runs like compared to the other FX style. I heard some good things about the new AX so should be fun to see how it does.

Also I have to agree about just buying a high end engine. You will get more right out of box than a sport .46 with parts in it. What prop are you running by the way?