Extreme Speed Prop Planes Discuss the need for speed with fast prop planes (Screamin Demon, Diamond Dust, Shrikes or any REAL sound breakin'''' plane)

GP Patriot Build

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Old 09-22-2005, 12:09 PM
  #1  
Leadfoot-RCU
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Default GP Patriot Build

I'll soon be starting the build of my new GP Patriot, and wanted to see what recommendations/changes to consider....

Here's the basics of the build...
- GP Patriot 40
- Retractable landing gear
- YS 45 SE w/ Macs Tuned Muffler (have a header, so may go to a pipe evenutally)
- no flaps, no fake intakes

Trying to decide on the following...
- Mechanical or Air retracts
- Engine mounted upright or sidewinder
- Dual or single aileron servos

That's about it for now. Look forward to hearing your suggestions!! Until then I'm still bashing aroung my current Patriot, and have now added another DC F-20 to my airforce!!

Thanks,
Steve
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Old 09-22-2005, 01:29 PM
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js3
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

Great choice for the motor! I had one just like this.

If I were you...

Spring Air retracts (mine had Hobbico mechs--no like)
Tank mounted in the wing compartment (on mine, I had two tanks rigged in series for a total of 20 oz of fuel)
Side mount engine with the pipe slung under the wing
I used only one aileron servo good and bad to both ways of doing it

Have fun!
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Old 09-22-2005, 01:55 PM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

I have just finished a Patriot 40 with OS 50 with APC 9x9. It needs to be light as possible because it is a heavy airplane. It flies great but is lacking in the speed category because of weight and drag. I mounted my engine sideways and it works well. You may need a tad mit of weight in left wing tip if you mount sideways, I did. The OS is happy with the 9x9 but it needs much more power to really haul, so I would use a pipe for sure if you know how to set one up. I think is you narowed the wing a tad and thined up the fuse and wing it would perform much better.
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Old 09-22-2005, 06:02 PM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

Great engine choice, you will not be disappointed. I'm running a YS45 se on my Patriot with a Macs 7.5 cc tuned pipe & APC 9x9 prop. I mounted the engine upright so I didn't have to mess with the pipe when removing the wing. Robart mechanical retracts, have had no problems yet on a grass field. Cut the ailerons so I could have flaps, work great, even when slowed way down there is still plenty of aileron control & the flaps really slow the landings down. Using 1 servo for each aileron mounted on their sides to the hatch covers(see pic). I liked the looks of the fake intakes but the plans have you build them with a flat front, I built mine up so they're beveled & hopefully more aerodynamic. A Dubro 12 oz tank fits perfect under the canopy, this will give me about a 7 minute flight.Have had the best luck with an OS A3 plug. I believe my RTF weight was about 7lb 2oz. On grass she'll take about a 150 FT run before takeoff, on asphalt runway she's off in about 75 FT & hauling *****, Top speed has got to be 120+ mph & rock solid as if on rails.
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Old 09-22-2005, 06:08 PM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

these are economical, light & work fine for the Patriot:
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LX7110&P=ML

there is also a mechanical version (directly from B&D) for $40 or so, but you would need two retract servos in the Patriot so the savings are nonexistant (unless you have already spare servos)
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Old 09-22-2005, 09:51 PM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

Thanks for the replies!! Lots of excellent ideas for this great plane!!!

HavinFun,

My friend that I fly with is running a Patriot setup almost exactly like yours, and it really hauls! I love the colour scheme that you choose for it, and may *ahem* borrow it for mine. Two reasons really: High visibility and my friends Patriot is done up in the classic Thunderbirds scheme, so having both our planes in the air together would be spectacular!! Yours was also where I got the idea to mount the engine upright, and have the pipe down the fuse.

Vasek,

Have you used the B&D air retracts?

JS3,

I never would have thought of having the fuel tank further into the fuse, but with the YS it would be possible!!


Thanks again everyone!!!

Steve

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Old 09-22-2005, 10:20 PM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build


ORIGINAL: Leadfoot-RCU

Thanks for the replies!! Lots of excellent ideas for this great plane!!!

HavinFun,

My friend that I fly with is running a Patriot setup almost exactly like yours, and it really hauls! I love the colour scheme that you choose for it, and may *ahem* borrow it for mine. Two reasons really: High visibility and my friends Patriot is done up in the classic Thunderbirds scheme, so having both our planes in the air together would be spectacular!! Yours was also where I got the idea to mount the engine upright, and have the pipe down the fuse.

Vasek,

Have you used the B&D air retracts?

JS3,

I never would have thought of having the fuel tank further into the fuse, but with the YS it would be possible!!


Thanks again everyone!!!

Steve

Feel free to use it, it's not mine, probably the US NAVY has some rights to it. With the lettering on the underside of the wing I have no problems with orientation, it is highly visible. With the Robart nose retract I had to mount it up higher than the plans showed for the Hobbico, so out came the fuel tank floor to make room for the retract. After this mod you'll be lucky to get a 2 oz tank in there, wanted a bigger tank anyway & a Dubro 12 oz fits perfect behind F2, this is just under the cockpit & just forward of the CG. With some engines you might have a fuel draw problem with the tank at this location, but not the YS45....you could put the tank anywhere you like.
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Old 09-22-2005, 11:11 PM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build


ORIGINAL: Leadfoot-RCU

JS3,

I never would have thought of having the fuel tank further into the fuse, but with the YS it would be possible!!
Right! Actually, I would try this with just about any two-stroke motor not just the YS. Especially so if you use a bladder tank.

Having the tank in the "radio" compartment above the wing does a couple of things: it makes room up front for the retract mechanism and wheel, plus it puts the fuel weight closer to the CG so the weight shift from full to empty isn't as noticeable.
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Old 09-22-2005, 11:11 PM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

Well...

A YS-45 without a pipe or Ultrathrust muffler is not worth running IMHO-

My YS-45 on a stock muffler was about the same as a 46FX, the Macs tuned muffler I understand is similar performance to a stock muffler- get the 7.5CC pipe

I have flown the Pat with mechanicals and air and I prefer air- Spring-Air to be specific.... No worries about strained servos, bent linkage or gear that are not "locked down" even when they look locked--- weight is negligible as mentioned***

I would mount the engine at 45 deg. or on her side, looks better and the pipe will be UNDER thew wing-

I use a single standard servo even on my Jett-50 powered Patriots! Just run 6V to boost the speed and torque of the servos-

Try a 10x7 on the YS if you get her piped...
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Old 09-23-2005, 08:45 AM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

yes I have both, B&D (mechanical & air) they are great!

B&D is an old guy that will replace any item on your gear for free (as long he is alive)

he's from the "old school" (that's good) but he has no email or website tho.... you have to phone him if you need something:

B&D Enterprises (304) 753-4636
HC81 Box 7
Ballard, WV, 24918
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Old 09-23-2005, 12:45 PM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

Vasek,

I believe that my friend's Patriot has B&D Retracts, and they work really well even from our rather rough grass field. I would like to give the air retracts a try and the price is right!!

Razor,

I know, I know, the YS really deserves to have th pipe on it, and I do have the header for it, so I'm sure it will just be a matter of time!!!!

And as you know, my current Patriot is piped and slung under the wing, but I have to admit I really like HavinFun's setup with the upright engine. In a way, it almost looks "cleaner" especially when the retracts are being used.....

No worries, it will look like a smokin' fast Patriot when all is said and done!!!

Thanks,
Steve
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Old 09-23-2005, 03:40 PM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

I really like B&D gear. They work great.

The only concerns Id have with them on the Patriot, is that the mounting flanges are a bit thicker than on most 'metal' frame gear (not a big deal if you plan ahead) and the nose gear unit tends to be a bit more bulky - which may cause some fit-up issues. Since you are moving the fuel tank, you have room. But have the landing gear on hand before you build, fit things up a bit, and plan ahead.

Either Spring Air or B&D are my choices. Robart has a set of 'springair clones' now , and those are good. Even a good ole set of RhomAir gear is great, if you can find a set

Bob
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Old 09-23-2005, 05:25 PM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

like BOB said, the nose gear takes a bit more space... however I believe the best way to setup the patriot is to use a 4oz hopper tank up front and a 10oz or a 12oz (cylindrical) in the front of the fuse wing location:
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXFU38&P=7

the big advantage of B&D is the weight you save especially up front (nose gear) you won't have to put a ton of lead in the tail [X(]
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Old 09-24-2005, 01:08 PM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

Do the B&D lock down when air pressure is low/gone? I have never used them...

I have some old mechanicals (Hobbico?) on one of my Patriots> works fine but no contest against Spring Air-
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Old 09-26-2005, 08:25 AM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

B&D are air up/air down. No springs. That is why they are very light weight.
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Old 09-26-2005, 08:49 AM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

Bob,

How durable are the B&D Air retracts? Our grass field is fairly rough is some spots, and I have been known to make the odd *ahem* rough landing from time to time!!

The price is right for them, so I would like to give them a try!

Thanks for the info!!

Steve
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Old 09-26-2005, 09:20 AM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

They are a rugged as anything else out there.

I flew them on 8lb pattern birds without any problems.

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Old 09-29-2005, 06:31 PM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

lead,

if you realy want spring loaded alum retracts (a la spring-air) have a look at this:

http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXJZE2&P=7

i just got a set for my f-16, for $135 its a good deal ... at first glance they look A OK! (a bit heavier than the B&D tho [X(])
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Old 09-29-2005, 08:56 PM
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Default RE: GP Patriot Build

How durable are the B&D Air retracts? Our grass field is fairly rough is some spots, and I have been known to make the odd *ahem* rough landing from time to time!!
I can vouch for their durability as well. I have a pair on my F20 and have made a few rough landings where I thought, at least on one occassion would have folded the gear. But, it held up great. Anyone know if there is a way to tighten the little bit of slop I have on my nosegear? I don't see a small setscrew like I have on my cheapy hobbico mechanicals.
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