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Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

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Old 08-23-2004, 10:23 AM
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Rainman-ACRF
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Default Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

Hi All,

Been flying my Magnum R with West Eurotech V1 .50 and pipe for a few months now and getting quite comfortable with it. I've squeezed the larger fuel tank in to increase duration (although not by much) and recently chucked away the 9x7 and installed the 8x8 prop.

Things were getting a bit boring with the 9x7 and sure, the 8x8 prop made quite a difference but it's still not what I'll call "balistic". Weston UK supplied me with two other prop - 8x9 and 8x10. I understand that the tuned pipe needs shortening but from what I read most people seem to be using just the 8x8.

I'm keen to get more from my Magnum and didn't know if there was anyone else out there using either of the props with bigger pitch? How well do they work? How much have you shortened the pipe by? Does it make a big difference to the way the engine runs?

Also, I'm having a hell of a job getting the West to cut prior to landing, and so far every landing has been made with the engine coughing and spluttering but not quite dead. I've checked the carb and made sure that when I'm closing the throttle I'm not re-opening it as the reverse side of the hole gets shown. I can get it to cut on the ground, but when there is air pushing the prop around it just won't die when I want it to. Any advise?

I guess I shouldn't complain too much as the only time I've had that engine dead-stick is when I've run it out of fuel.

Thanks!

Phil
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Old 08-23-2004, 10:53 AM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

I think I'm right in saying that the pipe doesnt need shortening if you use an 8x10... other than that i useless for info as i didnt have the bottle to fly my mag straight off with the westy Maidened it on Saturday with a 40. but i've already take that out to upgrade to something bigger. I couldnt get my 40 to cut at all in the air...same as you, fine on ground, but i had to bring it in running (only just) but it just didnt want to cut.
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Old 08-23-2004, 11:34 AM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

I am not much help either (haven't flown mine yet) but from what I have read people tend to climb to height when the engine coughs and purposely let it run out of fuel.

Must be able to sort it somehow though!
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Old 08-23-2004, 12:59 PM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

bottom end is set wrong at the factory for an idle to high, well not wrong, just everything is for joe stupid to bolt together and get results.
some poeple have taken the headder right down to the elbow and then some of the pipe, tho with the new pipe design i'm not sure what they are doing.


engines cuts are done here by waiting for the low fuel warning cough on a dive, then they climb mega high, then the mega dive cuts the engine, if not it will next time, this speed is then carried on to turning into wind and landing, a circuit if required on up wind passes
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Old 08-23-2004, 02:12 PM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

I'm running an 8x10 and I haven't modified the pipe in any way. For sure it's quicker than with an 8x8 or 8x9. All of my landings are done the way phillybaby described, letting it run out of fuel.
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Old 08-24-2004, 02:49 AM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

Thanks for the info. I'm not a big fan of running engines right out of fuel as the mixture leans out and can damage the engine although this West engine appears to be designed to scream like someone getting their fingers trapped in a car door in any case.

How wildly does cutting the pipe alter the tune? Does it allow for much higher RPM ?

Looks like the 8x10 is going to have to make an appearance for the next outing. [>:]

Phil
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Old 08-24-2004, 03:00 AM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

G'day Phil,
My West wont shut down either...never has, so I land went out of fuel like the others have said.
The "destruction manual" calls for 1" to be cut from the header pipe to increase the power. With an 8X8 prop I'm getting 21500 on the ground.
Cheers
Ken
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Old 08-24-2004, 03:04 AM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

Weston say use an 8x10 and you dont have to cut the pipe. (sure i read that somewhere)
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Old 08-24-2004, 03:06 AM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

ORIGINAL: Dave03B

other than that i useless for info as i didnt have the bottle to fly my mag straight off with the westy Maidened it on Saturday with a 40. but i've already take that out to upgrade to something bigger.
Honestly, the West is a damned fine engine and runs like clockwork. With a 9x6 up front it's not really any quicker than a good pattern model. It seems faster than it really is because of the size but it's something that you'll get used to fairly quickly - and I suspect that this will be case regardless of the engine you install. Don't waste your time, just get that West in there - you don't have to fly it at full throttle all the time.

You'll know when you're getting used to flying it as it runs out of fuel sooner.

Phil
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Old 08-24-2004, 03:11 AM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

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Old 08-24-2004, 06:18 AM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

The info is in the West manual re cutting the pipe
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Old 08-24-2004, 12:25 PM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

it only runs lean for a second or two, wont harm it.
in fact some people swear by running the engine dry at the end of the day to remove the nitro.
so by flying the whole tank you're doing it a favour.
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Old 08-24-2004, 12:27 PM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

So, are you saying that a West 50 will not cut inflight when told to?
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Old 08-24-2004, 12:33 PM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

does if you set the bottom end right.
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Old 08-24-2004, 12:34 PM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

ok
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Old 08-26-2004, 04:13 AM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

ORIGINAL: phillybaby

does if you set the bottom end right.
When you say "right" what do you mean?

I set mine up as per the manual and it runs like a charm and I can get it to cut on the ground, but not in the air.

Thanks,

Phil
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Old 08-26-2004, 05:34 AM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

Just had an interesting conversation with Weston UK.

They say:

Use Prosynth 10% and don't run the engine in. Don't run it rich. Just mount it in the model, start it, tune it and chuck it. Bench running does not provide enough cooling air and running rich does not allow the engine to get up to temperature.

9x7 prop use normal pipe lengths.
8x8 prop cut half inch off header and half inch off pipe.
8x9 and 8x10 use original pipe lengths.

8x9 and 8x10 is harder to hand launch as the prop needs to bite but top speed is higher (not suprising). 9x7 and 8x8 should pull straight out of your hand but top speed is not so high.

This is not my thoughts but as told to me by Weston.

Interesting stuff.
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Old 08-26-2004, 12:10 PM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

the bottom end gives a high idle, if you play with it you can get it lower, then it'll cut in the air, but what the heck do you want to cut it in the air for? fly it dry you jessy, it's what i have to do on my GRRT with no throttle

the running in is spot on, both my Wests have flown right fro the start, only the 50 got a quick ground check first to make sure it wouldn't cut.

if your in the air the engine is at it's normal running temp, so the piston liner relationship is as it will be. if you run on the ground and hot, or rich and cool the piston and liner will have a different relationship, so when you to final settings it'll all be the wrong shape and... worn out.

now I'm away from old gummy castor and old style engines this is what i do with every engine, tho the other makes get a few richish flights before leaning out.
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Old 08-26-2004, 02:43 PM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

This is gonna sound a really stupid question.

How do I balance a metal spinner? I have done props and fans/clutches before. But I am confused as to the best way of balancing the spinner for the West engine.

I understand it is quite important.
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Old 08-26-2004, 04:38 PM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

first rotate them to get the closetest you can to balanced without removing anything
make a lining up mark on both the spinner and backplate.
then take the back plate off and dremel/drill bits out, reattach it to the spinner using the mark each time till you have it balanced.
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Old 08-26-2004, 07:42 PM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

ORIGINAL: siclick33

This is gonna sound a really stupid question.

How do I balance a metal spinner? I have done props and fans/clutches before. But I am confused as to the best way of balancing the spinner for the West engine.

I understand it is quite important.
First balance your backplate alone, after that put on the cone and rebalance.

It should require very little, if any balancing. The backplate should be spot on the way it comes, but the cone could be a bit off due to the prop cutouts being really "cut out" rather than being machined.
The two Weston spinners I have had so far only took a couple of drops of CA in the cone to balance.
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Old 08-27-2004, 03:27 AM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

ORIGINAL: phillybaby

the bottom end gives a high idle, if you play with it you can get it lower, then it'll cut in the air, but what the heck do you want to cut it in the air for? fly it dry you jessy, it's what i have to do on my GRRT with no throttle
The patch at my club isn't exactly big and we're (were) surrounded by a crop of oats this year and got trees on two sides. I need to be able to take the guess-work out of when the engine cuts to make sure I can slow the model down sufficiently. I've had the Magnum end up in the crop twice this season and both times were when I'd run it out of fuel and it managed to develop a level of glide that you just wouldn't normaly expect. It's not been a big problem because oats are nice and soft to land in but the farmer has now harvested his crop and it won't be long before it ploughs the whole place and it becomes the texture of ripped-up concrete. Because of the limited space and surrounding obstacles it helps massively to be able to "fly" it through the finals until the last 30 yards.

On a different note, with the 8x8 and a well setup West .50 V1, what sort of top speed are people experiencing? People are always asking me "how fast", but in all honesty I just don't really know. I'm getting about 19,000 rpm on the ground and it seems to unload a fair bit more in the air.

Phil
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Old 08-27-2004, 12:40 PM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

You should get more on the ground than 19K... it should do over 20K... I've even seen figures of 21K around here, but mine doesn't get there.

With the pipe set for an 8x8, and running over 20K static, it will do about 175 flat... maybe 180...
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Old 08-27-2004, 01:30 PM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

21.5 is the best i've heard on the ground so far.
for speed we get about 185 tops on the flat. 200 in a dive maybe.

try playing with the bottom end, factory set is safe, but you can tweak it a fair bit more.
also how long are you waiting? at that speed it takes ages to wind down even when it runs dry
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Old 09-08-2004, 03:19 AM
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Default RE: Magnum R - more West V1 and prop Qs

OK, it sounds like I need to have a play with the bottom end settings AND take 1/2" off the header for starters. After flying this weekend it's not really "unloading" in air as much as I think it ought to.

I'll have a play with it and report back.

Thanks,

Phil
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