Extreme Speed Prop Planes Discuss the need for speed with fast prop planes (Screamin Demon, Diamond Dust, Shrikes or any REAL sound breakin'''' plane)

Scratch build ???

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Old 08-28-2005, 07:43 AM
  #1  
nexxa
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Default Scratch build ???

I don't known in final to what its gone look like but I have some wood to cut and glue to give a home to my OS.15CVA with tune pipe.
I decide to build a small plane... The only think I know... I want a landing gear on, 4oz gas tank and 3 servos. I want it under 2 pound.

Here are some pic of the wing plan and its construction. Until now I pass 5 hours to think about it, cut spare, build and sand the wing....
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Old 08-28-2005, 01:11 PM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

starting to look like a plane
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Old 08-28-2005, 04:42 PM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

You obviously have experience in scratch building. If it flys could you duplilcate the pieces and sell me one as a kit ? I would use my MAG .28 to test fly it and most will know why I would choose this engine. GJ and GL on maiden.

RCF esq.
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Old 08-28-2005, 10:01 PM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

There is no possibility to reproduce a kit from this scratch build. There is no plan. I only use basic formula to calculate wing area and loading, the CG location, stab dimension.... and incidence.... I cut the part one by one and figure it out one step at the time!
I know its going to look like a Quickie 200 at the end And yes, it's going to fly... how I don't know, but it's going to fly!

It's my fifth Prototype (scratch build) and all of them fly well.

Next step on my scratch build... finishing engine mount and wing holder plate. After that find place to fit tree servos, one receiver and one battery! A little bit of sanding after that I will be ready for the covering.

Pictures will follow
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Old 08-28-2005, 10:37 PM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

IMHO you are shooting yourself in the foot not making plans as you build. You may crash and need only a certain part of the plane and now you have to think of what you did to produce the part in the beginning. I built one kit in my entire RC career and didn't like doing it ,but I have repaired a plane 5 times and on the last crash just gave up on the plane. Once again GL .
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Old 08-29-2005, 06:44 AM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

Fiend,

I have built several planes "freehand"... they were not complex planes, like this one. Reproducing parts is not a problem... the only part he may need a "plan" for is the wing rib, and he's got that.
By the time you've got everything figured out it's all stored in your memory banks, so the plans are always available.

It's kinda like when I was taking tests in school: when trying to cheat I would make very small notes with a lot of condensed information on them... by the time I had summarised all the information into a sufficiently small package to fit on a note, I had put so much effort into it that I actually knew the stuff, and didn't need to cheat anymore
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Old 08-29-2005, 07:14 AM
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Like RudeBoy says. The only thing I need its the wing rib shape...
I love speed, and for what I know, when I crash one of my plane, must of the time the plan is not nessacery at all, because nothing remain from the crash! and I like testing a new plane limit, chance to build the same plane again from plan..... no chance at all!




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Old 08-29-2005, 07:29 PM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

Well if you two have memories like that , I suggest you try making money at black jack. Counting cards should be a cinch.

As far as me , in my business I work with a hundred different types of security systems and as time goes on most of them become obsolete but still exist in the field . So with out the manuals I might as well look for another job . Same thing goes for building a plane twice the same exact way without plans , I could never pull it off. Even if I had the plans , something will be put together different.

PS I know I'm getting old
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Old 09-12-2005, 10:23 AM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

The project go foward a bit a the time. Don't have enough free time [] but I'm expecting a Maiden flight next weekend.
I will post pictures tonigh.

Everything is done now. Just missing the landing gear and fix the receiver and batteries in.... realy don't know where but ...

Finally, It will fly with three servos. Elevator, one aileron and engine. I will try it with my .15 LA on APC 6.5X6.5 , if it flies well, I will replace the engine with my .15CVA with Mac tune pipe.
Actual weight 1.7pound (27oz) with everything in it, just missing the aluminium landing gear and covering.
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Old 09-13-2005, 07:13 PM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

Some pics
Starting covering tonight..... and maiden flight this weekend. I will know if I need to move this entire post in 1/8 - 1/4 airplanes forum!
Like I said, if its fun to fly, I will put my .15CVA with mac pipe in it....
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Old 09-13-2005, 07:47 PM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

Looks good... I'm kind of curious about the horizontal stab though, looks a bit on the small side to me...? What did you use to figure out the size, or did you just guess? (perfectly valid method). That things gonna get up and GO!

How's the mustang going? (from 1st post pictures)
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Old 09-13-2005, 08:31 PM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

Looks very good.

The Horizontal looks plenty big to me, I would think that you could shrink down the size of the firewall. I still think you will regret only having one aileron.
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Old 09-14-2005, 01:20 AM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

Scratch out a nice balsa wood cowling for it. (more speed)

Dave.
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Old 09-14-2005, 09:04 AM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

Yes, the Stab his a little bit small (18% of the wing), but big enough for this type of plane. I'm not worried about it. Not the same thing for my wing incidence and motor down trust. I will probably play a bit with down trust after a few fly.
But like you said, this plane was made by a little bit of planning and a little bit of guessing! After more than 10 scratch build, and more than 20 kits, now I known everything can be fix or modified to make it fly right (most of the time!)

For the one aileron setup!!! I’m not sure too! I known two ailerons is better than one, but it’s a Prototype! And I will never know how one aileron airplanes react before I try it! I thing I will need to mix a bit of elevator when using my aileron to make the plane stable and level in turn??? I will try it this weekend! But for sure 2 ailerons setup cannot be worst than one aileron, for sure. But this plane was made only to make big dive and low pass over the runway. If I want something maneuverable I will use my Wonder…





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Old 09-14-2005, 09:11 AM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

My P51 Mustang (.40 size), his almost finish. A bit of sanding, and it’s ago for the covering. I will install an OS.50 with pit style muffler. It has rear retract (tail wheel) and wing retract. Probably post some pics when I will put this project on the table again. Expecting flying weight (6.8 to 7 pound).

(Flyboy Dave)
Yep, an engine cowling looks a bit more finish.
But my engine motor mount do not permit that. The engine is mounting on an aluminum plate, and this plate is screw to the firewall... If I put a cowling, I can't change my engine. The only way, screw it to the airframe on plywood block...
If I’m not too tired, probably I will do it
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Old 09-16-2005, 09:04 AM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

Almost finish! Just waiting for the landing gear, after that I will be able to install the gas tank, close and cover the hatch.
I make a quick covering job using my old stuff (Ultracote).

This project cost me nothing until now, just need to by an 8$ aluminum landing gear, everything I used was remaining balsa sheet, used CA glue, epoxy... I finally find a home for my .15LA engine and radio gear. This is how I clean up (recycle) or make place for new stuff!

If everything going fine, this weekend it’s the Maiden flight. []. I don't think it’s gone be a Speed freak plane, but equivalent or faster than my Wonder (90 Mph). I’m sure. If everything going fine I will work on the firewall to make it more aerodynamic and make wheel pants too.
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Old 09-16-2005, 10:11 AM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

Looks great. Good job!
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Old 09-16-2005, 12:07 PM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

Thanks Daven.

I will work on covering a bit.... and remove these white strips on the side. I will follow the same wing pattern.
LA engine are cheap, and they probably be cheaper to produce if OS stop painting these engine Blue! I hate this color; at worse make the muffler fit the engine color! I don't know if Acetone can remove this blue paint on engine?

Anybody try it?
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Old 09-20-2005, 10:12 AM
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Default RE: Scratch build ???

Finally the Maiden flight as come! [:@]

In final, I have many thinks to modify to make it a good flyer.
I only do 3 flights. The first one was a rush of adrenaline to keep it in the air and land it without loosing the landing gear or the plane! I was so nose heavy (I add 6oz on the tail for the second flight!). Make turns with only one aileron is ok, when the airplane is perfectly tuned, but for the maiden one, I was hard and unpredictable! I land it like a pro, but I still asking me how!

The second one was, not so bad, take 20 feet of runway to put it in the air, strait and level. I flew it on an 8X5 APC prop, to slow it downs a bit and have enough trust to keep it in the air without to much speed. Adjust and trim my control and try some full throttle pass. It’s fast, very fast, and the acceleration was amazing compare to my Wonder. Make many turns on both sides, no problem with only one aileron, but I need to do it gently, if I put full up or down aileron, there is a tendency to snap, like using only the rudder to turn. But when I do it slowly there is no trouble. Expected speed 60mph

The third one I replace the 8X5 prop by 6.5X.6.5 APC turning at 18 200 RPM on 25% nitro. I take 50 feet of runway to put it in the air. I was surprise, the airplane was so fast (± 95mph, easy) and practically no tendency to climb with acceleration, but it was tough to turn, when I was using the aileron to turn left, the airplane incline slowly and take a lot of altitude (like using flap at high speed), and when using aileron to incline right the airplane comes completely unstable and dramatically loose altitude. And for the landing it was a big mess! I badly land it on the wing tip trying correcting the inclination, the airplane snap to the right 10 feet before touching the runway... Ouch. [&:]

Crash result: there is no damage to the wing, but not the same for the airframe! I crack both side of the fuselage near the firewall and broke both wing holder block. I already start the repairing process. I replace the 4oz tank for a 2oz and move the battery in the tail to remove extra tail weight. I will add 2 servos in the wing for the ailerons and try it again next Weekend.

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