Extreme Speed Prop Planes Discuss the need for speed with fast prop planes (Screamin Demon, Diamond Dust, Shrikes or any REAL sound breakin'''' plane)

Photo of BSE 90L FIRE. Outrageous specs!

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Old 06-13-2003, 02:20 AM
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Dustflyer
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Default Photo of BSE 90L FIRE. Outrageous specs!

Finally got my BSE 90L FIRE.

Dubb says he turned a 10X10 at 16K with it but felt I might get more because he didn't have the right pipe and said what he did have was too long.

The specs on it are outrageous. It is incredibly small and light. Weight is ONLY 20 OUNCES! That's only 7 ounces more than an OS 46FX! The crankcase is only 1 5/8" inches wide.

The engine is almost too gorgeous to run but I hope it will find a good home in my Patriot.

I can actually shoe horn the engine into the existing fuse but think I will enlarge the firewall by about 1/4" all around just to make life a little easier.
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Old 06-13-2003, 02:22 AM
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Default Patriot

Here's the "Super Patriot" under construction. With all the great ARF's out there I never thought I'd build another model airplane but here I go again.

I was darned lucky to get this sucker. The kit has been discontinued again.
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Old 06-21-2003, 04:24 AM
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Flyboy Dave
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Default Dustflyer....YEAH BABY...!!!

Lookin' good, Man....that motor is almost too pretty to
put in a plane....

I grabbed a Patriot kit too....The first time I saw the Pat.
I was in love....(again)

I'm gonna stick this old "clunker" in mine....

Dave.
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Old 06-21-2003, 04:38 AM
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Default Nice!

I have just about had it- Time to get serious about this stuff..


The Jett 90 only weighs 20 oz. Holy Crud!

Which Rossi is that Dave? 60?

I have another Patriot almost done and I gotta do something serious about a powerplant....

I was thinking of a K&B D/F 7.5- any thoughts?

I am soo jealous- Please keep posting this stuff, because it motivates me!

So far I have a Magic with an OS-50FSR Heli motor in it= Too loud

A Lanier F-4/ YS-45 and Macs tuned pipe= Too loud

A GP Spitfire ARF/ Rossi-45 = Too loud

My fiance says tonight " so you are trying to get as many planes as possible to be too loud, so you can't hardly fly them at the club"

YUP!
james
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Old 06-21-2003, 10:50 AM
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Default Engines

Razor,

Noise problem? Just put those nitro pipes away and go with the MACS quiet tuned pipe. On a Jett FIRE 50 I get the same rpm with the quiet pipe and 8.8X9.75 prop as my friend does with his using a full nitro pipe and the same prop. The MACS people tell me you get nearly the same rpm with the quiet pipe. See EW Spears comments further down this thread regarding the YS or Rossi 60.


Flyboy Dave and Razor,

Thanks. I agree, it looks like something you would put on display in a glass case but I said what the heck. I couldn't find one of those honkin' Rossi's so I had no choice but to buy something new.

Its pretty but I'm puttin' it to work anyway in that Patriot. You should see the 15cc quiet pipe for that thing, it's huge.

The engine weighs 7 oz more than a 46FX, so I've gone with metal geared servos to add a little more weight aft. I will also use a 5 cell 1700 mah pack in the servo compartment. This will add enough weight so only an ounce or two should be needed in the tail if anything.

I will be using 4-40 rods all around sleeved with slip-fit carbon fiber tube from Darrol Cady.

I made a new firewall enlarged 1/4" in width and 3/8" in height, this gives me a little more room to mount the engine and to use a 10 oz instead of the recommended 8 oz tank. I plan to use the Sig 60-90 size engine mounts, they are a lot smaller that the 90 sized GP mounts. B&D retracts.

Still haven't figured out the covering scheme but am leaning toward my tried and true florescent orange on top and white with black invasion stripes on the bottom. Boring as anything but fast planes are hard to see!
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Old 06-21-2003, 11:04 AM
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Default Photo of BSE 90L FIRE. Outrageous specs!

Not a BSE, but a Jett .90 (Torque Version) hanging from the nose of my 60 sized Pica Corsair. I haven't fired it up yet, but I can't wait.
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Old 06-21-2003, 11:54 AM
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Default Engines

Dustflyer,
You've got me motivated. Since I emailed you last about the YS60FR's I've picked up a Rossi 81DF, a Patriot, and a Jett BSE 90. I'm probably silly for doing so since my stick skills will only support trainers and Sticks, but I love to measure, modify, & tune hi-perf engines. As soon as I get some tuning data for the Jett BSE 90 we can swap info.

"Just put those nitro pipes away and go with the MACS quiet tuned pipe. You get the exact same rpm as with the nitro pipe"

I know this is what Dub says about the Jetts but this certainly isn't true with YS or Rossi. With YS or Rossi 60 about 250 more RPM is possible with Macs #1160 Straight Tuned Pipe than with Macs#1260 Quiet Pipe.
Since my BSE90 is coming with a Straight Tuned Pipe and you have the Quiet Pipe, We may be able to determine just what the difference is.
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Old 06-21-2003, 12:54 PM
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Default Quiet

EW,

I stand corrected on that one. I guess it all depends on the engine. I know that with an 8.8X9.75 on a Jett 50 I get the same rpm with the quiet pipe as my friend does on his with a full nitro pipe. In any case I would gladly trade 250 rpm and a few mph for the noise reduction.

Nitro pipes are just too loud and obnoxious for me and my hearing is already half shot as it is. Here in the Northeast noise is a major issue so we have to do all we can if we want any hope of keeping our flying fields.

It will be a little while before I have numbers on the engine. I ordered a custom header from Johnson because I am hanging the pipe on the side like a Magnum. The header has to go out to clear the fuse and up to clear the wing so it is a custom job. It will be a couple of weeks before I get it.

Will look forward to comparing info on the 90 with you!
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Old 06-21-2003, 01:28 PM
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Default Quiet

Once you loose as much hearing as I have, they don't seem so obnoxious

Actually in spite of small RPM loss, most of my pipes are of the quiet or muffled variety.
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Old 06-21-2003, 01:41 PM
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Default Pipe Routing

Dustflyer

Can you give me the source for Johnson Headers?

I was hoping to put a U shaped channel in the top of the Patriot Fuse and run the Pipe through it. Did you look into that and decide it wouldn't work?

The neatest best pipe setup I've seen is the one on ChuckAuger's Rossi 65/Whiplash. To me, That's Ideal
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Old 06-21-2003, 03:40 PM
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Default Headers and Pipes

Esten,

Fortunately I haven't reached that point yet so I'm just trying to hang on to what little hearing I have left.

You can reach Johnson Headers at (602) 867-2810. He makes all of Jett's stuff.

I've seen one Patriot with the pipe running through the canopy and turteldeck area. It's a way of doing it but I personally don't care for the look.

Putting the pipe in a channel is another idea. I suppose you would just leave off the canopy and turtle deck in that case? I guess you could reduce drag a bit with that setup. Actually I hadn't thought of that idea.

I kind of like the looks of a pipe on the side as with the Magnum and planned on that right from the start. I think it looks kind of cool that way and preserves the lines of the Patriot.
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Old 06-22-2003, 01:55 AM
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Default Photo of BSE 90L FIRE. Outrageous specs!

Dustflyer,

I just got home from the XFC where I spoke to SYD. He was telling me a little bit about your 90.......I don't think that he thinks you can beat his 205mph...
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Old 06-22-2003, 02:34 AM
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Default Syd's stuff

CAP,

Let me tell you something about Syd Clement, he is one heck of an RC pilot. The guy will fly his Whiplash five feet off the deck at 200 mph back and forth in front of you twenty feet away all day with boring regularity.

He's got stuff that will blow your mind. One day he brings out a glider with some kind of Webra and a carbon fiber tuned pipe on it. That thing was almost as fast as his Whiplash! No ailerons on it mind you and he does a rolling circle with it that puts most 3D hotshots to shame.

I doubt if I'll beat his Whiplash with my 90 powered Patriot, I never expected to. All I really wanted was a fast prop plane with some landing gear on it for a change!

No telling what that 90 will put out. Sometimes you just hit the right combination of stuff. Dubb said he has no idea what the BSE 90 FIRE will turn with that huge 15cc quiet pipe. Will have to wait a few weeks to find out. I've got the official Jett test stand for it and it's all bolted down to a plank just waiting for that header.

Yeah Baby!
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Old 06-22-2003, 11:28 AM
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Default Photo of BSE 90L FIRE. Outrageous specs!

Dust Flyer,

That .90L Patriot has a retactable gear and running with a tuned pipe. The photos were taken at the time of test flights still running on Jett's tuned muffler. The first Jetts had better compression and ran much tighter than the new one he puts out today. In fact that .90L is still so tight that even after 75 flights you still have to remove the glow plug put fuel in the cylinder just to start it so there is plenty of oil around the piston. It doesn't loosen up decent until it heats up. My .95 fire is no match for the first .90L's Jett orginally put out that I have. Those old AAC engines were totally awesome compared to the user friendly easy starting engines he builds today for the average modeler.

Blue Skyy

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Old 06-22-2003, 12:51 PM
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Default Patriot

Blue Skyy,

My apologies, I thought it was fixed gear.

I told Dubb what you said about the "old" 90's and he said he had changed them around a little for more torque. He said he would build mine like the old version.

Mine is plenty tight, I haven't put a prop on it but I can't turn it over by hand.

He said it would turn a 10X10 all day at 16,000 so on that basis I'm hoping it is as least as good as yours.
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Old 06-22-2003, 11:58 PM
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Default Photo of BSE 90L FIRE. Outrageous specs!

Sounds like he did build you a great one! To me that's the Jett test. In fact just to start the old .90L, you had to remove the plug, go full throttle, put a towel over the head and hit it with the electric start for 10 sec or so. The fuel would lube it just enough to get it to turn over and start with the electric start once you put the plug in place.

My .95 Jettfire can be started by hand, and power wise? About a 10% difference in rpm using the same prop on both engines! Can't beat that old .90L unless you know the boss and he will build you a "real Jett". Back when I bought my .95 he simply wasn't doing it anymore at any cost so I settled for second best.

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Old 06-23-2003, 12:52 AM
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Default 90L

Blue Skyy,

I guess we'll just have to wait until I get it on the test stand to see whether it is really up to the "old" 90L standard. You will be the first to know how I make out with it.

Just wanted you to know I think it is fantastic that you participate in this forum. Many years ago I wanted a fast airplane to prepare for flying model turbines. I searched the web and found your original "High Speed Prop Planes" web site. Back then it was the only site of its kind. Don't know if you still maintain it but it was really cool.

After putting nearly a hundred flights on my Diamond Dust I went on to successfully fly the HotSpot jet you see in my avatar. It's plently cool but you know what, I still love those high speed prop planes!

In many ways these planes are a lot more fun than turbines. They are a fraction of the cost and for that reason a lot less stressful to fly.

Right now my HotSpot is gathering dust while I tinker around with this Patriot. Until it's ready I'm getting a big charge out of flying my 60L powered Whiplash. I've got a Jett FIRE 50 powered "clipped" Dust ready to go as well. It looks like another real bullet.

I know it sounds weird but I'm actually a lot more excited about getting the Patriot going than flying my jet right now. I guess it's the "outside the box" idea of a 90 powered Patriot that has me juiced. No doubt it's the reason Great Planes has discontinued it again, too many crazy guys like me trying to stuff 427's into Novas.
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Old 06-23-2003, 02:51 AM
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Default well

You can't "overpower" a Nova or a Patriot!

I just love reading about all this stuff- Every time I think I am just gonna take a plunge and get a JETT- I find a great deal on a whole prop-jet for about the same price!

Of course nothing I have is very impressive, but I am smiling the entire time!

I have a 60 sized Cermark F-20 and now I am looking for something feasible power-wise...

Anyone got an OS-77 DF or Rossi-90?

Anyhow, I would be stoked about the 90 sized patriot too... Making the mods and seeing it haul the potatoes is a sweet sight!

Keep us posted and add more pics!
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