Extreme Speed Prop Planes Discuss the need for speed with fast prop planes (Screamin Demon, Diamond Dust, Shrikes or any REAL sound breakin'''' plane)

Poweplant for a fast Patriot

Reply

Old 01-24-2008, 12:54 PM
  #1  
stg61abc
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: São Paulo SP, BRAZIL
Posts: 385
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default Poweplant for a fast Patriot

will be this engine good for a fast patriot? (ST G 500 ABC Quickie)
Another choice would be a FX 46
thanks
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Qo40674.jpg
Views:	5
Size:	76.3 KB
ID:	859707   Click image for larger version

Name:	Ki19054.jpg
Views:	4
Size:	66.6 KB
ID:	859708  
stg61abc is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2008, 01:53 PM
  #2  
z06kal
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Woodland Hills, CA
Posts: 211
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

Your going to want a LOT more power than that for a fast patriot especially if you are talking 60 size.
z06kal is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2008, 02:09 PM
  #3  
Flyboy Dave
My Feedback: (21)
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Pinon Hills, CA
Posts: 13,775
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

....the Super Tiger looks like a good engine. [sm=thumbup.gif]
Flyboy Dave is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2008, 02:46 PM
  #4  
stg61abc
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: São Paulo SP, BRAZIL
Posts: 385
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

Hi, thanks, i really think that the ST will be a good choice too. The FX is a good motor, but have the known liner issues, and i dont know if it will withstand full power flights for some time, specially if use a tuned pipe ... several at my field pelled their liners...
stg61abc is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2008, 02:48 PM
  #5  
stg61abc
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: São Paulo SP, BRAZIL
Posts: 385
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

HI Z06, the patriot will be built for scratch and is .40 sized, many thanks!
stg61abc is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2008, 03:02 PM
  #6  
vasek
My Feedback: (4)
 
vasek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Prague, CZECH REPUBLIC
Posts: 4,144
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

Don't forget to place the Supertiger stickers on the plane...
vasek is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2008, 03:36 PM
  #7  
rmenke
Senior Member
My Feedback: (13)
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Merced, Ca., CA
Posts: 2,118
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

stg61abc:

Am trying to give you reality in this world of go fasters, short and intended to be sweet. There is no free lunch when it comes to going fast as this group defines or intends the use of the word. A Q-500, Nelson, Jett or Pico 40 of equal powered is hereby defined as fast, includes a Q-40/F1 types also. Both now compete around the 200 mph mark. Most of the crowd will call 100 and up "fast". You are welcome in the brotherhood if you think 100 is fast, but will shortly discover that speed is half-fast. Unfortunately, going fast has always, and always will have a price tag, generally around $400.00 for the power plant. There are other engines capable of the rpm's needed for 200mph, say around 20,000 to 24,000 + depending on the prop and airframe. The Pico racing engine, OS 90 VRDF and Bryon 91 Fan engines, hopped up OPS or Rossie will give it to you. With pipes and needed accessories, your going to be in the magical $400.00 power plant area. Wanna do it with electric? The current price is still in the same area. Mega 16/25/2 $100.00 + controller $95.00, hi performance lipo 149.00=$344.00. No prop, hub, plane included. If you just want to go fast, buy a Sports Jett 60LX with black pipe and a decent Q-500. The engine will be user friendly, idle and transition like a sport engine and give you something in the area of 20,000rpm in a 40 size block and weight. The throttle will give you the advantage of working up to the near 200 mph mark. While you may be a good 3d or pattern pilot, the world of going fast and turnig left takes some training just like 3D. Yes, you stuck some 3D planes in the ground learning, most will do the same with the go fasters as they learn turning around a pylon at around 200 and 15-20' off the ground. Thats what you need to achieve to race with the go fast bunch, and racing even on the club level is what most of us end up enjoying. I recall going to my first F-40 race with a kit shoestring and K & B 40. Got a kick out of that nice old guy of 80 next to me, gonna try to fly with 30 year old king me. Yep, he beat me with a great lesson in consistant flying and a little tretchery. Hope to be that 80 year old, old fox some day, unfortunately not far away in years. Of course a sleek streemlined airplane is going to help. A good OS and airframe is going to get you to near or over 100 mph. Other than the fan engines, the OS is intended to be a moderate reving sport engine, as most others are. A OS 46 FX in a Q-500 will get you around 100 only, it takes that great racing engine to scoot with the rpm's and power needed. If you want to go fast and use the engine for something else in the future in the fast sport area, the Jett 60LX is the only way to go IMHO. To learn what is user friendly and tough, go to a full out Q-500 race. The guys needeling on those Nelsons, Jetts and Picos are generally the best of the best. You may still see someone do a 2-3 second lean run. The engine, $400.00 worth may then be tost, a expensive fishing weight. Funny part is the guy will not be so upset about the cost of the engine, he is mostly PO'd about not beeing competetive in that race. That changes as he goes home and nears the financial controller of the family. Most of us do have one out of necessity. Its tough to try and keep one of us brotherhood types on a reasonable budget, and feed and house the family. After all, that go fast engine would be in the shop if up to us, the family can just cut back on food, house payment deferred a few weeks, etc. ENJOY
rmenke is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2008, 04:49 PM
  #8  
daven
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Waseca, MN
Posts: 8,455
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

Roger,

Don't ever change

I love your posts. Not always to the point, not always what the people want to read, but ALWAYS entertaining.


As to the original post, to answer your question with a question, what do you consider fast?
daven is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2008, 05:18 PM
  #9  
Mike Connor
Senior Member
My Feedback: (5)
 
Mike Connor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Tulsa, OK
Posts: 2,025
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot


ORIGINAL: daven
Roger,

Don't ever change
Except for maybe....paragraph breaks?
Mike Connor is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2008, 12:03 PM
  #10  
stg61abc
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: São Paulo SP, BRAZIL
Posts: 385
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

Man, this is what i called of DETAILED EXPLANATION !!!!
stg61abc is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2008, 12:14 PM
  #11  
Kmot
My Feedback: (24)
 
Kmot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Northridge, CA
Posts: 10,941
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

I don't believe stg61abc wants to "go fast and turn left" with a Patriot.

Probably just wants to go fast, turn around, and go fast again.
Kmot is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2008, 12:19 PM
  #12  
daven
Senior Member
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Waseca, MN
Posts: 8,455
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

For me, neither of those engines would be fast in a patriot. Its all a matter of perspective. He may be perfectly happy buzzing the field at 100 mph. I would not be.
daven is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2008, 01:58 PM
  #13  
bob27s
My Feedback: (19)
 
bob27s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Cleveland, OH
Posts: 5,576
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

I will assume for a moment we are speaking of the original Patriot (.40 size)

The ST Q-500 engine has a tuned muffler. Similar to what Jett, Webra and Nelson offered up early on in the 428 engine battles.

A few ST .40 racing engines made it into racing down in SEMPRA competition back in the early 1990s, and for a while held their own against the webra and sport-jett engines. The engine runs well, but keep in mind that varient was tweeked for rpm use. Its one weakness was the muffler -- some assembly issues.

For the Patriot, you could use the engine if you already own it. Keep in mind, you have to prop the engine to turn "over" 17,000 peak ground rpm with the q-500 muffler. So you will be limited in prop size... APC 9x6, 9x7 would be where to start. Was raced with 8.75x7 and 8.75x7.5 rev-up racing props. It is not going to turn much larger of a prop very well.

Combined with the 9x7, you should get decent performance. As dave noted, how fast do you consider fast?

The OS 46FX is a good engine also. If you have one, sure... use it. Adding a tuned exhaust like the jett-stream or ultra-thrust really can bring that engine alive. Prop selection of 9x7, 9x8, 10x6 and 10x7 are possible.

Key to getting the patriot to move is to use retracts, and keep the airframe clean.

As dave noted, how fast do you consider fast?

Bob
bob27s is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2008, 02:06 PM
  #14  
stg61abc
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: São Paulo SP, BRAZIL
Posts: 385
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

Yeah, my patriot only will be for a fast sport fun in my field.... this is it!!!!
stg61abc is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2008, 02:09 PM
  #15  
stg61abc
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: São Paulo SP, BRAZIL
Posts: 385
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

Hi Bob, fast for me is a fast sport flying, maybe 110 or little more. I dont look for super speeds, just for plain fast fun....
thanks

ps i have both engines
stg61abc is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2008, 02:18 PM
  #16  
bob27s
My Feedback: (19)
 
bob27s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Cleveland, OH
Posts: 5,576
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

Try the ST first..... as long as you have it..... might as well give it a home
bob27s is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2008, 09:43 PM
  #17  
KC36330
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Enterprise, AL
Posts: 5,952
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

I've got a YS45 w/ a Jett Stream muff on my Patriot 40, as far as glow planes go it's fast but it has to be the first plane i fly that day or after flying the turbines a lap or two with the patriot is anything but fast and it quickly looses its appeal.

KC36330 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2008, 02:34 AM
  #18  
rmenke
Senior Member
My Feedback: (13)
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Merced, Ca., CA
Posts: 2,118
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

MC:

GD school teachers just never let go. Just hate it when they are right. So, I flunked out in english. Well, so did that E=mc2 guy. ENJOY
rmenke is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2008, 11:20 PM
  #19  
funflyerf4
My Feedback: (6)
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: vernon, NJ
Posts: 700
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

My Patriot is almost done,I ran the Jett 60 lx for the first time over the weekend and wow!With a 9-8 still rich spinning 18,000.The finished weight came out at 5lbs.I just have to do some painting on the cowling and pics. will follow.
funflyerf4 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2008, 11:47 PM
  #20  
Mike Connor
Senior Member
My Feedback: (5)
 
Mike Connor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Tulsa, OK
Posts: 2,025
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot


ORIGINAL: rmenke

MC:

GD school teachers just never let go. Just hate it when they are right. So, I flunked out in english. Well, so did that E=mc2 guy. ENJOY
School teacher I am not. Just having a little fun with good intentions.
Mike Connor is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2008, 07:59 AM
  #21  
phjoker
Senior Member
My Feedback: (4)
 
phjoker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Vernon, NJ
Posts: 869
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot


ORIGINAL: funflyerf4

My Patriot is almost done,I ran the Jett 60 lx for the first time over the weekend and wow!With a 9-8 still rich spinning 18,000.The finished weight came out at 5lbs.I just have to do some painting on the cowling and pics. will follow.
yea you should have felt the torque that thing had while I was holding it.Its gonna be a rocket
phjoker is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2008, 11:02 AM
  #22  
bob27s
My Feedback: (19)
 
bob27s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Cleveland, OH
Posts: 5,576
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot


ORIGINAL: phjoker


ORIGINAL: funflyerf4

My Patriot is almost done,I ran the Jett 60 lx for the first time over the weekend and wow!With a 9-8 still rich spinning 18,000.The finished weight came out at 5lbs.I just have to do some painting on the cowling and pics. will follow.
yea you should have felt the torque that thing had while I was holding it.Its gonna be a rocket
Stuff like that just cant help but put a smile on your face.....
bob27s is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2008, 01:10 PM
  #23  
phjoker
Senior Member
My Feedback: (4)
 
phjoker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Vernon, NJ
Posts: 869
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

your not kidding. now I have to get my 60 running like his. i haven't even looked at it yet since you told me what to do
to get mine running right. One of these day Hopefully soon!
phjoker is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2008, 12:20 AM
  #24  
rmenke
Senior Member
My Feedback: (13)
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Merced, Ca., CA
Posts: 2,118
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot


funfyerf4

Please just get used to following Dub Jett's breakin and other recommendations closely. Think the 9 X 8 may be a little much for breakin, but shes turning 18K minimum so may be a little stronger than most and just fine. That 60 is not like anything else out there. Small, light, strong, great rpms. You can prop for more pitch, or run the rpms up to around 20k with no problems, maby 22. Great engine for learning to match prop size to airframe, cause most can see the changes in speed or turning or both. Some day you probably will run int a old fox who's airplane is slower than yours, yet he beats you around the pylons with ease. Yea, its prop selection. Learn all you can from the best out there to the point that you can beat them. Great feeling of self satisfaction and acomplishment.


Mike Connor & Rudeboy:

You are both great Americans and nice guys in every since of the word!!!! Even my dog missunderstands my intent when I pet his butt once in a while. No offence intended, none taken.

Dave Norman:

Have spent a day or two thinking of how to answer your question of "How fast is fast for you". Well, after flying it around for a while and dialing in things, I go to the pylons. If I can get a good tight turn and correct hedding to the next pylon, its fine. When the elevation and hedding change while in the corner, the darn thing is too fast. Thats somewhere above 170. (Last year). Yaall have a good one.
rmenke is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2008, 12:07 PM
  #25  
Razor-RCU
Senior Member
My Feedback: (50)
 
Razor-RCU's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Mira Mesa, CA
Posts: 5,405
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Poweplant for a fast Patriot

Roger- You are crazy man! LOL I actually "scan" your posts since reading them I feel is exhausting.

A 5lb patriot with the Jett-60LX will be a rocket, BTW.

To the gentelemen who wants 110mph, to be honest you will still need a really nice powerplant to get 110. Most people over-estimate their speed and I feel that my fastest Patriot with a Jett-50 and retracts, maybe hit 120mph.

Flying a Patriot with a 46FX/AX etc. should be criminal- the plane does not even fly really well with those engines. Just being honest- I would get a used Webra-50GT in the swap-shop or something or a Rossi-53 and go with that if you do not want to spend the $$ on a Jett.

Cheers!
Razor-RCU is offline  
Reply With Quote

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service