1fasthitman

Why do Q500 planes like the Great Planes Viper use the V tail setup? I have flown the viper on the sim and find its flying characteristics rather annoying. Are there Q500 planes like it with a standard tail?

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

The local Q-500 record has been held by a conventional tailed plane since the last time I checked. If V-tails are set up right, they control the plane just fine....but they are more work to get right.

HighPlains

My Feedback: (1)

In racing competitors are always looking for the next little trick for speed.

Now the story -

A really long time again there was a local left coast racer named "Iron Oxide". He was a very competitive fellow, pretty good flier and modeler with long sleeves on his shirt. You got to have long sleeves, because that's where you keep the tricks. Anyway, it was his nature that he had to win our one dollar trophies by any means possible. So he did what he did towards that goal. Quite often he outran the next fastest model by a lap or more with his model with a V-tail. Well, there must be something about that tail, and the usual blather about less junctions cause less drag were expounded upon with great care. But the actual truth was the creative grinding on the sleeve, and excessive amounts of nitro he put into the fuel tank were the real reasons of his success.

Mike Connor

My Feedback: (5)

It seems to me that the benefit of one less surface in the breeze would be lost by the opposing forces generated when you moved the stick. A full up pylon turn would also have the drag of left and right rudders at the same time.

HighPlains

My Feedback: (1)

Yes, but full up is only about 3/16" measured at the TE. Also why I alway kept my tail at 120 degrees instead of the more popular (but also wrong) angle of 110 degree.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

I would like to figure out how to operate a V-tail with torque rods in that cramped end of the fuselage. Are there any examples of how to do this?
I think the levers coming off the torque rods inside the fuselage would need to be able to pivot.

Ed Smith

Combatpig,

We need 3D pictures for this! The picture shows my method. The pushrod has a ball socket on the end. The funny bent horn has a threaded end. On the end of that is a Dubro #189 ball link. The top left of the horn is the part that goes into the elevator, the middle part of the horn is on the hinge line, The last section is vertical to the push rod. The fuselage width at the horn location has to be 5/8"min. It is a tight fit. I make my tails detachable.

Ed S

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

ED, yes that is tight! I am amzed that you can get both levers to cooperate in such a confined space. There must be less side to side movement than I visualized. Those levers are nice and long, looks like you will get maximum control resolution and leverage mechanically. Should be able to fly the plane with a $50 radio if you wanted to.

daven

My Feedback: (1)

Combatpigg, there are some pretty detailed instructions at www.supertrc.com under Hurrikane instructions.

Here are a couple pics that should help, there are plenty more on the site.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Dave, that's another real good look at it, thanks. This time we see how it's done with a wood fuselage. I've looked at those ball links on the shelves and never had the courage to try them. Do they tend to stay tighter longer than a clevis type linkage?

Ed Smith

The amount of use and movement is actually very little. The wear therefore is minimal. With a wood fuselage I imagine it is fairly easy to install the pushrods. Glue on the tail, install the pushrods then glue on the fuselage bottom. I use my own glass fuselage. Hence the detchable tail. I hook up the pushrods then thread them through the hole in the tail seat. Just for safety I always glue a small balsa block in the bottom of the fuselage that sits under and is just clear of the ball socket. This makes it impossible for the ball socket to pop off the ball.

Ed S

rmenke

My Feedback: (13)

Guys:

What amazes me is how you can get both V sections perfectly alligned with the proper incidence relative to the datum line and wing. I can see how to make jigs to keep the two in line with respects to each other, but the attatchment to the fuse has evaded me foreaver. If I can't see how something can be accurately measured by instrument, I flat won't do it. Have thought of building a jig to hold a steel rod along the datum line, then the fuse could be turned to a point the position of each V could be measured with a inclinomeater. Yes, I am insane about getting incidence lines perfect, and will take things to a extreem to insure things are correct, but the attitude has served me well through the years. Must be a genitic thing with german ancestry? Don't everyone measure with a digital micrometer? ENJOY

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Roger, they don't know how to glue them straight at Lanier, either.

mugenkidd

My Feedback: (94)

Maybe the sim is wrong. I have a viper and it doesn't fly too much different than any other sport plane.... btw the linkage is an easy direct pushrod from servo to tail surface, no tricky ball sockets required.

daven

My Feedback: (1)

I use bulk 4/40 rod (threads just on one end) and have bent so many that I can get them nearly perfect on my first or second try it is a piece of cake without any fancy measuring devices. TLAR works for me, then again, my eyesight is pretty good

rmenke

My Feedback: (13)

CP:

Thats a little harsh, but yet, true. But, if your gonna do it, do it right. Guess a cnc machine shop could build you a perfect jig that may work well on a perfect work bench. Do all your V tail quickees fly the same? If you say yes, "pants on fire". If not, what is the most likely variable? Ok, I might as well admit it. I'm just to lazy to build another crutch just for V tails when storeing one is such a pain. Hard to teach old dogs new tricks.

diggs_74

I think it's just like anything else.. Once you do it a few times it gets easier.. I can't tell you how I set the V-tail on my quickies before making a mold for them.. I just lined it up and eye-balled it for about an entire evening before I glued it.. Did they all fly the same, no, not exactly but pretty darn close..

MJD

My Feedback: (1)

The required vertical and horizontal stabilizer areas are achieved with less total surface area and fewer fuselage/stabilizer junctions = less drag. Just because a sim does something does not mean it is so in real life. They are only as good as the physics engine and the parameters provided to it.

MJD